Zone1 Personal relationship with Jesus.. and Once Saved Always Saved are NOT in the Bible

[The Irish Ram]

So now there's no building that is a true church!

And it sounds like the majority doesn't accept their bibles as being the literal word of their god!

That is Incorrect. Here is the truth:
Luke 21:33 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

His word is alive and well, and His bride is intact...

 

[The Irish Ram]

but Christ IS Catholic

He just isn't a Berg Catholic, that is for sure.

Why anyone thinks "pope" Francis is a real pope is beyond me. I knew that as soon as i heard the first words he uttered after being "elected"

Dear God.
Jesus is the LION OF THE TRIBE OF JUDAH> DO YOU NOT KNOW WHO JUDAH IS???????? Christ is JEWISH. HE FULFILLED JEWISH LAW, NOT CATHOLIC LAW. HE RETURNS AS A JEW. HE WEARS A JEWISH PRAYER SHAWL. WHEN DO YOU HAVE HIM CONVERTING? BEFORE OR AFTER FULFILLING PASSOVER SACRIFICE? FIND THAT FOR ME IN SCRIPTURE!

Why would a Catholic Jesus not go to the Vatican to rule and reign for 1,000 years?
This post is a clear indictment of what happens with replacement theology. It makes God a liar.

Here is what God actually said about Jesus:
He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David; and He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and His kingdom will have no end.”

DAVID IS JEWISH. JACOB IS JEWISH. DAVID'S THRONE IS IN ISRAEL.
The Catholic Church kicked God's chosen people, His elect, out of the way so they could take their place. The only ones that that fooled were the Catholics...

 

[The Irish Ram]

which is worse: drawing the wrong conclusion from the correct premises or drawing the correct conclusion from the wrong premises?

Both you and Meriweather are off base. That's because you are both talking about the NO Church which is absolutely, positively NOT the True Catholic Church.

so there's that...

The best is to study, so you will draw the correct conclusion from the correct premise. Show yourself approved. Don't guess and hope you are correct. Study the word. Don't flip through it once and think that you have absorbed all the knowledge contained within it. There is layer upon layer to reveal.

 

[Meriweather]

but Christ IS Catholic

Christ is opening and welcoming to all, and this openness and welcome to others is why his followers became known as "Catholic". Open and Welcoming is the definition, the etymology, of the word Catholic.

 

[SweetSue92]

That is your twist on it.

Catholics, on the other hand do not worship Mary. She is regarded as part of God's plan in bringing redemption to mankind. We note the part she plays in this plan, nothing more. We revere all whom God called and used to bring about salvation, and note His love and care of them.

Catholic focus is on God. Unfortunately Protestant focus seems to be on figuring out how Catholic observances of God's plan unfolding can be twisted to fling mud, which is nothing at all to be proud of--not if one follows Christ to salvation.

Catholics do worship Mary and the bolded section above is only proof positive that you know it's wrong.

Hear this: if you are saved by Jesus my Savior I am happy. I am thrilled.

But the Catholic Church muddies the waters with their Marian obsession.

 

[Meriweather]

Catholics do worship Mary and the bolded section above is only proof positive that you know it's wrong.

The end result of projecting your own inference onto someone else is still your inference. You are telling me I know it is wrong. You may have even convinced yourself I know it is wrong.

Why not consider my own assessment: I know that I am correct. Why are you recreating me in your own mind? Why do you recreate the Catholic Church in your own mind? Your mind now has two imaginary creations that simply do not exist.

What is so awful about hearing what is from the Catholic perspective? No one is asking you to become Catholic. No one is asking you to participate in the Sacraments that are like relief snapshots in the life of Jesus. No one is asking you to even remember the name of Jesus' mother, let alone any of the events of her life. Why does it bother you so much that Catholics love reliving the events of Jesus' life through the seven Sacraments or enjoy seeing and relating how the lives of his mother, his stepfather, and his apostles intertwined with his?

 

[Meriweather]

Jesus my Savior

Some of us hold a wider view of Jesus as savior/redeemer of the world...not only 'my'.

 

[Meriweather]

But the Catholic Church muddies the waters with their Marian obsession.

Consider that those who have no room in their faith life for Mary because of fear their waters will be muddied, may be in shallow water. It is shallow water that becomes muddied.

Catholics, on the other hand, live such in such spiritual depths that including Mary as a member of the Body of Christ, makes not even a mite of dust in the clarity of their water.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

And that Once SAved Always Saved thing is far worse

You are right about this. Except, you are not "saved" until the Resurrection of the dead. That hasn't occurred yet, so no one has been "saved."

The imparting of the Holy Spirit is only a "down payment." A Christian "in the flesh" is basically an embryo, or a caterpillar awaiting it's "resurrection" to glory. A Christian certainly can neglect the Holy Spirit and lose salvation.

 

[SweetSue92]

The end result of projecting your own inference onto someone else is still your inference. You are telling me I know it is wrong. You may have even convinced yourself I know it is wrong.

Why not consider my own assessment: I know that I am correct. Why are you recreating me in your own mind? Why do you recreate the Catholic Church in your own mind? Your mind now has two imaginary creations that simply do not exist.

What is so awful about hearing what is from the Catholic perspective? No one is asking you to become Catholic. No one is asking you to participate in the Sacraments that are like relief snapshots in the life of Jesus. No one is asking you to even remember the name of Jesus' mother, let alone any of the events of her life. Why does it bother you so much that Catholics love reliving the events of Jesus' life through the seven Sacraments or enjoy seeing and relating how the lives of his mother, his stepfather, and his apostles intertwined with his?

I made up the Immaculate Conception?

I made up the ascension of Mary?

Why are these necessary? They're not Biblical.

 

[Foxfyre]

I know bc I have read the entire thing, Old and New. Plus I have heard it read to me at Holy Mass over the years. If you go to both daily and Sunday Mass for 3 years straight, you will hear virtually the entire Bible (the Apocrypha books also).

So even though it is great to have a "personal relationship" with Jesus.. To all you people who claim to go by the Bible alone and refuse to listen to anything not mentioned specifically therein: Why do you spoutate "truisms" that are not found in the Bible? Yet you accuse Catholics of adding to the Scriptures!

And that Once SAved Always Saved thing is far worse. Jesus said that if you do not love your neighbor (care for a needy neighbor's needs) you end up in HELL

Mt 25:31-46

Here's what I think.
Those who believe 'once saved always saved' and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who believe you must do good works in order to be a Christian and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who believe the Bible word for word and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who interpret the Bible as the flat earthers or other groups do and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who believe belonging to a particular church or denomination is the way and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who understand the Bible as a composite of metaphor, parables, history, poetry, law, story telling, prophecy, etc., some that can be taken literally and some should not be taken literally and have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

Those who have never read the Bible, don't understand or really believe much of it, but have a personal relationship with Jesus the Christ are most likely going to be okay.

As for everybody else, I don't honestly know, but I do know a loving, caring God that points us in the right direction if we're willing to take the direction and that may be to witness to them. It is not my prerogative or responsibility to judge them.

One thing I'm pretty darn sure of. All those of us, regardless of our doctrines, dogmas, theology, beliefs, who get to Heaven are going to be really REALLY surprised at how much of all this we got wrong.

 

[ninja007]

I did NOT call you a liar

I said that what you posted is a lie. All Protestants have been lied to about the CC. It's just tht some of them investigate the CC to make sure they really are viewing it in the light of reality and not prejudice.. problem is: VERY few (in my experiences) do that

I WAS A CATHOLIC. THEN I GREW A BRAIN. THE RCC IS TEACHING FALSE DOCTRINE LEFT AND RIGHT. YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO ADD OR TAKE AWAY FROM THE BIBLE; INDULGENCES, ORIGINAL SIN, PURGATORY, MARY WORSHIP,PRIESTS,SEVEN SACRAMENTS ARE NO WHERE TAUGHT IN THE KJV.

 

[ninja007]

John 10:27-29 - My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: (Read More...)

John 6:37 - All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 10:28 - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

John 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 11:29 - For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

Jude 1:24 - Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

1 John 5:13 - These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

2 Corinthians 1:22 - Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

Romans 8:38-39 - For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, (Read More...)

Ephesians 2:8 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Philippians 1:6 - Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

1 John 5:10-13 - He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. (Read More...)

 

[ninja007]

TO THE O.P.- how many sins before you lose your salvation. Salvation is a gift. fully completed. you did NOTHING TO EARN IT AND CAN DO NOTHING TO KEEP IT.

 

[ninja007]

If the Bible nowhere states tradition is inspired, or beneficial, how do Catholics arrive at this? Trough their church! But the church is to be based on the apostles teachings not the apostles teachings based on the Church. If the traditions Catholics hold are suppose to be a body of oral teaching that was passed down by the apostles, why are they written down? Does this not make them Scripture? To be consistent if they are equal to Scripture from the apostles they should be added to the Bible. But then there is the warning, “Do not add to his words lest you be rebuked and found a liar” (Prov. 30:6).

The word tradition occurs only 14 times in the whole New Testament, in the Old Testament not once. We find 8 references of traditions are from Jesus himself, all of which are unfavorable. Not once does He imply they are spiritually useful. Mark 7:7-9 “And in vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men. “For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men.” This is what happens when another body of teachings are made equal with what God has spoken. Jesus made it clear that the Bible was in a class of its own, exalted above all religious traditions. He rebuked the Pharisees not because they didn’t understand tradition, but for not accepting sola Scriptura. They negated the final authority the Word of God by their religious traditions. Their tradition made the word of God to have no effect. (Mk.7) They stopped the people from reading the word and had them obey their traditions instead. Whenever tradition is set alongside Scripture, it eventually competes for the greater position to replace it. It then is used to reinterpret Scripture. This is what happened to Judaism in the days of Christ, and this is what has happened in the Roman Catholic Church. No one can trace oral tradition back to its source, so we can never be sure of its accuracy. Oral tradition becomes subject to the very leaders that gave it and we have to take their word for its accuracy.

 

[ninja007]

Catechism and Purgatory
By Sis. Sandy w/Tracy

Comparison between "Catechism of the Catholic Church"
(published in 1995 by Doubleday, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036)
and the Bible -- the Authorized King James Version of 1611

RCC Catechism	Bible
Jesus is not enough to purify sins "All who die in God's grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation; but after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven." (Pg. 291, #1030)	Jesus purifies from ALL sin Jesus is Enough and His one-time sacrifice alone saves us to an eternity with God. Jesus nailed our sins to the cross. He took care of business and left none of it undone. ...the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from allsin. -1 John 1:7 [Jesus] Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross. -Colossians 2:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. - Hebrews 10:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins. - Colossians 1:14 Jesus said that His crucifixion completes the payment for sin. He hung suspended between the earth and heaven for six hours taking the brutal payment for your wickedness and mine. After He had taken on the sins of this whole wicked world, He said these words just before He died, "It is finished." John 19:30 Everytime a person says, "I gotta go to purgatory to pay for the rest," he calls Jesus a liar. Out of a love that cannot be comprehended, Jesus died for every sin, past, present and future. All we have to do is believe on Him. He said, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. -John 6:29 You cannot pay for your crimes (sins) against God for they are eternal in nature. THAT is why Jesus came. The Everlasting God shed His blood which eternally blots out your transgressions if you'll believe on Jesus Christ. If you think you have anything to offer God outside of believing on Jesus, read on about yourself: But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. - Isaiah 64:6 To say, "We must purify ourselves" negates the work that Jesus did and puts our salvation in your own hands. You'll NEVER make it in on your own. Turn while there is time. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
Purgatory is an intermediate to heaven "The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification of the elect.." (Pg. 291, #1031) "The Church formulated her doctrine of faith on Purgatory especially at the Councils of Florence and Trent." (Pg. 291, #1031)	Heaven or hell (a) Nowhere in Scripture does it say one will have to undergo "purification" after death. There is no detour to heaven. "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgement." -Heb. 9:27 No amount of purification is necessary in a fictitious place called purgatory. When one accepts Jesus Christ as his Lord and Saviour, he gets the "free gift" of Salvation, and is immediately justified. Justified means to "declare free from blame." If you are a born again believer, your justification is by the BLOOD (not a limited time in purgatory). There is no punishment for sin in the afterlife. "Much more then, BEING NOW JUSTIFIED BY HIS BLOOD, we shall be saved from the wraththrough him." -Rom. 5:9 "...by the righteousness of one [Jesus] THE FREE GIFT came upon all men unto JUSTIFICATION of life." -Rom. 5:18 "Being JUSTIFIED FREELY by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:" -Rom. 3:24 "And such were some of you: but ye are WASHED, but ye are SANCTIFIED, but ye are JUSTIFIED in the name of the Lord Jesus.." -Cor. 6:11 (b) To insist that one must go through purification after death before one can get to heaven, is to say the sacrifice of Christ on the cross was insufficient. This would wipe out many passages in the New Testament which tells us of our stand before God now, and after death. God says if you believe on Him, you will not come into condemnation: "...He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, HATH EVERLASTING LIFE, and SHALL NOT COME INTO CONDEMNATION; but is passed from death to life." -John 5:24 For a born again believer, to die is to gain and to be present with the Lord, not a limited time in purgatory: "For me to live is Christ, and to die is gain." -Phil. 1:21 "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord." -2 Cor. 5 (c) Should you worry about a place called "purgatory?" Can it be found in the Bible? No. The Church itself ADMITS that it is their own invention. The Council of Trent took place in 1545 and approved this superstitious belief along with many others. The decrees were made by the council of MEN, not the God of the Bible. And those who would refuse to believe the decrees of Rome were under the threat of "anathema," and the curse has not yet been lifted to this day while they cry for unity with Bible believing Christians.
Some people are being purified in purgatory right now "But at the present time some of his disciples are pilgrims on earth. Others have died and are being purified, while still others are in glory..." (Pg. 270, #954)	The dead are either in heaven or hell He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrathof God abideth on him. - John 3:36 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. -Matthew 25:46 Is the wrath of God abiding on you today? Which will you choose? The real Jesus or the false christ of Romanism?

 

[ninja007]

Catechism and Bible Interpretation
By Sis. Sandy w/Tracy

Comparison between "Catechism of the Catholic Church"
(published in 1995 by Doubleday, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036)
and the Bible -- the Authorized King James Version of 1611

RCC Catechism

Bible

Only the Magisterium of the Church Can Interpret the Bible "The task of interpreting the Word of God authentically has been entrusted solely to the magisterium of the Church, that is, the Pope and to the bishops in communion with him." #100, p.35

The Holy Ghost Interprets the Bible for Christians (a) Christians don't need ANY middle man to teach them to understand God's word. These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. --1 John 2:26-27 We find out in (b) below that it is the Holy Ghost that teacheth us what we need to know from God's word. (b) Nowhere in the Bible does it say God has entrusted His Scriptures to the Roman Catholic pope or his bishops, nor the interpreting of Scriptures to the pope and his bishops. God Himself interprets Scriptures for His Children. "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." --John 14:26 "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH.." --John 16:13 (c) We disciples are commanded in God's word to STUDY the Bible. It does not say we are to leave it up to others: "STUDY to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH." --2 Tim. 2:15 (d) God did not leave the Scriptures for private interpretation to any leaders of any organization. "Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any PRIVATE INTERPRETATION." --2 Peter 1:20 (e) If it were impossible for us to understand the Scriptures, Jesus would have never rebuked the Sadducees for making errors: "And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?" --Mark 12:24 (f) God will give you more understanding than all your teachers, including the pope and his bishops because: "O how love I thy law! it is my meditation all the day. Thou through thy commandments hast made me wiser than mine enemies: for they are ever with me. I have more understanding than all my teachers: for thy testimonies are my meditation." --Ps. 119:97-99

 

[ninja007]

Catechism and Confirmation
By Sis. Sandy w/Tracy

Comparison between "Catechism of the Catholic Church"
(published in 1995 by Doubleday, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036)
and the Bible -- the Authorized King James Version of 1611

RCC Catechism	Bible
Confirmation Gives Holy Spirit "Confirmation perfects Baptismal grace; it is the sacrament which gives the Holy Spirit in order to root us more deeply in the divine filiation, incorporate us MORE FIRMLY into Christ, strengthen our bond with the Church.." (#1316, p. 367)	God Gives Holy Spirit If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Luke 11:13
Confirmation Puts Us More Firmly in Christ "Confirmation perfects Baptismal grace; it is the sacrament which gives the Holy Spirit in order to root us more deeply in the divine filiation, incorporate us MORE FIRMLY into Christ, strengthen our bond with the Church.." (#1316, p. 367) "Confirmation, like Baptism, imprints a spiritual mark or indelible character on the Christian's soul..." (#1317, p. 367)	You are either "in Christ" or "out of Christ" (a) No such thing as being more "firmly" into Christ. One is either "In Christ, or "Out" of Christ. "Therefore if any man be IN CHRIST, he is a new creature; old things are passed away, behold, all things are beome new. --2 Cor. 5:17 (b) Once you are "IN CHRIST," nothing can take you out of Christ. ...him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. --John 6:37 "For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is IN CHRIST JESUS our Lord." --Rom. 8:38-39 (c) No need to be more "firmly incorporated into Christ." "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are IN CHRIST JESUS, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." --Rom. 8:1 (d) There is nothing in the Bible about "imprinting a spiritual mark on a Christian's soul. This being the case, why does the Catholic religion practice this? Because it is CATHOLIC TRADITION, NOT God's word.
Confirmation Binds People to the Catholic Religion "For by the sacrament of Confirmation, [the baptized] are more perfectly BOUND TO THE CHURCH..."[Roman Catholic Church] (#1285, p. 358)	Confirmation Binds People to Satan Jesus makes people free, but Satan binds them in prision. In Isaiah 14:16-17 the people look at a cast down, brought down Lucifer asking: Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; that made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisioners? The Catholic religion binds people to its own traditions which are the opposite of God's. Does not Satan pervert and turn inside out everything that God says? God told Adam "Don't eat from the tree. What did Satan tell Eve? "Eat from the tree." God says, "I'll seal you with my Holy Spirit." Satan says, "The priest will seal you with my Holy Spirit." No need to be "bound" to the rituals of the Roman Catholic Church. Christ doesn't "bind" you to man-made traditions. He sets people FREE! "If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be FREE INDEED." --John 8:36 "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith CHRIST hath made us free.." --Gal. 5:1 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised. -- Luke 4:18

 

[ninja007]

Catechism and Pope as Vicar of Christ
By Sis. Sandy w/Tracy

Comparison between "Catechism of the Catholic Church"
(published in 1995 by Doubleday, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036)
and the Bible -- the Authorized King James Version of 1611

RCC Catechism	Bible
The Pope is the Head of the Church "For the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered." (#882, p. 254)	Jesus is the Head of the Church God did not appoint Korol Wojtyla (John Paul II) to be the universal power over the whole Church. The Bible says the Lord Jesus Christ is the head of the church: "For the husband is the head of the wife, even as CHRIST IS THE HEAD OF THE CHURCH..." -Eph. 5:23
The Pope is the Supreme Pastor and Teacher "The Roman Pontiff...as supreme pastor and teacher of all the faithful.." (#891, p. 256)	The Holy Ghost is the Supreme Teacher The Pope's position as "supreme pastor and teacher" is null and void, for the Bible says this position is already filled by someone else, and He will abide forever. Thus, there is no need to elevate Korol Wojtyla to take over the job that is reserved for the Holy Spirit alone. "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." --John 14:26 "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH..." -John 16:13 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you FOR EVER;" --John 14:16
The Pope has Ultimate Power Over Every Soul "The Pope enjoys, by divine institution, supreme, full, immediate, and universal power in the care of souls" (#937, p.267) "For the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered." (#882, p. 254)	A Great Christian is a Servant (a) The disciples questioned among themselves who would be the greatest leader and Jesus told them that the greatest are the biggest servants. Jesus and John the Baptist were quite unlike Korol the pope with his big fancy hats and white royal attire and "power which he can ALWAYS exercise UNHINDERED (one aspect of a cult--a charismatic leader who tells followers what to do.) But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them. But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister; And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant: Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. Matthew 20:25-28 (b) Korol Wojtyla, the current pope, allows himself to be called "Holy Father". This term is found ONCE in the entire Bible. It is in the garden of Gethsemane and Jesus is praying to God the Father: ...Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are. John 17:11 Romanists call the pope God!!!!!! And Korol accepts it--even expects it!!!!! (c) To take the name "Holy" father, is to try to steal God's glory and take a title that belongs to God alone. God is exceeding angry about this situation. "Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for THOU ONLY ARE HOLY..." --Rev. 15:4 "I am the LORD: that is my name: and MY GLORY WILL I NOT GIVE TO ANOTHER..." --Isa. 42:8 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God: Exodus 34:14

 

[ninja007]

Catechism and Statues/Images
By Sis. Sandy w/Tracy

Comparison between "Catechism of the Catholic Church"
(published in 1995 by Doubleday, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036)
and the Bible -- the Authorized King James Version of 1611

RCC Catechism	Bible
Images increase faith "Sacred images in our churches and homes are intended to awaken and nourish our faith in the mystery of Christ. Though the icon of Christ and his works of salvation, it is he whom we adore. Through sacred images of the holy Mother of God, of the angels and of the saints, we venerate the persons represented." (Pg. 337, #1192)	Faith comes by hearing the word of God Nothing short of hearing and doing the Word of God will increase our faith. So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17
Keep images in your home & church "Following the divinely inspired teaching of our holy Fathers and the tradition of the Catholic Church (for we know that this tradition comes from the Holy Spirit who dwells in her) we rightly define with full certainty and correctness that, like the figure of the precious and life-giving cross, venerable and holy images of our Lord and God and Saviour, Jesus Christ, our inviolate Lady, the holy Mother of God, and the venerated angels, all the saints and the just, whether painted or made of mosaic or another suitable material, are to be exhibited in the holy churches of God, on sacred vessels and vestments, walls and panels, in houses and on streets." (Pg. 328, #1161)	Do not make images (a) A Catholic will quickly respond, "We don't worship statues!" Please note carefully that it has nothing to do with worshipping statutes [Tracy thinks it does], but MAKING AND HAVING GRAVEN IMAGES. The Catholic church contends that these graven images are "intended to awaken and nourish our faith in the mystery of Christ" which is a transgression against the second commandment: "Thou shalt not make unto thee ANY GRAVEN IMAGE, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:" -Ex. 20:4 God hates it and continues to command: "Take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the LORD your God, which he made with you, and make you a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, which the LORD God hath forbidden thee." -Deut. 4:23 God still hates it: "Neither shalt thou set thee up any image; WHICH THE LORD THY GOD HATETH." -Deut. 16:22 (b) The Bible tells us you have been "corrupted" and therefore are given to graven images: "Take ye therefore good heed unto yourselves...Lest ye corrupt yourselves, and make you a graven image, the similitude of any figure, the likeness of male or female." -Deut. 4:15-16 (c) God forbids the bowing down to statues, which is a common practice in the Catholic church. In the convent I spent many days saying novenas (which is a recitation of prayers and devotion for a special purpose during nine consecutive days), bowing down before a certain statue saying my rosary. The next time you bow down before a statue, remember the following: "Thou shalt NOT BOW DOWN THYSELF TO THEM, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy am a jealous God..." -Ex. 20:5 (d) Bowing down before statues will not awaken and nourish your faith in the mystery of Christ. Rather, behind every graven image is a devil: "What say I then? that the idol is any thing, or that which is offered in sacrifice to idols is any thing?...the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice TO DEVILS, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils." -1 Cor. 10:19-20 (e) God says to stay away from idols for your own good. Everytime you bow down to one, you bow to the kingdom of Satan. This is not a command which the Lord hath given and He despises the practice. He will not share His glory with graven images, Mary worship or "saint" worship. "TURN YE NOT UNTO IDOLS, nor make to yourselves molten gods: I am the LORD your God." -Lev. 19:4
Tradition says exhibit images "Following the divinely inspired teaching of our holy Fathers and the tradition of the Catholic Church (for we know that this tradition comes from the Holy Spirit who dwells in her) we rightly define with full certainty and correctness that, like the figure of the precious and life-giving cross, venerable and holy images of our Lord and God and Saviour, Jesus Christ, our inviolate Lady, the holy Mother of God, and the venerated angels, all the saints and the just, whether painted or made of mosaic or another suitable material, are to be exhibited in the holy churches of God, on sacred vessels and vestments, walls and panels, in houses and on streets." (Pg. 328, #1161)	Holy Ghost says do not make images (a) Does this doctrine come from the Bible? No. The Bible clearly states, "NO IMAGES!" Again, the Roman Catholic Church admits it is another TRADITION. If the Roman Catholic Church also got this tradition from a spirit, it's certainly not the Holy Spirit of the Bible. It is Satan who ALWAYS corrupts and changes the word of God. The spirits of Romanism defy what God has commanded! It is significant that the Catholic religion says that the Holy Spirit guided this practice of images. Anytime someone attributes the work of Satan to the Holy Ghost they blasphemy. Read Matthew 12:22-24 and 31-32--in this passage, the Pharisees said Jesus cast out devils by Beelzebub the prince of the devils when in actuality He cast them out by the Holy Ghost. He told them: All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. -Matt. 12:31 There is no Scripture to support her tradition. Ask yourself how these idols will awaken and nourish your faith in the mystery of Christ when you are forbidden to make them and bow down to them? The only conclusion is that these "MEN" (so-called "holy fathers"), "tradition," and another "spirit" set out to violate God's word. Their idols are nothing. They speak not, hear not, see not, and breathe not. They are nothing and benefit nothing. "The idols of the heathen are silver and gold, the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not; They have ears, but they hear not; neither is there any breath in their mouths. They that make them are like unto them: so is every one that trusteth in them." -Ps. 135:15-18 Jesus says men reject the commandment of God that they may keep their own tradition: "Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition." -Mk. 7:9 Can you really bow down in front of a statute or have them in your home after God has warned us in His word: "Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the LORD your God: -Lev.26:1