Planned Parenthood Exposed - New Undercover Video

[Amanda]

I like your honesty in general and this was particularly well put. "Remembering it is for two reasons only, to overcome other roadblocks (thus why the laughter is so important) and to prevent it from happening again if possible. If not for those two reasons then it's just terrorism to bring it up (the use of fear to rule or alter anothers view)."

So you must have found this post admirable:

As creepy as it sounds, but then considering my ideals it's not surprising, I live by that. It isn't my business who kills what because I don't really care, as long as they don't come after me, then it's my business.

Which was why I quoted Pastor Martin Niemöller's poem in the first place.

 

[KittenKoder]

As long as you skip over acknowledging that your professed attitude toward life is what made it easy for the Nazis I guess you dodged the bullet.

*rae* Um ... yeah. Okay, I thought at first you were more intelligent than this makes you look, because that makes no sense at all and for so few lines to make such little sense ... yeah.

Let's try this though, are you trying to say I am a practicing Jew? I already pointed out that I am only Jewish by blood and that my family (on my fathers side particularly in case you haven't read my other posts in other threads) was forced over here by them, I myself was not born until looooong after such, well not that long but long enough to not have been involved. My father doesn't even recall anything about it, he was born just after my grandfather and grandmother came here. But the stories were told, just so we would avoid making the same mistakes with someone else. Even after all that, I STILL don't get your question at all.

 

[Anguille]

So you must have found this post admirable:


Which was why I quoted Pastor Martin Niemöller's poem in the first place.

Actually her response was to Gunny, who was responding to me.

 

[KittenKoder]

Actually that is Gunny's post quoted as mine.

The quoting got messed up somehow, but cool. I am still creepy in that way.

 

[no1tovote4]

Sorry, your rant went right over my head. I'll try to read it tomorrow, but anyone that thinks a fetus is a living, breathing human AND thinks it is okay to kill one because of the way that life was brought into existence is the lowest and scummiest hypocrite in existence.

Not necessarily. Many believe that before the fetus thinks, they have yet to gain what it is to be a person. While it is human, it has yet to gain 'personhood' because higher thought is impossible until brain development.

Personally I believe that all life is something to be protected, that like Amida Buddha that life is more than the sum of its parts. Life should not be sacrificed for convenience.

However, abortion should not be the only option as a way to keep from forcing a human to incubate. I believe we need to put some serious effort toward creating a third option to incubation and adoption or raising the child, or taking life. That we should begin to remove the fetuses with an effort to keep it alive, to incubate it ex utero. That with that effort we can create a real choice without the need to take a life or the need to enforce upon another what can be conceived of as continued victimization or control.

While I believe this, I can place myself into the shoes of another still without shading it with my own belief.

If you believe you are killing a person, then there could be no excuse. But if they have yet to gain personhood, it is understandable (if not to me personally, through that shade of another's eyes) if they believe it is undesirable but acceptable at earlier stages before brain development.

 

[Anguille]

So you must have found this post admirable:


Which was why I quoted Pastor Martin Niemöller's poem in the first place.

Her post is admirable in her honesty and humor. I think you read it in the extreme. I took it to mean she minds her own business when it comes to another woman's decisions about her own body and hopes no one is out to kill her,KK.

 

[KittenKoder]

So you must have found this post admirable:


Which was why I quoted Pastor Martin Niemöller's poem in the first place.

Meh ... Just because one person shares my way of life doesn't make it the same. I am certain our reasonings are very different, but you'd have to read MUCH more of my posts in a lot of threads to understand why I stated it in the first place. Many already know why, but for your benefit I will make a quick summary of my reasons: The world is over populated with people, before I start caring about human life again we have to lose at least 4 billion humans, otherwise we are in excess. This overpopulation IS the cause of all our problems, not the polution, violence, etc. but the amount of it. At least that is my view. So, honestly I just really do mind my own business as Ang said. I only defend the intelligent in debates because it's something to do.

 

[Anguille]

The quoting got messed up somehow, but cool. I am still creepy in that way.

It happens sometimes when a post containing a quote is quoted. You just have to delete the quote script for the person whose quote doesn't show.

 

[no1tovote4]

It happens sometimes when a post containing a quote is quoted. You just have to delete the quote script for the person whose quote doesn't show.

It also happens when somebody removes a portion of a quoted post and accidentally removes one of the brackets.

[ <this one just before the /quote is usually the one most often missing that creates weird 'quoting' issues.

 

[Anguille]

Meh ... Just because one person shares my way of life doesn't make it the same. I am certain our reasonings are very different, but you'd have to read MUCH more of my posts in a lot of threads to understand why I stated it in the first place. Many already know why, but for your benefit I will make a quick summary of my reasons: The world is over populated with people, before I start caring about human life again we have to lose at least 4 billion humans, otherwise we are in excess. This overpopulation IS the cause of all our problems, not the polution, violence, etc. but the amount of it. At least that is my view. So, honestly I just really do mind my own business as Ang said. I only defend the intelligent in debates because it's something to do.

Similar to my feelings. That's why I believe every abortion is admirable in at least it means one less human to polute and create more humans.
Spay and neuter should be personal goals for humans not just pets.

 

[Anguille]

Not necessarily. Many believe that before the fetus thinks, they have yet to gain what it is to be a person. While it is human, it has yet to gain 'personhood' because higher thought is impossible until brain development.

Personally I believe that all life is something to be protected, that like Amida Buddha that life is more than the sum of its parts. Life should not be sacrificed for convenience.

However, abortion should not be the only option as a way to keep from forcing a human to incubate. I believe we need to put some serious effort toward creating a third option to incubation and adoption or raising the child, or taking life. That we should begin to remove the fetuses with an effort to keep it alive, to incubate it ex utero. That with that effort we can create a real choice without the need to take a life or the need to enforce upon another what can be conceived of as continued victimization or control.

While I believe this, I can place myself into the shoes of another still without shading it with my own belief.

If you believe you are killing a person, then there could be no excuse. But if they have yet to gain personhood, it is understandable (if not to me personally, through that shade of another's eyes) if they believe it is undesirable but acceptable at earlier stages before brain development.

Interesting way of looking at it. It would be cool if fetus could be transfered from the bodies of women who want to shed them to the bodies of women who do want them... or men who want them. LOL! Shogun, are you listening?
Butv I would not support tax money going towards that kind of research. Not till we get a grip on out of control world overpopulation first.
For me, it's a separate life from the mother when it's out and has taken it's first breath.

 

[Amanda]

*rae* Um ... yeah. Okay, I thought at first you were more intelligent than this makes you look, because that makes no sense at all and for so few lines to make such little sense ... yeah.

Let's try this though, are you trying to say I am a practicing Jew?

No.

I already pointed out that I am only Jewish by blood and that my family (on my fathers side particularly in case you haven't read my other posts in other threads) was forced over here by them, I myself was not born until looooong after such, well not that long but long enough to not have been involved. My father doesn't even recall anything about it, he was born just after my grandfather and grandmother came here. But the stories were told, just so we would avoid making the same mistakes with someone else. Even after all that, I STILL don't get your question at all.

No, I'm saying that your attitude (I don't care unless they come for me) is like that expressed in the poem. That attitude contributed to the Holocaust. I think it's called irony.

 

[KittenKoder]

Similar to my feelings. That's why I believe every abortion is admirable in at least it means one less human to polute and create more humans.
Spay and neuter should be personal goals for humans not just pets.

Or at least temporary neutering then requiring a license for reproducing to keep the numbers down. Just something, this breeding all the time combined with the longer life spans is really hurting us as a species, we are driving ourselves extinct and so few are willing to see or admit the real cause. Instead some want to blame nature, others say it's the pollution.

 

[no1tovote4]

Meh ... Just because one person shares my way of life doesn't make it the same. I am certain our reasonings are very different, but you'd have to read MUCH more of my posts in a lot of threads to understand why I stated it in the first place. Many already know why, but for your benefit I will make a quick summary of my reasons: The world is over populated with people, before I start caring about human life again we have to lose at least 4 billion humans, otherwise we are in excess. This overpopulation IS the cause of all our problems, not the polution, violence, etc. but the amount of it. At least that is my view. So, honestly I just really do mind my own business as Ang said. I only defend the intelligent in debates because it's something to do.

Overpopulation is a reason to advance, to find ways to get off the planet, to be more efficient with what we have.

Humans tend to not do what is necessary, until it becomes necessary. No matter how much foresight we use. The goal should be to find ways to maintain life (all of it, not just human) without having to remove life or to take it.

 

[KittenKoder]

No.



No, I'm saying that your attitude (I don't care unless they come for me) is like that expressed in the poem. That attitude contributed to the Holocaust. I think it's called irony.

Meh... again, different times and reasons. Back then it may have made a difference, but maybe not, all we can do is speculate anyway. But modern day, it is IMPOSSIBLE to care about every human life, that's more than 8 billion humans to protect, it's just not possible or wise. Comparing me to someone from another time is like comparing a Pentium to a 386. It doesn't work. Sorry, but I am a geek 100% and computers I just happen to know too much about so I understand them better. I hope you get this comparison.

 

[KittenKoder]

Overpopulation is a reason to advance, to find ways to get off the planet, to be more efficient with what we have.

Humans tend to not do what is necessary, until it becomes necessary. No matter how much foresight we use. The goal should be to find ways to maintain life (all of it, not just human) without having to remove life or to take it.

Getting off the planet is a valid solution, though as long as people continue to fear advances in science it will not happen either. We are doomed because of people who do not want science to advance, no matter which solution is used. Although I would love to get to space, that would totally rock.

 

[no1tovote4]

Interesting way of looking at it. It would be cool if fetus could be transfered from the bodies of women who want to shed them to the bodies of women who do want them... or men who want them. LOL! Shogun, are you listening?
Butv I would not support tax money going towards that kind of research. Not till we get a grip on out of control world overpopulation first.
For me, it's a separate life from the mother when it's out and has taken it's first breath.

It matters not if it needs the mother to live, as it will continue to need that kind of assistance throughout much of its early existence.

Whether or not we use government money to do this, we should not continue to practice killing as the only option and once there is another we should stop that practice once and for all. The goal of any doctor should not be to kill one of the entities in the room, nor to force another to take part in incubating it. How can we do both? By starting. As long as we think there are no other options, we will be right.

 

[Anguille]

Or at least temporary neutering then requiring a license for reproducing to keep the numbers down. Just something, this breeding all the time combined with the longer life spans is really hurting us as a species, we are driving ourselves extinct and so few are willing to see or admit the real cause. Instead some want to blame nature, others say it's the pollution.

I couldn't agree with the requirement of a license to procreate, as attractive as that idea sounds. What a woman does with her body is still her business, IMO, even if I don't approve or even if it's clearly not good for society if she's popping out babies. I would totally agree with the right for the state to remove children from parents once born. You don't own the kids you bear.

 

[Amanda]

I would totally agree with the right for the state to remove children from parents once born.

You don't see a huge potential for problems with something like that?

 

[no1tovote4]

Getting off the planet is a valid solution, though as long as people continue to fear advances in science it will not happen either. We are doomed because of people who do not want science to advance, no matter which solution is used. Although I would love to get to space, that would totally rock.

Again, until it is necessary we will not do what it takes to get there. It is one of the problems of humans, and one of the best things about them. We will find a way.

The idea that we should only cater to the lowest common denominator, to focus only on the negative solutions rather than positive solutions, because some fear scientific advancement will only serve to ensure that those who fear are the ones who will be in the majority when the need comes and thus make it more difficult for those who will have to find the positive solution.