Newsflash: This Just In

[westwall]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

Your initial post disproves itself moron. There is no need to disprove a logical fallacy. Get a grip.

 

[SYTFE]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

Your initial post disproves itself moron. There is no need to disprove a logical fallacy. Get a grip.

Hey hey! Look at this! Name calling #2 by a moderator. Did you give yourself a warning for that one?

I'd love to see you disprove anything I've said. Go ahead, moderator....you've already failed, try again. I'll wait for you to find your sources from your right wing blogs like a good little parrot.

 

[westwall]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

Your initial post disproves itself moron. There is no need to disprove a logical fallacy. Get a grip.

Hey hey! Look at this! Name calling #2 by a moderator. Did you give yourself a warning for that one?

I'd love to see you disprove anything I've said. Go ahead, moderator....you've already failed, try again. I'll wait for you to find your sources from your right wing blogs like a good little parrot.

No, silly boy, I have this study from that bastion of right wing conservatism....you know, HARVARD, that says it.

It must suck to be you and have one of the pillars of liberalism support us. DAMN IT ALL TO HELL!

WOULD BANNING FIREARMS REDUCE MURDER AND SUICIDE? A REVIEW OF INTERNATIONAL AND SOME DOMESTIC EVIDENCE DON B. KATES* AND GARY MAUSER**
http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronline.pdf

 

[SYTFE]

The United States has more guns and gun deaths than any other developed country in the world, researchers found.

A study by two New York City cardiologists found that the U.S. has 88 guns per 100 people and 10 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people - more than any of the other 27 developed countries they studied.

Japan, on the other hand, had only .6 guns per 100 people and .06 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people, making it the country with both the fewest guns per capita and the fewest gun-related deaths.

Drs. Sripal Bangalore, who works at NYU Langone Medical Center, and Dr. Franz Messerli of St. Luke's Medical Center studied the statistics of guns per capita and gun deaths. They used firearm injury data from the World Health Organization and guns per capita data from the Small Arms Survey to put together a list of 27 developed countries.

They said they carried out their study because of what they said are seemingly baseless claims on either side of the gun control debate.

"I think we need more of what I would call evidence-based discussion and not merely people pulling things out of their hats," Bangalore said. "We hear time and time again about these shootings, especially in the last year or so. A lot of claims are made…so we wanted to look at the data and see if any of this holds water."

They concluded that more guns do not make people safer.

David Hemenway, a professor at the Harvard School of Public Health who specializes in injury research and is considered one of the top gun violence researchers in the country, said the there's "no question" that the relationship between guns and gun deaths is real.

"It shouldn't be really a surprise to people," Hemenway said.

There are some caveats to the data, such as countries' records of illegal guns, but it seems to be "reasonable" and on par with previous research, Hemenway said.

The National Rifle Association did not immediately respond to ABCNews.com request for comment.

U.S. Has More Guns - And Gun Deaths - Than Any Other Country, Study Finds

Debate that, internet tough guys.

 

[westwall]

The United States has more guns and gun deaths than any other developed country in the world, researchers found.

A study by two New York City cardiologists found that the U.S. has 88 guns per 100 people and 10 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people - more than any of the other 27 developed countries they studied.

Japan, on the other hand, had only .6 guns per 100 people and .06 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people, making it the country with both the fewest guns per capita and the fewest gun-related deaths.

Drs. Sripal Bangalore, who works at NYU Langone Medical Center, and Dr. Franz Messerli of St. Luke's Medical Center studied the statistics of guns per capita and gun deaths. They used firearm injury data from the World Health Organization and guns per capita data from the Small Arms Survey to put together a list of 27 developed countries.

They said they carried out their study because of what they said are seemingly baseless claims on either side of the gun control debate.

"I think we need more of what I would call evidence-based discussion and not merely people pulling things out of their hats," Bangalore said. "We hear time and time again about these shootings, especially in the last year or so. A lot of claims are made…so we wanted to look at the data and see if any of this holds water."

They concluded that more guns do not make people safer.

David Hemenway, a professor at the Harvard School of Public Health who specializes in injury research and is considered one of the top gun violence researchers in the country, said the there's "no question" that the relationship between guns and gun deaths is real.

"It shouldn't be really a surprise to people," Hemenway said.

There are some caveats to the data, such as countries' records of illegal guns, but it seems to be "reasonable" and on par with previous research, Hemenway said.

The National Rifle Association did not immediately respond to ABCNews.com request for comment.

U.S. Has More Guns - And Gun Deaths - Than Any Other Country, Study Finds

Debate that, internet tough guys.

Debate what? A poorly done study? They failed to follow proper protocols when they did that "study". Thus it is less than useless.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Statistics? Try reading ya cretin.
Go back to your source.
88.8 references gun ownership, not gun crime. Derp.

Ok...does this one work for you?

Or how about this one?

All you have to do is scroll through the list.

Excellent! Now you can stop lying, you stupid twat.

Now that we've gotten your pissing contest out of the way, you ready to discuss those particular stats?

I have a theory as to why they are the way they are...

less guns = less gun murders

more guns = more gun murders

It's making more sense now, isn't it?

Now that we've gotten your pissing contest out of the way,

Now that you've admitted your idiocy.

less guns = less gun murders

The Washington Post says your moronic claim is wrong.

Newsflash: This Just In

It "says" no such thing. That initial stat only PROVES my overall point, moron. We own more guns than any other country, and dwarf all but the most chaotic 3rd world countries in gun violence. Either admit that, or shut the fuck up.

More Guns = More Gun Violence

End of fucking story.

It "says" no such thing.

The dubious distinction of having the most gun violence goes to Honduras, at 68.43 homicides by firearm per 100,000 people, even though it only has 6.2 firearms per 100 people. Other parts of South America and South Africa also rank highly, while the United States is somewhere near the mid-range. Still, America sees far more gun violence than countries in Europe, and Canada, India and Australia, which is perhaps how it gets its bloody reputation among comparatively peaceful nations.


Umm...the US has almost 15 times as many guns per person than Honduras, with more than a 90% lower firearm homicide rate.
That makes your claim moronic. End of fucking story.

 

[SYTFE]

Or, since you like Harvard, debate this one. Or not. Your choice.

-------------------------
Homicide

1. Where there are more guns there is more homicide (literature review)

Our review of the academic literature found that a broad array of evidence indicates that gun availability is a risk factor for homicide, both in the United States and across high-income countries. Case-control studies, ecological time-series and cross-sectional studies indicate that in homes, cities, states and regions in the U.S., where there are more guns, both men and women are at a higher risk for homicide, particularly firearm homicide.

Hepburn, Lisa; Hemenway, David. Firearm availability and homicide: A review of the literature. Aggression and Violent Behavior: A Review Journal. 2004; 9:417-40.



2. Across high-income nations, more guns = more homicide

We analyzed the relationship between homicide and gun availability using data from 26 developed countries from the early 1990s. We found that across developed countries, where guns are more available, there are more homicides. These results often hold even when the United States is excluded.

Hemenway, David; Miller, Matthew. Firearm availability and homicide rates across 26 high income countries. Journal of Trauma. 2000; 49:985-88.



3. Across states, more guns = more homicide

Using a validated proxy for firearm ownership, we analyzed the relationship between firearm availability and homicide across 50 states over a ten-year period (1988-1997).

After controlling for poverty and urbanization, for every age group, people in states with many guns have elevated rates of homicide, particularly firearm homicide.

Miller, Matthew; Azrael, Deborah; Hemenway, David. Household firearm ownership levels and homicide rates across U.S. regions and states, 1988-1997. American Journal of Public Health. 2002; 92:1988-1993.



4. Across states, more guns = more homicide (2)

Using survey data on rates of household gun ownership, we examined the association between gun availability and homicide across states, 2001-2003. We found that states with higher levels of household gun ownership had higher rates of firearm homicide and overall homicide. This relationship held for both genders and all age groups, after accounting for rates of aggravated assault, robbery, unemployment, urbanization, alcohol consumption, and resource deprivation (e.g., poverty). There was no association between gun prevalence and non-firearm homicide.

Miller, Matthew; Azrael, Deborah; Hemenway, David. State-level homicide victimization rates in the U.S. in relation to survey measures of household firearm ownership, 2001-2003. Social Science and Medicine. 2007; 64:656-64.



5. A summary of the evidence on guns and violent death

This book chapter summarizes the scientific literature on the relationship between gun prevalence (levels of household gun ownership) and suicide, homicide and unintentional firearm death and concludes that where there are higher levels of gun ownership, there are more gun suicides and more total suicides, more gun homicides and more total homicides, and more accidental gun deaths.

This is the first chapter in the book and provides and up-to-date and readable summary of the literature on the relationship between guns and death. It also adds to the literature by using the National Violent Death Reporting System data to show where (home or away) the shootings occurred. Suicides for all age groups and homicides for children and aging adults most often occurred in their own home.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hemenway D. Firearms and violence death in the United States. In: Webster DW, Vernick JS, eds. Reducing Gun Violence in America. Baltimore MD: Johns Hopkins University Press, 2013.



6. More guns = more homicides of police

This article examines homicide rates of Law Enforcement Officers (LEOs) from 1996 to 2010. Differences in rates of homicides of LEOs across states are best explained not by differences in crime, but by differences in household gun ownership. In high gun states, LEOs are 3 times more likely to be murdered than LEOs working in low-gun states.

This article was cited by President Obama in a speech to a police association. This article will hopefully bring police further into the camp of those pushing for sensible gun laws.

Swedler DI, Simmons MM, Dominici F, Hemenway D. Firearm prevalence and homicides of law enforcement officers in the United States. American Journal of Public Health. 2015; 105:2042-48.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/guns-and-death/

 

[SYTFE]

The United States has more guns and gun deaths than any other developed country in the world, researchers found.

A study by two New York City cardiologists found that the U.S. has 88 guns per 100 people and 10 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people - more than any of the other 27 developed countries they studied.

Japan, on the other hand, had only .6 guns per 100 people and .06 gun-related deaths per 100,000 people, making it the country with both the fewest guns per capita and the fewest gun-related deaths.

Drs. Sripal Bangalore, who works at NYU Langone Medical Center, and Dr. Franz Messerli of St. Luke's Medical Center studied the statistics of guns per capita and gun deaths. They used firearm injury data from the World Health Organization and guns per capita data from the Small Arms Survey to put together a list of 27 developed countries.

They said they carried out their study because of what they said are seemingly baseless claims on either side of the gun control debate.

"I think we need more of what I would call evidence-based discussion and not merely people pulling things out of their hats," Bangalore said. "We hear time and time again about these shootings, especially in the last year or so. A lot of claims are made…so we wanted to look at the data and see if any of this holds water."

They concluded that more guns do not make people safer.

David Hemenway, a professor at the Harvard School of Public Health who specializes in injury research and is considered one of the top gun violence researchers in the country, said the there's "no question" that the relationship between guns and gun deaths is real.

"It shouldn't be really a surprise to people," Hemenway said.

There are some caveats to the data, such as countries' records of illegal guns, but it seems to be "reasonable" and on par with previous research, Hemenway said.

The National Rifle Association did not immediately respond to ABCNews.com request for comment.

U.S. Has More Guns - And Gun Deaths - Than Any Other Country, Study Finds

Debate that, internet tough guys.

Debate what? A poorly done study? They failed to follow proper protocols when they did that "study". Thus it is less than useless.

LMAO

So, let me get this straight....because they concluded -- as did Harvard -- that the presence of more guns translate to more gun violence, you think they "failed to follow proper protocols?"

Get the fuck over yourself.

 

[SYTFE]

We could literally have a mass shooting event every day for an entire year, and the conservative clown show would STILL cling to their dangerous delusions. What a bizarre pathology.

 

[Dr Grump]

Embedded media from this media site is no longer available

Required watching for the gun nuts.

An Australian comedian telling me about guns, .that's like the Pope telling me how to have sex.

But as he says, the thing that really pisses off the gun nuts is that he's right.

 

[Dr Grump]

Umm...the US has almost 15 times as many guns per person than Honduras, with more than a 90% lower firearm homicide rate.
That makes your claim moronic. End of fucking story.

Now compare the US to the rest of the civilised world..

 

[Pumpkin Row]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

I've already disproved your statement three times, and you chose not to reply each time. You're clearly a troll. As has Westwall and Toddsterpatriot. You're just ignoring posts that disprove your fallacy.

 

[SYTFE]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

I've already disproved your statement three times, and you chose not to reply each time. You're clearly a troll. As has Westwall and Toddsterpatriot. You're just ignoring posts that disprove your fallacy.

But you didn't "say" anything. And none of your graphs are disproving anything I've said, so I didn't bother. I've already posted the ACTUAL stats several times now, and included a couple more peer reviewed studies that concluded my point as well. The facts are simply not on your side, guy.

 

[westwall]

Embedded media from this media site is no longer available

Required watching for the gun nuts.

An Australian comedian telling me about guns, .that's like the Pope telling me how to have sex.

But as he says, the thing that really pisses off the gun nuts is that he's right.

Only the evidence says otherwise. Which pisses you off, so you have to lie about it. I will give it to you propagandists, there is no lie to big. But of course, that was Goebbels' mantra, wasn't it...

 

[westwall]

Umm...the US has almost 15 times as many guns per person than Honduras, with more than a 90% lower firearm homicide rate.
That makes your claim moronic. End of fucking story.

Now compare the US to the rest of the civilised world..

Just compare it to Europe. The EU has all the laws you want and they have had two mass shootings that killed more people than all of the mass shootings in the US combined over the last 20 years. And by a lot. Face it dude, you are factually wrong on all counts.

 

[Pumpkin Row]

Not talking about just killing...I'm talking specifically about gun related deaths.

Wow...Spinning the gun grabber argument already...
Hey rookie. if guns are outlawed, the criminals won't give a fuck...
Now, go to another site and post there. In the minors. You're not ready for this place.

LOL

As if this place is the "big leagues?" You flatter yourself, and seem bizarrely unaware of other forums. This is a conservative echo chamber. NONE of you can disprove my initial post. All any of you can do is whine, cry, call me names, but none of you can debate worth a shit. Particularly you.

I've already disproved your statement three times, and you chose not to reply each time. You're clearly a troll. As has Westwall and Toddsterpatriot. You're just ignoring posts that disprove your fallacy.

But you didn't "say" anything. And none of your graphs are disproving anything I've said, so I didn't bother. I've already posted the ACTUAL stats several times now, and included a couple more peer reviewed studies that concluded my point as well. The facts are simply not on your side, guy.

I addressed your stats. If you actually look at the graphs, you'll notice the spike in crime after the bill is passed, then a drop when they are hiring more police and the economy is improving. You're only ignoring my points because they, and actual common sense, disprove all of your Liberal propaganda.

Crime doesn't drop because you disarmed citizens, it drops because of all the extra police and jobs. The graphs I posted clearly show that. The crime rate even starts going back up when the police numbers drop and unemployment rises.

You're basically arguing that criminals follow the law. If that actually worked, then there would be no murder anywhere, because it's illegal.

 

[Dr Grump]

Only the evidence says otherwise. Which pisses you off, so you have to lie about it. I will give it to you propagandists, there is no lie to big. But of course, that was Goebbels' mantra, wasn't it...

What evidence?

 

[Dr Grump]

Just compare it to Europe. The EU has all the laws you want and they have had two mass shootings that killed more people than all of the mass shootings in the US combined over the last 20 years. And by a lot. Face it dude, you are factually wrong on all counts.

They did? Really? The US has all the lax laws you want and still you have mass shootings. You had a whole raft of cops at Dallas and still five got killed.

That aside, your assertion is BS. From 1996-2016 there have been 478 victims of mass shootings in the US. The two worst in Europe don't add up to it.

US Mass Shootings, 1982-2016: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

 

[skookerasbil]

The fucking moron who started this thread read "guns per 100 residents" as "gun crime".
Because he's a fucking idiot.

Try again? Derp!

lol...again, MORON, do you know what you're "derping" to? lol, holy shit....this is great. Tell me, genius, do you understand statistics?

You're literally the dumbest person I've ever encountered on any forum. Wow.

Statistics? Try reading ya cretin.
Go back to your source.
88.8 references gun ownership, not gun crime. Derp.

Ok...does this one work for you?

Or how about this one?

All you have to do is scroll through the list.

Excellent! Now you can stop lying, you stupid twat.

Now that we've gotten your pissing contest out of the way, you ready to discuss those particular stats?

I have a theory as to why they are the way they are...

less guns = less gun murders

more guns = more gun murders

It's making more sense now, isn't it?

makey-uppey statements are ghey

Harvard study concludes that gun control does not prevent murders, other violent crime

 

[dannyboys]

Less guns = less gun violence.

More guns = more gun violence.

Pretty simple folks. Squeegee your third fucking eye.

Criminological studies show your assertion to be not just false, but catastrophically so. But, never let facts get in the way of a progressive moron.

Can the moderation on this forum engage in name-calling? That's interesting. Kind of cool if that's allowed here.

Anyway, do you happen to know what happened in Australia when they too away their gurrns? They haven't had a mass shooting event since. Do you know why that is?

Because less guns = less gun violence.

More guns = more gun violence.

Pretty fucking simple.

Fuck off 'stoner'.
We crap bigger than you on this forum!

Permanent Ignore.