Palestinian children tortured, used as shields by Israel: U.N.

[toastman]

Instead of hyperbole, let's talk specifics, Sherri.

What specific rights are denied to non-Jewish children under the Basic Laws?

In responding, please quote the laws themselves, as opposed to some secondary source or commentary.

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

Coyote, I think his request for Sherri to cite the specific laws that Palestinians are discriminated against is a viable one. I am interested to see therm as well.

 

[Coyote]

Instead of hyperbole, let's talk specifics, Sherri.

What specific rights are denied to non-Jewish children under the Basic Laws?

In responding, please quote the laws themselves, as opposed to some secondary source or commentary.

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

Coyote, I think his request for Sherri to cite the specific laws that Palestinians are discriminated against is a viable one. I am interested to see therm as well.

But in relation to the topic - what difference does it make? I can not find much regarding specific military law, for example - and how they are handled in military courts.

Consider for example, a country like Russia which has laws on it's books for freedom of speech but which clearly aren't enforced.

(disclaimer - this is not a comparison of Israel to Russia, merely an example)

 

[HistoryBefore67]

Instead of hyperbole, let's talk specifics, Sherri.

What specific rights are denied to non-Jewish children under the Basic Laws?

In responding, please quote the laws themselves, as opposed to some secondary source or commentary.

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

No, the problem is that Sherri attributed the supposed discriminatory practices to the Basic Laws but, when asked to substantiate those assertions with specific quotes to the text of the law, she remains silent.

I don't see why you feel the need to defend her. If she is able to cite a portion of the law, we can discuss it. If she has a specific example of unequal enforcement, we can discuss that as well.

If all she has is broad, sweeping, unsubstantiated accusations, then there is nothing to discuss.

 

[Coyote]

Instead of hyperbole, let's talk specifics, Sherri.

What specific rights are denied to non-Jewish children under the Basic Laws?

In responding, please quote the laws themselves, as opposed to some secondary source or commentary.

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

No, the problem is that Sherri attributed the supposed discriminatory practices to the Basic Laws but, when asked to substantiate those assertions with specific quotes to the text of the law, she remains silent.

I don't see why you feel the need to defend her. If she is able to cite a portion of the law, we can discuss it. If she has a specific example of unequal enforcement, we can discuss that as well.

If all she has is broad, sweeping, unsubstantiated accusations, then there is nothing to discuss.

I'm not defending her - I'm questioning why the basic laws are relevant

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

Coyote, I think his request for Sherri to cite the specific laws that Palestinians are discriminated against is a viable one. I am interested to see therm as well.

But in relation to the topic - what difference does it make? I can not find much regarding specific military law, for example - and how they are handled in military courts.

Consider for example, a country like Russia which has laws on it's books for freedom of speech but which clearly aren't enforced.

(disclaimer - this is not a comparison of Israel to Russia, merely an example)

Racial Discrimination Convention - Consideration of Israel's 14th to 16th periodic reports/Occupied Palestinian Territory, Jerusalem, Golan heights - CERD concluding observations (Adv. unedited version - excerpts) (9 March 2012). Racist laws are identified by UN here.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

No, the problem is that Sherri attributed the supposed discriminatory practices to the Basic Laws but, when asked to substantiate those assertions with specific quotes to the text of the law, she remains silent.

I don't see why you feel the need to defend her. If she is able to cite a portion of the law, we can discuss it. If she has a specific example of unequal enforcement, we can discuss that as well.

If all she has is broad, sweeping, unsubstantiated accusations, then there is nothing to discuss.

I'm not defending her - I'm questioning why the basic laws are relevant

The UN Report says the Basic Laws are faulty because they do not expressly gurantee non discrimination. They address this in their Report on children that is discussed in the OP. As far as the demand of a poster I prove that by quoting the law, I cannot quote something not in the law. The UN faults the Basic Laws for their failure to include a prohibition against discrimination In their provisions

 

[HistoryBefore67]

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

No, the problem is that Sherri attributed the supposed discriminatory practices to the Basic Laws but, when asked to substantiate those assertions with specific quotes to the text of the law, she remains silent.

I don't see why you feel the need to defend her. If she is able to cite a portion of the law, we can discuss it. If she has a specific example of unequal enforcement, we can discuss that as well.

If all she has is broad, sweeping, unsubstantiated accusations, then there is nothing to discuss.

I'm not defending her - I'm questioning why the basic laws are relevant

They're relevant because Sherri brought them up in a prior post.

 

[HistoryBefore67]

No, the problem is that Sherri attributed the supposed discriminatory practices to the Basic Laws but, when asked to substantiate those assertions with specific quotes to the text of the law, she remains silent.

I don't see why you feel the need to defend her. If she is able to cite a portion of the law, we can discuss it. If she has a specific example of unequal enforcement, we can discuss that as well.

If all she has is broad, sweeping, unsubstantiated accusations, then there is nothing to discuss.

I'm not defending her - I'm questioning why the basic laws are relevant

The UN Report says the Basic Laws are faulty because they do not expressly gurantee non discrimination.

Nope. Sorry. That's not an answer.

In fact, that's complete gibberish. Laws (apart from specific provisions, such as Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, for example) don't generally "guarantee non-discrimination." A law that, for example, estabishes a speed limit does not include language stating "these speed limits are applicable to all people, regardless of race, gender, etc." So to criticize a general body of law for not specifying "non discrimination" is nonsense.

If you can't either:

1. Cite to a specific discriminatory provision in the law; or
2. Cite to a specific example of a discriminatory application of the law,

then you are wasting our time.

I'm not interested in "_____ said so" responses.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

Instead of hyperbole, let's talk specifics, Sherri.

What specific rights are denied to non-Jewish children under the Basic Laws?

In responding, please quote the laws themselves, as opposed to some secondary source or commentary.

The problem with your demand is that it isn't necessarily the laws themselves - it's the fact that they are not enforced and that children are prosecuted in military courts.

Coyote, I think his request for Sherri to cite the specific laws that Palestinians are discriminated against is a viable one. I am interested to see therm as well.

Racial Discrimination Convention - Consideration of Israel's 14th to 16th periodic reports/Occupied Palestinian Territory, Jerusalem, Golan heights - CERD concluding observations (Adv. unedited version - excerpts) (9 March 2012)

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

I'm not defending her - I'm questioning why the basic laws are relevant

The UN Report says the Basic Laws are faulty because they do not expressly gurantee non discrimination.

Nope. Sorry. That's not an answer.

If you can't either:

1. Cite to a specific discriminatory provision in the law; or
2. Cite to a specific example offer and discriminatory application of the law,
UT
then you are wasting our time.

I'm not interested in "_____ said so" responses.

That is what the UN says In their report on Israels violations of her treaty obligations under intl law with the respect to the treatment of children. I accept their findings. I conclude they have expertise with the law that you lack.
This is part of the lynchmarks of Apartheid and that is my words. Recap, the UN issued a report addressing Israels compliance with her treaty obligations under The Convention on the Rights Of the Child On June 14, 2013 The UN finds racist laws contribute to abuses against children. The Basic Laws are racist because they do not prohibit discrimination. And many specific racist laws have been enacted. They are identified in a 2012 UN Report, paragraphs 11, 15, 16, 18 and 27. http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/61F72B9D0D24D85E852579C1006545B9

 

[HistoryBefore67]

Okay, let's make a general rule so that we can stop wasting time.

If you post links, I won't read them.

If you cut and paste from opinion pieces and "studies" from organizations with obvious agendas and biases, I won't read them.

If you tell me "because ____ said so," I'll disregard your comment.

If you want to tell me what you think, and provide specific examples to support your position, then I'm happy to discuss these issues with you.

 

[MHunterB]

UN report documents Israeli regime’s abuse and torture of Palestinian children

By Jean Shaoul*25 June 2013

The United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child (CRC) published areport*last week accusing Israel of committing abuses against Palestinian children, including torture, solitary confinement and threats of death and sexual assault in prisons.The committee’s 18 independent experts examined Israel’s record of compliance with a 1990 treaty as part of its regular review of a pact signed by all nations except Somalia and the United States. They obtained their evidence, which relates to the 10-year period from 2002, from other UN rights bodies, military sources and Israeli and Palestinian rights groups, including the Israeli soldiers’ group Breaking the Silence. UN report documents Israeli regime?s abuse and torture of Palestinian children - World Socialist Web Site

Edited Fair Use

I don't give any credence to the filth churned out by Marxist propaganda hate sites; they're just a different group of fascists, is all.

 

[toastman]

UN report documents Israeli regime’s abuse and torture of Palestinian children

By Jean Shaoul*25 June 2013

The United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child (CRC) published areport*last week accusing Israel of committing abuses against Palestinian children, including torture, solitary confinement and threats of death and sexual assault in prisons.The committee’s 18 independent experts examined Israel’s record of compliance with a 1990 treaty as part of its regular review of a pact signed by all nations except Somalia and the United States. They obtained their evidence, which relates to the 10-year period from 2002, from other UN rights bodies, military sources and Israeli and Palestinian rights groups, including the Israeli soldiers’ group Breaking the Silence. UN report documents Israeli regime?s abuse and torture of Palestinian children - World Socialist Web Site

Edited Fair Use

I don't give any credence to the filth churned out by Marxist propaganda hate sites; they're just a different group of fascists, is all.

Propaganda hate sites is all she has

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

UN report documents Israeli regime’s abuse and torture of Palestinian children

By Jean Shaoul*25 June 2013

The United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child (CRC) published areport*last week accusing Israel of committing abuses against Palestinian children, including torture, solitary confinement and threats of death and sexual assault in prisons.The committee’s 18 independent experts examined Israel’s record of compliance with a 1990 treaty as part of its regular review of a pact signed by all nations except Somalia and the United States. They obtained their evidence, which relates to the 10-year period from 2002, from other UN rights bodies, military sources and Israeli and Palestinian rights groups, including the Israeli soldiers’ group Breaking the Silence. UN report documents Israeli regime?s abuse and torture of Palestinian children - World Socialist Web Site

Edited Fair Use

I don't give any credence to the filth churned out by Marxist propaganda hate sites; they're just a different group of fascists, is all.

Propaganda hate sites is all she has

Yup, Sherri really has to scrape the barrel now.

 

[Kondor3]

"...Empires certainly do rise and they certainly do fall, we are watching one falling right now. The only question, is when shall our end come? That certainly shall be a day for celebration by many, in so many lands we have visited to attack and kill the innocent within. I cant help but see some Justice in the future I know that shall be unfolding..."

That is about as close to saying "I look forward to the fall of the United States of America" as one can come without using those exact words and naming the country...

I now know you for an enemy of our Country and its People...

...as many here (myself included) have long-suspected, and I will conduct myself accordingly.

 

[Kondor3]

"...I don't give any credence to the filth churned out by Marxist propaganda hate sites; they're just a different group of fascists, is all."

Agreed.

I mean... really... "World Socialist Website"?

 

[Kondor3]

And, as a piece of pure extempore...

The Israelis are treating arrested Palestinian youth differently than arrested Israeli youth?

Really?

Now there's a big surprise!

Not.

I"m guessing it has a little something to do with the idea that arrested Palestinian youth are usually taken into custody for throwing rocks (and worse) at Israeli troops, and that they come from parts of the country that direct suicide bombing and indiscriminate rocket attacks against Israeli civilians, and that they oftentimes have first-hand knowledge of adult terrorists and 'enemy combatants' and their activities...

Whereas arrested Israeli youth are usually taken into custody for joy-rides and fistfights and rowdiness and the usual range of teenage angst.

Different ranges of offense and different environmental backgrounds require different response-strategies.

Or so it would seem to anyone with even a lick of common sense, at first glance.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

The UN is not a hate site. We are discussing a UN Report disclosing racist laws against children in Israel and Palestine, racist laws and practices that have resulted in disproportionate injuries and deaths to Palestinian children, hundreds of Palestinian children killed and thousands injured from Israels military operations (paragraph 25 of report), practices that subjected children to naval and air strikes in densely populated areas utilizing attack methods that violated the rules of proportionality and distinction ( paragraph 25 of UN Report), practices of Israel in shooting Palestinian children near the Gaza border while they collected building material to help their families rebuild their homes Israel destroyed- the UN reported 30 cases of killings like this over the reporting period, (par. 25 of report) Other findings of UN in Paragraph 25: Israeli settlers have continued to attack children, killing 4 children since 2008. Hundreds more have been injured. The UN notes not only does the IDF not stop these attacks, they often come and support the settlers in the attacks. The perpetrators of crimes against children are not punished and receive complete Impunity for their crimes. All of this is documented by the UN in Paragraph 25 of their report, a paragraph entitled Right to life, survival and development. Rights of Child Convention/Second to fourth periodic reports of Israel - Cttee on Rights of Child - Concluding observations (advance unedited version) (14 June 2013)

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

The UN expresses concern about the devastating impact on the right to life, survivival and development of children, of the Wall and the Gaza Blockade imposed since 2007 and held by the IRC to be collective punishment. Rights of Child Convention/Second to fourth periodic reports of Israel - Cttee on Rights of Child - Concluding observations (advance unedited version) (14 June 2013)

 

[Coyote]

And, as a piece of pure extempore...

The Israelis are treating arrested Palestinian youth differently than arrested Israeli youth?

Really?

Now there's a big surprise!

Not.

I"m guessing it has a little something to do with the idea that arrested Palestinian youth are usually taken into custody for throwing rocks (and worse) at Israeli troops, and that they come from parts of the country that direct suicide bombing and indiscriminate rocket attacks against Israeli civilians, and that they oftentimes have first-hand knowledge of adult terrorists and 'enemy combatants' and their activities...

Whereas arrested Israeli youth are usually taken into custody for joy-rides and fistfights and rowdiness and the usual range of teenage angst.

Different ranges of offense and different environmental backgrounds require different response-strategies.

Or so it would seem to anyone with even a lick of common sense, at first glance.

Israeli children throw rocks also. When they're arrested, they are treated very differently from Palestinian children.