"protecting" And "serving"

[bucs90]

and the military vehicles , he11 they are paid for by taxpayers and should be sold to taxpayers that want them same as was done in the past with old Army DUCKS and old military surplus jeeps , Garands , 45s and M1 carbines , etc , etc !!

I have no problem with that. Any surplus military gear available to cops should also be available for purchase by any non felon citizen.

However...if the Bloods gang and Black Panthers roll in MRAPS...cops will need to have a plan to take one out if needed. Remember the whacko who stole a tank in California? Cops were hopeless.

 

[MikeK]

Innocent citizens held at gunpoint in terrifying California checkpoints

Americano,

Thank you for posting this info.

 

[MikeK]

Again...DISCIPLINE. I agree attitude is everything. And we've softened our police academies. Military style discipline fixes it. I agree there...SOME police academies are failing there.

No one on a SWAT team should be on it without a lot of discipline.

I agree. Training, with specific regard to Procedure, is where much of the problem lies. Equally at fault is inadequate or plainly improper supervision. These deficits can be corrected, which I have no doubt will substantially eliminate much of the existing problems with police misconduct.

while the vast majority of cops are perfectly capable of performing properly and appropriately they are for the most part inadequately trained, supervised, and disciplined. These deficiencies are self-evident in the readily apparent laissez-faire conduct of individuals in uniform.

While I am a strong advocate of unions I believe those "benevolent associations" which in fact are police unions are inappropriately empowered in that they serve mainly to enable their membership to evade punishment for serious misconduct. The purpose of any union is to prevent exploitation and mistreatment of employees by employers, not to defend misconduct on the part of employees by participating in "job actions" (work slowdowns), etc., which we now see happening in Baltimore and elsewhere.

If these unions do not assume a responsible posture and limit their defensive actions on behalf of obvious misconduct the time will come when the federal government will step in, censure them, and possibly dissolve them as a necessary action in the interest of public safety.

 

[MikeK]

I have no problem with that. Any surplus military gear available to cops should also be available for purchase by any non felon citizen.

However...if the Bloods gang and Black Panthers roll in MRAPS...cops will need to have a plan to take one out if needed. Remember the whacko who stole a tank in California? Cops were hopeless.

While a very marginal segment of National Guard troops were deployed to Vietnam, Bush Jr. expanded on the practice by using major segments of National Guard troops to invade Iraq, thereby seriously limiting the availability of Guard troops to respond to internal situations occurring beyond the ability of local and state police to contain. Thus the subsequent militarization of civilian police agencies -- which is a bad idea because it confuses the agencies' personnel as to their purpose and limitations.

The American public doesn't need militarized police. They need properly trained and oriented civilian police agencies and a readily available National Guard to deal with situations which are beyond the capabilities of civilian cops.

We don't want this Nineteen Eighty Four stuff:

 

[prison/con.net]

the dope laws are WRONG, folks. It's none of anyone else's business what an adult puts into or takes out of his own body.

 

[MikeK]

the dope laws are WRONG, folks. It's none of anyone else's business what an adult puts into or takes out of his own body.

You're quite right!

The drug war resides at the root of America's law-enforcement problems. The police have become militarized because of this major administrative blunder. They are preoccupied with enforcing drug laws in spite of the fact that their efforts have produced and are producing zero effect on the use and availability of recreational drugs.

 

[bucs90]

I have no problem with that. Any surplus military gear available to cops should also be available for purchase by any non felon citizen.

However...if the Bloods gang and Black Panthers roll in MRAPS...cops will need to have a plan to take one out if needed. Remember the whacko who stole a tank in California? Cops were hopeless.

While a very marginal segment of National Guard troops were deployed to Vietnam, Bush Jr. expanded on the practice by using major segments of National Guard troops to invade Iraq, thereby seriously limiting the availability of Guard troops to respond to internal situations occurring beyond the ability of local and state police to contain. Thus the subsequent militarization of civilian police agencies -- which is a bad idea because it confuses the agencies' personnel as to their purpose and limitations.

The American public doesn't need militarized police. They need properly trained and oriented civilian police agencies and a readily available National Guard to deal with situations which are beyond the capabilities of civilian cops.

We don't want this Nineteen Eighty Four stuff:

National Guard troops are trained more for war than domestic policing. Im not sure why'd you'd prefer a part time Guard infantry unit policing a US city over a full time police department. Seems the risk to citizens would he greater with part timers who are mostly trained in war fighting...whereas a cop's instincts are policing....not war fighting.

 

[bucs90]

the dope laws are WRONG, folks. It's none of anyone else's business what an adult puts into or takes out of his own body.

You're quite right!

The drug war resides at the root of America's law-enforcement problems. The police have become militarized because of this major administrative blunder. They are preoccupied with enforcing drug laws in spite of the fact that their efforts have produced and are producing zero effect on the use and availability of recreational drugs.

I agree mostly. Weed should be legal. Drug gangs carry big guns and are vicious. Cant blame cops for arming up...but yeah...it was big time response to it. We absolutely need drug reform. Legally prescribed drugs do as much if not more harm to society than weed or acid.

Good convo. Glad to trade ideas with someone of another perspective who is logical and makes good points.

 

[Ame®icano]

all they can do is cast innuendo Americano , some people want a standing military type force in the USA . Americans though can see the danger in that style of policing and I'm glad that they do .

 

[Ame®icano]

I'm old enough to remember police from the 60s , police were alright !! Police have escalated as shown by the guy that was STOPPED because he flipped the bird . That's not right because flipping the bird is legal . Cops have AR rifles and shotguns , high cap pistols and that's cool as their taxpaying employers have AR's and shotguns . I only object to attitude shown by the cop that pulled over a finger flipping motorist because he thinks that he is SPECIAL Bucs !!

I understand that criminals today are more dangerous. But still, I don't think there is enough justification that every single village or town is in need for swat team or armored vehicles. Atop that, counties have them, sheriffs, states. Atop that there are FBI, DEA, DHS, even freaking USDA purchased submachine guns for their agents.

On the other hand...

 

[hipeter924]

all they can do is cast innuendo Americano , some people want a standing military type force in the USA . Americans though can see the danger in that style of policing and I'm glad that they do .

The guy on the top of the third carrier looks like Rick Moranis, just a bigger helmet and he would fit right in with Spaceballs:

 

[MikeK]

National Guard troops are trained more for war than domestic policing.

That was not always the case.

The Kent State (college campus) incident occurred as evidence of a change in training policies -- which came about as the direct result of Guard troops being deployed to Vietnam. According to a cousin who served in the National Guard prior to the shift in training policy (1950s era) the training emphasis was on riot and crowd control and community occupation.

Im not sure why'd you'd prefer a part time Guard infantry unit policing a US city over a full time police department. Seems the risk to citizens would he greater with part timers who are mostly trained in war fighting...whereas a cop's instincts are policing....not war fighting.

Deployment of the National Guard in situations like Baltimore would be a matter of necessity, not preference. It would be a temporary situation in which the Guard would supplement local police, not replace them, and they would be withdrawn as soon as order is restored.

The reason for avoiding militarization of civilian police is the effect it has on the ultimate disposition of the militarized police toward the civilian population. Many behaviorists believe the circumstances we are seeing today, i.e., the manifest disconnection of the police from the civilian social order via an exaggerated authoritarian disposition, is the result of the military mentality seeping into a para-military occupation.

The effect of this circumstance leads to such major occurrences as the cop who shot the fleeing subject in the back seven times and the relatively minor example of the idiot cop who pursued and pepper-sprayed (assaulted) a harmless finger-waving jerk. Those are just two examples of an unmistakable trend.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Another hero protecting the serving the shit out of a 13 year old kid for skateboarding.

Horrifying Video Shows Cop Choking 13-Year-old Boy as He Tasers Him in the Spine Punk Rock Libertarians

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

NYPD harasses and assaults another brown man for essentially no reason at all and jokes about it.

Bronx man to sue over unexplained arrest alleged injury - NY Daily News

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Arkansas cops assault legally blind black man claiming they felt threatened by him

Video Shows Arkansas Cops Slamming Cooperative Blind Black Man to the Ground Alternet

 

[blackhawk]

What I have noticed is peoples attitude toward the police is becoming much the same as it is toward lawyers you don't trust them you trash them and criticize them until you need one then that attitude changes dramatically.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

What I have noticed is peoples attitude toward the police is becoming much the same as it is toward lawyers you don't trust them you trash them and criticize them until you need one then that attitude changes dramatically.

Well, the police have themselves to blame for a lot of that.

 

[Unkotare]

Arkansas cops assault legally blind black man claiming they felt threatened by him

Video Shows Arkansas Cops Slamming Cooperative Blind Black Man to the Ground Alternet

This just in: Message Board User obsessively touts his arrested development fear of authority; refuses to grow up.

 

[MaryL]

Lets make sure we are on the same page here. Are we jumping on the bash cops bandwagon because it is popular, right? All the focus on bad cops/racist cops couldn't possibly be just...a symptom of bad reportage and fixated liberal media with a ax to grind? Na, not in a million years. Folks Like Brian Wilson, Dan Rather, People don't put an agenda first and facts second, do they? THEY ARE THE MEDIA! So is the national inquirer and TMZ.

 

[blackhawk]

What I have noticed is peoples attitude toward the police is becoming much the same as it is toward lawyers you don't trust them you trash them and criticize them until you need one then that attitude changes dramatically.

Well, the police have themselves to blame for a lot of that.

No actually they are to blame for only a small part of that the main problem is media that takes what are a small number of incidents when you realize how many police officers there are across the nation and try to protray their actions as representative of the majority of police officers. Any police officer who crossses the line should be delt with switfly but fairly and you don't come down on the entire force because of the actions of a few they did that in Balitmore and we see how that's working out.