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Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

I think we can see how far society still has to travel.

If you are in the cake business then you sell cakes to the public. Not just to those whose sex lives pass your bigoted standards.

B'loney. That is not the point of the Tolerance. In a DIVERSE society, people are free to have beliefs which may offend others. The most basic right is the right to be left alone. To be forced into service of another, even if it's for money, is a violation of that right.

What people who promote PC Tolerance and Diversity always forget is that, in their pursuit of their Social Justice Cause, they trample of the rights of others.

The bakers weren't preventing the couple from getting married or buying a cake from someone else. They just did not want to be forced to provide Their Labor in the service of something that violated their beliefs.

Tolerance is Not Acceptance and Not Forced Participation.

Tolerance is a two way street, the lesbians should have tolerated the baker's beliefs


Should they? Shouldn't the bakers have tolerated that society is a place where people should feel they aren't being persecuted?

Would you tolerate a person who hates Americans living and working in America?

Poor analogy, there are people living and working (well a few) in America who hate real Americans....progressives

How is it a poor analogy if you then say there are such people? The point being that they have a right to their views, even if they hate America, but no doubt many people will tell them to leave America if they don't like America.

I don't go around telling anyone to leave America, I tolerate them...as the lesbians should have tolerated the bakers. Again, it's a two way street but you on the left and the gays keep pushing it....this time there is blowback and it flabbergasts you it happened.
 
Owning a business that is open to the public involves certain responsibilities. I have a business open to the public and I understand them. I do not refuse service to anybody based upon color, ethnicity, or sexual orientation.

As far as the cakes are concerned, I do not believe a baker should be required to write a message upon one that violates their principles, but the simple act of baking one does not mean one is endorsing anything.

That being said, the couple involved did have other options at their disposal. They could have approached a different baker instead of filing a lawsuit, and so they surely must have known that they would be making themselves public figures and that there would be a backlash.
 
B'loney. That is not the point of the Tolerance. In a DIVERSE society, people are free to have beliefs which may offend others. The most basic right is the right to be left alone. To be forced into service of another, even if it's for money, is a violation of that right.

What people who promote PC Tolerance and Diversity always forget is that, in their pursuit of their Social Justice Cause, they trample of the rights of others.

The bakers weren't preventing the couple from getting married or buying a cake from someone else. They just did not want to be forced to provide Their Labor in the service of something that violated their beliefs.

Tolerance is Not Acceptance and Not Forced Participation.

Tolerance is a two way street, the lesbians should have tolerated the baker's beliefs
They didnt give a toss about the bakers beliefs. They just wanted a cake.
They got their cake and put this baker out of business with the protests they inspired. Now they learn that they had a price to pay themselves.

The price of being bullied by religious fanatics from a religion that claims not to act in such a manner?
The price of being a bully themselves. Which is a good thing. They are experiencing the consequences of their own actions.

Were they bullying? Or just making sure the law was being upheld? I mean, if someone murders someone then you go to the police and tell them, are you bullying?
 
I think we can see how far society still has to travel.

If you are in the cake business then you sell cakes to the public. Not just to those whose sex lives pass your bigoted standards.

B'loney. That is not the point of the Tolerance. In a DIVERSE society, people are free to have beliefs which may offend others. The most basic right is the right to be left alone. To be forced into service of another, even if it's for money, is a violation of that right.

What people who promote PC Tolerance and Diversity always forget is that, in their pursuit of their Social Justice Cause, they trample of the rights of others.

The bakers weren't preventing the couple from getting married or buying a cake from someone else. They just did not want to be forced to provide Their Labor in the service of something that violated their beliefs.

Tolerance is Not Acceptance and Not Forced Participation.

Tolerance is a two way street, the lesbians should have tolerated the baker's beliefs


Should they? Shouldn't the bakers have tolerated that society is a place where people should feel they aren't being persecuted?

Would you tolerate a person who hates Americans living and working in America?


It's not persecution to refuse the business of someone. That is just plain nonsense.

I see signs in restaurants that say "No shoes, no shirts, no service". That's discrimination against Nudists, but such discrimination is allowed.
An infant could craft a better argument. Are you seriously putting that forward ?
 
They didnt give a toss about the bakers beliefs. They just wanted a cake.

And the bakers' beliefs include things like "don't cross over the road and ignore those who you might not like", oh, they were quickly forgotten, weren't they?


The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.
 
Tolerance is a two way street, the lesbians should have tolerated the baker's beliefs
They didnt give a toss about the bakers beliefs. They just wanted a cake.
They got their cake and put this baker out of business with the protests they inspired. Now they learn that they had a price to pay themselves.

The price of being bullied by religious fanatics from a religion that claims not to act in such a manner?
The price of being a bully themselves. Which is a good thing. They are experiencing the consequences of their own actions.

Were they bullying? Or just making sure the law was being upheld? I mean, if someone murders someone then you go to the police and tell them, are you bullying?
You are equating cake baking with murder?
 
Can we have a collective "AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

In all seriousness, I am absolutely against anyone harassing these women, but they are the ones who went after the Klein's.

The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

It's just a cake, Laurel Bowman-Cryer used to tell her wife, Rachel. But three and a half years have passed, and the hate mail keeps coming.

Back in 2013, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa made headlines when they refused to make the lesbians' wedding cake. A state official, in a move that's redefined his political career, eventually ordered the bakers to pay $135,000.

The Bowman-Cryers have received thousands of Facebook messages, each one calling them fat or evil, the dumb lesbians who ruined those Christian bakers' lives.

As they waited for their daughter's school bus this May, Rachel's cell phone dinged with a new missive.

"I am buying up my ammo right now you filthy, ugly, disgusting, fat, stupid, cruel, anti-Christian piece of liberal scum," she read aloud. "I am getting ready for the war so I hope you have a good hiding place, you sick, disgusting, miserable, piece of degenerate lesbian scum."

The Bowman-Cryers say they never wanted the money, which remains locked in a government account. They say they never wanted a war.

For three and a half years, they have hidden, believing in time their names would disappear from the headlines. They didn't answer the phone. They declined hundreds of interviews, quit their jobs and stopped leaving the house.

Their silence has not protected them. As the Bowman-Cryers retreated, the fury over their case grew louder.

The bakers, Aaron and Melissa Klein, appealed their fines and hired former President George H.W. Bush's White House lawyer. They toured the country with presidential candidate Ted Cruz as the face of a new fight for business owners' religious freedom.

The legalization of same-sex marriage isn't the end of the story, the Kleins told crowds from Iowa to Washington, D.C. The government, they said, wants to force Christian business owners to help gay people marry. The solution, the Kleins warned receptive lawmakers, would be legislation protecting religious liberty. Arkansas, North Carolina and Mississippi have approved bills since then, curtailing the civil rights gay people fought to win.


The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

IMO the bakers should have to bake the cake. However, I'm not for ruining people's lives over this. Just fine the bakers a reasonable amount ($135K?? REALLY? That's beyond fucking excessive) and move on to another baker. Everyone is wrong here - The baker for not baking the cake, the lesbians for being part of a movement that tries to ruin people's lives and the state official for fining the bakers an absurd amount.

It's an ugly situation. This is easily solved - If the baker refuses to bake the cake, then fine the baker what it would cost for the couple to buy a cake at another store and leave it at that. Neither side needs to ruin people's lives over this.
 
And the bakers' beliefs include things like "don't cross over the road and ignore those who you might not like", oh, they were quickly forgotten, weren't they?


The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.

How is it sinful to take part in a wedding? How is it sinful to make a cake that ends up in a wedding sinful? Makes no sense to me.

It sounds like people who want it to be a sin.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:25-37 - New International Version

Luke 10:25-37

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’a]">[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b]”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic]">[c] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

This suggests you'd make the cake.
 
They didnt give a toss about the bakers beliefs. They just wanted a cake.
They got their cake and put this baker out of business with the protests they inspired. Now they learn that they had a price to pay themselves.

The price of being bullied by religious fanatics from a religion that claims not to act in such a manner?
The price of being a bully themselves. Which is a good thing. They are experiencing the consequences of their own actions.

Were they bullying? Or just making sure the law was being upheld? I mean, if someone murders someone then you go to the police and tell them, are you bullying?
You are equating cake baking with murder?

I'm equating one law with another law. Don't try and go off on one about murder and making a cake. This is about LAWS. Christians need to OBEY THE LAW right? Yes or not? Does a Christian have to follow the laws of the USA regardless of whether it is a small law or a large law?
 
The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.

How is it sinful to take part in a wedding? How is it sinful to make a cake that ends up in a wedding sinful? Makes no sense to me.

It sounds like people who want it to be a sin.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:25-37 - New International Version

Luke 10:25-37

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’a]">[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b]”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic]">[c] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

This suggests you'd make the cake.


Or not....

This world is full of sinners, and we must be careful to not be partakers with them. Eph. 5:3-7
 
Can we have a collective "AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

In all seriousness, I am absolutely against anyone harassing these women, but they are the ones who went after the Klein's.

The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

It's just a cake, Laurel Bowman-Cryer used to tell her wife, Rachel. But three and a half years have passed, and the hate mail keeps coming.

Back in 2013, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa made headlines when they refused to make the lesbians' wedding cake. A state official, in a move that's redefined his political career, eventually ordered the bakers to pay $135,000.

The Bowman-Cryers have received thousands of Facebook messages, each one calling them fat or evil, the dumb lesbians who ruined those Christian bakers' lives.

As they waited for their daughter's school bus this May, Rachel's cell phone dinged with a new missive.

"I am buying up my ammo right now you filthy, ugly, disgusting, fat, stupid, cruel, anti-Christian piece of liberal scum," she read aloud. "I am getting ready for the war so I hope you have a good hiding place, you sick, disgusting, miserable, piece of degenerate lesbian scum."

The Bowman-Cryers say they never wanted the money, which remains locked in a government account. They say they never wanted a war.

For three and a half years, they have hidden, believing in time their names would disappear from the headlines. They didn't answer the phone. They declined hundreds of interviews, quit their jobs and stopped leaving the house.

Their silence has not protected them. As the Bowman-Cryers retreated, the fury over their case grew louder.

The bakers, Aaron and Melissa Klein, appealed their fines and hired former President George H.W. Bush's White House lawyer. They toured the country with presidential candidate Ted Cruz as the face of a new fight for business owners' religious freedom.

The legalization of same-sex marriage isn't the end of the story, the Kleins told crowds from Iowa to Washington, D.C. The government, they said, wants to force Christian business owners to help gay people marry. The solution, the Kleins warned receptive lawmakers, would be legislation protecting religious liberty. Arkansas, North Carolina and Mississippi have approved bills since then, curtailing the civil rights gay people fought to win.

The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

IMO the bakers should have to bake the cake. However, I'm not for ruining people's lives over this. Just fine the bakers a reasonable amount ($135K?? REALLY? That's beyond fucking excessive) and move on to another baker. Everyone is wrong here - The baker for not baking the cake, the lesbians for being part of a movement that tries to ruin people's lives and the state official for fining the bakers an absurd amount.

It's an ugly situation. This is easily solved - If the baker refuses to bake the cake, then fine the baker what it would cost for the couple to buy a cake at another store and leave it at that. Neither side needs to ruin people's lives over this.


However had the bakers followed the law they signed up to abide by as business owners, then they wouldn't have gotten into the mess.
 
I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.

How is it sinful to take part in a wedding? How is it sinful to make a cake that ends up in a wedding sinful? Makes no sense to me.

It sounds like people who want it to be a sin.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:25-37 - New International Version

Luke 10:25-37

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’a]">[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b]”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic]">[c] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

This suggests you'd make the cake.


Or not....

This world is full of sinners, and we must be careful to not be partakers with them. Eph. 5:3-7

So in other words Christians can do what the hell they like because their religious book justifies ANYTHING?
 
I feel no pity for them. None. Zip. Nada. They brought this on themselves and now they can live with it.

Am I against the LGBT community? Nope. But I am against idiots that want to force themselves onto people when a LGBT bakery would have LOVED to have had their business. Why not support them with baking their cake? Why MAKE someone go against their own beliefs with a lawsuit?

I agree. Americans hate bullies. These two acted like bullies.
 
And the bakers' beliefs include things like "don't cross over the road and ignore those who you might not like", oh, they were quickly forgotten, weren't they?


The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.
Laughable.

Is there a definitive list of "sinner" that they would refuse to serve ?

Maybe a couple getting remarried ? Or an adulterer getting a cake for his girlfriend ? Or a swindler using dirty money to buy his cake ? Or a wifebeater or a single mother buying a cake for her bastard kids, or muslims,or hindus or athiests ?

Its just bigotry targeting a minority.
 
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.

How is it sinful to take part in a wedding? How is it sinful to make a cake that ends up in a wedding sinful? Makes no sense to me.

It sounds like people who want it to be a sin.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:25-37 - New International Version

Luke 10:25-37

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’a]">[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b]”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic]">[c] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

This suggests you'd make the cake.


Or not....

This world is full of sinners, and we must be careful to not be partakers with them. Eph. 5:3-7

So in other words Christians can do what the hell they like because their religious book justifies ANYTHING?


You mean like lesbans can do it because some law justifies it? You're missing the two way street thing. If gays want tolerance they have to be prepared to be tolerant. To date they are failing in epic fashion and the blowback they got on this is why. They should have walked away...but nope they had to press it and now they demonized themselves
 
Where did Jesus command anyone to be robbers? Did Jesus command anyone to hide the robbers or fence the stolen goods?

What is or is not sinful to another individual is not your judgment to make. It doesn't need to make sense to you. The bakers said to them same sex marriage is a sin. They will refuse to commit that sin. They aren't stopping anyone else from comitting a sin.

The government commands that Christians sin or be punished. The government has become the national pastor to interpret the Bible for the national flock.

Someone is shocked that there would be a backlash against the perverts that put this Christian couple to the financial rack.
 
The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.
Laughable.

Is there a definitive list of "sinner" that they would refuse to serve ?

Maybe a couple getting remarried ? Or an adulterer getting a cake for his girlfriend ? Or a swindler using dirty money to buy his cake ? Or a wifebeater or a single mother buying a cake for her bastard kids, or muslims,or hindus or athiests ?

Its just bigotry targeting a minority.
Now the minority is getting what's coming to them.
 
Can we have a collective "AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

In all seriousness, I am absolutely against anyone harassing these women, but they are the ones who went after the Klein's.

The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

It's just a cake, Laurel Bowman-Cryer used to tell her wife, Rachel. But three and a half years have passed, and the hate mail keeps coming.

Back in 2013, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa made headlines when they refused to make the lesbians' wedding cake. A state official, in a move that's redefined his political career, eventually ordered the bakers to pay $135,000.

The Bowman-Cryers have received thousands of Facebook messages, each one calling them fat or evil, the dumb lesbians who ruined those Christian bakers' lives.

As they waited for their daughter's school bus this May, Rachel's cell phone dinged with a new missive.

"I am buying up my ammo right now you filthy, ugly, disgusting, fat, stupid, cruel, anti-Christian piece of liberal scum," she read aloud. "I am getting ready for the war so I hope you have a good hiding place, you sick, disgusting, miserable, piece of degenerate lesbian scum."

The Bowman-Cryers say they never wanted the money, which remains locked in a government account. They say they never wanted a war.

For three and a half years, they have hidden, believing in time their names would disappear from the headlines. They didn't answer the phone. They declined hundreds of interviews, quit their jobs and stopped leaving the house.

Their silence has not protected them. As the Bowman-Cryers retreated, the fury over their case grew louder.

The bakers, Aaron and Melissa Klein, appealed their fines and hired former President George H.W. Bush's White House lawyer. They toured the country with presidential candidate Ted Cruz as the face of a new fight for business owners' religious freedom.

The legalization of same-sex marriage isn't the end of the story, the Kleins told crowds from Iowa to Washington, D.C. The government, they said, wants to force Christian business owners to help gay people marry. The solution, the Kleins warned receptive lawmakers, would be legislation protecting religious liberty. Arkansas, North Carolina and Mississippi have approved bills since then, curtailing the civil rights gay people fought to win.

The hate keeps coming: Pain lingers for lesbian couple denied in Sweet Cakes case

IMO the bakers should have to bake the cake. However, I'm not for ruining people's lives over this. Just fine the bakers a reasonable amount ($135K?? REALLY? That's beyond fucking excessive) and move on to another baker. Everyone is wrong here - The baker for not baking the cake, the lesbians for being part of a movement that tries to ruin people's lives and the state official for fining the bakers an absurd amount.

It's an ugly situation. This is easily solved - If the baker refuses to bake the cake, then fine the baker what it would cost for the couple to buy a cake at another store and leave it at that. Neither side needs to ruin people's lives over this.


However had the bakers followed the law they signed up to abide by as business owners, then they wouldn't have gotten into the mess.

Which is why I said they need to pay a fine. But a REASONABLE fine, not one that puts them out of business. You can't ruin people's lives over a cake, but the lesbian needs to be taken care of also. When does common sense and reason win out? Now both sides are suffering.
 
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.

How is it sinful to take part in a wedding? How is it sinful to make a cake that ends up in a wedding sinful? Makes no sense to me.

It sounds like people who want it to be a sin.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:25-37 - New International Version

Luke 10:25-37

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’a]">[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b]”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denariic]">[c] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

This suggests you'd make the cake.


Or not....

This world is full of sinners, and we must be careful to not be partakers with them. Eph. 5:3-7

So in other words Christians can do what the hell they like because their religious book justifies ANYTHING?
We are not talking about doing something. This is failing to do something. Can a Christian refuse to act because their religious book justifies non action?

Pretty much!
 
The Bakers didn't go anywhere. They were in their own shop.

I didn't say anything about going anywhere. However they're Christians, and part of Christian belief is not to turn away from those you don't like. ISN'T IT?
No part of Christian belief requires Christians to commit sin.

What sin would be committed by making a cake for gay people exactly?
Direct participation in the wedding which is a sinful act. Now we know that the government will force Christians to sin and punish them when they refuse. That part is over. The complaint the lesbians have now is a general disapproval of their perversion.

If gays and lesbians could make their unhappiness known, which they did. Sweet Cakes was happily put out of business. Then anyone else could also make their unhappiness known. This couple is getting exactly what they deserve.
Laughable.

Is there a definitive list of "sinner" that they would refuse to serve ?

Maybe a couple getting remarried ? Or an adulterer getting a cake for his girlfriend ? Or a swindler using dirty money to buy his cake ? Or a wifebeater or a single mother buying a cake for her bastard kids, or muslims,or hindus or athiests ?

Its just bigotry targeting a minority.

Yeah, they do seem to be very good at ignoring those bits they don't find convenient any more. Weren't some of these supposed to be killed, according to the Bible?
 

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