"personhood" idiocy in N Dakota

[JakeStarkey]

jakestarkey is not a person, he is a troll, thus he has no rights

That is a compliment straight from the Queen of Trolls.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I believe that implantation, not conception, is the benchmark of pregnancy i.e. beginning of life. At the time of implantation you have the "hatching" of the blastocyst- Not dissimilar to the hatching of an egg. From the moment of conception until the implantation is about 2 weeks. Indeed, numerous fertilized eggs never implant. Breast feeding an infant produces a natural hormone that prevents implantation...natures way of allowing the woman's body to recover and the infant to be nurtured.

As to the canard that defining person hood while in the womb will lead to some sort of witch hunt when natural abortion occurs, (aka miscarriage) that is just an attempt to blur the issue. The unborn, until Roe VS Wade, were thought of as babies...the only witch hunt that occurred was the one to kill them while they were in the womb.

For further reading

Conception Verses Implantation ? When Are You Considered Pregnant? | Ovatel

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

 

[clevergirl]

I believe that implantation, not conception, is the benchmark of pregnancy i.e. beginning of life. At the time of implantation you have the "hatching" of the blastocyst- Not dissimilar to the hatching of an egg. From the moment of conception until the implantation is about 2 weeks. Indeed, numerous fertilized eggs never implant. Breast feeding an infant produces a natural hormone that prevents implantation...natures way of allowing the woman's body to recover and the infant to be nurtured.

As to the canard that defining person hood while in the womb will lead to some sort of witch hunt when natural abortion occurs, (aka miscarriage) that is just an attempt to blur the issue. The unborn, until Roe VS Wade, were thought of as babies...the only witch hunt that occurred was the one to kill them while they were in the womb.

For further reading

Conception Verses Implantation ? When Are You Considered Pregnant? | Ovatel

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

The courts were ignorant of the science that came after those decisions... Had the modern ultra sound been available there is no way in hell Roe would ever have been decided the way it was...EVER!

Science is not my "belief". Person-hood is merely the singular identity of each individual human. You are were and will always be the person you became at the moment you were created. That did not manically change outside the womb.

 

[Lakhota]

I've heard that North Dakota is already the worst state for women.

The Worst State for Women?

 

[Noomi]

Not any more scary than how Callously the left dismisses the idea that a Fetus is a person.

A fetus is not a legal person until birth.

 

[Meathead]

Not any more scary than how Callously the left dismisses the idea that a Fetus is a person.

A fetus is not a legal person until birth.

Do you ever read what you write?!

 

[Noomi]

The lifers really need to stop and think for a moment about what this could mean for women. If a fetus was ruled a person, abortion would be murder. If a woman needed an abortion for medical reasons, it would be defensive homicide if she had one, and she would have to answer to her 'crime' in court - because her abortion WOULD be considered a crime until she can prove otherwise.

A woman or young girl who is the victim of incest wouldn't be allowed to abort the fetus - the spawn of her rapist would have more rights than she does.

You would be taking rights away from the woman and giving them to something that cannot even think for itself, and isn't even aware of its own existence.

If you don't think that is going to far, there is something wrong with you.

 

[Noomi]

Not any more scary than how Callously the left dismisses the idea that a Fetus is a person.

A fetus is not a legal person until birth.

Do you ever read what you write?!

What I said is true. A fetus is not a legal person until it is born.

 

[Meathead]

A fetus is not a legal person until birth.

Do you ever read what you write?!

What I said is true. A fetus is not a legal person until it is born.

How can a fetus be born? It reminds me that you once argued that women were not responsible for making bad choices because they thought they had found their knight in shining armor.

Ok, you're an Australian waitress, but still...bit too goofy even for that.

 

[Noomi]

Do you ever read what you write?!

What I said is true. A fetus is not a legal person until it is born.

How can a fetus be born? It reminds me that you once argued that women were not responsible for making bad choices because they thought they had found their knight in shining armor.

Ok, you're an Australian waitress, but still...bit too goofy even for that.

When a fetus is born, and takes a breath, it becomes a legal person. Before that, it has virtually no value under the law at all.

If a fetus is a person, why is abortion legal?

 

[Wicked Jester]

And that is exactly the question personhood laws opens up. When should the state step in, should a crack head be imprisoned for 9 months to prevent her from poisoning her fetus? Should a pregnant woman who's a drunk be confined to the county jail to protect her fetus?

So far the government can already dictate the kind of delivery a woman has, and can charge her should she attempt to make her own medical choices. What next?

Last I heard, anyone smoking crack can wind up in jail. When do we take the responsibility of having sex, smoking, drinking or doing drugs? Everything we do has consequences, good or bad, when do we own up to what we do?

I will never accept that the consequences of getting pregnant are giving over the right to my body to the state.

If I want to eat all raw food, get drunk every night, never visit an OBGYN and have a home birth in my bath tub with a witch doctor chanting over me, that's my right, and the state has no fucking business telling me otherwise.

And i'm quite sure you woud have no problem using the state system (medical and monetary) to take care of the child when it is born with major non-functional issues, due to the stupid choices you made while pregnant, correct?

 

[AmyNation]

I believe that implantation, not conception, is the benchmark of pregnancy i.e. beginning of life. At the time of implantation you have the "hatching" of the blastocyst- Not dissimilar to the hatching of an egg. From the moment of conception until the implantation is about 2 weeks. Indeed, numerous fertilized eggs never implant. Breast feeding an infant produces a natural hormone that prevents implantation...natures way of allowing the woman's body to recover and the infant to be nurtured.

As to the canard that defining person hood while in the womb will lead to some sort of witch hunt when natural abortion occurs, (aka miscarriage) that is just an attempt to blur the issue. The unborn, until Roe VS Wade, were thought of as babies...the only witch hunt that occurred was the one to kill them while they were in the womb.

For further reading

Conception Verses Implantation ? When Are You Considered Pregnant? | Ovatel

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

The courts were ignorant of the science that came after those decisions... Had the modern ultra sound been available there is no way in hell Roe would ever have been decided the way it was...EVER!

Science is not my "belief". Person-hood is merely the singular identity of each individual human. You are were and will always be the person you became at the moment you were created. That did not manically change outside the womb.

You are probably right about the court siding the other way had they had modern ultrasounds. However, that was then, and this is now and I don't believe ultrasounds will sway the court now.

 

[AmyNation]

Last I heard, anyone smoking crack can wind up in jail. When do we take the responsibility of having sex, smoking, drinking or doing drugs? Everything we do has consequences, good or bad, when do we own up to what we do?

I will never accept that the consequences of getting pregnant are giving over the right to my body to the state.

If I want to eat all raw food, get drunk every night, never visit an OBGYN and have a home birth in my bath tub with a witch doctor chanting over me, that's my right, and the state has no fucking business telling me otherwise.

And i'm quite sure you woud have no problem using the state system (medical and monetary) to take care of the child when it is born with major non-functional issues, due to the stupid choices you made while pregnant, correct?

Are you attempting to suggest the state has the right to force pregnant women to eat healthy, visit a government approved doctor and have a government approved birth because she might ask for assistance from the state after she we
gives birth?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Riddle:

To the right, what's the difference between a woman, fertilized egg and a corporation?

One isn't considered a person.

Really? Which one?

This oughtta be comical...

 

[JakeStarkey]

I believe that implantation, not conception, is the benchmark of pregnancy i.e. beginning of life. At the time of implantation you have the "hatching" of the blastocyst- Not dissimilar to the hatching of an egg. From the moment of conception until the implantation is about 2 weeks. Indeed, numerous fertilized eggs never implant. Breast feeding an infant produces a natural hormone that prevents implantation...natures way of allowing the woman's body to recover and the infant to be nurtured.

As to the canard that defining person hood while in the womb will lead to some sort of witch hunt when natural abortion occurs, (aka miscarriage) that is just an attempt to blur the issue. The unborn, until Roe VS Wade, were thought of as babies...the only witch hunt that occurred was the one to kill them while they were in the womb.

For further reading

Conception Verses Implantation ? When Are You Considered Pregnant? | Ovatel

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

The courts were ignorant of the science that came after those decisions... Had the modern ultra sound been available there is no way in hell Roe would ever have been decided the way it was...EVER!

Science is not my "belief". Person-hood is merely the singular identity of each individual human. You are were and will always be the person you became at the moment you were created. That did not manically change outside the womb.

Your beliefs are not evidence.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

The courts were ignorant of the science that came after those decisions... Had the modern ultra sound been available there is no way in hell Roe would ever have been decided the way it was...EVER!

Science is not my "belief". Person-hood is merely the singular identity of each individual human. You are were and will always be the person you became at the moment you were created. That did not manically change outside the womb.

Your beliefs are not evidence.

Neither are your delusions...

 

[JakeStarkey]

Thank you for admitting that beliefs (and delusions, yours) are not evidence.

 

[paulitician]

North Dakota Personhood Measure Passes State Senate

"These bills just open the door for every other state in the country to interject themselves into everybody's bedroom."

Which is exactly what the rw's want. The more laws and the more intrusive, the better.

That's exactly what you Socialists/Progressives want too. It's always funny observing you Socialist Nanny/Police Staters screeching about how you're so different than those mean ole 'Right Wingers.' You're all Big Government-worshipping stooges in the end.

 

[paulitician]

And btw, if you don't like North Dakota, don't live there. Problem solved.

 

[clevergirl]

That’s your belief, however subjective, and you’re entitled to it; and Griswold/Roe/Casey allows you to retain that belief and act upon it accordingly, just as others are allowed to believe ‘personhood’ begins at some point before or after, free from interference by the state.

The courts were wise to refrain from the issue of ‘when life begins,’ and appropriately left that to each person’s good conscience, good faith, and religious or philosophical beliefs.

The courts were ignorant of the science that came after those decisions... Had the modern ultra sound been available there is no way in hell Roe would ever have been decided the way it was...EVER!

Science is not my "belief". Person-hood is merely the singular identity of each individual human. You are were and will always be the person you became at the moment you were created. That did not manically change outside the womb.

Your beliefs are not evidence.

The scientific evidence stands. Your illegitimate opinions about that evidence prove your ignorance and nothing more.