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And to the accusation of being a liar.
Here are a few more posts where I've clearly laid out my position that birth certificate race identifications are self-selected by the parent(s) and not from a restrictive government list like BR claims.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3510221-post240.htmlWorldwatcher said:Thing about that birth certificate back in the 60's is that they were typed up based on what the individuals put down on paper forms and were not based on computer generated drop-down lists which limit you to a predefined list. What would have gone in the box is what the individual wrote (be it Dunham or Obama Sr.) and it's perfectly logical for someone from Africa, not familiar with American vernacular or idiom to list their race as African.
I remember being at the hospital when my kids were born, part of the paperwork was a worksheet that I filled out as a parent, that worksheet was then transcribed into the Birth Certificate issued by the government.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3512852-post330.htmlWorldwatcher said:A birth certificate is not a U.S. Government document. It is not filled out by the U.S. Government, it is completed by local hospitals based on information provided by the parent.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3513846-post395.htmlWorldwatcher said:Oh bullshit. The hospital would have had no idea what to put down. They wouldn't know whether to put White (Caucasian) or if I could claim a Hispanic derivative, or if I had Native American blood. (And no you can't tell just by looking at people.)
Actually I filled out the paperwork and it included race/ethnicity information, that is what is on the birth certificate.
What do you think the government conducts investigations as to race/ethnicity of it's patients? Do they use the local police, FBI or to they hire private investigators?
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3514325-post405.htmlWorldwatcher said:The person taking the hospital forms and then typing up medical records and hospital birth records - that are the sent to the government to create the official birth certificate - will never have even seen the person that filled out the forms.
Yes they would. Racial identifiers are SELF identification and when that information is provided by the individual it is completely up to them to SELF identify. If a fair skinned Irish redhead walks into our office to be hired and fills out her paperwork and lists black as her race, then that's what goes into the system. We do not have the authority to override a self identification.
That's her choice and we follow the self identification.
>>>>
>
And to the accusation of being a liar.
Here are a few more posts where I've clearly laid out my position that birth certificate race identifications are self-selected by the parent(s) and not from a restrictive government list like BR claims.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3510221-post240.htmlWorldwatcher said:Thing about that birth certificate back in the 60's is that they were typed up based on what the individuals put down on paper forms and were not based on computer generated drop-down lists which limit you to a predefined list. What would have gone in the box is what the individual wrote (be it Dunham or Obama Sr.) and it's perfectly logical for someone from Africa, not familiar with American vernacular or idiom to list their race as African.
I remember being at the hospital when my kids were born, part of the paperwork was a worksheet that I filled out as a parent, that worksheet was then transcribed into the Birth Certificate issued by the government.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3512852-post330.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3513846-post395.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3514325-post405.htmlWorldwatcher said:The person taking the hospital forms and then typing up medical records and hospital birth records - that are the sent to the government to create the official birth certificate - will never have even seen the person that filled out the forms.
Yes they would. Racial identifiers are SELF identification and when that information is provided by the individual it is completely up to them to SELF identify. If a fair skinned Irish redhead walks into our office to be hired and fills out her paperwork and lists black as her race, then that's what goes into the system. We do not have the authority to override a self identification.
That's her choice and we follow the self identification.
>>>>
Dude I could careless what you post you have been defending the African racial identifier this whole fucking thread, and now you say that hasn't been your claim. fuck you I know exactly what you have been defending and what you have claimed. Either produce a document from 1961 federal or state government that used African as a racial identifier. If not shut the fuck up.
You're a lying sack of shit You can't support what you have been defending and expect me to answer your question fuck you. I could care less about any other racial identifer non of those are part of my argument. I not defending aginst any other raical identifier. So go fuck yourself hack.
You should calm down before you do yourself an injury, bigreb.
YOU have claimed that the BC provided by Obama is not valid because the word African is in the racial identifier space for his father, and that it would not be accepted. YOU have posted another BC as evidence to compare to Obama's to try to show how there are differences, on which various words such as German and Korean are in a racial identifier space. YOU have posted some links about racial identifiers (I believe this is the post you mean) : http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/162416-trump-i-have-investigators-in-hawaii-they-cannot-believe-what-theyre-finding-21.html#post3512164. Are all the nationalities on the BC YOU posted listed? If not, regardless of Obama's BC, by your argument you have posted fraudulent evidence.
At best you are correct that African would not be accepted as a racial identifier for Obama's father, proving the BC he provided false, but you have also posted a false BC, so you may win this argument but lose credibility. At worst, and far more likely IMO, you are just spouting more birther nonsense for which you have no evidence while at the same time demanding others provide evidence to back up claims they have not made. Whatever the case, you certainly ARE running from the question of your posted evidence and are being dishonest.
I await the expected, "Fuck you! I don't have to explain myself!"
One more time back in the decade of the 60's African was not a racial identifer in America. Period. I don't care about the others
At best you are correct that African would not be accepted as a racial identifier for Obama's father, proving the BC he provided false, but you have also posted a false BC, so you may win this argument but lose credibility.
What false BC?
>
And to the accusation of being a liar.
Here are a few more posts where I've clearly laid out my position that birth certificate race identifications are self-selected by the parent(s) and not from a restrictive government list like BR claims.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3510221-post240.htmlWorldwatcher said:Thing about that birth certificate back in the 60's is that they were typed up based on what the individuals put down on paper forms and were not based on computer generated drop-down lists which limit you to a predefined list. What would have gone in the box is what the individual wrote (be it Dunham or Obama Sr.) and it's perfectly logical for someone from Africa, not familiar with American vernacular or idiom to list their race as African.
I remember being at the hospital when my kids were born, part of the paperwork was a worksheet that I filled out as a parent, that worksheet was then transcribed into the Birth Certificate issued by the government.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3512852-post330.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3513846-post395.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/3514325-post405.htmlWorldwatcher said:The person taking the hospital forms and then typing up medical records and hospital birth records - that are the sent to the government to create the official birth certificate - will never have even seen the person that filled out the forms.
Yes they would. Racial identifiers are SELF identification and when that information is provided by the individual it is completely up to them to SELF identify. If a fair skinned Irish redhead walks into our office to be hired and fills out her paperwork and lists black as her race, then that's what goes into the system. We do not have the authority to override a self identification.
That's her choice and we follow the self identification.
>>>>
Dude I could careless what you post you have been defending the African racial identifier this whole fucking thread, and now you say that hasn't been your claim. fuck you I know exactly what you have been defending and what you have claimed. Either produce a document from 1961 federal or state government that used African as a racial identifier. If not shut the fuck up.
OK - post the link. If you don't, then we'll talk about whether you lied.Because I googled it.....
Are you suggesting I lied?
You are a fucking idiot. I do hope you know that....
white africans - Google Search
I am a Sergeant, I do not lie. Dumb Ass.
Have you stopped running from his question? No.WOW.
Moron much?
OH so I'm running from his questiuon? and what is he doing to the one I asked him 35 pages ago? Fuck off.
OK - post the link. If you don't, then we'll talk about whether you lied.
You are a fucking idiot. I do hope you know that....
white africans - Google Search
I am a Sergeant, I do not lie. Dumb Ass.
Ok, maybe implying you might be lying was out of line, but what does your being a sergeant have to do with whether or not you lie?
One more time back in the decade of the 60's African was not a racial identifer in America. Period. I don't care about the others
One more time back in the decade of the 60's African was not a racial identifer in America. Period. I don't care about the others
And you STILL haven't backed up that bullshit.
Where is your link, Rebecca?
You are a fucking idiot. I do hope you know that....
white africans - Google Search
I am a Sergeant, I do not lie. Dumb Ass.
Ok, maybe implying you might be lying was out of line, but what does your being a sergeant have to do with whether or not you lie?
Uh...excuse me, but I didn't imply that. I asked him a simple question:
How do you know the nationality of each of those people?
That question was in response to his statement of fact that:
All the people in this Picture are African. Are they all of the same race?
Note that he says "All", and states it as fact. Now tell me if he is in a position to state that as fact by grabbing a photo from a page of photos, using the search term "white africans".
He may not have lied, but that only leaves "incredibly naive" or "just plain stupid".
Have you stopped running from his question? No.
OH so I'm running from his questiuon? and what is he doing to the one I asked him 35 pages ago? Fuck off.
You're a chickenshit! Answer his fucking question.
Or keep running.
>
And to the accusation of being a liar.
Here are a few more posts where I've clearly laid out my position that birth certificate race identifications are self-selected by the parent(s) and not from a restrictive government list like BR claims.
>>>>
Dude I could careless what you post you have been defending the African racial identifier this whole fucking thread, and now you say that hasn't been your claim. fuck you I know exactly what you have been defending and what you have claimed. Either produce a document from 1961 federal or state government that used African as a racial identifier. If not shut the fuck up.
This sounds like you are saying you don't care what WW has said, you only care what you think his motives are. That's at least as bad as some of the people who have assumed that all birthers must be racially motivated, whatever they may have said.
And, because I find it funny to do so, I will say either produce a document(s) from 1995 federal or state government that used Hawaiian, Chinese, Korean, German, English and Portuguese as racial identifiers or shut the fuck up.
And, because I find it funny to do so, I will say either produce a document(s) from 1995 federal or state government that used Hawaiian, Chinese, Korean, German, English and Portuguese as racial identifiers or shut the fuck up
You should calm down before you do yourself an injury, bigreb.
YOU have claimed that the BC provided by Obama is not valid because the word African is in the racial identifier space for his father, and that it would not be accepted. YOU have posted another BC as evidence to compare to Obama's to try to show how there are differences, on which various words such as German and Korean are in a racial identifier space. YOU have posted some links about racial identifiers (I believe this is the post you mean) : http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/162416-trump-i-have-investigators-in-hawaii-they-cannot-believe-what-theyre-finding-21.html#post3512164. Are all the nationalities on the BC YOU posted listed? If not, regardless of Obama's BC, by your argument you have posted fraudulent evidence.
At best you are correct that African would not be accepted as a racial identifier for Obama's father, proving the BC he provided false, but you have also posted a false BC, so you may win this argument but lose credibility. At worst, and far more likely IMO, you are just spouting more birther nonsense for which you have no evidence while at the same time demanding others provide evidence to back up claims they have not made. Whatever the case, you certainly ARE running from the question of your posted evidence and are being dishonest.
I await the expected, "Fuck you! I don't have to explain myself!"
One more time back in the decade of the 60's African was not a racial identifer in America. Period. I don't care about the others
At best you are correct that African would not be accepted as a racial identifier for Obama's father, proving the BC he provided false, but you have also posted a false BC, so you may win this argument but lose credibility.
What false BC?
Here's a link to your post, where YOU posted an image of a Hawaii BC which has 6 different races in the box for mother's race http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/164534-the-end-all-be-all-usmb-obama-birth-poll-7.html#post3567826. In 1995 (the date of of the birth) were Hawaiian, Chinese, Korean, German, English and Portuguese all valid racial identifiers? If they were not, then the document you posted is a fraud, by your own reasoning. Of course, if you weren't so wedded to the idea that Obama was not born in Hawaii, you might look at your own posted image and agree that perhaps they allow the parents to self-identify their race.
You are like a caricature of a birther. It's hard to believe anyone can be so willfully blind not only to the flaws in his overall arguments, but to the contradictory nature of the details he tries to use to bolster those arguments.
>
And to the accusation of being a liar.
Here are a few more posts where I've clearly laid out my position that birth certificate race identifications are self-selected by the parent(s) and not from a restrictive government list like BR claims.
>>>>
Dude I could careless what you post you have been defending the African racial identifier this whole fucking thread, and now you say that hasn't been your claim. fuck you I know exactly what you have been defending and what you have claimed. Either produce a document from 1961 federal or state government that used African as a racial identifier. If not shut the fuck up.
Depends on what you mean by "defending the African racial identifier", your incorrect claim is that because it wasn't on an official government list, that it could not have possibly been used on a Hawaiian birth certificate. It's true I disagree with that position because race on birth certificates is self-identified and is not restricted to some government list.
This position is supported by documents that YOU supplied in multiple threads that show "English", "German", "Korean", and "Portuguese" as a racial identifier and they are not on a government list either. To date you have provided no government racial identifier list which has listed those options for use on birth certificates.
So, if birth certificates are restricted to only those items that appear on some government list applicable to birth certificates you need to provide such a list that shows "English", "German", "Korean", and "Portuguese" as restricted values for Hawaii. If you can't supply a list supporting your position, then you have in fact inadvertently supported the position that race is self identified.
I can understand why you are getting so upset, it's kind of embarrassing to supply the information that disproves your own position. Probably why you are resorting to being insulting and using childish profanity.
>>>>
These fucking racist pricks make me sick when they deny their racism, no other president has ever been asked to release such information, its as if if you're black and the leader of this country you must prove something more than anyone else, who the hell is Donald Trump or any other racist prick to prove something to? The racist pricks just can't get themselves to accept that a black man sits in the WH and not as a servant or janitor.
That is the problem in a nutshell. Except one more thing. They also just cannot accept President Obama's intelligence. It just pisses them off something fierce.
Umm, not to nitpick, because I do think there was a certain amount of racism in the origin of this whole conspiracy theory, though I don't believe all birthers are necessarily racist...
But...
The subject of being a "Natural Born Citizen" has in fact been brought up before in several presidential races.
Natural Born Citizen Clause - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Specifically:
- Chester A. Arthur (18291886), 21st president of the United States, was rumored to have been born in Canada. This was never demonstrated by his Democratic opponents, although Arthur Hinman, an attorney who had investigated Arthur's family history, raised the objection during his vice-presidential campaign and after the end of his Presidency. Arthur was born in Vermont to a U.S. citizen mother and a father from Ireland, who was eventually naturalized as a U.S. citizen in 1843 (14 years after Chester was born). Despite the fact that his parents took up residence in the United States somewhere between 1822 and 1824, Chester Arthur additionally began to claim between 1870 and 1880 that he had been born in 1830, rather than in 1829, which only caused minor confusion and was even used in several publications. Arthur was sworn in as president when President Garfield died after being shot.
- Christopher Schürmann (born 1848 in New York) entered the Labor primaries during the 1896 Presidential election. His eligibility was questioned in a New York Tribune article, because he was born to alien parents of German nationality. It was stated that "various Attorney-Generals of the United States have expressed the opinion that a child born in this country of alien parents, who have not been naturalized, is, by the fact of birth, a native-born citizen entitled to all rights and privileges as such". But due to a lack of any statute on the subject, Schürmann's eligibility was "at best an open question, and one which should have made [his] nomination under any circumstances an impossibility", because questions concerning his eligibility could have been raised after the election.
- The eligibility of Charles Evans Hughes (18621948) was questioned in an article written by Breckinridge Long, and published in the Chicago Legal News during the U.S. presidential election of 1916, in which Hughes was narrowly defeated by Woodrow Wilson. Long claimed that Hughes was ineligible because his father had not yet naturalized at the time of his birth and was still a British citizen. Observing that Hughes, although born in the United States, was also a British subject and therefore "enjoy[ed] a dual nationality and owe[d] a double allegiance", Long argued that a native born citizen was not natural born without a unity of U.S. citizenship and allegiance and stated: "Now if, by any possible construction, a person at the instant of birth, and for any period of time thereafter, owes, or may owe, allegiance to any sovereign but the United States, he is not a 'natural-born' citizen of the United States."
- Barry Goldwater (19091998) was born in Phoenix, in what was then the incorporated Arizona Territory of the United States. During his presidential campaign in 1964, there was a minor controversy over Goldwater's having been born in Arizona when it was not yet a state.
- George Romney (19071995), who ran for the Republican party nomination in 1968, was born in Mexico to U.S. parents. Romney's grandfather had emigrated to Mexico in 1886 with his three wives and children after Utah outlawed polygamy. Romney's monogamous parents retained their U.S. citizenship and returned to the United States with him in 1912. Romney never received Mexican citizenship, because the country's nationality laws had been restricted to jus-sanguinis statutes due to prevailing politics aimed against American settlers.
- Lowell Weicker (born 1931), the former Connecticut Senator, Representative, and Governor, entered the race for the Republican party nomination of 1980 but dropped out before voting in the primaries began. He was born in Paris, France to parents who were U.S. citizens. His father was an executive for E. R. Squibb & Sons and his mother was the Indian-born daughter of a British general.
You're an idiot.
You guys really are going to claim that we're talking in "code" since you can't justifiably accuse us of racism any other way. Since we don't behave and speak in a racist manner, you have to claim that we're hiding our racism in CODE and if you just crack the code, you got us!
The only racists are the idiots who are using blacks, and race, to bolster up a party that has completely sickened the world. The only way you can pull people to you is by lying, and accusing the other side of the most foul behavior you can think of. And you don't care how many black people get hurt when you do it
BTW, do a search on this site of every foul racist word you can think of. I guarantee that the huge majority of people using them are left wingers
Are you serious??? You think that the only way a person can show their racism is by using the "N" word??? Don't you know that people get their racism noticed in ways that are often subtle?? Also, actions can convey racism, expressions can convey racism. Words can convey racism, such as this post from you!!! How stupid can you be???
yall have rendered the word racism meaningless the way you have tossed it around for the last 4 years. No matter what criticism ANYONE has of Obama racism charges get thrown out there.
Are you serious??? You think that the only way a person can show their racism is by using the "N" word??? Don't you know that people get their racism noticed in ways that are often subtle?? Also, actions can convey racism, expressions can convey racism. Words can convey racism, such as this post from you!!! How stupid can you be???
yall have rendered the word racism meaningless the way you have tossed it around for the last 4 years. No matter what criticism ANYONE has of Obama racism charges get thrown out there.
Not true. That ball went right over your head.
