Olympic Arms, Inc. bans all sales to the State of New York Government

[J.E.D]

In other words, another swing and a miss for BigDerp

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Doesn't really matter as long as the State is in compliance with federal import laws. If the Feds banned certain companies, like Bush did with Norinco, then the state couldn't purchase from them. Otherwise should be OK. Many foreign arms manufacturers are on the free market.

True, but they would have too get the ok from the fed's

Meaning your contention that the city of Buffalo can't go to a foreign source to buy arms is so much nonsense.....

They can't do it on their own, yes or no?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Why not?

Article. I. section 10

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Doesn't really matter as long as the State is in compliance with federal import laws. If the Feds banned certain companies, like Bush did with Norinco, then the state couldn't purchase from them. Otherwise should be OK. Many foreign arms manufacturers are on the free market.

True, but they would have too get the ok from the fed's

Meaning your contention that the city of Buffalo can't go to a foreign source to buy arms is so much nonsense.....

They "may" enter into such agreement. Good luck getting the guns into the country.
Big Reb is on a stretch. But it's not unlikely that not only states, but county and municipal governments have laws and regulations that provide for the purchase of American made goods. Many of the states where unions represent all government workers, those purchases most likely must be made from companies that have organized labor.
I will ask, when is the last time you or anyone else saw a state/county or municipal vehicle that was NOT American made?
Anyway, moot point. These firearms manufacturers actions will certainly create problems for the offending governments.
People on your side cannot stand it that someone is standing up to unjust and overbearing government.

 

[thereisnospoon]

OK, here is the rest:

"No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it's inspection Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress."

"No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay."

2nd paragraph deals with duties and imports. Nothing applies there.

3rd paragraph, more about duties, no troops or ships of war in time of peace, agreements or compacts with other States or foreign powers, engaging in war unless invaded... Still not seeing anything preventing a State from purchasing weapons from any supplier that suits its needs, so long as they are complying with federal import laws.

<sigh>
You aren't seeing it because you don't want too see it

No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any Duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay.

The city of Buffalo or for that matters any city, would have to do an agreement (CONTRACT) to make a purchase for the firearms.
AND the original disagreement was going too a foreign country to get arms.

They would be entering an agreement with a foreign company, not a foreign government. As long as they are in compliance with the export laws of the foreign country and the import laws of the US, where is the problem? If your argument is that purchasing something from another country = a treaty, agreement, or compact, then how would any state be able to import foodstuffs from other countries? Go to your local supermarket. You will see lettuce from Mexico, grapes from Peru, oranges from Australia. Do you have to sign a treaty to purchase these items?

Many nations subsidize domestic business. Many others are owned or at least partnered with the national government.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I find a pile of irony in this thread and for that matter any thread where libs are so willing to get into bed with central government. For it was the birth of the liberal movement in the 1960's that was adamantly opposed to the central government.
Now the left is enamored with government. They cannot wait until the federal government controls all aspects of business and social issues.

 

[Borillar]

Article. I. section 10

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

 

[Montrovant]

Article. I. section 10

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

Wow. Where did this come from?

First, 'you libs'? Since when did I become a lib? Do you, in fact, know anything at all about my politics, or are you making a huge assumption based on....well....pretty much nothing at all?

What do unions have to do with the point of contention here? Not a damn thing, so far as I can tell.

bigreb claimed that article 1 section 10 would prevent the city of Buffalo from buying arms from a foreign source. I was questioning that claim. In the end, by his own admission, it is untrue. That's the entirety of the conversation between the two of us. Where did the basis of this little rant come from, other than your own delusions?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false.

OH fuck you're right I'm wrong all gun companies outside the united states are privately owned and not run by the government in the country they are based in. They are all run by private ownership.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

Wow. Where did this come from?

First, 'you libs'? Since when did I become a lib? Do you, in fact, know anything at all about my politics, or are you making a huge assumption based on....well....pretty much nothing at all?

What do unions have to do with the point of contention here? Not a damn thing, so far as I can tell.

bigreb claimed that article 1 section 10 would prevent the city of Buffalo from buying arms from a foreign source. I was questioning that claim. In the end, by his own admission, it is untrue. That's the entirety of the conversation between the two of us. Where did the basis of this little rant come from, other than your own delusions?

OH fuck you're right I'm wrong all gun companies outside the united states are privately owned and not run by the government in the country they are based in. They are all run by private ownership.

 

[Montrovant]

I find a pile of irony in this thread and for that matter any thread where libs are so willing to get into bed with central government. For it was the birth of the liberal movement in the 1960's that was adamantly opposed to the central government.
Now the left is enamored with government. They cannot wait until the federal government controls all aspects of business and social issues.

Considering your apparent desire to label people libs based on little to no information, I find it hard to take your opinion of them very seriously.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I find a pile of irony in this thread and for that matter any thread where libs are so willing to get into bed with central government. For it was the birth of the liberal movement in the 1960's that was adamantly opposed to the central government.
Now the left is enamored with government. They cannot wait until the federal government controls all aspects of business and social issues.

Considering your apparent desire to label people libs based on little to no information, I find it hard to take your opinion of them very seriously.

And you would be what?

 

[Borillar]

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false.

OH fuck you're right I'm wrong all gun companies outside the united states are privately owned and not run by the government in the country they are based in. They are all run by private ownership.

Now who is desperate? Nobody claimed that all arms manufacturers outside the US were privately owned. The claim is that the state is free to purchase from any source that passes federal import restrictions and regulations.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false.

OH fuck you're right I'm wrong all gun companies outside the united states are privately owned and not run by the government in the country they are based in. They are all run by private ownership.

Now who is desperate? Nobody claimed that all arms manufacturers outside the US were privately owned. The claim is that the state is free to purchase from any source that passes federal import restrictions and regulations.

If they aren't privately own that means the state would have to go to a foreign power and make a contract to get access to more guns?

 

[Borillar]

OH fuck you're right I'm wrong all gun companies outside the united states are privately owned and not run by the government in the country they are based in. They are all run by private ownership.

Now who is desperate? Nobody claimed that all arms manufacturers outside the US were privately owned. The claim is that the state is free to purchase from any source that passes federal import restrictions and regulations.

If they aren't privately own that means the state would have to go to a foreign power and make a contract to get access to more guns?

State agencies could purchase from foreign companies as long as they are in compliance with federal import laws and restrictions. If the foreign company is restricted from sales in the US, then the state couldn't do business with them. Then again, the State is more likely to want to deal with privately owned foreign companies like Glock, Sig Sauer, and Steyr than deal with cheap knockoffs from Communist bloc countries anyway.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Now who is desperate? Nobody claimed that all arms manufacturers outside the US were privately owned. The claim is that the state is free to purchase from any source that passes federal import restrictions and regulations.

If they aren't privately own that means the state would have to go to a foreign power and make a contract to get access to more guns?

State agencies could purchase from foreign companies as long as they are in compliance with federal import laws and restrictions. If the foreign company is restricted from sales in the US, then the state couldn't do business with them. Then again, the State is more likely to want to deal with privately owned foreign companies like Glock, Sig Sauer, and Steyr than deal with cheap knockoffs from Communist bloc countries anyway.

If those companies are not privately own that would mean they are government controlled which means going through a foreign power to obtain those firearms?
I'm not going to allow you too slide on this.

 

[thereisnospoon]

What does that have to do with buying arms from a foreign source? I can't wait to hear your *logic* on this one.

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

However, it is the law in New York and most other states that all business must be done with the lowest bidder.
Plus, doing business with foreign companies is not politically expedient.
Please do not smugly assume this action will not have an effect on NY or the state government. It will.
Even if NY finds a way around this, it's a pain in the ass and it's expensive.
The point it to make one's voice heard and make one's intentions hurt.
If that is not acceptable to you or anyone else, well that's just to bad.
I find it ironic that those on the left are just full of piss an vinegar over civil disobedience ( Occupy Wall Street being a perfect example) but when the protest is in opposition to something liberals support suddenly civil disobedience or public protest is a horrible concept.
Can't have it both ways.

 

[Borillar]

Oh please. You libs together with union interests have been bleating about "buy American" because you are wetting your underoos over the losses unions are taking.
Now it's "so what" if they buy foreign.
Did it ever occur to you hypocritical flit boys that many of the domestic gun manufacturers might just be staffed with workers who are also members of unions?
Nah, of course not. That wouldn't fit the narrative.
Ahh yes. Politics of convenience. An exclusive province of the liberal left.

There was a contention that a state government couldn't procure arms from a foreign source. That has been shown to be false. Now chances are that state police agencies would purchase their arms domestically. If a company like Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with or in a state, that's their business. The state can simply go to another vendor. There are over 115 firearms manufacturing companies in the US. NY can get them from the other 112 domestic manufacturers, or one of the many foreign companies. One company, or three companies not doing business would not provide any burden on the state at all. Plus, no evidence has been presented that these companies ever had any business with NY to begin with.

However, it is the law in New York and most other states that all business must be done with the lowest bidder.
Plus, doing business with foreign companies is not politically expedient.
Please do not smugly assume this action will not have an effect on NY or the state government. It will.
Even if NY finds a way around this, it's a pain in the ass and it's expensive.
The point it to make one's voice heard and make one's intentions hurt.
If that is not acceptable to you or anyone else, well that's just to bad.
I find it ironic that those on the left are just full of piss an vinegar over civil disobedience ( Occupy Wall Street being a perfect example) but when the protest is in opposition to something liberals support suddenly civil disobedience or public protest is a horrible concept.
Can't have it both ways.

Don't get me wrong. I'm perfectly fine with a company choosing whether or not to do business with anybody. Just like I'm fine with anybody choosing to frequent or boycott any business. If Olympic Arms doesn't want to do business with the State of NY, it's no skin off my nose. But since they didn't do business with NY anyway, it is kind of a hollow protest, IMHO. NY doesn't have to find a way around this, because they don't do business with them to begin with. Even if they did, there is no shortage of vendors to choose from. They just have to go and get bids.

 

[Borillar]

If they aren't privately own that means the state would have to go to a foreign power and make a contract to get access to more guns?

State agencies could purchase from foreign companies as long as they are in compliance with federal import laws and restrictions. If the foreign company is restricted from sales in the US, then the state couldn't do business with them. Then again, the State is more likely to want to deal with privately owned foreign companies like Glock, Sig Sauer, and Steyr than deal with cheap knockoffs from Communist bloc countries anyway.

If those companies are not privately own that would mean they are government controlled which means going through a foreign power to obtain those firearms?
I'm not going to allow you too slide on this.

What part of compliance with federal import laws and restrictions don't you understand? If it is OK with the Federal laws, a state can do business with the foreign companies in question.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Again, this sort of thing is hilarious to me.

Did Olympic Arms have any contracts with New York law enforcement before? And what point do they think they're making? It's not like there aren't plenty of other companies that make AR15s and 1911s.

Denying their company lucrative government contracts doesn't seem to effect anyone but themselves.

You are so right, none of the hundreds of thousands of people who work for the government ever shopped in that store before.

Explaining the point would require you to understand English.