Repealing the ACA would increase federal budget deficits by $137 billion over the 2016–2025 period

[imawhosure]

I had to change to a high deductible plan, and I didn't want to. What happened to if I liked my insurance, I could keep it, period.

Who held the gun to your head when you chose your plan? There are high deductible plans, but there are also plans that have no deductible. You should have chosen something other than a high deductible plan.

the numbers I quoted show the falsehood of the OP. The amount he is bitching about is less than a day and a half of federal spending per year. Our federal budget has gotten that bloated, and people like you want to bloat it even more.[/QUOTE]

Since when does $13.7 billion dollars added to the deficit not constitute "bloating it even more?"

What can $13.7B buy?

• Provide $90K in gross wages to 152,222 people
• Buy 44,771 $306K homes
• Feed 1.463M+ people for a year. ($180/week spent on food)

And as I said, the $137B figure is the most liberal projection. Read the report to see what is the more conservative one.

30 million people are not on ObamaCare

Can you clarify what meant by that? There are some 320+ million citizens/people in the U.S. and something like 20 million of them use Obamacare. The rest get their insurance elsewhere or they don't have insurance.

The cost for the PPO premium went up dramatically, and the high deductible made more sense economically. Again, I could not keep the plan I liked.

You could. You chose not to.

That wasn't part of the deal. Costs were supposed to go down, not up. I was supposed to be able to keep the plan I liked. He didn't say I would have to pay more for it.

he lied, and you continue that lie because it suits you, you cheap, dime store hack.

Marty, these people need government intrusion into everyone's life or they are not happy. Government knows best for everyone, one size fits all. The government has screwed up every entitlement it has ever created, but these people want to try again. They can't name one, not 2, but O-N-E entitlement program that has worked as advertised, not losing massive amounts of money, and yet, these BRILLIANT leftists want to try again, and again, and again!

Who in the heck do they think they are kidding?!?!?! How about YOU brilliant leftists fix one or two of the other entitlement programs your lefty predecessors created, before you saddle America with another bunch of phony promises that do not work, and cost a damn fortune!

 

[Rambunctious]

I have read up on them - it's red meat puffery and it takes magical thinking to imagine that it is a realistic solution to the void repealing Obamacare would create.

Obamacare is over and done with, it did not work for all of the people so it does not work for America. It's toast and so is Obama's legacy.

 

[12icer]

You scared him off Tom, he knew his lies didn't stick again. gone to start another try to stick lie. Same old lies told a hundred different ways to try to stick them to anything. Same old stretch it so thin it is invisible to try to make any connection. Never works because their BS is so visible, and predictable like all want to be ruling class dictators and their brownshirts.

 

[Rambunctious]

No, there are objectives documents, but there is nothing that could be considered a plan.

If you think there is, please cite

They are not even in office yet but since you obviously only watch and listen to left wing rat trap news and did not hear the plans I will enlighten you. It's called government out private sector in and most important competition for your dollar.

 

[Tom Horn]

I don't see anything funny in it, but I do think it's sad and embarrassing that you actually wrote what you did in post #102. Do you really not have enough self respect to double check your information/beliefs before making comments that are very clearly wrong?

Here ya go...oh, and I said $500M....it's actually much worse:

Guy Benson - Smoking Gun: Obama Admits He Cut Billions from Medicare to Fund Obamacare

 

[AntonToo]

I have read up on them - it's red meat puffery and it takes magical thinking to imagine that it is a realistic solution to the void repealing Obamacare would create.

Obamacare is over and done with, it did not work for all of the people so it does not work for America. It's toast and so is Obama's legacy.

Yea are delusional if you think it is that simple.

 

[usmbguest5318]

Because of the cuts in Medicare payments to doctors, Obamacare actually reduced budget deficits. You can be sure that part of O-care will stay in place.

No, he stole $500M from Medicare to fund the first few years of Barry-Care. No program's funds are safe from these thieves.

Because of the cuts in Medicare payments to doctors, Obamacare actually reduced budget deficits. You can be sure that part of O-care will stay in place.

No, he stole $500M from Medicare to fund the first few years of Barry-Care. No program's funds are safe from these thieves.

The ACA and other legislation have played an important role in slowing Medicare payment growth. (Click the fucking link to get more detail on that statement.)

The reconciliation process normally can’t be used to pass legislation that increases the deficit 10 or more years into the future; that’s why the Bush tax cuts in 2001 expired after 10 years. Since Obamacare reduced the deficit, it would stand to reason that repealing it increases the deficit in the long run, and runs afoul of this rule. To get around this, the reconciliation bill preserves Obamacare’s cuts to Medicare doctor payments, and so is scored as reducing the deficit, because those cuts plus the cost of the insurance subsidies and Medicaid expansion swamp the revenue loss from repealing all of Obamacare’s taxes. (Click the fucking links for the details. You need to understand them.)

Dude. Whether Obamacare resulted in lower deficits than would have resulted were it not enacted is not a matter of whether one thinks it did/did not or whether one wants to believe it did/did not. It did. Every U.S. Senator, and especially the Republican ones, know it did. They knew it would do so when it was enacted. The CBO has made available to every member of Congress the details that show the ACA resulted in lower deficits and that repealing it will increase the growth of federal budget deficits. That is why the Senate effort to trash the ACA and Sen. Enzi's bill will have to be processed as reconciliation bill.


I recently joined this site, but I'm astounded by how often people will, and how many people, will say things that they seem to believe quite confidently and yet to people who do know the topic, it is patently clear those "true believers" don't know what they are talking about. And then, when someone shows them they are mistaken, instead of simply saying, "Oh, I didn't know that. I had it wrong," so the conversation can move forward in a mature way, they take to attacking the source.

What kind of mature, thinking adults who actually give a damn about a given topic will actually do that? WTF? Is there some unwritten Internet forum rule that says forum members must belong to the "cult of Intransigent Ignorance" and ascribe to the motto "My Ignorance is Just as Good as Your Knowledge?" I mean really. WTF? Who does that?

Want more?

"The Affordable Care Act of 2010 (ACA) permanently slowed the default growth in Medicare prices for nearly all providers (except physicians) by about 1 percentage point a year. These “cuts” do not actually reduce prices in nominal terms, but prices will be lower under the ACA than they would have been otherwise, and prices will grow more slowly than input prices."

 

[AntonToo]

I have been with the same company for 20 years. until Obamacare my premiums went up in a nice slow manner, and my coverage remained the same.

Then Obamacare came along. I got forced into a wellness plan, the PPO option became so expensive the high deductible plan was the only one that made sense, AND my premiums have gone up much quicker, even under the high deductible plan.

AND, the "Cadillac Tax" has not even come into play yet. You can take your graphs, and cram them up your who-hole. I know what has happened to my insurance, and I don't like it.

Where are the savings I was supposed to see?

You can take your personal experience and shove them up your ass much further than you instruct me to shove my national statistics.

You are one guy who already had insurance, you did not have to deal with trying to get a policy in individual market, in one locale, imagining yourself to represent all of America. You do not.

I have personal experience too - my insurance costs didn't increase. So what? Should I imagine that's a rule make too?

Obama said I could keep my plan If I liked it. I didn't get to keep the plan I liked. It doesn't matter the reason, he sold me a load of bullshit.

So basically it's OK i got screwed over because you did not?

Well fuck you, you twat-waddle. Fuck yourself with an aids infested tire iron.

Or at least suck up to me and thank me for subsidizing your heath insurance, you lazy little leech.

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

 

[martybegan]

I have been with the same company for 20 years. until Obamacare my premiums went up in a nice slow manner, and my coverage remained the same.

Then Obamacare came along. I got forced into a wellness plan, the PPO option became so expensive the high deductible plan was the only one that made sense, AND my premiums have gone up much quicker, even under the high deductible plan.

AND, the "Cadillac Tax" has not even come into play yet. You can take your graphs, and cram them up your who-hole. I know what has happened to my insurance, and I don't like it.

Where are the savings I was supposed to see?

You can take your personal experience and shove them up your ass much further than you instruct me to shove my national statistics.

You are one guy who already had insurance, you did not have to deal with trying to get a policy in individual market, in one locale, imagining yourself to represent all of America. You do not.

I have personal experience too - my insurance costs didn't increase. So what? Should I imagine that's a rule make too?

Obama said I could keep my plan If I liked it. I didn't get to keep the plan I liked. It doesn't matter the reason, he sold me a load of bullshit.

So basically it's OK i got screwed over because you did not?

Well fuck you, you twat-waddle. Fuck yourself with an aids infested tire iron.

Or at least suck up to me and thank me for subsidizing your heath insurance, you lazy little leech.

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

 

[AntonToo]

You can take your personal experience and shove them up your ass much further than you instruct me to shove my national statistics.

You are one guy who already had insurance, you did not have to deal with trying to get a policy in individual market, in one locale, imagining yourself to represent all of America. You do not.

I have personal experience too - my insurance costs didn't increase. So what? Should I imagine that's a rule make too?

Obama said I could keep my plan If I liked it. I didn't get to keep the plan I liked. It doesn't matter the reason, he sold me a load of bullshit.

So basically it's OK i got screwed over because you did not?

Well fuck you, you twat-waddle. Fuck yourself with an aids infested tire iron.

Or at least suck up to me and thank me for subsidizing your heath insurance, you lazy little leech.

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

 

[usmbguest5318]

I don't see anything funny in it, but I do think it's sad and embarrassing that you actually wrote what you did in post #102. Do you really not have enough self respect to double check your information/beliefs before making comments that are very clearly wrong?

Here ya go...oh, and I said $500M....it's actually much worse:

Guy Benson - Smoking Gun: Obama Admits He Cut Billions from Medicare to Fund Obamacare

Goddamit! Just how darned "ignernt" are you? You truly don't realize that what you have just shared is information that here in 2017 is both irrelevant and obsolete??

• What the fuck does it take for you to understand that where money comes from and that spending less money overall are two different things?
• Would you bother so much as to look at the dates of the CBO report I provided and the date of the study that underpins the article you provided? Or even just the date of the article you provided? Do you honestly think that come June 2015 the CBO did not have better data about the ACA's budget impact than did the CBO itself or the Mercatus Institute's Charles Blahous in 2012?

Dude! Really? You didn't even pay attention to the dates of the content being discussed in this thread? Come the fuck on! A fourth grader can comprehend the temporal relevance of a goddamned date!

Not only do you not know what you are talking about, you don't actually pay attention to shit that presumably you read. Yet you tossed it into your post above as though it somehow vindicated the ignorant claim you made.

 

[imawhosure]

Obama said I could keep my plan If I liked it. I didn't get to keep the plan I liked. It doesn't matter the reason, he sold me a load of bullshit.

So basically it's OK i got screwed over because you did not?

Well fuck you, you twat-waddle. Fuck yourself with an aids infested tire iron.

Or at least suck up to me and thank me for subsidizing your heath insurance, you lazy little leech.

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

Look Antontoo------> If you people want Ocare, then you can keep your plan! I don't care if you keep Ocare, as long as there is an option NOT to!

Understand the basic reality of the debate--------> We are NOT demanding you do what we say, but YOU are demanding we do what YOU say! Keep Ocare if you like, whatever you want to do is fine, as long as WE have a choice.

Now, even a leftist can understand that what I have stated is FAIR; and what is wrong with being FAIR? Freedom is about choices. The more choices you have, the more free you are! So there you have it!

CONSERVATIVES ON THIS BOARD-----------> Are any of you demanding that any leftist on this board can NOT keep their high deductibles, or help others buy health insurance if they so choose to?

See Antontoo, all of us agree YOU can help others all you want, and KEEP your high deductibles to boot if makes YOU personally happy

 

[martybegan]

Obama said I could keep my plan If I liked it. I didn't get to keep the plan I liked. It doesn't matter the reason, he sold me a load of bullshit.

So basically it's OK i got screwed over because you did not?

Well fuck you, you twat-waddle. Fuck yourself with an aids infested tire iron.

Or at least suck up to me and thank me for subsidizing your heath insurance, you lazy little leech.

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

I pay extra on my healthcare so you can pay less. Thank me, you ungrateful little twat.

 

[AntonToo]

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

I pay extra on my healthcare so you can pay less. Thank me, you ungrateful little twat.

Prove it.

 

[martybegan]

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

I pay extra on my healthcare so you can pay less. Thank me, you ungrateful little twat.

Prove it.

Where do you get your healthcare from?

 

[AntonToo]

Obama lied or just brain farted or was speaking in overly broad terms - Either way no one can guarantee that your employer or private insurance companies will not change their plans. As I already explained plan turn over was high well before Obamacare, to expect that to not happen as entire healthcare market is getting reworked is no realistic.

Obamacare does have Grandfather clause which does force insurance companies (no your employer) to keep your plan if you had it for 4 years or longer. Maybe that's what Obama had in mind when he was saying this.

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

Look Antontoo------> If you people want Ocare, then you can keep your plan! I don't care if you keep Ocare, as long as there is an option NOT to!

Understand the basic reality of the debate--------> We are NOT demanding you do what we say, but YOU are demanding we do what YOU say! Keep Ocare if you like, whatever you want to do is fine, as long as WE have a choice.

Now, even a leftist can understand that what I have stated is FAIR; and what is wrong with being FAIR? Freedom is about choices. The more choices you have, the more free you are! So there you have it!

CONSERVATIVES ON THIS BOARD-----------> Are any of you demanding that any leftist on this board can NOT keep their high deductibles, or help others buy health insurance if they so choose to?

See Antontoo, all of us agree YOU can help others all you want, and KEEP your high deductibles to boot if makes YOU personally happy

There is nothing in Obamcare for me other than general well being of this country.

I am well insured, well employed, healthy and otherwise blessed in this world and it is exactly because my concern does not end at my picket fence that I support Obamacare and further reforms it lays foundation for.

America is a great country of the willing and able - there is no reason why we can't have world's best healthcare, not the over-priced, under-delivering, people-screwing mess we have had going on for the last 3 decades.

 

[martybegan]

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

Look Antontoo------> If you people want Ocare, then you can keep your plan! I don't care if you keep Ocare, as long as there is an option NOT to!

Understand the basic reality of the debate--------> We are NOT demanding you do what we say, but YOU are demanding we do what YOU say! Keep Ocare if you like, whatever you want to do is fine, as long as WE have a choice.

Now, even a leftist can understand that what I have stated is FAIR; and what is wrong with being FAIR? Freedom is about choices. The more choices you have, the more free you are! So there you have it!

CONSERVATIVES ON THIS BOARD-----------> Are any of you demanding that any leftist on this board can NOT keep their high deductibles, or help others buy health insurance if they so choose to?

See Antontoo, all of us agree YOU can help others all you want, and KEEP your high deductibles to boot if makes YOU personally happy

There is nothing in Obamcare for me than general well being of this country.

I am well insured, well employed, healthy and otherwise blessed in this world and it is exactly because my concern does not end at my picket fence that I support Obamacare and further reforms it lays foundation for. America is a great country and deserves world's best healthcare, not the over-priced, under-delivering mess we have had.

And fucking me over, you forget that part.

Why should I pay full price when others get government assistance? Plus why should I pay full price for something less than what I got before?

 

[AntonToo]

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

I pay extra on my healthcare so you can pay less. Thank me, you ungrateful little twat.

Prove it.

Where do you get your healthcare from?

My employer.

 

[AntonToo]

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

Look Antontoo------> If you people want Ocare, then you can keep your plan! I don't care if you keep Ocare, as long as there is an option NOT to!

Understand the basic reality of the debate--------> We are NOT demanding you do what we say, but YOU are demanding we do what YOU say! Keep Ocare if you like, whatever you want to do is fine, as long as WE have a choice.

Now, even a leftist can understand that what I have stated is FAIR; and what is wrong with being FAIR? Freedom is about choices. The more choices you have, the more free you are! So there you have it!

CONSERVATIVES ON THIS BOARD-----------> Are any of you demanding that any leftist on this board can NOT keep their high deductibles, or help others buy health insurance if they so choose to?

See Antontoo, all of us agree YOU can help others all you want, and KEEP your high deductibles to boot if makes YOU personally happy

There is nothing in Obamcare for me than general well being of this country.

I am well insured, well employed, healthy and otherwise blessed in this world and it is exactly because my concern does not end at my picket fence that I support Obamacare and further reforms it lays foundation for. America is a great country and deserves world's best healthcare, not the over-priced, under-delivering mess we have had.

And fucking me over, you forget that part.

Why should I pay full price when others get government assistance? Plus why should I pay full price for something less than what I got before?

NOBODY is charging you ANYTHING for Obamacare subsidies.

You ramblings about ME somehow fucking YOU over is your psychosis kicking into overdrive.

 

[imawhosure]

My plan was constant for over a decade, then all of sudden Obamacare came into effect and I had to change things, all at a higher cost to me than previously, for less benefits.

And keep sucking Obama's dick, but remember to clean your mouth off afterwards, asshole.

Fuck you and your little mememememe world.

Grandfathered Plans

You are the greedy one here, wanting me to subsidize your crap so you can continue your lazy lifestyle.

Get a fucking job, or a better one and take care of your own shit.

WTF? What of my crap do you subsidize? Fuck off, I pay for everything and then some.

You are a pathetic little man to even go there.

Look Antontoo------> If you people want Ocare, then you can keep your plan! I don't care if you keep Ocare, as long as there is an option NOT to!

Understand the basic reality of the debate--------> We are NOT demanding you do what we say, but YOU are demanding we do what YOU say! Keep Ocare if you like, whatever you want to do is fine, as long as WE have a choice.

Now, even a leftist can understand that what I have stated is FAIR; and what is wrong with being FAIR? Freedom is about choices. The more choices you have, the more free you are! So there you have it!

CONSERVATIVES ON THIS BOARD-----------> Are any of you demanding that any leftist on this board can NOT keep their high deductibles, or help others buy health insurance if they so choose to?

See Antontoo, all of us agree YOU can help others all you want, and KEEP your high deductibles to boot if makes YOU personally happy

There is nothing in Obamcare for me other than general well being of this country.

I am well insured, well employed, healthy and otherwise blessed in this world and it is exactly because my concern does not end at my picket fence that I support Obamacare and further reforms it lays foundation for.

America is a great country of the willing and able - there is no reason why we can't have world's best healthcare, not the over-priced, under-delivering, people-screwing mess we have had going on for the last 3 decades.

I agree with you, as long as your side does NOT insist we subsidize others that we can't claim on our taxes; especially illegal aliens.

Again, I am being fair-------->we will NOT force you to do anything and punish you monetarily if you do not do as we say, and we expect the same out of your side. If you feel charitable, then by all means.....give to whatever cause you like, just do not mandate that WE have to!