"Reasonable" gun control vs "gun nut gun control"

[Brain357]

You are comparing that to cities with millions of people? You must be joking.

Houston and surrounding area population.....6.18 million. Try again.

Houston has plenty of shootings.

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

 

[Brain357]

Population density mostly. Nothing to do with race.

Yeah...okay.
Funny thing though,I live in a master planned community that has in excess of 8'000 homes. I'd have to say thats a pretty dense population.
Yet we never have shootings.

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

Really brain.......when you say something like that you really look stupid. Ask the family in Vice President Joe Biden's neighborhood...you know the ultra safe community...where the family was taken hostage, the 10 year old son was tortured to get the cooperation of the parents and the husband beaten to death with a bat, and the wife stabbed to death and the maid murdered as well........

Why didn't you warn them Brain.....you know the future........you keep telling us we don't need guns if we live in safe communities...why didn't you warn them?

Or the family.....the wife and daughter followed home by 2 monsters....again, a really, really nice community....the husband was a Doctor for goodness sakes.......they raped the wife and 2 daughters, beat the husband with a baseball bat and then ended up burning the wife and 2 daughters alive......all in a very safe community.......

And how about a golden oldie......the Tate and La Bianca families........living in Hollywood, very, very nice homes and communities.....and the manson family comes in and murders them....Sharon Tate...begging the killers to let her live so she can have her baby...she was pregnant when they murdered her....and they cut her open to see the baby.....another really, really safe community.........

(on a side note, close personal friend of barak and michelle obama, bernadine dorhn, whose husband is bill ayers......she adopted the 4 finger salute during the time she helped lead the riots at the democrat convention in the 60s...the 4 fingers represented the fork used by the manson family members to open Sharon Stones stomach....you know...kill the pigs.....
That is one of the close personal freinds of obama.....who introduced michelle to barak......)

If you can tell when people will need guns and when they won't need them brain...wow......imagine how many lives you could save.......

You want me to be paranoid and scared for such rare events? You must be joking.

Not at all brain.....I am pointing out that they do happen...as do rapes, robberies and murders....and you never know where or when or who the victim will be. A nurse was leaving work and kidnapped and raped by 2 teenagers......they locked her in her trunk and pushed it into a reservoir. She took about 5 minutes to drown.....

You constantly mock people who carry guns for self defense.....even though crime happens to people every day, and no one knows if they will be the next victim.....you are a jerk......

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study

 

[2aguy]

Yeah...okay.
Funny thing though,I live in a master planned community that has in excess of 8'000 homes. I'd have to say thats a pretty dense population.
Yet we never have shootings.

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

Really brain.......when you say something like that you really look stupid. Ask the family in Vice President Joe Biden's neighborhood...you know the ultra safe community...where the family was taken hostage, the 10 year old son was tortured to get the cooperation of the parents and the husband beaten to death with a bat, and the wife stabbed to death and the maid murdered as well........

Why didn't you warn them Brain.....you know the future........you keep telling us we don't need guns if we live in safe communities...why didn't you warn them?

Or the family.....the wife and daughter followed home by 2 monsters....again, a really, really nice community....the husband was a Doctor for goodness sakes.......they raped the wife and 2 daughters, beat the husband with a baseball bat and then ended up burning the wife and 2 daughters alive......all in a very safe community.......

And how about a golden oldie......the Tate and La Bianca families........living in Hollywood, very, very nice homes and communities.....and the manson family comes in and murders them....Sharon Tate...begging the killers to let her live so she can have her baby...she was pregnant when they murdered her....and they cut her open to see the baby.....another really, really safe community.........

(on a side note, close personal friend of barak and michelle obama, bernadine dorhn, whose husband is bill ayers......she adopted the 4 finger salute during the time she helped lead the riots at the democrat convention in the 60s...the 4 fingers represented the fork used by the manson family members to open Sharon Stones stomach....you know...kill the pigs.....
That is one of the close personal freinds of obama.....who introduced michelle to barak......)

If you can tell when people will need guns and when they won't need them brain...wow......imagine how many lives you could save.......

You want me to be paranoid and scared for such rare events? You must be joking.

Not at all brain.....I am pointing out that they do happen...as do rapes, robberies and murders....and you never know where or when or who the victim will be. A nurse was leaving work and kidnapped and raped by 2 teenagers......they locked her in her trunk and pushed it into a reservoir. She took about 5 minutes to drown.....

You constantly mock people who carry guns for self defense.....even though crime happens to people every day, and no one knows if they will be the next victim.....you are a jerk......

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study

 

[2aguy]

Yeah...okay.
Funny thing though,I live in a master planned community that has in excess of 8'000 homes. I'd have to say thats a pretty dense population.
Yet we never have shootings.

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

If you never have shootings why are you so scared and clinging to your gun?

Really brain.......when you say something like that you really look stupid. Ask the family in Vice President Joe Biden's neighborhood...you know the ultra safe community...where the family was taken hostage, the 10 year old son was tortured to get the cooperation of the parents and the husband beaten to death with a bat, and the wife stabbed to death and the maid murdered as well........

Why didn't you warn them Brain.....you know the future........you keep telling us we don't need guns if we live in safe communities...why didn't you warn them?

Or the family.....the wife and daughter followed home by 2 monsters....again, a really, really nice community....the husband was a Doctor for goodness sakes.......they raped the wife and 2 daughters, beat the husband with a baseball bat and then ended up burning the wife and 2 daughters alive......all in a very safe community.......

And how about a golden oldie......the Tate and La Bianca families........living in Hollywood, very, very nice homes and communities.....and the manson family comes in and murders them....Sharon Tate...begging the killers to let her live so she can have her baby...she was pregnant when they murdered her....and they cut her open to see the baby.....another really, really safe community.........

(on a side note, close personal friend of barak and michelle obama, bernadine dorhn, whose husband is bill ayers......she adopted the 4 finger salute during the time she helped lead the riots at the democrat convention in the 60s...the 4 fingers represented the fork used by the manson family members to open Sharon Stones stomach....you know...kill the pigs.....
That is one of the close personal freinds of obama.....who introduced michelle to barak......)

If you can tell when people will need guns and when they won't need them brain...wow......imagine how many lives you could save.......

You want me to be paranoid and scared for such rare events? You must be joking.

Not at all brain.....I am pointing out that they do happen...as do rapes, robberies and murders....and you never know where or when or who the victim will be. A nurse was leaving work and kidnapped and raped by 2 teenagers......they locked her in her trunk and pushed it into a reservoir. She took about 5 minutes to drown.....

You constantly mock people who carry guns for self defense.....even though crime happens to people every day, and no one knows if they will be the next victim.....you are a jerk......

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study

Whew....you better build a time machine and go back and tell all these people they are useless in a violent attack


Armed Citizen®

Local police won’t charge a Right-to-Carry permit holder who killed a man during an attempted carjacking in Orem, Utah. The armed citizen heard a scream while he was in the parking lot of a grocery store. When he saw a woman being pulled from her car, he approached, drew his 9 mm Luger handgun and told the carjacker to stop what he was doing. The suspect lunged at the armed citizen, who fired his weapon once, killing the would-be car thief. Police Capt. Ned Jackson said the shooter, who was not identified, won’t be charged, because Utah law allows the use of a gun in self-defense or to prevent a forcible felony. (The Salt Lake Tribune, Salt Lake City, Utah, 5/4/15)

Breaking up before the big dance carried a price for several people. Two Wisconsin teens had a lovers’ spat before the prom, after the girl’s parents had spent $500 on a dress. The girl’s parents asked the boy to partially reimburse them since he backed out of the date. The Madison boy stewed about the request and became enraged. He returned to his girlfriend’s house in the wee hours of the morning and tried to break in. The girl’s father caught the boy and called him to task, prompting the boy to draw a knife and stab the man seven times. While the two males were grappling, the girl’s mother came out and fired a handgun into the air. The gunfire distracted the youth, and the man wrestled the teen to the ground. The boyfriend faces multiple charges, including attempted homicide. The girl’s father was airlifted to a hospital to have his wounds treated. (Wisconsin State Journal, Madison, Wis., 5/8/15)

A repeat offender won’t be committing any more crimes. A Tennessee homeowner fatally shot a man who was climbing through the home’s front window. The resident was awakened by a thud in the middle of the night. He responded by chambering a round in his Glock and going to investigate. When he saw the intruder at the window, he fired once, striking the miscreant in the head. The homeowner called 911, but the suspect died before authorities arrived. The investigation revealed that the criminal had first tried to kick in the door—accounting for the noise that woke up the resident. The dead man had a criminal history that included multiple aggravated burglaries. (Knoxville News Sentinel, Knoxville, Tenn., 5/1/15)

One problem with random attacks is that you never know how your victim might respond. An assault suspect in Washington state learned that lesson. The assailant had been shopping at a Wal-Mart in Yakima. He picked a metal tee-ball bat off the shelf and struck another shopper. The victim, who had a concealed-carry permit, pulled a SIG Sauer from his holster and ordered the attacker to lie on the ground. Store surveillance video indicated the attack was unprovoked. The suspect was being held in the Yakima County jail. (Yakima Herald Republic, Yakima, Wash., 4/14/15)

Just because someone is going to a medical facility doesn’t make them any more vulnerable than anyone else. An armed robber targeted a Michigan patient who had pulled into the parking lot at a dialysis center for treatment early one morning. The Oakland County Sheriff’s Department said the robber stepped out of a wooded area near the parking lot, pulled his gun and demanded the driver’s wallet. The patient responded by drawing his own gun and asking, “Do you really want to do this?” The assailant turned and ran. Police tried to track the suspect with dogs, but couldn’t find him. (myfoxdetroit.com, Detroit, Mich., 5/19/15)

An elderly Miami-area man refused to be a victim, even though the bad guys outnumbered him 2-to-1. Miami-Dade police said two burglars entered a house in Redland one afternoon, and shots were fired soon thereafter. One intruder died at the scene and the other was taken to a hospital. The homeowner, 77, is cooperating with police, who are treating this as a “stand your ground” case. People in the neighborhood had reported several burglaries and attempted burglaries before this one. (NBC News 6, Miami, Fla., 5/18/15)

Rifles can come in handy for self-defense. A St. Regis, Mont., woman used a .22-250 Rem. rifle to fend off a bear. The woman and her husband were watching TV late one night when they heard a noise outside. The husband opened the door to investigate and the bear charged. The woman shot once, felling the animal eight feet from the home. (Missoulian, Missoula, Mont., 5/21/15)

 

[2aguy]

Houston and surrounding area population.....6.18 million. Try again.

Houston has plenty of shootings.

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

 

[RKMBrown]

Let us compare California and Vermont, the states with the most and least restrictive gun laws.

California - "Reasonable" gun control
CA gun laws require that:
-All transfers must be through a dealer, thus...
-All transfers undergo a background check
-All transfers undergo a 10-day waiting period (ruled unconstitutional 8/2014)
-All firearms must be registered
-Handgun purchases require a handgun safety certificate-– a permit.that requires training and a test
-Ban on ‘assault weapons’, effective 1 JUN 1989
-Ban on magazines that hold more than 10 rounds
-Ban on NFA machineguns
-Restrictive "may issue" concealed carry permits
-Restrictive open carry

% of murders in US committed with a firearm: 69.36 (8855/12765)
% of murders in CA committed with a firearm: 69.39 (1304/1879)

% US population in CA: 12.12%
% US murders in CA: 14.71
% US murders with a gun in CA 14.72

Vermont - "Gun nut gun control"
VT gun control law sates:
-No gun owners are licensed
-No firearm must be registered
-No ban on ‘assault weapons’
-No ban on magazines that hold more than 10 rounds
-No ban on NFA weapons
-Concealed carry legal w/o permit for residents and non-residents
-Open carry legal w/o permit for residents and non-residents

% of murders in US committed with a firearm: 69.36 (8855/12765)
% of murders in VT committed with a firearm: 55.55 (5/9)

% US population in VT: 1.9648%
% US murders in VT: 0.075%
% US murders with a gun in VT 0.059%

Short version:
CA has far more restrictive gun control than Vermont
Per-capita gun-related murder in CA significantly higher than the the US as a whole
Per-capita gun-related murder in VT significantly lower than the US as a whole.

How can this be?

Easy, there are more inner city gang bangers, illegals, and drug runners in California. Plus there's more money in CA so there's more opportunity / easier pickings for crime there.

 

[Brain357]

Houston has plenty of shootings.

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

I often and clearly state gun ownership does not effect crime rates. Neither does concealed carry.

 

[2aguy]

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study


Yes.....tell us again how armed citizens can't use guns for self defense...do you think all of these people are Navy Seals.....


Zachary Rogers, 26, was working late one night at the 21st Amendment liquor store. It was just past midnight when an armed man wearing a ski mask entered the store and forced Rogers and another store employee, Alicia Grabarczyk, 25, down a hallway toward an office where the safe was kept. With a concealed handgun in his front pocket, Rogers chose his moment of opportunity carefully. In one quick motion, Rogers pushed Grabarczyk to the floor and fired at the armed robber. He then helped Grabarczyk into the office and out of the line of fire. Although the burglar had been struck, Rogers saw him raise his firearm. Rogers fired three more rounds at the gunman which proved fatal. Neither Rogers nor Grabarczyk were harmed. (Indianapolis Star, Indianapolis, IN, 10/11/12)

While at home with his wife and daughter, a homeowner prepared to go outside to investigate a sudden power outage. His wife asked him to carry his firearm with him as a precaution. As he opened the front door to step outside, three men charged him in an attempt to gain entry. The homeowner pushed his wife aside as he fell backward and fired at the intruders. His daughter, a student in her early 20s, hid in another room and called police. One of the three home invaders suffered multiple gunshot wounds and was listed in serious condition. The remaining two suspects managed to escape. The homeowner and his family were not seriously injured. (Sun Sentinel, Miramar, FL, 10/2/12)

Kendra St. Clair, a 12-year-old at home alone one day during her fall break, called her mother at work to say there was a man repeatedly ringing the doorbell and banging on the door. When no one answered the door, she said he disappeared. St. Clair’s mother instructed her daughter to get her .40-cal. Glock pistol and go into a bathroom closet. St. Clair heard him break in through the back door. As the man made his way through her home, 911 dispatchers kept St. Clair on the phone. He was inside the home for approximately six minutes before he made his way to the bathroom where St. Clair was hiding. When she saw the door knob begin to turn, she fired the gun. The 32-year-old intruder was taken into custody after being treated for a gunshot to the chest. (The Oklahoman, Durant, OK, 10/20/12)

George Polanin, 66, went to bed early one evening only to be awakened by noises coming from inside his home. He was upstairs and followed the sound of footsteps to the basement. When he reached the stairs, Polanin said he could see only the intruder’s feet. “ … I got my weapon and basically told him I had a weapon, it was loaded and I will use it,” Polanin said. He then ordered the intruder to come out as he dialed 911. Polanin held the intruder at gunpoint until police arrived. (Kenosha News, Kenosha, WI, 10/17/12)

Cindy Schachter, an employee at Furnari Jewelers, was working when two men entered the store around 4 p.m. Schachter’s boss, Anthony Furnari, was sitting at his desk facing the showroom. Something about the men made Schachter uneasy, so she gave her boss a quiet warning right before they pulled clothing over their faces and jumped over the counter. Furnari quickly pulled his .38-cal. handgun from his desk and fired several rounds at one of the suspects as he came toward him. Furnari was severely beaten as both men tried to gain control of his firearm. When Furnari fought back, the men grabbed a display of gold chains and fled. One suspect was later taken into custody after seeking treatment for several bullet wounds. It was last reported that the second suspect was still at large. Furnari suffered a broken nose, a concussion, multiple stitches to the face and hand, and a fractured rib. Schachter was reportedly unharmed. (The Republican, Chicopee, MA, 10/17/12)

Jack and Linda Dillon were roused from their sleep at approximately 2:45 a.m. when they realized someone had just broken into their home. The intruder gained entry through an unlocked window. He allegedly entered the home with intent to steal electronics. Linda called 911 as Jack retrieved a firearm and confronted the 29-year-old intruder in their living room. Jack fired when the man lunged at him. The intruder’s wound proved fatal. (The Morning Journal, Elyria, OH, 10/20/12)

 

[2aguy]

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study

Do you think this 12 year old girl has been in the Seals very long....?

Kendra St. Clair, a 12-year-old at home alone one day during her fall break, called her mother at work to say there was a man repeatedly ringing the doorbell and banging on the door. When no one answered the door, she said he disappeared. St. Clair’s mother instructed her daughter to get her .40-cal. Glock pistol and go into a bathroom closet. St. Clair heard him break in through the back door. As the man made his way through her home, 911 dispatchers kept St. Clair on the phone. He was inside the home for approximately six minutes before he made his way to the bathroom where St. Clair was hiding. When she saw the door knob begin to turn, she fired the gun. The 32-year-old intruder was taken into custody after being treated for a gunshot to the chest. (The Oklahoman, Durant, OK, 10/20/12)

 

[RKMBrown]

Houston has plenty of shootings.

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

Gun control laws are not there to reduce gun violence... they are there to control guns. The citizens of CA and their law enforcement people want the people to be unarmed if at all possible. Disarming the population gives power to the the government and it's law enforcement people. Gun control is about increasing government power not reducing gun violence.

 

[Brain357]

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study


Yes.....tell us again how armed citizens can't use guns for self defense...do you think all of these people are Navy Seals.....


Zachary Rogers, 26, was working late one night at the 21st Amendment liquor store. It was just past midnight when an armed man wearing a ski mask entered the store and forced Rogers and another store employee, Alicia Grabarczyk, 25, down a hallway toward an office where the safe was kept. With a concealed handgun in his front pocket, Rogers chose his moment of opportunity carefully. In one quick motion, Rogers pushed Grabarczyk to the floor and fired at the armed robber. He then helped Grabarczyk into the office and out of the line of fire. Although the burglar had been struck, Rogers saw him raise his firearm. Rogers fired three more rounds at the gunman which proved fatal. Neither Rogers nor Grabarczyk were harmed. (Indianapolis Star, Indianapolis, IN, 10/11/12)

While at home with his wife and daughter, a homeowner prepared to go outside to investigate a sudden power outage. His wife asked him to carry his firearm with him as a precaution. As he opened the front door to step outside, three men charged him in an attempt to gain entry. The homeowner pushed his wife aside as he fell backward and fired at the intruders. His daughter, a student in her early 20s, hid in another room and called police. One of the three home invaders suffered multiple gunshot wounds and was listed in serious condition. The remaining two suspects managed to escape. The homeowner and his family were not seriously injured. (Sun Sentinel, Miramar, FL, 10/2/12)

Kendra St. Clair, a 12-year-old at home alone one day during her fall break, called her mother at work to say there was a man repeatedly ringing the doorbell and banging on the door. When no one answered the door, she said he disappeared. St. Clair’s mother instructed her daughter to get her .40-cal. Glock pistol and go into a bathroom closet. St. Clair heard him break in through the back door. As the man made his way through her home, 911 dispatchers kept St. Clair on the phone. He was inside the home for approximately six minutes before he made his way to the bathroom where St. Clair was hiding. When she saw the door knob begin to turn, she fired the gun. The 32-year-old intruder was taken into custody after being treated for a gunshot to the chest. (The Oklahoman, Durant, OK, 10/20/12)

George Polanin, 66, went to bed early one evening only to be awakened by noises coming from inside his home. He was upstairs and followed the sound of footsteps to the basement. When he reached the stairs, Polanin said he could see only the intruder’s feet. “ … I got my weapon and basically told him I had a weapon, it was loaded and I will use it,” Polanin said. He then ordered the intruder to come out as he dialed 911. Polanin held the intruder at gunpoint until police arrived. (Kenosha News, Kenosha, WI, 10/17/12)

Cindy Schachter, an employee at Furnari Jewelers, was working when two men entered the store around 4 p.m. Schachter’s boss, Anthony Furnari, was sitting at his desk facing the showroom. Something about the men made Schachter uneasy, so she gave her boss a quiet warning right before they pulled clothing over their faces and jumped over the counter. Furnari quickly pulled his .38-cal. handgun from his desk and fired several rounds at one of the suspects as he came toward him. Furnari was severely beaten as both men tried to gain control of his firearm. When Furnari fought back, the men grabbed a display of gold chains and fled. One suspect was later taken into custody after seeking treatment for several bullet wounds. It was last reported that the second suspect was still at large. Furnari suffered a broken nose, a concussion, multiple stitches to the face and hand, and a fractured rib. Schachter was reportedly unharmed. (The Republican, Chicopee, MA, 10/17/12)

Jack and Linda Dillon were roused from their sleep at approximately 2:45 a.m. when they realized someone had just broken into their home. The intruder gained entry through an unlocked window. He allegedly entered the home with intent to steal electronics. Linda called 911 as Jack retrieved a firearm and confronted the 29-year-old intruder in their living room. Jack fired when the man lunged at him. The intruder’s wound proved fatal. (The Morning Journal, Elyria, OH, 10/20/12)

More people than that accidently shoot and kill themselves.

 

[2aguy]

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

I often and clearly state gun ownership does not effect crime rates. Neither does concealed carry.

That is just wrong brain...at a minimum....it stops the crime for the person carrying the gun on their person..........and that happens every day...

 

[2aguy]

They are also in a border state with Mexico...a country with complete civilian disarmament....where the government and drug cartels murder their citizens in the thousands each year....and send that violence into Texas.....

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

Gun control laws are not there to reduce gun violence... they are there to control guns. The citizens of CA and their law enforcement people want the people to be unarmed if at all possible. Disarming the population gives power to the the government and it's law enforcement people. Gun control is about increasing government power not reducing gun violence.

Exactly RKMB...well said.

 

[2aguy]

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study


Yes.....tell us again how armed citizens can't use guns for self defense...do you think all of these people are Navy Seals.....


Zachary Rogers, 26, was working late one night at the 21st Amendment liquor store. It was just past midnight when an armed man wearing a ski mask entered the store and forced Rogers and another store employee, Alicia Grabarczyk, 25, down a hallway toward an office where the safe was kept. With a concealed handgun in his front pocket, Rogers chose his moment of opportunity carefully. In one quick motion, Rogers pushed Grabarczyk to the floor and fired at the armed robber. He then helped Grabarczyk into the office and out of the line of fire. Although the burglar had been struck, Rogers saw him raise his firearm. Rogers fired three more rounds at the gunman which proved fatal. Neither Rogers nor Grabarczyk were harmed. (Indianapolis Star, Indianapolis, IN, 10/11/12)

While at home with his wife and daughter, a homeowner prepared to go outside to investigate a sudden power outage. His wife asked him to carry his firearm with him as a precaution. As he opened the front door to step outside, three men charged him in an attempt to gain entry. The homeowner pushed his wife aside as he fell backward and fired at the intruders. His daughter, a student in her early 20s, hid in another room and called police. One of the three home invaders suffered multiple gunshot wounds and was listed in serious condition. The remaining two suspects managed to escape. The homeowner and his family were not seriously injured. (Sun Sentinel, Miramar, FL, 10/2/12)

Kendra St. Clair, a 12-year-old at home alone one day during her fall break, called her mother at work to say there was a man repeatedly ringing the doorbell and banging on the door. When no one answered the door, she said he disappeared. St. Clair’s mother instructed her daughter to get her .40-cal. Glock pistol and go into a bathroom closet. St. Clair heard him break in through the back door. As the man made his way through her home, 911 dispatchers kept St. Clair on the phone. He was inside the home for approximately six minutes before he made his way to the bathroom where St. Clair was hiding. When she saw the door knob begin to turn, she fired the gun. The 32-year-old intruder was taken into custody after being treated for a gunshot to the chest. (The Oklahoman, Durant, OK, 10/20/12)

George Polanin, 66, went to bed early one evening only to be awakened by noises coming from inside his home. He was upstairs and followed the sound of footsteps to the basement. When he reached the stairs, Polanin said he could see only the intruder’s feet. “ … I got my weapon and basically told him I had a weapon, it was loaded and I will use it,” Polanin said. He then ordered the intruder to come out as he dialed 911. Polanin held the intruder at gunpoint until police arrived. (Kenosha News, Kenosha, WI, 10/17/12)

Cindy Schachter, an employee at Furnari Jewelers, was working when two men entered the store around 4 p.m. Schachter’s boss, Anthony Furnari, was sitting at his desk facing the showroom. Something about the men made Schachter uneasy, so she gave her boss a quiet warning right before they pulled clothing over their faces and jumped over the counter. Furnari quickly pulled his .38-cal. handgun from his desk and fired several rounds at one of the suspects as he came toward him. Furnari was severely beaten as both men tried to gain control of his firearm. When Furnari fought back, the men grabbed a display of gold chains and fled. One suspect was later taken into custody after seeking treatment for several bullet wounds. It was last reported that the second suspect was still at large. Furnari suffered a broken nose, a concussion, multiple stitches to the face and hand, and a fractured rib. Schachter was reportedly unharmed. (The Republican, Chicopee, MA, 10/17/12)

Jack and Linda Dillon were roused from their sleep at approximately 2:45 a.m. when they realized someone had just broken into their home. The intruder gained entry through an unlocked window. He allegedly entered the home with intent to steal electronics. Linda called 911 as Jack retrieved a firearm and confronted the 29-year-old intruder in their living room. Jack fired when the man lunged at him. The intruder’s wound proved fatal. (The Morning Journal, Elyria, OH, 10/20/12)

More people than that accidently shoot and kill themselves.

Brain....in 2013 only 505 people were accidentally killed with guns...

Each year on average Americans use guns 2 million times to stop or prevent violent criminal attack and save lives...

over 12.8 million people carry concealed guns for self defense....

So 505 accidental deaths in a country of over 320 million people is no way to set policy......

 

[RKMBrown]

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

Gun control laws are not there to reduce gun violence... they are there to control guns. The citizens of CA and their law enforcement people want the people to be unarmed if at all possible. Disarming the population gives power to the the government and it's law enforcement people. Gun control is about increasing government power not reducing gun violence.

Exactly RKMB...well said.

Funny, when I said that in that other thread you called me crazy Hint.. in the other thread you never asked the question right

 

[Brain357]

CA borders mx too. Does VT? Another reason the comparison is just plain stupid.

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

I often and clearly state gun ownership does not effect crime rates. Neither does concealed carry.

That is just wrong brain...at a minimum....it stops the crime for the person carrying the gun on their person..........and that happens every day...

Guns Don t Deter Crime Study Finds

 

[2aguy]

actually, no it isn't.....you guys keep saying that lax gun laws lead to more gun crime.....VT has lax gun laws....and doesn't have a lot of crime........California has extreme gun control....and lots of crime........

So VT should have a lot more crime than it actually does because it has lax gun laws... you say it should have more, it doesn't so you are wrong....

California, a state in a 1st world country has extreme gun control laws....and high rates of gun murder......you say it shouldn't...and it does....you are wrong.....

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

I often and clearly state gun ownership does not effect crime rates. Neither does concealed carry.

That is just wrong brain...at a minimum....it stops the crime for the person carrying the gun on their person..........and that happens every day...

Guns Don t Deter Crime Study Finds

18 other studies says they do......

 

[Brain357]

Regular people are totally useless when trying to use a handgun in self-defense study


Yes.....tell us again how armed citizens can't use guns for self defense...do you think all of these people are Navy Seals.....


Zachary Rogers, 26, was working late one night at the 21st Amendment liquor store. It was just past midnight when an armed man wearing a ski mask entered the store and forced Rogers and another store employee, Alicia Grabarczyk, 25, down a hallway toward an office where the safe was kept. With a concealed handgun in his front pocket, Rogers chose his moment of opportunity carefully. In one quick motion, Rogers pushed Grabarczyk to the floor and fired at the armed robber. He then helped Grabarczyk into the office and out of the line of fire. Although the burglar had been struck, Rogers saw him raise his firearm. Rogers fired three more rounds at the gunman which proved fatal. Neither Rogers nor Grabarczyk were harmed. (Indianapolis Star, Indianapolis, IN, 10/11/12)

While at home with his wife and daughter, a homeowner prepared to go outside to investigate a sudden power outage. His wife asked him to carry his firearm with him as a precaution. As he opened the front door to step outside, three men charged him in an attempt to gain entry. The homeowner pushed his wife aside as he fell backward and fired at the intruders. His daughter, a student in her early 20s, hid in another room and called police. One of the three home invaders suffered multiple gunshot wounds and was listed in serious condition. The remaining two suspects managed to escape. The homeowner and his family were not seriously injured. (Sun Sentinel, Miramar, FL, 10/2/12)

Kendra St. Clair, a 12-year-old at home alone one day during her fall break, called her mother at work to say there was a man repeatedly ringing the doorbell and banging on the door. When no one answered the door, she said he disappeared. St. Clair’s mother instructed her daughter to get her .40-cal. Glock pistol and go into a bathroom closet. St. Clair heard him break in through the back door. As the man made his way through her home, 911 dispatchers kept St. Clair on the phone. He was inside the home for approximately six minutes before he made his way to the bathroom where St. Clair was hiding. When she saw the door knob begin to turn, she fired the gun. The 32-year-old intruder was taken into custody after being treated for a gunshot to the chest. (The Oklahoman, Durant, OK, 10/20/12)

George Polanin, 66, went to bed early one evening only to be awakened by noises coming from inside his home. He was upstairs and followed the sound of footsteps to the basement. When he reached the stairs, Polanin said he could see only the intruder’s feet. “ … I got my weapon and basically told him I had a weapon, it was loaded and I will use it,” Polanin said. He then ordered the intruder to come out as he dialed 911. Polanin held the intruder at gunpoint until police arrived. (Kenosha News, Kenosha, WI, 10/17/12)

Cindy Schachter, an employee at Furnari Jewelers, was working when two men entered the store around 4 p.m. Schachter’s boss, Anthony Furnari, was sitting at his desk facing the showroom. Something about the men made Schachter uneasy, so she gave her boss a quiet warning right before they pulled clothing over their faces and jumped over the counter. Furnari quickly pulled his .38-cal. handgun from his desk and fired several rounds at one of the suspects as he came toward him. Furnari was severely beaten as both men tried to gain control of his firearm. When Furnari fought back, the men grabbed a display of gold chains and fled. One suspect was later taken into custody after seeking treatment for several bullet wounds. It was last reported that the second suspect was still at large. Furnari suffered a broken nose, a concussion, multiple stitches to the face and hand, and a fractured rib. Schachter was reportedly unharmed. (The Republican, Chicopee, MA, 10/17/12)

Jack and Linda Dillon were roused from their sleep at approximately 2:45 a.m. when they realized someone had just broken into their home. The intruder gained entry through an unlocked window. He allegedly entered the home with intent to steal electronics. Linda called 911 as Jack retrieved a firearm and confronted the 29-year-old intruder in their living room. Jack fired when the man lunged at him. The intruder’s wound proved fatal. (The Morning Journal, Elyria, OH, 10/20/12)

More people than that accidently shoot and kill themselves.

Brain....in 2013 only 505 people were accidentally killed with guns...

Each year on average Americans use guns 2 million times to stop or prevent violent criminal attack and save lives...

over 12.8 million people carry concealed guns for self defense....

So 505 accidental deaths in a country of over 320 million people is no way to set policy......

2 million is completely made up. There are less than 10 million crimes committed each year. Gun owners are a minority and most crimes are committed when nobody is there to defend then. Your number isn't mathematically possible.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Easy, there are more inner city gang bangers, illegals, and drug runners in California. Plus there's more money in CA so there's more opportunity / easier pickings for crime there.

Ah.
So... demo-soci-economic issues have a greater effect on crime than gun control?

 

[Brain357]

VT without any large cities is silly to compare. What a joke.

Sorry brain....you anti gun extremists say lax gun laws create more gun crime......VT. shows that that is completely wrong......and all the gun laws in California, not reducing their gun violence....

I often and clearly state gun ownership does not effect crime rates. Neither does concealed carry.

That is just wrong brain...at a minimum....it stops the crime for the person carrying the gun on their person..........and that happens every day...

Guns Don t Deter Crime Study Finds

18 other studies says they do......

18 studies by Lott who is a pro gun nut.