Obama announces debt deal--GOP/Tea Party members WIN big!

[JakeStarkey]

Harding and Coolidge had a much worse situation than FDR did, especially since FDR refused to work with Harding to stop the bank runs between Nov 1932 and his inauguration in March 1933. Not only that but to make matters worse, Congressional Democrats released the names of banks taking loans from the Reconstruction Finance Corporation to help accelerate the panic. Hitler's invasion of Poland, the low countries and France did more for the US economy than FDR ever did.

1. Harding died in 1922.

2. FDR refused to be bound by Hoover's failed programs.

3. Dems demanded transparency in the RFC.

4. Rearmaments and war preparations propelled Germany, Italy, and Japan out of Depression more quickly than the western powers, yes.

5. Relief for the needy and economic reform of banking and stock market exchange were right on.

Hoover's failed interventionist policies you mean? You do realize that when campaigning against Hoover, FDR criticized his policies as too socialist, don't you? Hoover was not a "do nothing" president. He intervened heavily in the economy in unprecedented ways. And it led to disaster. FDR then pursued even more radical policies that led to even more disaster.

The War ending the Depression is also a myth. What was produced was tanks and war materials largely useless outside of war. Cities were destroyed in Europe. Exactly how is the destruction of thousands of homes and businesses economic growth?

Shackled, I imagine Hoover called FDR too conservative. It was an election, nimrod.

Hoover's policies led to disaster because he looked to Old Progressive ways instead of looking to the future in which the full strength of the government was necessary to overcome the complete failure of unregulated capitalism.

The war industries in America put everybody to work. The government guided and directed business in xfring from war to civilian production at the end of the war.

You really do not know history, do you?

 

[JakeStarkey]

GDP (nominal)
1929: 103.6B
1930: 91.2B
1931: 76.5B
1932: 58.7B
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

49% increase in GDP in four years. You were saying something about "disaster"?

Some of the slowest growth in US history coupled with massive unemployment. The reason: FDRs policies. I call that disastrous.

Huh? That period between 1933 and 1937 is the fastest multiyear period of growth in modern US history. It's not "some of the slowest", it's "the fastest".

Unemployment fell by over 8 points, in modern terms a creation of about 10 million jobs.

Shackled, when confronted with stats, begins blathering stupidities, as do all the out of mainstream far right reactionaries

 

[Full-Auto]

GDP (nominal)
1929: 103.6B
1930: 91.2B
1931: 76.5B
1932: 58.7B
1933: 56.4B <-----FDR takes office.
1934: 66.0B
1935: 73.3B
1936: 83.8B

49% increase in GDP in four years. You were saying something about "disaster"?

Some of the slowest growth in US history coupled with massive unemployment. The reason: FDRs policies. I call that disastrous.

Huh? That period between 1933 and 1937 is the fastest multiyear period of growth in modern US history. It's not "some of the slowest", it's "the fastest".

Unemployment fell by over 8 points, in modern terms a creation of about 10 million jobs.

You want to raise the GDP? Pump in government cash for the illusion.

 

[8537]

Some of the slowest growth in US history coupled with massive unemployment. The reason: FDRs policies. I call that disastrous.

Huh? That period between 1933 and 1937 is the fastest multiyear period of growth in modern US history. It's not "some of the slowest", it's "the fastest".

Unemployment fell by over 8 points, in modern terms a creation of about 10 million jobs.

You want to raise the GDP? Pump in government cash for the illusion.

Except it wasn't an illusion. it was across virtually every sector of the economy.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Want to improve the economy?

Stay away from strategies that Full Auto, Shackled, and Rott endorse. Sure failures.

 

[8537]

Shackled, when confronted with stats, begins blathering stupidities, as do all the out of mainstream far right reactionaries

This meme about the Depression comes from a single UCLA study, a Mackinac center piece of peesearch, and a lot of blathering from CATO and Heritage.

The fact is that the New Deal was a mix of effective, ineffectual and detrimental programs - but the effective ones far outweighed the impact of the remaining. The two banking acts alone turned investment on a dime. The decision to reset the value of the dollar was a tremendous help. Many of the labor programs helped down and out Americans earn a living and have a confidence to spend a dollar, all the while creating many of the lasting legacies we now consider part of American culture.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

No one really won with this bitter Shit Sandwich. The only positive i can see with this awful deal is there will be a required Balanced-Budget Amendment Vote. Otherwise,we're still screwed. The disastrous $16 Trillion Debt is here. That's just the sad reality.

 

[pete]

Any credible source?

Full text of President's speech.

Full text of the president's remarks - - POLITICO.com

What !!!!! No prime time rhetoric?

 

[Sarah G]

No one really won with this bitter Shit Sandwich. The only positive i can see with this awful deal is there will be a required Balanced-Budget Amendment Vote. Otherwise,we're still screwed. The disastrous $16 Trillion Debt is here. That's just the sad reality.

I'm glad you finally see this sad fact. You might want to read up on the BBA thing as well.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

No one really won with this bitter Shit Sandwich. The only positive i can see with this awful deal is there will be a required Balanced-Budget Amendment Vote. Otherwise,we're still screwed. The disastrous $16 Trillion Debt is here. That's just the sad reality.

I'm glad you finally see this sad fact. You might want to read up on the BBA thing as well.

Yea i know,there are problems with this as well. This deal only requires a Vote on a Balanced Budget Amendment. It does not require it be passed. But i'll just have to take what i can get at this point. It's the only positive i see in this awful deal.

 

[P@triot]

You do realize, that FDR got the country out of the Great Depression by SPENDING more money than ever before, right? Particularly by setting up, SS, and unemployment, and by starting dozens of different governmental organizations that provide hundreds of different services, millions of jobs, and made the country better?

Your statement is 100% false. FDR's Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr. was the key architect of FDR's "New Deal" and testified before the House Ways and Means Committee that the economic policies created by he and FDR failed the United States.

“I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. … And an enormous debt to boot! " - FDR Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr.

“We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work.” - FDR Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr.

Unemployment never fell below 20% during his Administration, and after the second phase of the "New Deal", unemployment actually went up (phase 2 begins in 1937 with unemployment at 21%. By the 1938, unemployment is at 27%).

Is there no end to the misinformation and propaganda from the liberals? And how many times do liberal policies have to fail until liberals will accept that they are failed policies? We've had over 100 years of profound failed liberal policies - from the U.S.S.R. to Cuba to Greece to current state of the US. Nobody can possibly be this stupid - not even the Dumbocrats. I have to believe these are policies are planned specifically to collaspe the US.

Where do you come up with this shit? The unemployment rate fell from 25% to about 16%. The economy grew at record pace (See my earlier post with pre- and post-1933 GDP data. We went from losing 3,000 banks per year to losing 7. 7! But in true conservatarian fashion, you believe anything that confirms your bias and Heritage will confirm absolutely any rightwingnut bias.

Is there no end to the misinformation and propoganda from conservatarians?

Who cares how many banks were "lost"? Especially since you people hate banks and "evil" rich people. Unemployment is what mattered (you know - jobs - something else you people hate) and the facts about the unemployment numbers don't lie. Unemployment went up after his second phase of the new deal by 6%, and those numbers can be independently verified just about any where. You guys just got destroyed on your entire FDR argument. Deal with it.

 

[8537]

Your statement is 100% false. FDR's Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr. was the key architect of FDR's "New Deal" and testified before the House Ways and Means Committee that the economic policies created by he and FDR failed the United States.

“I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. … And an enormous debt to boot! " - FDR Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr.

“We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work.” - FDR Secretary of the Treasury Henry Morgenthau Jr.

Unemployment never fell below 20% during his Administration, and after the second phase of the "New Deal", unemployment actually went up (phase 2 begins in 1937 with unemployment at 21%. By the 1938, unemployment is at 27%).

Is there no end to the misinformation and propaganda from the liberals? And how many times do liberal policies have to fail until liberals will accept that they are failed policies? We've had over 100 years of profound failed liberal policies - from the U.S.S.R. to Cuba to Greece to current state of the US. Nobody can possibly be this stupid - not even the Dumbocrats. I have to believe these are policies are planned specifically to collaspe the US.

Where do you come up with this shit? The unemployment rate fell from 25% to about 16%. The economy grew at record pace (See my earlier post with pre- and post-1933 GDP data. We went from losing 3,000 banks per year to losing 7. 7! But in true conservatarian fashion, you believe anything that confirms your bias and Heritage will confirm absolutely any rightwingnut bias.

Is there no end to the misinformation and propoganda from conservatarians?

Who cares how many banks were "lost"?

Methinks someone doesn't understand the financial system. Downplaying the impact of a collapsed bank prior to the 1933 Banking act makes you look a bit... foolish.

Those collapsing banks literally took the economy with them. Stopping those collapses was the single most important step towards stabilizing the economy, which otherwise would have continued in a downward spiral.

Unemployment is what mattered (you know - jobs - something else you people hate) and the facts about the unemployment numbers don't lie. Unemployment went up after his second phase of the new deal by 6%

No, unemployment went up after the congress decided to attempt to balance the budget and cut spending. You really need to learn not to trust the bullshit Heritage produces.

You just got destroyed on your entire FDR argument. Deal with it.

 

[P@triot]

The Tea Party is now finished as ineffective force in American politics. Why? Obama and the Dems get to raise the ceiling by another two trillion. Obama et al don't have to worry about this debt until after 2012. The BBA is a dead duck that won't float in Congress now. The Dems will go after and may well get increased revenues. The Dems may get up to five hundred billion in defense spending cuts.

As I said before, no matter how many times you repeat that stupid statement, you can't wish the Tea Party away. They stormed Washington last November when they sent nearly one of your useless, reckless spending, pro-Marxist Dumbocrats home to their unemployment lines and in 2012 they are going to finish the job.

You start every post with "the Tea Party is now finished" as if you can somehow convince people to turn to your radical Marxist/Socialist/Communist policies. Nobody is listening to you except for the other 10% of radical left-wing Communists out there.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Harding and Coolidge had a much worse situation than FDR did, especially since FDR refused to work with Harding to stop the bank runs between Nov 1932 and his inauguration in March 1933. Not only that but to make matters worse, Congressional Democrats released the names of banks taking loans from the Reconstruction Finance Corporation to help accelerate the panic. Hitler's invasion of Poland, the low countries and France did more for the US economy than FDR ever did.

1. Harding died in 1922.

2. FDR refused to be bound by Hoover's failed programs.

3. Dems demanded transparency in the RFC.

4. Rearmaments and war preparations propelled Germany, Italy, and Japan out of Depression more quickly than the western powers, yes.

5. Relief for the needy and economic reform of banking and stock market exchange were right on.

Right I meant Hoover instead of Harding.

FDR Doubled down on all of Hoover Filed Programs

Dems used the RFC to fuck the US Economy under Hoover.

Yes, war baled out bad Democrat programs and ideas

FDRs programs made the US Economy worse than the 7 Biblical Lean Years

 

[P@triot]

Where do you come up with this shit? The unemployment rate fell from 25% to about 16%. The economy grew at record pace (See my earlier post with pre- and post-1933 GDP data. We went from losing 3,000 banks per year to losing 7. 7! But in true conservatarian fashion, you believe anything that confirms your bias and Heritage will confirm absolutely any rightwingnut bias.

Is there no end to the misinformation and propoganda from conservatarians?

Who cares how many banks were "lost"?

Methinks someone doesn't understand the financial system. Downplaying the impact of a collapsed bank prior to the 1933 Banking act makes you look a bit... foolish.

Those collapsing banks literally took the economy with them. Stopping those collapses was the single most important step towards stabilizing the economy, which otherwise would have continued in a downward spiral.

Unemployment is what mattered (you know - jobs - something else you people hate) and the facts about the unemployment numbers don't lie. Unemployment went up after his second phase of the new deal by 6%

No, unemployment went up after the congress decided to attempt to balance the budget and cut spending. You really need to learn not to trust the bullshit Heritage produces.

You just got destroyed on your entire FDR argument. Deal with it.

Well I think someone has no idea about grammar, much less economics. Unemployment went up after FDR's second phase of the New Deal, but you ignore that fact and try to celebrate that they "only" lost 7 banks per year. I mean, that's hysterical. You can't even say that they added 1 single bank, you want to celebrate the fact that they LOST banks as proof of success of the New Deal.

Here is an undeniable fact: unemployment went up to an ungodly 27% after FDR implemented the second phase of his New Deal. To counter that, you actually have the audacity to make the asinine statement that the higher unemployment was caused by congress trying to "balance the budget". Seriously folks - you can't make this stuff up. Only the Dumbocrat would try to convince people that spending within your means and not collapsing the nation with debt would cause markets to panic and jobs to be lost.

By the way, it's interesting you keep attacking Heritage when it was your fellow idiot liberal Dumbocrat Henry Morgenthau Jr., the architect of the New Deal, who admitted that the spending made the entire economy considerably worse:

“We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work.”

“I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. … And an enormous debt to boot!”

You just got destroyed on your entire FDR argument by the man who was in the administration, forgot more about economics than you will ever know, and who was the architect behind the New Deal. Only a Dumbocrat would actually argue with an expert who created something and then admitted it failed.

 

[hellofromwarsaw]

Luckily, this time the Dems got in before "common sense" Pubs totally wasted the economy. Now their austerity and job,jobs, jobs BS, and obstruction have stalled the recovery. Now we can get back to it, especially if the Pubs/TP STFU and even vote for some Pub style jobs bills they're blocking...unbelievable tools of the greedy rich...

 

[hellofromwarsaw]

Morgenthau was a bought off A-HOLE who fell on his face with austerity measures in 1938. The Geitner of his age...

 

[JakeStarkey]

The Tea Party is now finished as ineffective force in American politics. Why? Obama and the Dems get to raise the ceiling by another two trillion. Obama et al don't have to worry about this debt until after 2012. The BBA is a dead duck that won't float in Congress now. The Dems will go after and may well get increased revenues. The Dems may get up to five hundred billion in defense spending cuts.

As I said before, no matter how many times you repeat that stupid statement, you can't wish the Tea Party away. They stormed Washington last November when they sent nearly one of your useless, reckless spending, pro-Marxist Dumbocrats home to their unemployment lines and in 2012 they are going to finish the job.

You start every post with "the Tea Party is now finished" as if you can somehow convince people to turn to your radical Marxist/Socialist/Communist policies. Nobody is listening to you except for the other 10% of radical left-wing Communists out there.

Almost one dumocrat got send home, Rott? Should have been more. The Tea Party economic and cultural fascists of the far right have alerted the great responsible conservative and the center of the country that the fascists are out to punish the poor, make the middle class absorb the taxes that should be paid by the rich, and give business the key to U.S. treasury.

No matter how much you keep yapping like a chihuahuua, the TeaPots have shot their bolt.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

I think it's pretty sad that Reid & Democrats ended up passing Boehner's Plan after they insulted him and bitched about it for days. Petty partisan politics at its worst. All that bitching and feigned outrage,yet they ended up passing Boehner's Plan in the end anyway. What a bunch of douchebags.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Boehner's plan? Lib, are you drinking or drugging? You are fun to read, that comment is stupid.