Reconstructing Q: Some Research Done

[Meriweather]

I have morals and values. I understand right from wrong, and that is based on my basic human instincts. It is not pleasurable to see someone in pain and agony, especially if I am the cause of that. IT is pleasurable to make people laugh and to make them happy and smile. It is a simple concept that I don't need a religious belief to understand or adhere to.

Yes. Call it instinct or, as scripture has it, that the laws of God are written on every human heart, believer or non-believer.

 

[ChrisL]

I hear "nonbelievers are immoral." They would just kill people because they have nobody to worship, I suppose. *shrugs*

Yeah, and I hear we believers are responsible for all the bad things that happen (or have happened) in the world--including mass killings.

Both serve only as not very good distractions to an ongoing discussion.

That is a "liberal" thing. While I might not have any particular beliefs in gods, I am definitely NOT a liberal, though you can see where "religious disagreements" among the ignorant (which like it or not, are a HUGE part of the population still) could lead to serious conflicts. There are different religions that are all competing with one another for followers or "sheep" as they call them. That is another thing that is rather insulting about the man made religious books, when the refer to us as their "sheep" or their "flock." Well, they can call me the FOX amongst the sheep!

 

[Meriweather]

Well then why would you treat me as if my life "could be better" if I had a belief in a god?

Where did I say that? Doesn't sound like anything I espouse. I tend to agree with St. Theresa of Avila. She had an experience once where she was complaining about something to God. She said God responded, "Ah, Theresa, I treat all my friends this way."

Before she could help herself, Theresa retorted, "No wonder you have so few."

 

[Meriweather]

True happiness comes from within but that doesn't mean you need to believe in a supernatural entity to grant you that happiness.

Yeah, I'm not sure who said we do. Are you arguing with someone?

 

[ChrisL]

True happiness comes from within but that doesn't mean you need to believe in a supernatural entity to grant you that happiness.

Yeah, I'm not sure who said we do. Are you arguing with someone?

No, I'm just saying.

 

[ChrisL]

I have morals and values. I understand right from wrong, and that is based on my basic human instincts. It is not pleasurable to see someone in pain and agony, especially if I am the cause of that. IT is pleasurable to make people laugh and to make them happy and smile. It is a simple concept that I don't need a religious belief to understand or adhere to.

Yes. Call it instinct or, as scripture has it, that the laws of God are written on every human heart, believer or non-believer.

So which religion is it that you follow? Because I know quite a bit about the Catholic religion. My mother was brought up as a Catholic. She went to St. Mary's Catholic schools and was educated as a Catholic. Communions, the whole dealio. I am very familiar with the Catholic belief system and it is not as you say it is.

 

[Meriweather]

There are plenty of other religious people who do. Like I said earlier, a lot of times a religious person will think he or she is a better person or better off in some way than a nonbeliever because of their belief. They seem to believe that their god helps them accomplish goals in their lives or something like that. I believe that if there was a supernatural entity, it probably wouldn't be helping specific individuals while ignoring others.

Grin. And since I'm around a lot of atheists I sometimes hear that I could be even stronger if I gave up my belief in God.

One thing about God, He is an expert at not letting His left hand know what His right hand is doing. So, He probably has a field day with atheists.

 

[ChrisL]

There are plenty of other religious people who do. Like I said earlier, a lot of times a religious person will think he or she is a better person or better off in some way than a nonbeliever because of their belief. They seem to believe that their god helps them accomplish goals in their lives or something like that. I believe that if there was a supernatural entity, it probably wouldn't be helping specific individuals while ignoring others.

Grin. And since I'm around a lot of atheists I sometimes hear that I could be even stronger if I gave up my belief in God.

One thing about God, He is an expert at not letting His left hand know what His right hand is doing. So, He probably has a field day with atheists.

That is not funny. If there was actually a God, playing games with us like that is nothing but cruelty. I have some questions for him, such as where is my son. Is my son okay? Is he taking good care of my son? Why would he give me a son and take him away from me in such a cruel manner?

 

[Meriweather]

So which religion is it that you follow? Because I know quite a bit about the Catholic religion. My mother was brought up as a Catholic. She went to St. Mary's Catholic schools and was educated as a Catholic. Communions, the whole dealio. I am very familiar with the Catholic belief system and it is not as you say it is.

You may know a lot about the Catholic religion, but I doubt it comes close to what I know. I too was born into a Catholic family, went to Catholic school, married in the Catholic Church, children baptized/raised Catholic, taught Catholicism to teenagers, made it a life long study. It is exactly as I say it is. On its best day. Doesn't mean it lacks its bad days or bad people or people having bad days.

 

[ChrisL]

So which religion is it that you follow? Because I know quite a bit about the Catholic religion. My mother was brought up as a Catholic. She went to St. Mary's Catholic schools and was educated as a Catholic. Communions, the whole dealio. I am very familiar with the Catholic belief system and it is not as you say it is.

You may know a lot about the Catholic religion, but I doubt it comes close to what I know. I too was born into a Catholic family, went to Catholic school, married in the Catholic Church, children baptized/raised Catholic, taught Catholicism to teenagers, made it a life long study. It is exactly as I say it is. On its best day. Doesn't mean it lacks its bad days or bad people or people having bad days.

Well your teachings are not mainstream Catholic beliefs. They believe in a hell. They believe that nonbelievers go to hell. They believe all kinds of things that don't seem to go along with the things you are saying, and this is a mainstream Catholic church, a very WEALTHY one at that.

 

[ChrisL]

It's an absolutely gorgeous piece of architecture, I must say. Stained glass windows, an impressive altar. It's just beautiful to look at. One of the most beautiful churches I've ever seen.

 

[Meriweather]

That is not funny. If there was actually a God, playing games with us like that is nothing but cruelty. I have some questions for him, such as where is my son. Is my son okay? Is he taking good care of my son? Why would he give me a son and take him away from me in such a cruel manner?

God isn't playing games. He just has this thing about blowing one's own horn. If one does something good for another, God advises keep it quiet. He certainly does.

I've always a great deal of respect for the Psalm that flat out state that we will go through dark times. The Psalm doesn't promise that the dark times will go away, only that God will be with us as we go through them. Sometimes it is so dark and painful, I don't want anyone near, and that includes God. I just hurt too badly and need left alone.

When each person enters this life, the question is not, "Will we suffer?" The question is, "How will we suffer?" Suffering is reality for all.

Thinking of your son in good hands would still be of small comfort, not when his place is in your hands.

 

[ChrisL]

 

[ChrisL]

That is not funny. If there was actually a God, playing games with us like that is nothing but cruelty. I have some questions for him, such as where is my son. Is my son okay? Is he taking good care of my son? Why would he give me a son and take him away from me in such a cruel manner?

God isn't playing games. He just has this thing about blowing one's own horn. If one does something good for another, God advises keep it quiet. He certainly does.

I've always a great deal of respect for the Psalm that flat out state that we will go through dark times. The Psalm doesn't promise that the dark times will go away, only that God will be with us as we go through them. Sometimes it is so dark and painful, I don't want anyone near, and that includes God. I just hurt too badly and need left alone.

When each person enters this life, the question is not, "Will we suffer?" The question is, "How will we suffer?" Suffering is reality for all.

Thinking of your son in good hands would still be of small comfort, not when his place is in your hands.

Well, like I said, I don't really believe in a god.

 

[ChrisL]

Yeah, I've heard all the "god has a bigger plan for us" talk more than I can bear.

 

[Meriweather]

Well your teachings are not mainstream Catholic beliefs. They believe in a hell. They believe that nonbelievers go to hell. They believe all kinds of things that don't seem to go along with the things you are saying, and this is a mainstream Catholic church, a very WEALTHY one at that.

Yes, we Catholics believe there is a hell. We also teach that we don't know who, if anyone, is in hell. (This is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church). This same catechism teaches that non-believers are entrusted to the mercy and love of God. There are warnings of what places people in danger of hell. One is (not non-belief) but believing there is a God and rejecting Him and His love. Even then, the final judgement is in God's hands, who can judge whether the rejection is rooted in a strong emotion, such as grief, etc.

I don't know who has been telling you what, but what I present is what the Catholic Church actually teaches--not what some say some Catholics "really" believe.

 

[Meriweather]

Yeah, I've heard all the "god has a bigger plan for us" talk more than I can bear.

Bigger plan? Hmm, I suppose, I guess. I'm more of the mind that often God's plans are very small, one small step at a time type of plans.