Republican bill stops funding to states issuing DL's to illegals

[Ray From Cleveland]

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

Yep, illegals are all about following the rules...good one.

This is where common sense departs from the conservative brain. Just because someone doesn't follow rules in one context doesn't mean they don't in other contexts. A driver's license is not a "reward" for anything - it's simply a legal document saying you have passed the tests and requirements to drive in this country. Period.

You have two choices - don't issue it, and hope they don't drive (not going to happen) or issue it and improve the odds that they will be safer drivers. That is all this is about. Common sense.

Yeah, common sense. We need more American mothers like this one.

 

[Flopper]

No. It doesn't GUARANTEE you will drive safe. NOTHING does. But adds to the odds that you will be a safer driver.

I wish you on the right would be honest about the arguments....but you are not.

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

You don't need a drivers license to know the basic rules. You can look that up on the internet or get a drivers manual from your local DMV. They all have them.

No, but you need to know the rules of road and be able to pass a driving test and eye test which are not near as easy as they once were to pass.

 

[Coyote]

No. It doesn't GUARANTEE you will drive safe. NOTHING does. But adds to the odds that you will be a safer driver.

I wish you on the right would be honest about the arguments....but you are not.

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

You don't need a drivers license to know the basic rules. You can look that up on the internet or get a drivers manual from your local DMV. They all have them.

A license requires you pass a test of both driving skills and knowledge. If you don't need one because anyone can look it up - why do we require them?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

What does legal status have to do with driver's licenses that are supposed to be about safety?
What about a tourist who does not want citizenship, but just wants to be able to rent a car here and drive, for the years they are visiting?
Are you going to deny them a US driver's license while a legal resident because they are undocumented as far as citizenship?

Unless you’re here legally such as a travel visa, work visa, green card, etc. you do not have the right to get a drivers license. Period. End of story.

I am not sure I see how rights have anything to do with it, because the POINT is the can and will drive anyway, so issuing them a driver's license just allows us to ensure they are better and safer drivers.

If they have a driver's license, they have had some drivers education and they can buy auto insurance which benefits everyone. The GOP's attempt to keep driver's licenses out of the hands of illegal immigrants is just plain stupid.

No, stupid is rewarding people for coming here and breaking our laws. Complain about American businesses hiring them, and then do what you can to make it easier to get to these jobs they're not supposed to have.

Issuing a driver's license is not a reward. They don't care. Only we care, because they it makes them safer.

I care. It gives them a legal US ID. They do not deserve one as they are illegal.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Bullshit. My 14 year old cannot wait until she can drive and get one. It is a privilege not a right.

No one is saying they are a right.

You are. It is a privilege for those who are in this country legally. Period. End of Story. If you're here illegally, either find a path to remain here legally or GTFO. There are no in-betweens.

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

 

[Rigby5]

Drivers licenses aren't a reward. There is nothing rewarding about them.

Bullshit. My 14 year old cannot wait until she can drive and get one. It is a privilege not a right.

No one is saying they are a right.

You are. It is a privilege for those who are in this country legally. Period. End of Story. If you're here illegally, either find a path to remain here legally or GTFO. There are no in-betweens.

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Because a driver's license has nothing to do with citizenship.
It is just about safety.

 

[Coyote]

No one is saying they are a right.

You are. It is a privilege for those who are in this country legally. Period. End of Story. If you're here illegally, either find a path to remain here legally or GTFO. There are no in-betweens.

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

Then you clearly have some serious reading comprehension issues. Public safety is not about "rights".

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What does legal status have to do with driver's licenses that are supposed to be about safety?
What about a tourist who does not want citizenship, but just wants to be able to rent a car here and drive, for the years they are visiting?
Are you going to deny them a US driver's license while a legal resident because they are undocumented as far as citizenship?

Unless you’re here legally such as a travel visa, work visa, green card, etc. you do not have the right to get a drivers license. Period. End of story.

I am not sure I see how rights have anything to do with it, because the POINT is the can and will drive anyway, so issuing them a driver's license just allows us to ensure they are better and safer drivers.

If they have a driver's license, they have had some drivers education and they can buy auto insurance which benefits everyone. The GOP's attempt to keep driver's licenses out of the hands of illegal immigrants is just plain stupid.

No, stupid is rewarding people for coming here and breaking our laws. Complain about American businesses hiring them, and then do what you can to make it easier to get to these jobs they're not supposed to have.

Issuing a driver's license is not a reward. They don't care. Only we care, because they it makes them safer.

Sure it's a reward. If they get pulled over, they won't get arrested and possibly deported. I call that a reward.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Bullshit. My 14 year old cannot wait until she can drive and get one. It is a privilege not a right.

No one is saying they are a right.

You are. It is a privilege for those who are in this country legally. Period. End of Story. If you're here illegally, either find a path to remain here legally or GTFO. There are no in-betweens.

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Because a driver's license has nothing to do with citizenship.
It is just about safety.

Fine. May we compromise. Give them a license and write "ILLEGAL" in big red letters on it. Deal?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

You are. It is a privilege for those who are in this country legally. Period. End of Story. If you're here illegally, either find a path to remain here legally or GTFO. There are no in-betweens.

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

Then you clearly have some serious reading comprehension issues. Public safety is not about "rights".

Getting a license won't make them safer drivers. 16-year olds get licenses and most are terrible, inexperienced drivers.

 

[Kondor3]

Unless you’re here legally such as a travel visa, work visa, green card, etc. you do not have the right to get a drivers license. Period. End of story.

I am not sure I see how rights have anything to do with it, because the POINT is the can and will drive anyway, so issuing them a driver's license just allows us to ensure they are better and safer drivers.

We can say that about our law breakers as well. Why should a judge suspend somebody's license if they are going to drive anyway? Maybe when they get out of jail is six or seven years for killing somebody driving drunk, just give them their licenses back. They're going to drive anyway, right???

If someone gets a license, they have to show they know how to drive safely and what the rules are. It's a beginning and at least adds a little bit to public safety. If people lose their licenses and drive anyway - that's another issue. If people are going to drive anyway without ever having gotten a license - they are more likely to be unsafe.

Safety is the most bogus argument to make in this case. Just because you have a drivers license doesn't mean you are going to drive safe. Do you suppose it's easier or harder for law enforcement to locate a driver that hit a pedestrian and took off if they are illegal? Of course not. They just pack their bags and get back to El Salvador and not worry about it.

I wish you people on the left were more honest. Just admit you want these illegals here and aim to make them being here illegally as comfortable as possible.

People who come here, legally or illegally, spend thousands, so are not just going to take off.
And the facts are they drive better and commit fewer crimes, because they know they have to be on their best behavior if they want to stay.
Issuing driver's licenses does not ensure safety, but it makes them safer than if you do not issue licenses.

If an Illegal Alien is caught driving without a license they should be deported immediately.

No State or other jurisdiction should be allowed to issue a driver's license to an Illegal Alien.

Do so, and lose your DOT and infrastructure funding.

It's been tested in the courts before.

Time to test it again, with an express track to a 5-4 SCOTUS.

 

[Coyote]

I really wish you would stop lying about what I say.

It's not a "right". I never said it was.

End of story.

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

Then you clearly have some serious reading comprehension issues. Public safety is not about "rights".

Getting a license won't make them safer drivers. 16-year olds get licenses and most are terrible, inexperienced drivers.

That argument has already been made here.

It won't make them safe drivers, but they will probably be safer then if they hadn't had to meet the requirements of getting a license.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

You don't need a drivers license to know the basic rules. You can look that up on the internet or get a drivers manual from your local DMV. They all have them.

A license requires you pass a test of both driving skills and knowledge. If you don't need one because anyone can look it up - why do we require them?

You stated it was so they knew the basic rules. You don't have to be licensed for that. If you are an illegal, and are going to break our laws once again by driving illegally, you can still know our rules even without a license.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Then why do you support them having a license when they are illegals?

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

Then you clearly have some serious reading comprehension issues. Public safety is not about "rights".

Getting a license won't make them safer drivers. 16-year olds get licenses and most are terrible, inexperienced drivers.

That argument has already been made here.

It won't make them safe drivers, but they will probably be safer then if they hadn't had to meet the requirements of getting a license.

I disagree. Would you be cool if their license said "ILLEGAL" on it in huge red letters?

 

[Thinker101]

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

Yep, illegals are all about following the rules...good one.

This is where common sense departs from the conservative brain. Just because someone doesn't follow rules in one context doesn't mean they don't in other contexts. A driver's license is not a "reward" for anything - it's simply a legal document saying you have passed the tests and requirements to drive in this country. Period.

You have two choices - don't issue it, and hope they don't drive (not going to happen) or issue it and improve the odds that they will be safer drivers. That is all this is about. Common sense.

I see, so if you rob a liquor store, chances are pretty slim that you'll rob a bank....certainly not the stupidest thing you've said but pretty damn close.

 

[Coyote]

Already explained that several times in this thread.

Yes and those explanations scream "right".

Then you clearly have some serious reading comprehension issues. Public safety is not about "rights".

Getting a license won't make them safer drivers. 16-year olds get licenses and most are terrible, inexperienced drivers.

That argument has already been made here.

It won't make them safe drivers, but they will probably be safer then if they hadn't had to meet the requirements of getting a license.

I disagree. Would you be cool if their license said "ILLEGAL" on it in huge red letters?

Sure. But then I suspect that would deter them from getting a license.

 

[Rigby5]

The problem was, even though the ACA was THEIR idea, they were the ones who threatened to filibuster it if it included a public option or a Medicare Buy in, either of which would have fixed most of the problems. The fact the Democrats were burdened with guys like Jim Webb and Joe Lieberjew (who only thinks the Zionist Entity should have health care paid for by Americans,not actual Americans), who kept these options off the table in the Senate version.

But this STILL could have been fixed in the conference, had not Ted Kennedy passed away.

Utter bull. It was never "our" idea. Just because some organization wrote about it, and some loser RINO governor instituted it in his state doesn't make it OUR idea. The Republicans knew they were going to lose on the Commie Care vote, so they tried to dilute it as much as possible. Had they not, it would have been even more destructive than it already is today.

No, ACA is mandated private health insurance, almost exactly the same as states mandating auto insurance.
It is an extremely conservative and right wing position.
And in fact it came from right wing sources.

ACA was put in place to force healthy people to pay for the sick. If you don’t want to drive and want to Uber everywhere you don’t have to have auto insurance. Your conflation is false.

All of society is about pooling risk.
Defense, fire fighting, crime prevention, etc.
All private insurance is risk pooling.
The problem with ACA is not risk pooling, but unregulated profiteering by the insurance company, that deliberately encourages high prices and low quality.

And madatory car insurance is wrong for the exact same reason,
Mahdatory profiteering that is unregulated, so unfair, over priced, and with poor quality.

If you are going to mandate something, then you are obligated to ensure it is done fairly.

If you can post a bond with the state that meets liability requirements, then liability insurance should be optional. However, even if that were possible, insurance companies would not have much to worry about. Loan companies will still require insurance on the vehicle and many people will want the protection liability insurance offers and protection of their vehicle.

If you are wealthy enough, then you are exempt from the insurance mandate law.
Almost all companies self insure, but you have to have millions in assets.
If you do not finance based on the car as collatoral, then no loan company has any say either.

It is not that I mind the concept of insurance, but that I believe all insurance companies are essentially frauds.
They always try to get out of paying, and they often do.
Highly unethical and over charging.

 

[Coyote]

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

Yep, illegals are all about following the rules...good one.

This is where common sense departs from the conservative brain. Just because someone doesn't follow rules in one context doesn't mean they don't in other contexts. A driver's license is not a "reward" for anything - it's simply a legal document saying you have passed the tests and requirements to drive in this country. Period.

You have two choices - don't issue it, and hope they don't drive (not going to happen) or issue it and improve the odds that they will be safer drivers. That is all this is about. Common sense.

I see, so if you rob a liquor store, chances are pretty slim that you'll rob a bank....certainly not the stupidest thing you've said but pretty damn close.

Common sense is now spiraling down into actual retardation.

According to your logic - if you jaywalk, the chances that you'll rob a bank are higher.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Was that English? Again, a license is a privilege not a right. A privilege for US citizens and those with green cards not for illegals.

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

You don't need a drivers license to know the basic rules. You can look that up on the internet or get a drivers manual from your local DMV. They all have them.

No, but you need to know the rules of road and be able to pass a driving test and eye test which are not near as easy as they once were to pass.

You're talking to a person that spent his life on the road. Don't tell me that drivers licenses make anybody a better driver. I see licensed drivers all day long. Again, these are cheap excuses for what you on the left really want, and that is these illegals in this country and comfortable as you can make them.

 

[Coyote]

Sure you can argue that, but you completely overlook the issue of public safety. As a driver - I would rather people be licensed to drive regardless of their citizenship status.

I would rather them not be in this country. If they cannot get a license they may not drive for fear of being pulled over and deported. Illegals should not be in our country period! End of story.

Yet, here they are. Here they have always been in greater or lesser numbers. And here, they drive, without licenses or insurance.

Not having a license won't stop them. Having a license will at least insure they know the basic rules.

You don't need a drivers license to know the basic rules. You can look that up on the internet or get a drivers manual from your local DMV. They all have them.

A license requires you pass a test of both driving skills and knowledge. If you don't need one because anyone can look it up - why do we require them?

You stated it was so they knew the basic rules. You don't have to be licensed for that. If you are an illegal, and are going to break our laws once again by driving illegally, you can still know our rules even without a license.

Possibly. But without testing that knowledge, you don't know. Your argument essentially eliminates the requirement for a license. In fact, for any sort of knowledge based license or certification. Why have it?