NSA collecting phone records of millions of Verizon users: Why?

[RoadVirus]

I didn't see this as big deal in the previous admin, and I don't see it here. If the NSA knows the phone number of a suspected terrorist in Pak or someplace, I sure as hell want them to know who the sob is talking to over here.

That's all fine and good, but to take everyone's data? That's not to track down a terrorist...that's abusing one's authority!

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Lost what?

All pretense of privacy.

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Yeah, sure.

 

[OnePercenter]

Basically, our government is absolutely worthless. It would make king george blush.

Really? You call 9-1-1 and nobody responds? The roadways around your home are deteriorating? Your Social Security check not showing up?

 

[RoadVirus]

Lost what?

All pretense of privacy.

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

It's sad to know that you believe that.

 

[OnePercenter]

All pretense of privacy.

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Yeah, sure.

If you can provide evidence to the contraindicate what I posted please provide.

 

[OnePercenter]

All pretense of privacy.

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

It's sad to know that you believe that.

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

 

[blackhawk]

Not a conspiracy theory. It's really happening. The Guardian has a copy of the court order.

I'd heard this on Levin earlier and checked it out. The Guardian (left wing Brit newspaper) is reporting that the NSA is secretly collecting millions of Verizon subscribers phone records.

Check this out.

Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily

Exclusive: Top secret court order requiring Verizon to hand over all call data shows scale of domestic surveillance under Obama

The National Security Agency is currently collecting the telephone records of millions of US customers of Verizon, one of America's largest telecoms providers, under a top secret court order issued in April.

The order, a copy of which has been obtained by the Guardian, requires Verizon on an "ongoing, daily basis" to give the NSA information on all telephone calls in its systems, both within the US and between the US and other countries.

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (Fisa) granted the order to the FBI on April 25, giving the government unlimited authority to obtain the data for a specified three-month period ending on July 19.

Under the terms of the blanket order, the numbers of both parties on a call are handed over, as is location data, call duration, unique identifiers, and the time and duration of all calls. The contents of the conversation itself are not covered.

The disclosure is likely to reignite longstanding debates in the US over the proper extent of the government's domestic spying powers.

Under the Bush administration, officials in security agencies had disclosed to reporters the large-scale collection of call records data by the NSA, but this is the first time significant and top-secret documents have revealed the continuation of the practice on a massive scale under President Obama.

The unlimited nature of the records being handed over to the NSA is extremely unusual. Fisa court orders typically direct the production of records pertaining to a specific named target who is suspected of being an agent of a terrorist group or foreign state, or a finite set of individually named targets.

The Guardian approached the National Security Agency, the White House and the Department of Justice for comment in advance of publication on Wednesday.

All declined. The agencies were also offered the opportunity to raise specific security concerns regarding the publication of the court order.

The court order expressly bars Verizon from disclosing to the public either the existence of the FBI's request for its customers' records, or the court order itself.

More at link:

Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily | World news | The Guardian

This was started under President Bush and is yet another Bush policy continued by Obama it seems like the left not only gave Bush a third term by electing Obama but a fourth one by reelecting him which I find more than a little funny.

 

[tinydancer]

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Yeah, sure.

If you can provide evidence to the contraindicate what I posted please provide.

The evidence of the NSA collecting phone records of millions is right in my OP.

Here ya go. Again. Note millions. No connection to specific terrorist activity whatsoever.
Just a blatant collection of data on millions of Americans daily.


Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily

Exclusive: Top secret court order requiring Verizon to hand over all call data shows scale of domestic surveillance under Obama

The National Security Agency is currently collecting the telephone records of millions of US customers of Verizon, one of America's largest telecoms providers, under a top secret court order issued in April.

The order, a copy of which has been obtained by the Guardian, requires Verizon on an "ongoing, daily basis" to give the NSA information on all telephone calls in its systems, both within the US and between the US and other countries.

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (Fisa) granted the order to the FBI on April 25, giving the government unlimited authority to obtain the data for a specified three-month period ending on July 19.

Under the terms of the blanket order, the numbers of both parties on a call are handed over, as is location data, call duration, unique identifiers, and the time and duration of all calls. The contents of the conversation itself are not covered.

The disclosure is likely to reignite longstanding debates in the US over the proper extent of the government's domestic spying powers.

Under the Bush administration, officials in security agencies had disclosed to reporters the large-scale collection of call records data by the NSA, but this is the first time significant and top-secret documents have revealed the continuation of the practice on a massive scale under President Obama.

The unlimited nature of the records being handed over to the NSA is extremely unusual. Fisa court orders typically direct the production of records pertaining to a specific named target who is suspected of being an agent of a terrorist group or foreign state, or a finite set of individually named targets.

The Guardian approached the National Security Agency, the White House and the Department of Justice for comment in advance of publication on Wednesday.

All declined. The agencies were also offered the opportunity to raise specific security concerns regarding the publication of the court order.

The court order expressly bars Verizon from disclosing to the public either the existence of the FBI's request for its customers' records, or the court order itself.

Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily | World news | The Guardian

 

[tinydancer]

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

It's sad to know that you believe that.

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

 

[tinydancer]

Not a conspiracy theory. It's really happening. The Guardian has a copy of the court order.

I'd heard this on Levin earlier and checked it out. The Guardian (left wing Brit newspaper) is reporting that the NSA is secretly collecting millions of Verizon subscribers phone records.

Check this out.

Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily

Exclusive: Top secret court order requiring Verizon to hand over all call data shows scale of domestic surveillance under Obama

The National Security Agency is currently collecting the telephone records of millions of US customers of Verizon, one of America's largest telecoms providers, under a top secret court order issued in April.

The order, a copy of which has been obtained by the Guardian, requires Verizon on an "ongoing, daily basis" to give the NSA information on all telephone calls in its systems, both within the US and between the US and other countries.

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (Fisa) granted the order to the FBI on April 25, giving the government unlimited authority to obtain the data for a specified three-month period ending on July 19.

Under the terms of the blanket order, the numbers of both parties on a call are handed over, as is location data, call duration, unique identifiers, and the time and duration of all calls. The contents of the conversation itself are not covered.

The disclosure is likely to reignite longstanding debates in the US over the proper extent of the government's domestic spying powers.

Under the Bush administration, officials in security agencies had disclosed to reporters the large-scale collection of call records data by the NSA, but this is the first time significant and top-secret documents have revealed the continuation of the practice on a massive scale under President Obama.

The unlimited nature of the records being handed over to the NSA is extremely unusual. Fisa court orders typically direct the production of records pertaining to a specific named target who is suspected of being an agent of a terrorist group or foreign state, or a finite set of individually named targets.

The Guardian approached the National Security Agency, the White House and the Department of Justice for comment in advance of publication on Wednesday.

All declined. The agencies were also offered the opportunity to raise specific security concerns regarding the publication of the court order.

The court order expressly bars Verizon from disclosing to the public either the existence of the FBI's request for its customers' records, or the court order itself.

More at link:

Revealed: NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily | World news | The Guardian

This was started under President Bush and is yet another Bush policy continued by Obama it seems like the left not only gave Bush a third term by electing Obama but a fourth one by reelecting him which I find more than a little funny.

At least Bush didn't think that millions of American citizens were his enemy like Obama does. It's true that the left screamed and whined and moaned about Bush's policies but Obama's implementing the same but on steroids.

 

[Katzndogz]

The paranoid Obama administration is hell bent on weeding out anyone and everyone who opposes him or questions anything he says or does in any way, shape, or form. This is a search, identify, and destroy mission.

obama's paranoia is rising to the level of madness. The only time I've seen this kind of paranoia is in long time cocaine addicts. With his history of cocaine use that's probably the reason here.

obama sees the entire nation as his enemies. His inner circle is getting smaller and smaller as more become enemies.

 

[oreo]

I expect to see the left wing outrage in

3.............



2....................


1.....................................

I doubt you'll see any left wing outrage over this--(Obama is still in office.) What is remarkable--is they're stating they're looking for dates--length of calls--but no conversation.

WTF is that all about? "I know that Jane Doe--talked to John Doe on April 1, 2013 for 10 minutes--but I don't know what they talked about." Yeah right.

Now give me a freakin break--there is more to this than what they're telling us. And if they're doing it to Verizon--you can bet they're doing it to every other service provider in this nation. This is in direct violation of the U.S. Constitution and our rights to privacy.

 

[OnePercenter]

It's sad to know that you believe that.

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

How is this a better question? How would I know that?

The NSA is collecting numbers to see a pattern of calls to know terrorists. If a pattern develops, the NSA obtains a court order to obtain the name and address of the individual making the calls. Isn't the NSA doing their job?

 

[edthecynic]

It's sad to know that you believe that.

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

probably the same number as when Bush did it.

 

[OnePercenter]

Since this has been ongoing for seven years, why is this making light today?

Answer: My fellow onepercenters, Mark Levin and Breibart family have more to sell. Mark and family need a new yacht!

 

[OnePercenter]

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

probably the same number as when Bush did it.

What's the point?

 

[tinydancer]

There's outrage even from the left. Nice to see. The outrage should be bipartisan.

Any moron that runs around flapping their gums with the "well if you have nothing to hide" should be slapped upside the head for being so freaking stupid.

The American Civil Liberties Union put out an immediate statement calling for an end to the program - which is scheduled to run until July 19 - and a investigation into the order.

'From a civil liberties perspective, the program could hardly be any more alarming,' ACLU deputy legal director Jameel Jaffer said in a statement.

'It’s a program in which some untold number of innocent people have been put under the constant surveillance of government agents.

'It is beyond Orwellian, and it provides further evidence of the extent to which basic democratic rights are being surrendered in secret to the demands of unaccountable intelligence agencies.'

AND

Former Vice President Al Gore took to Twitter to call the revelation 'obscenely outrageous'.


AND

An expert in electronic freedom practices says that it was unlikely that Verizon would be the only subject of such an order and that the other major carriers probably had similar orders against them.

'That's not the society we've built in the United States,' said Kurt Opsahl, an attorney at the Electronic Frontier Foundation, which is suing the NSA over surveillance inside the country.

'It's not the society we set forth in the Constitution, and it's not the society we should have.'


NSA is collecting the phone records of MILLIONS of Verizon customers daily under top secret order issued in April and it lasts into July | Mail Online

 

[Avatar4321]

The NSA is targeting numbers dialed from the U.S. to known or suspected terrorists overseas. Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

It's sad to know that you believe that.

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

The more accurate question is: What business is it of the government who he or I or anyone else talks to when we are law abiding citizens?

 

[flacaltenn]

Who are you calling that makes you so paranoid?

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

How is this a better question? How would I know that?

The NSA is collecting numbers to see a pattern of calls to know terrorists. If a pattern develops, the NSA obtains a court order to obtain the name and address of the individual making the calls. Isn't the NSA doing their job?

Your lack of understanding of this tyranny is a direct threat to our democracy.. I wish YOU were the 1%. but I doubt it.

First off the NSA job is to supply technology and systems for strategic INTERNATIONAL Intelligience. They have been expressly forbidden to partake in any domestic operations within our borders.

Second, I have some knowledge of intelligience business and the NSA is the single bastion of competence and excellence in govt. These guys can do freaking miracles with data from signals and communications. You do not want to unleash them on yourself. Trust me.

Third -- THIS Program that Verizon and almost all of the telephone carriers have be co-opted into covers ALL communications in the territorial US. Not just calls that connect to offshore. The data being recorded and analyzed contains data and time and duration of the call. What phones were on each end and the approximate physical location of each phone. With that info -- I could tell where you bank, who your clients and donors are, where you've been. With who you've been and probably whether you were likely having an affair. The data will be mined and refined to yield amazing results of associations and movements of ANY CITIZEN. This is NOT a drill. You need to wake the fuck up and stop guessing or projecting your political biases.

Have I helped?

 

[edthecynic]

Better question.

How many millions of calls placed with Verizon by American citizens on a daily basis would you believe are terror related for this big of a secret sweep?

probably the same number as when Bush did it.

What's the point?

The point is it didn't bother the Right while Bush was doing it and up until now the Right was having a shit fit on the possibility that Obama might weaken the Patriot Act. Now suddenly the P A is worse than Hitler.

Here is Heritage.org asking that Section 215 be made permanent in 2011.

After Bin Laden: Support the PATRIOT Act

Osama bin Laden’s death was undoubtedly a major victory for the United States and civilized society. The War on Terrorism, however, is not over—al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups will continue to stage plots against the United States, as they have done at least 39 times since 9/11. Successful counterterrorism policies, capable of stopping these threats before they materialize, require tools that empower counterterrorism and law enforcement investigators to track down leads, including in local communities.
Those tools include two provisions of the PATRIOT Act and one in the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004, which provide national security investigators with more extensive means to prevent acts of terrorism. Congress and the Administration should ensure that these tools are made a permanent piece of the nation’s counterterrorism policy.


2. Section 215 of the PATRIOT Act: Business Record Orders under FISA. Domestic prosecutors routinely rely on business records and other concrete evidence to prove a wide variety of criminal charges from simple theft to homicide. Law enforcement, working with local prosecutors, acquires this evidence throughout the course of an investigation, often through the use of a subpoena. However, national security agents did not have the same authority to acquire similar evidence prior to the passage of Section 215. They had to obtain a court order and were limited to those records held by a business that was a “common carrier, public accommodation facility, physical storage facility or vehicle rental facility.”
Section 215 eliminated those arbitrary, dangerously narrow and self-limiting provisions but required that the records sought are relevant to an authorized investigation. However, unlike a standard prosecutor-issued subpoena, or even a grand jury subpoena, an order issued under Section 215 requires FISA court approval. In other words, Congress inserted a federal judge between investigators and potential suspects. Furthermore, the law requires substantial congressional oversight.
This provision allows law enforcement, with approval from the FISA court, to require disclosure of documents and other records from businesses and other institutions without a suspect’s knowledge. Third-party recipients of Section 215 orders can appeal the order to the FISA court.
Section 215 further protects civil liberties by requiring additional approval for document requests that might have the slightest relation to freedom of speech and expression, such as library records.
As Wainstein testified, “There is no reason to return to the days when it is easier for prosecutors to secure records in a simple assault prosecution than for national security investigators to obtain records that may help prevent the next 9/11.”