Official Thread for Denial of GreenHouse Effect and Radiative Physics.

[Thevolunteerwino]

I don't think your question is well-posed. I presume you are referring to what is good for humans. Yes the flora and fauna can adapt to a wide range of temperatures, but a problem will occur when trying to adapt to a climate changing rapidly within one generation. It will affect farming regions, sea side cities, ocean ecology, invasive species, etc.

The question should be about the rate of change of climate, not which direction it's headed.

We've endured a single degree centigrade temperature rise over the past 100 years ... why would you characterize a single degree centigrade over 50 years as "rapid" ... and that's actually two generations ... the infant born today would be welcoming their grandchildren in 50 years ...

What crops do not grow where 100 years ago they florished? ... which sea side city cannot add two or three feet to their sea walls over 100 years? ... how could a slight increase in temperature stop over-fishing the oceans? ... how does a change in climate cause humans to start releasing their unwanted pets into the wild? ...

"Rate of change" has a very specific definition in this context ... using Newtonian notation: f'(T, P, RH, w, r) [where T=temperature, P=pressure, RH=relative humidity, w=the wind vector, r=precipitation] ... with respect to time ... if all these parameters remain within instrumentation error, then we can conclude climate change cannot be measured ... f'(T, P, RH, w, r) = 0 ...

I'm sorry, environmental devastation better correlates to human population growth ... the more people raping the Earth, the worst off the Earth is ...

Not just population growth. I find that somewhat misleading. As I travel the country in my car I find most of it is vacant of human population. Huge swaths of land across the country are void of human life.
Im not saying the population numbers dont contribute to devestation. Im just saying its not at the core of the problem. DDT and other examples show how industrial science mixed with irresponsible marketing and proliferation contribute greatly as well. With only 1/ 4 of the current population we still would have polluted streams and destroyed the ozone. It just would have taken longer to show itself and we would have less people anf scientists to recognize the problem as well.
I was an avid organic gardener for years and had a good instruction from experience on the tenacity of life amd the earth and how well it loves to work in unison. Im not so much sure its too much population as it is irresponsibility of management of our current science.
Even now we are supposed to be solving a misguided warming theory with electric cars which tear up bog ponds in other countries for lithium. The bogs seem unimportant but unknowingly the microbes in the bottom contribute to the ecosystem above.
In the end to the marketing and their paid science its not about the planet we are living on its about profit. And in the end when things get desperate they can always blame the population even though they knew better about their actions from the start. Its not simply the population. Change must start from the top and they must first admit their wrongs and the problems they are causing. In this increasing technological age with nano tech, nuclear tech. Space knowledge. etc.. Even a few people can in theory destroy the planet unawares.
And it looks as if they will make it so if they dont change their perspective very soon.
And yes adapting to a changing planet amd its climate is easy. You learn that from working with your fingers in the earth and observing growing things.
But changing an entire adapting planets environment is like medically trying to treat the symptoms of a disease while ignoring the cause. It becomes very difficult to save the patient.

 

[Wuwei]

Wuwei. I believe if people would quit fighting and get along. They would adapt amd help each other out. Plenty of time to adjust and adapt to new housing locations and new crops. Where you see trauma I see opportunity

"if people would quit fighting and get along"
There's the rub.

 

[Wuwei]

We've endured a single degree centigrade temperature rise over the past 100 years ... why would you characterize a single degree centigrade over 50 years as "rapid" ... and that's actually two generations ... the infant born today would be welcoming their grandchildren in 50 years ...

I did not say that I think there has been a rapid change. My point is only that a rapid rate of change is more difficult problem than a stable temperature that is several degrees different one way or another. It was a hypothetical remark.

What crops do not grow where 100 years ago they florished? ... which sea side city cannot add two or three feet to their sea walls over 100 years? ... how could a slight increase in temperature stop over-fishing the oceans? ... how does a change in climate cause humans to start releasing their unwanted pets into the wild? ...

Again you are reading to much into my post that isn't there.

"Rate of change" has a very specific definition in this context ... using Newtonian notation: f'(T, P, RH, w, r) [where T=temperature, P=pressure, RH=relative humidity, w=the wind vector, r=precipitation] ... with respect to time ... if all these parameters remain within instrumentation error, then we can conclude climate change cannot be measured ... f'(T, P, RH, w, r) = 0 ...

Thermodynamics is way outside the context of my post. It would be more practical to measure rate of change by changes in precipitation, regional temperature changes, flooding increases, etc. Eg. the wine industry in France is very sensitive to those changes and is currently beginning to suffer. But who cares about wine.

IMO it will take a few decades to see if there is a climate change problem.

I'm sorry, environmental devastation better correlates to human population growth ... the more people raping the Earth, the worst off the Earth is ...

Of course.
.

 

[jc456]

......
So my first question I always ask the other individual on this subject is according to our planets point in history which direction should we be headed right now?
.....
It happens all the time. Adapt to it.

I don't think your question is well-posed. I presume you are referring to what is good for humans. Yes the flora and fauna can adapt to a wide range of temperatures, but a problem will occur when trying to adapt to a climate changing rapidly within one generation. It will affect farming regions, sea side cities, ocean ecology, invasive species, etc.

The question should be about the rate of change of climate, not which direction it's headed.

where is that happening at?

 

[evenflow1969]

To be honest I never considered myself a climate change denier.

More of a climate change encourager. I fully encourage the appearance of Palm Trees in Duluth. Being tommorows forecast calls for snow in the area, I am completely discouraged about the current rate of warming.

Um, ya know you can just move south for such a thing. Meanwhile the plats and animals in your area like the weather.

 

[ReinyDays]

Um, ya know you can just move south for such a thing. Meanwhile the plats and animals in your area like the weather.

No they don't ... look at your maple tree ... looks dead doesn't it? ... see how the deer are starving? ... how many birds just flat desert your area for winter? ... if there's snow on the ground where you live, you've made a terrible mistake ... there's a reason Fargo is the butt of so many jokes ...

 

[ding]

the more people raping the Earth, the worst off the Earth is

I never saw myself as raping the earth.

 

[ding]

Not sure how anyone can deny the greenhouse effect or radiative physics.

 

[ReinyDays]

Not sure how anyone can deny the greenhouse effect or radiative physics.

They don't come around anymore ... they believed that photons come with return addresses on them ... individual molecules can then decide which ones to keep and which ones to return to sender ... oh, and molecules are very conscientious and only send photons to good homes ... where they'll be loved and adored and get regular visits to the photon doctor down the block ...

[sigh] ...

 

[ding]

Not sure how anyone can deny the greenhouse effect or radiative physics.

They don't come around anymore ... they believed that photons come with return addresses on them ... individual molecules can then decide which ones to keep and which ones to return to sender ... oh, and molecules are very conscientious and only send photons to good homes ... where they'll be loved and adored and get regular visits to the photon doctor down the block ...

[sigh] ...

I don't think so.

 

[ReinyDays]

Thank you ... it's been awhile since I've seen a video about physics where no house cat was harmed ...

 

[james bond]

Thank you ... it's been awhile since I've seen a video about physics where no house cat was harmed ...

I'm getting my next door neighbor a house kitten for Christmas because my dog chased one of her three feral cats away. But I'm not sure if she wants a house kitten. I'm hoping she goes for it.



What's weird is I see the cat as my dogs chase it out of the bushes along the river, but there no way I can catch it. I set out a trap, but it caught a skunk. Ugh. The SPCA man came out and shot it with an air gun and put a big hole in the cage.

 

[esalla]

Wuwei. I believe if people would quit fighting and get along. They would adapt amd help each other out. Plenty of time to adjust and adapt to new housing locations and new crops. Where you see trauma I see opportunity

"if people would quit fighting and get along"
There's the rub.

And if people would stop cooking dogs alive

 

[Resnic]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

 

[miketx]

This planet is 4.5 billion years old.

So they tell you.

 

[ChemEngineer]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean View attachment 486842

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

The 1977 issue is fake. I deplore mendacity.

 

[sparky]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean View attachment 486842

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

Agnotology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

~S~

 

[jc456]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean View attachment 486842

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

The 1977 issue is fake. I deplore mendacity.

prove it.

 

[jc456]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean View attachment 486842

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

Agnotology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

~S~

how old do you think this planet is? are you saying the land masses didn't split? are you saying we didn't have a global ice age? what exactly is stupid? come on man stand up and be noticed.

 

[Crick]

I'm not sure where I fall.

This planet is 4.5 billion years old. This planet has been through worldwide fires, worldwide floods, bombardment by cosmic radiation, the depletion and rebuilding of the ozone layer, a total reversal of the poles, entire land masses breaking apart, major techtonic damage, the ice age, hit by countless meteors, extinction of entire species, volcanos and a lot more million and billions of years before we even showed up. I can't help but wonder if we're just going through a phase yet again. Earth is not static, it's chaotic, always changing. We have only been here in the blink of an eye and only a small portion of that has been with real science and real equipment. What is going now has happened thousands of times already.

I mean View attachment 486842

In the 70s we had scientic proof and everyone agreed we were headed into an ice age because of nuclear power being a prime problem. It was a fact we had an ice age coming.

In this day and age of everyone using anything they can as an agenda or to spin a narrative it's hard for me to take any of it serious. Climate change is a big big business with million dollar grants floating around, speeches to be made, tshirts to be printed, podcasts made on it with sponsors and so on. We all know people will do anything for money, even exploiting the climate trend.

But then again pollution could be a contributing factor but I don't believe it to be the sole one. We haven't even had heavy industry that long in the grand scheme of things.

There was never any consensus among scientists that we were heading into an ice age. There were a few individuals leaning that way and the media picked up on it.