Poll: Solid majority (71%) of Americans support Obama’s increase of the minimum wage

[Dubya]

LOL...the cost of EVERYTHING I purchase for that business would go up right along with the cost of my food. Or don't you understand that concept? If the guy who ships my produce has to increase the wage he pays the guy who packs it and puts it on a truck then that cost gets passed along to me. That's not hyperbole from me that's simply the way it WORKS. I really don't understand how progressives like you can understand so little about business yet are so ready to impose legislation on it.

You are obviously too dumb to own a business. If minimum wage increased 25%, your cost of doing business would not increase that amount and neither would other businesses. If wages continued to decrease in purchasing power, your business would eventually go bankrupt as people cut back on going to restaurants. If you've owned restarurants, you know there are times when business is slow and you still can only cut back on help so much. I've been around many restaurants, both fancy and plain, and been around plenty of the people who work there both on an after work. It's common for restaurant workers to get off work and socialize together at a late hour restaurant.

If you are a restaurant owner, you would want a very healthy economy where people aren't concerned about money, unless you own a very fancy restaurant where only the rich dine. Anyone who has been in that business knows that.

Labor costs...as anyone who HAS owned a restaurant knows only too well, is the single biggest cost that a restaurant incurs. It's why competent owners and their managers watch labor costs like hawks trying to keep them in line. Having labor costs go up by 25% would be an enormous increase to the cost of doing business...an increase that would have to be passed along in the cost of a meal. That's just common sense...which you appear to be in very short supply of.

I asked you for a percentage of the total cost of running the business. More specifically, I asked you to take one of your restaurants and add up the total cost of a minimum wage increase and determine what percentage of increase it was in doing business. That means the full cost of running that business, including the cost of having your money invested in the business. Hiding behind generalities isn't the answer, because to maintain the same profit, it's the increase in doing business that is the factor which would lead to a price increase. Then, you have to factor in if your restaurant will get more business at that new price, because working people have more money to spend in restaurants. That's assuming your restaurant gets customers who are near minimum wage or lower, or the people who would get raises with a minimum wage increase.

 

[hunarcy]

Doing some of the minimum wage work is a marketable skill. I don't know where you get the impression that minimum wage jobs don't require work and work is a marketable skill. You aren't going to last long on any job just by showing up.

What a pile of crap. You've obviously run your course and are now stuck on stupid.

However, if you come up with anything intelligent, please feel free to try again.

 

[Dubya]

Doing some of the minimum wage work is a marketable skill. I don't know where you get the impression that minimum wage jobs don't require work and work is a marketable skill. You aren't going to last long on any job just by showing up.

What a pile of crap. You've obviously run your course and are now stuck on stupid.

However, if you come up with anything intelligent, please feel free to try again.

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

 

[Oldstyle]

You are obviously too dumb to own a business. If minimum wage increased 25%, your cost of doing business would not increase that amount and neither would other businesses. If wages continued to decrease in purchasing power, your business would eventually go bankrupt as people cut back on going to restaurants. If you've owned restarurants, you know there are times when business is slow and you still can only cut back on help so much. I've been around many restaurants, both fancy and plain, and been around plenty of the people who work there both on an after work. It's common for restaurant workers to get off work and socialize together at a late hour restaurant.

If you are a restaurant owner, you would want a very healthy economy where people aren't concerned about money, unless you own a very fancy restaurant where only the rich dine. Anyone who has been in that business knows that.

Labor costs...as anyone who HAS owned a restaurant knows only too well, is the single biggest cost that a restaurant incurs. It's why competent owners and their managers watch labor costs like hawks trying to keep them in line. Having labor costs go up by 25% would be an enormous increase to the cost of doing business...an increase that would have to be passed along in the cost of a meal. That's just common sense...which you appear to be in very short supply of.

I asked you for a percentage of the total cost of running the business. More specifically, I asked you to take one of your restaurants and add up the total cost of a minimum wage increase and determine what percentage of increase it was in doing business. That means the full cost of running that business, including the cost of having your money invested in the business. Hiding behind generalities isn't the answer, because to maintain the same profit, it's the increase in doing business that is the factor which would lead to a price increase. Then, you have to factor in if your restaurant will get more business at that new price, because working people have more money to spend in restaurants. That's assuming your restaurant gets customers who are near minimum wage or lower, or the people who would get raises with a minimum wage increase.

You've never run a business...have you, Dubya? I've already explained to you that there is what I'll now refer to as a "totem pole" structure for wages...with entry level jobs at the bottom all the way up highly skilled jobs at the top. Whenever you raise a level at the bottom you invariably have to raise ALL the levels along with that. Why? Because people who have gotten increases in their pay because of a promotion don't feel it's right for someone who hasn't yet learned the skills that they had to learn to make the same pay as they do.

Your contention that I will make more money because working people will HAVE more money to spend is ridiculous since "I" am the one who will be giving them that extra money! I know that economics isn't the strong point of progressives but surely even YOU can understand that? The fact of the matter is that nobody will really have more money because business owners like myself will be raising our prices to offset the increased costs of those wage increases. If I pay you two dollars more an hour but raise the cost of everything you consume...have you really made more money? The government will make more because they'll be getting more in taxes. They are the only "winners" with an increase in the minimum wage because they get more revenue to play with.

 

[Claudette]

Labor costs...as anyone who HAS owned a restaurant knows only too well, is the single biggest cost that a restaurant incurs. It's why competent owners and their managers watch labor costs like hawks trying to keep them in line. Having labor costs go up by 25% would be an enormous increase to the cost of doing business...an increase that would have to be passed along in the cost of a meal. That's just common sense...which you appear to be in very short supply of.

I asked you for a percentage of the total cost of running the business. More specifically, I asked you to take one of your restaurants and add up the total cost of a minimum wage increase and determine what percentage of increase it was in doing business. That means the full cost of running that business, including the cost of having your money invested in the business. Hiding behind generalities isn't the answer, because to maintain the same profit, it's the increase in doing business that is the factor which would lead to a price increase. Then, you have to factor in if your restaurant will get more business at that new price, because working people have more money to spend in restaurants. That's assuming your restaurant gets customers who are near minimum wage or lower, or the people who would get raises with a minimum wage increase.

You've never run a business...have you, Dubya? I've already explained to you that there is what I'll now refer to as a "totem pole" structure for wages...with entry level jobs at the bottom all the way up highly skilled jobs at the top. Whenever you raise a level at the bottom you invariably have to raise ALL the levels along with that. Why? Because people who have gotten increases in their pay because of a promotion don't feel it's right for someone who hasn't yet learned the skills that they had to learn to make the same pay as they do.

Your contention that I will make more money because working people will HAVE more money to spend is ridiculous since "I" am the one who will be giving them that extra money! I know that economics isn't the strong point of progressives but surely even YOU can understand that? The fact of the matter is that nobody will really have more money because business owners like myself will be raising our prices to offset the increased costs of those wage increases. If I pay you two dollars more an hour but raise the cost of everything you consume...have you really made more money? The government will make more because they'll be getting more in taxes. They are the only "winners" with an increase in the minimum wage because they get more revenue to play with.

He obviously hasn't got any common sense.

Raise labor costs, the price of eveything goes up and there goes your raise to pay for those higher prices.

Common sense 101.

 

[Oldstyle]

Doing some of the minimum wage work is a marketable skill. I don't know where you get the impression that minimum wage jobs don't require work and work is a marketable skill. You aren't going to last long on any job just by showing up.

What a pile of crap. You've obviously run your course and are now stuck on stupid.

However, if you come up with anything intelligent, please feel free to try again.

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

 

[Oldstyle]

And my customer base is NOT minimum wage earners, Dubya! People making minimum wage cannot afford to dine out in nice restaurants. When you're on a limited budget you buy inexpensive foods and you cook at home.

 

[The Rabbi]

And my customer base is NOT minimum wage earners, Dubya! People making minimum wage cannot afford to dine out in nice restaurants. When you're on a limited budget you buy inexpensive foods and you cook at home.

Mickey D's!

 

[hunarcy]

What a pile of crap. You've obviously run your course and are now stuck on stupid.

However, if you come up with anything intelligent, please feel free to try again.

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

You are correct, but you're wasting your time trying to explain it to that guy. In fact, I bet he got his story off a lifetime movie. He just is very upset that I brought up the idea that marketable skills make people more valuable and gets them raises, so most people don't STAY at minimum wage. Because if he realized that, he'd have to admit that the real result of rasing minimum wage is to devalue the wages of the vast majority of workers and make their lives less prosperous.

 

[Dubya]

What a pile of crap. You've obviously run your course and are now stuck on stupid.

However, if you come up with anything intelligent, please feel free to try again.

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

That minimum wage was around $10 per hour compared to today.

America has it's share of people with your views and they tend to be represented in very high numbers in the political forums. Those views are extremist views, so don't kid yourself into thinking the vast majority of Americans accept them. From 2006 to 2010 the amount of people making minimum wage or below minimum wage increased from 2.2% to 6.0% of the 59.7% of workers receiving hourly wages. That's telling you when times get bad, employers will pay people less, because they can get away with it. All that does is prolong a recession and if minimum wage laws weren't there as a floor, it would just add another dimension to businesses paying less in wages. Your free market concepts don't work and we've tried them.

 

[The Rabbi]

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

That minimum wage was around $10 per hour compared to today.

America has it's share of people with your views and they tend to be represented in very high numbers in the political forums. Those views are extremist views, so don't kid yourself into thinking the vast majority of Americans accept them. From 2006 to 2010 the amount of people making minimum wage or below minimum wage increased from 2.2% to 6.0% of the 59.7% of workers receiving hourly wages. That's telling you when times get bad, employers will pay people less, because they can get away with it. All that does is prolong a recession and if minimum wage laws weren't there as a floor, it would just add another dimension to businesses paying less in wages. Your free market concepts don't work and we've tried them.

No, it tells you people wouldn't have jobs at all because employers could not reduce wages so they would simply cut their workforce.
You aren't what they call a "deep thinker", are you?

 

[Redfish]

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

That minimum wage was around $10 per hour compared to today.

America has it's share of people with your views and they tend to be represented in very high numbers in the political forums. Those views are extremist views, so don't kid yourself into thinking the vast majority of Americans accept them. From 2006 to 2010 the amount of people making minimum wage or below minimum wage increased from 2.2% to 6.0% of the 59.7% of workers receiving hourly wages. That's telling you when times get bad, employers will pay people less, because they can get away with it. All that does is prolong a recession and if minimum wage laws weren't there as a floor, it would just add another dimension to businesses paying less in wages. Your free market concepts don't work and we've tried them.

you are totally wrong on every point, your own story invalidates your premise.

but you are so thick headed its a waste of time debating you. thats why you were banned from the other forums-------for being an idiot.

 

[Dubya]

Where do you idiots get off claiming working isn't a marketable skill and believing someone without a higher education doesn't deserve a decent job? Most of the people who get a good job get it because they have some kind of family influence to get it. Just how many people getting a college degree manage to find employment in that field?

When I turned 16, I got my working papers, because a cannery about 3 miles from where I lived was going to hire. The people looking for a job gathered there the first day and they picked people and started the operation. Occasionally, they would come and pick one of the remaining people looking for work on the first day. My parents told me they weren't going to hire me, but I wanted to go back the second day. About two hours before the job ended that evening I was hired. They gave me a broom and told me to feed the husks that were building up at the end of the drag chain into the drag chain. Then, they told me to go between the husking machines and clean up that buildup. Then, they told me to keep the area in front of the husking machines clean with a hose, because the corn would splatter and made that area slippery. There was an old guy there who kept the husking machines lubricated and removed buildup, mostly corn silk from moving parts. He had his hands full, so he showed me what to do to assist him, like cutting the silk off rotating parts. Now, that doesn't sound like much of a job, but you really had to hustle to keep up with it all and if you really could work fast, you could keep that area fairly clean, but never clean. The job was necessary because eventually the buildup would shut the operation down.

The cannery was owned by three brothers who inherited it from their dad. One took care of field operations, one did the business operations and the other used his mechanical ability to keep the cannery running. When something vital caused a shutdown, the workers were put off the clock until it was fixed. Somehow, the owner who would fix it requested me to assist him and I was happy to do it, because that meant I was still being paid. The next year they move me to the cutter room to replace a job done by the son of the owner who did field operations. There I had to maintain the cutter heads that cut corn from the cob, which meant I had to disassemble them and sharpen the blades. They had to be cleaned up too and oiled. The cutting machines would periodically jam up, so I had to keep and eye on them, unjam them and sometimes replace the cutter head, if the machine wasn't working right. At times, motors burned up and they showed me how to replace and align the motors. Again, if the cannery shutdown, I would go help fix the problem. They asked me to stay over and clean up during lunch and dinner, so I would use a steam hose and water hose to clean the area and only took 15 minutes for lunch and 30 minutes for dinner. I'd also stay over at night and do a major cleanup. Evenually, they gave me the key to the gate and I was the first one there opening the gate in the morning and the last to leave each night. During the evening on my third day of the week, I passed my 50th hour and was making overtime for the rest of the week. They didn't work Sundays.

On my third year there, they asked me to work and do some rebuilding of the machinery before the cannery opened, so I was working there as a machinist, because I had been fixing machines long before I was old enough to operate them. All that was done before I went to college and it was back in the days when minimum wage was at it's historical high. The minimum wage for agricultural work was $1.60, which was $0.05 cheaper than the regular minimum wage. On my third year, I asked for a raise and was making $1.75 per hour. The only skill I offered them to advance was the skill to work hard. Until my third year, I wasn't old enough to operate the machines I learned to fix. Now, obviously that place offered opportunities that normal minimum wage jobs don't offer, but those opportunities can't be offered to everybody who worked there. You can't use everybody to fix a breakdown in a production line. There wasn't anyone who worked there that didn't have a job essential to producing that product, which was just a can of corn, sold in a variety of labels. Even the people who had jobs feeding machines, where ten machines were needed, were needed to produce the product at the proper level. All the jobs were important and necessary.

Being exceptional has never been a problem for me, but I've never been arrogant enough to think I'm better than someone else. You assholes need to learn some humility.

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

You are correct, but you're wasting your time trying to explain it to that guy. In fact, I bet he got his story off a lifetime movie. He just is very upset that I brought up the idea that marketable skills make people more valuable and gets them raises, so most people don't STAY at minimum wage. Because if he realized that, he'd have to admit that the real result of rasing minimum wage is to devalue the wages of the vast majority of workers and make their lives less prosperous.

You're an idiot. How many people does one of those owners need to help him fix a breakdown in production? The times I remember mostly involve the two of us and sometimes one of the foreman. Some jobs you just can't crowd with extra people, because they get in the way. You only need the amount of people you need and you need to get in there and work as fast as you can. I started off just doing minor assistance of handing tools and anticipating what needed to be done next.

Everyone of the people who worked there had a marketable skill, because the job had it's built-in demands. The people needed to perform at 100% of what was required and someone not giving 100% was just taking up space. That's the way most minimum wage jobs are and there isn't room to have people not doing what's required of them. You keep saying things about minimum wage jobs as if they are entry level jobs in some kind of production and that isn't the case. Nearly all those minimum wage jobs just require someone to do that job and that's it. They are a dead end job with no chance for advancement.

 

[Dubya]

Your story is actually a perfect example of why we DON'T need minimum wage laws, Dubya. You got an entry level job...you learned skills...you were promoted...you made more money...you learned even more skills and you earned even more money. Does the natural "order" of that not resonate with you? Yet here you are demanding that people starting out be given more money simply because they are working. THINK about that!!!

That minimum wage was around $10 per hour compared to today.

America has it's share of people with your views and they tend to be represented in very high numbers in the political forums. Those views are extremist views, so don't kid yourself into thinking the vast majority of Americans accept them. From 2006 to 2010 the amount of people making minimum wage or below minimum wage increased from 2.2% to 6.0% of the 59.7% of workers receiving hourly wages. That's telling you when times get bad, employers will pay people less, because they can get away with it. All that does is prolong a recession and if minimum wage laws weren't there as a floor, it would just add another dimension to businesses paying less in wages. Your free market concepts don't work and we've tried them.

No, it tells you people wouldn't have jobs at all because employers could not reduce wages so they would simply cut their workforce.
You aren't what they call a "deep thinker", are you?

Who could be cut from that cannery workforce? If you cut one person from a husking machine or cutter machine, then the production of the whole operation is reduced by about 10%. That means all those other people working and doing their jobs are still be paid, but you are making that much less product. If you cut one of those unique jobs that aren't done by multiple people, the whole production is stopped.

Who are you going to cut from a convenience store or fast food place? Who are you going to cut from a grocery store and still make the store function? You dumbasses act like those workers are just there out of generosity and not necessity. The convenience store that has two people working the cash registers needs two people. That store will not function well with one person on the cash register, no matter how fast they are. I know of plenty of people who work those kinds of jobs, because I visit the same places often and there isn't one of them that isn't needed doing that job.

Saying you can cut a workforce is different than proving you can cut the workforce. It's just meaning words coming from you.

 

[Dubya]

And my customer base is NOT minimum wage earners, Dubya! People making minimum wage cannot afford to dine out in nice restaurants. When you're on a limited budget you buy inexpensive foods and you cook at home.

Your restaurant can't be that fine if you pay $7 instead of $7.25 for a dishwasher. You still haven't shown how much an increase in minimum wage changes the overall increase in the cost of you doing business. I would guess a minimum wage increase to $9 per hours might add 2% to your cost of doing business, so that $20 steak will now cost $20.40. Big fucking deal!

You're just cheap and one way in your economic views. We don't build an economic system around your restaurant business.

 

[hunarcy]

You're an idiot. How many people does one of those owners need to help him fix a breakdown in production? The times I remember mostly involve the two of us and sometimes one of the foreman. Some jobs you just can't crowd with extra people, because they get in the way. You only need the amount of people you need and you need to get in there and work as fast as you can. I started off just doing minor assistance of handing tools and anticipating what needed to be done next.

Everyone of the people who worked there had a marketable skill, because the job had it's built-in demands. The people needed to perform at 100% of what was required and someone not giving 100% was just taking up space. That's the way most minimum wage jobs are and there isn't room to have people not doing what's required of them. You keep saying things about minimum wage jobs as if they are entry level jobs in some kind of production and that isn't the case. Nearly all those minimum wage jobs just require someone to do that job and that's it. They are a dead end job with no chance for advancement.

You're obviously on drugs, for nothing you posted has any relationship to anything I said. Come back when you find out what "marketable skills" are...but, here's a hint. The more knowledge or skills you have, the more marketable you are and the more money you're able to attract. If it's a job anyone can do, you won't command much money and will be stuck at minimum wage. However, as you work and gain knowledge and skills, you get raises and command more money.

 

[Dubya]

You're an idiot. How many people does one of those owners need to help him fix a breakdown in production? The times I remember mostly involve the two of us and sometimes one of the foreman. Some jobs you just can't crowd with extra people, because they get in the way. You only need the amount of people you need and you need to get in there and work as fast as you can. I started off just doing minor assistance of handing tools and anticipating what needed to be done next.

Everyone of the people who worked there had a marketable skill, because the job had it's built-in demands. The people needed to perform at 100% of what was required and someone not giving 100% was just taking up space. That's the way most minimum wage jobs are and there isn't room to have people not doing what's required of them. You keep saying things about minimum wage jobs as if they are entry level jobs in some kind of production and that isn't the case. Nearly all those minimum wage jobs just require someone to do that job and that's it. They are a dead end job with no chance for advancement.

You're obviously on drugs, for nothing you posted has any relationship to anything I said. Come back when you find out what "marketable skills" are...but, here's a hint. The more knowledge or skills you have, the more marketable you are and the more money you're able to attract. If it's a job anyone can do, you won't command much money and will be stuck at minimum wage. However, as you work and gain knowledge and skills, you get raises and command more money.

Marketable skills are the ability to do work well enough that someone wants to pay you to do it. There are plenty of jobs you idiots call unskilled that you wouldn't be able to do. That means you don't have the marketable skills in those jobs.

 

[whitehall]

No, a solid majority of 1,028 Americans surveyed supported the wage increase. The last time I looked there were around 350 Million Americans. Put it up in a National referendum if you think Americans are for the issue but don't insult our intelligence with a demographic slanted poll.

 

[Dubya]

No, a solid majority of 1,028 Americans surveyed supported the wage increase. The last time I looked there were around 350 Million Americans. Put it up in a National referendum if you think Americans are for the issue but don't insult our intelligence with a demographic slanted poll.

You flatter yourself if you think the majority of Americans are whackos like you.

 

[Dragonlady]

No, a solid majority of 1,028 Americans surveyed supported the wage increase. The last time I looked there were around 350 Million Americans. Put it up in a National referendum if you think Americans are for the issue but don't insult our intelligence with a demographic slanted poll.

You mean like those slanted polls that said the Obama was going to win?

Republicans don't like to admit that their policies are wrong headed and people simply do not support heaping more pain on the working poor. Every time the minimum wage is raised, unemployment goes down, yet Republicans keep saying it's the opposite.