Republicans be honest: if Trump were president during the Cuban Missile Crisis, how do you think...

[Wyatt earp]

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

 

[dannyboys]

...that would have turned out?

Can you see Trump achieving what Kennedy did? No you cannot. Just admit it - that would have been a terrifying time to be alive.

we capitulated

Which prevented a nuclear war.

So now you recommend we capitulate to NK so we will "prevent a nuclear war"?
Same goes for Iran right?........asshole!
You're a typical LIB coward!
How did Neville Chamberlain fair when he "capitulated" to Hitler?..........asshole!

 

[Cellblock2429]

Trump would have gone with the recommendations of the Generals. Launch an invasion of Cuba.

Wrong answer. Cue the nuclear launch, Cue our response against Cuba... Cue the Soviet response against the USA.... Cue the USA response against Russia....

Cue Charlton Heston at the statue of liberty (planet of the apes)

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

/—-/ my turn to ask an idiotic what if question. If JFK was the ottoman emperor how would he have handed the Crimean war? Admit it Dems. It would have been a disaster.

 

[rightwinger]

Had President Donald Trump or President Ronald Reagan been in office, there would not have been a Cuban Missile Crisis.

It was, indeed, a very scary time. Several years before President Nakita Khrushchev had already made his speech where he threatened, "we will bury you".

Following that, President Kennedy failed to support the Bay of Pigs invasion showing the Russians and Cuba weakness. Had he supported the Bay of Pigs, there would never have been the Cuban Missile Crisis. Today Cuba could have been a rich paradise with a great economy.

Instead, President Kennedy secretly negotiated with Khrushchev that the US would remove our Jupiter missiles from Turkey if Russia would remove their missiles from Cuba. Thus the stalemate that lasts to this day.

Can you imagine what Havana would look like today, if all the money that went into Vegas went into Havana?

Easier to get to Havana and the beaches are nicer

And closer to what, until recently were the primary population centers of the US.


Hell, would probably have drawn significant European traffic.


The potential profit to have been made by a Cuba smart enough to be diplomatic with the US, is mind boggling.

If only the Cuban government could have teamed up with the mafia and created a gambling center backed by the government.....

Oh....wait, they tried that

 

[eddiew37]

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

You think coming out of our greatest recession had anything to do with it ?? A recession btw,given to us by a republican president

 

[Cellblock2429]

Had President Donald Trump or President Ronald Reagan been in office, there would not have been a Cuban Missile Crisis.

It was, indeed, a very scary time. Several years before President Nakita Khrushchev had already made his speech where he threatened, "we will bury you".

Following that, President Kennedy failed to support the Bay of Pigs invasion showing the Russians and Cuba weakness. Had he supported the Bay of Pigs, there would never have been the Cuban Missile Crisis. Today Cuba could have been a rich paradise with a great economy.

Instead, President Kennedy secretly negotiated with Khrushchev that the US would remove our Jupiter missiles from Turkey if Russia would remove their missiles from Cuba. Thus the stalemate that lasts to this day.

Can you imagine what Havana would look like today, if all the money that went into Vegas went into Havana?

Easier to get to Havana and the beaches are nicer

And closer to what, until recently were the primary population centers of the US.


Hell, would probably have drawn significant European traffic.


The potential profit to have been made by a Cuba smart enough to be diplomatic with the US, is mind boggling.

If only the Cuban government could have teamed up with the mafia and created a gambling center backed by the government.....

Oh....wait, they tried that

/—-/ Did the Cuban people fair better under Batista or Castro?

 

[dannyboys]

Don’t you love pointless hypothetical threads?

"What would Jesus have done?"

 

[eddiew37]

Trump would have gone with the recommendations of the Generals. Launch an invasion of Cuba.

Wrong answer. Cue the nuclear launch, Cue our response against Cuba... Cue the Soviet response against the USA.... Cue the USA response against Russia....

Cue Charlton Heston at the statue of liberty (planet of the apes)

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

/—-/ my turn to ask an idiotic what if question. If JFK was the ottoman emperor how would he have handed the Crimean war? Admit it Dems. It would have been a disaster.

If JFK were Roman emperor would he have Jesus killed?

 

[Cellblock2429]

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

You think coming out of our greatest recession had anything to do with it ?? A recession btw,given to us by a republican president

/—-/ Obozo took what should have been a 6 month recession and turned it in to an 8 year disaster

 

[Correll]

...that would have turned out?

Can you see Trump achieving what Kennedy did? No you cannot. Just admit it - that would have been a terrifying time to be alive.

/——/ Well for starters Trump wouldn’t have turned chicken with the Bay of Pigs. He’d have overthrown Castro and the Cuban people would have had a free country to live in.

I was in the Army when troops were called to Florida If trump was president then I and 1000's more American soldiers and who knows how many civilians wouldn't be around today Trump is an ass ..and I'm being kind

My father in law was a marine nearby to possibly support the invaders. He would have certainly gone in.


He blames the Cuban Missile Crisis on JFK for NOT giving the order to go in.

 

[Cellblock2429]

Trump would have gone with the recommendations of the Generals. Launch an invasion of Cuba.

Wrong answer. Cue the nuclear launch, Cue our response against Cuba... Cue the Soviet response against the USA.... Cue the USA response against Russia....

Cue Charlton Heston at the statue of liberty (planet of the apes)

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

/—-/ my turn to ask an idiotic what if question. If JFK was the ottoman emperor how would he have handed the Crimean war? Admit it Dems. It would have been a disaster.

If JFK were Roman emperor would he have Jesus killed?

Emperor Trump would have appointed Jesus director of health and human services over the objections of the DemocRATS

 

[Correll]

Had President Donald Trump or President Ronald Reagan been in office, there would not have been a Cuban Missile Crisis.

It was, indeed, a very scary time. Several years before President Nakita Khrushchev had already made his speech where he threatened, "we will bury you".

Following that, President Kennedy failed to support the Bay of Pigs invasion showing the Russians and Cuba weakness. Had he supported the Bay of Pigs, there would never have been the Cuban Missile Crisis. Today Cuba could have been a rich paradise with a great economy.

Instead, President Kennedy secretly negotiated with Khrushchev that the US would remove our Jupiter missiles from Turkey if Russia would remove their missiles from Cuba. Thus the stalemate that lasts to this day.

Can you imagine what Havana would look like today, if all the money that went into Vegas went into Havana?

Easier to get to Havana and the beaches are nicer

And closer to what, until recently were the primary population centers of the US.


Hell, would probably have drawn significant European traffic.


The potential profit to have been made by a Cuba smart enough to be diplomatic with the US, is mind boggling.

If only the Cuban government could have teamed up with the mafia and created a gambling center backed by the government.....

Oh....wait, they tried that

Better than what they tried next.


"We are right next door to the richer of the two superpowers, and the largest market in the world. Let's be ENEMIES with them and ally with the POOR superpower on the other side of the world"


What a great plan.

 

[Kosh]

The far left is continuing to prove that JFK or FDR would never be allowed in the Democratic party of today!

 

[SeaGal]

There are a number of points in history where only one person could have done what was done. Not just politics, but in a variety of situations. Sticking with Politics, and starting with the Cuban Missile Crisis, only Kennedy could have done what he did during the crisis.

No other President before, or since could have. Any other President would have bowed to the demands of the Military to bomb the anti aircraft sites. That would have led to a retaliatory strike on either Berlin, or Florida. Only Kennedy would have the certainty to stand up and refuse the Military demands. Eisenhower would not, LBJ would not.

No one else could have done what Kennedy did. That is why he is so admired. But there are other points. There is an old saying. Only Nixon could have gone to China. The reason that saying is used, and true, is that only Nixon had the long history of being so rabidly anti-communist that the people trusted him to keep American interests secure. In other words the people trusted him to negotiate and not give away the store.

Reagan. Only Reagan could have walked away from Iceland secure in his belief that he had just doomed the Soviet Union. Everyone else thought this was the wrong move. Everyone else wanted the deal that the Soviets were offering, and end to Nuclear Weapons. Only Reagan would pass on the deal, and it was demonstrated by History to be the right move.

Truman. Only Truman would have the courage to stand up and refuse to allow the Atomic Bomb to be used in North Korea. Everyone else, anyone else, would have bowed to the request from MacArthur. MacArthur had the public following. But only Truman had the courage to make the point final that the Civilian Government was in control of the Military.

It wasn’t just Americans either. Nobody but Margaret Thatcher would have ordered the Military to fight a war at the end of an impossibly long supply chain, dangerously close to the Enemy supplies, with such a small force, to recapture the Falkland Islands. Nobody else would have done so with the paltry military that Britain had.

Do you imagine that there was anyone else who could have led the British People alone against the might of the Nazi’s Besides Churchill?

There were a handful of vital people in the NASA program to reach the moon. Neil Armstrong was not one of those vital people. If Apollo 11 had aborted because of the computer problem on approach then Apollo 12 would have been the first man on the moon. Instead of Armstrong, it would have been Pete Conrad.

Those few vital people are those like John Aaron. The Engineer who saved Apollo 12, and the one who recognized the biggest priority for Apollo 13 was energy. Aaron was a brilliant Engineer. Aaron isn’t alone, but I’m not going to waste your time with names of people you’ve never heard of.

There were many points in History where one person was the only one who could have done it. Three Mile Island. Only Carter had the understanding of nuclear power that allowed him to instantly understand what was happening. Only Carter had the training to know that he could travel there safely and that allowed him to overrule the adamant objections of his staff, and probably the Secret Service. Nobody but Carter would have gone, and nobody but Carter could. He was just the right person, at the right place, at the right time.

But that is true of many more situations. Curiously enough, you can’t say that about W. Obama, or a lot of others who have inhabited the White House. Most residents of that house have not had the defining moment of the Cuban Missile Crisis, or the lifetime of rhetoric to justify the trust to open China, or the understanding of the nuances like Reagan. All of them went against the advice of the experts, and all of them were proven right.

That’s the thing. Each of them gambled like a Texas Hold-em playing going all in. Only the pot wasn’t a life savings, it was literally the nation’s future. Think of this. If Argentina had won the Faulklands war, would Britain have emerged as a world power? Or would they be viewed like The Netherlands, a small nation with an irrelevant military?

Reagan could well have doomed the world to another fifty years of Cold War. Nixon could well have failed in his diplomatic efforts and actually triggered a regional war with China.

Kennedy could well have been wrong, and the right answer was to send in the Military. His delays and half measures could be damned by History as the irresolute moves of a spineless fool. If he had failed, History would be flooded with the idea that Kennedy screwed it up because he was on strong medication for his back pain.

It is also important to note that these individuals did not do everything well. Just the one thing, when it really mattered. When it was all on the line.

Saying that Trump could not have gotten us through the Cuban Missile Crisis is true. Then again, no one else could have. There was a plane called the Gimli Glider. It ran out of fuel, a new 757 aircraft and it ran out of gas. The pilots who landed the plane performed a near miracle in doing so. Every other pilot that was put in the simulator to try their hand at the problem, crashed. Every one. Only one man kept it from being a disaster. He’s not the only example of that. There are others.

Do we demand that all pilots are able to perform a miracle? Do we demand that all Presidents are able to read the play of the enemy and go against the advice of their advisors to do what eventually wins? No, we pick the best of the available choices, and we hope that it works out in the future.

This is where your analogy falls down. Hillary would not be any better. Her history is one of clever plans that were always just that hair short of clever enough to actually work. If Hillary had been President during the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Southern states would be radioactive ash for another fifty years.

Your response is well thought out - and well written. I enjoyed reading it.

Since we're dealing with the hypothetical - in addressing your first paragraph...did Kennedy's decision to green light the Bay of Pigs invasion, then not provide support send a signal to Khrushchev that Kennedy was weak? I think it unlikely that the red K' really wanted to risk nuclear war - he wanted those missiles out of Turkey - which ultimately he got. If Kennedy's behavior caused the missile crises, then I don't know how much he can be praised for ending it.

As a sentient being during the 60's, I can't help but wonder how different things might be today had John, Martin and Bobby been destined to die of old age.

 

[nat4900]

poor little gnat, his boi friend kicked him out of bed on a sunday morning

Mr. Tuna......just because I basically called your cult hero a fucking idiot, should not have prompted you to make your usual gay-bashing retorts.

Instead, go light a cross somewhere......

 

[SavannahMann]

There are a number of points in history where only one person could have done what was done. Not just politics, but in a variety of situations. Sticking with Politics, and starting with the Cuban Missile Crisis, only Kennedy could have done what he did during the crisis.

No other President before, or since could have. Any other President would have bowed to the demands of the Military to bomb the anti aircraft sites. That would have led to a retaliatory strike on either Berlin, or Florida. Only Kennedy would have the certainty to stand up and refuse the Military demands. Eisenhower would not, LBJ would not.

No one else could have done what Kennedy did. That is why he is so admired. But there are other points. There is an old saying. Only Nixon could have gone to China. The reason that saying is used, and true, is that only Nixon had the long history of being so rabidly anti-communist that the people trusted him to keep American interests secure. In other words the people trusted him to negotiate and not give away the store.

Reagan. Only Reagan could have walked away from Iceland secure in his belief that he had just doomed the Soviet Union. Everyone else thought this was the wrong move. Everyone else wanted the deal that the Soviets were offering, and end to Nuclear Weapons. Only Reagan would pass on the deal, and it was demonstrated by History to be the right move.

Truman. Only Truman would have the courage to stand up and refuse to allow the Atomic Bomb to be used in North Korea. Everyone else, anyone else, would have bowed to the request from MacArthur. MacArthur had the public following. But only Truman had the courage to make the point final that the Civilian Government was in control of the Military.

It wasn’t just Americans either. Nobody but Margaret Thatcher would have ordered the Military to fight a war at the end of an impossibly long supply chain, dangerously close to the Enemy supplies, with such a small force, to recapture the Falkland Islands. Nobody else would have done so with the paltry military that Britain had.

Do you imagine that there was anyone else who could have led the British People alone against the might of the Nazi’s Besides Churchill?

There were a handful of vital people in the NASA program to reach the moon. Neil Armstrong was not one of those vital people. If Apollo 11 had aborted because of the computer problem on approach then Apollo 12 would have been the first man on the moon. Instead of Armstrong, it would have been Pete Conrad.

Those few vital people are those like John Aaron. The Engineer who saved Apollo 12, and the one who recognized the biggest priority for Apollo 13 was energy. Aaron was a brilliant Engineer. Aaron isn’t alone, but I’m not going to waste your time with names of people you’ve never heard of.

There were many points in History where one person was the only one who could have done it. Three Mile Island. Only Carter had the understanding of nuclear power that allowed him to instantly understand what was happening. Only Carter had the training to know that he could travel there safely and that allowed him to overrule the adamant objections of his staff, and probably the Secret Service. Nobody but Carter would have gone, and nobody but Carter could. He was just the right person, at the right place, at the right time.

But that is true of many more situations. Curiously enough, you can’t say that about W. Obama, or a lot of others who have inhabited the White House. Most residents of that house have not had the defining moment of the Cuban Missile Crisis, or the lifetime of rhetoric to justify the trust to open China, or the understanding of the nuances like Reagan. All of them went against the advice of the experts, and all of them were proven right.

That’s the thing. Each of them gambled like a Texas Hold-em playing going all in. Only the pot wasn’t a life savings, it was literally the nation’s future. Think of this. If Argentina had won the Faulklands war, would Britain have emerged as a world power? Or would they be viewed like The Netherlands, a small nation with an irrelevant military?

Reagan could well have doomed the world to another fifty years of Cold War. Nixon could well have failed in his diplomatic efforts and actually triggered a regional war with China.

Kennedy could well have been wrong, and the right answer was to send in the Military. His delays and half measures could be damned by History as the irresolute moves of a spineless fool. If he had failed, History would be flooded with the idea that Kennedy screwed it up because he was on strong medication for his back pain.

It is also important to note that these individuals did not do everything well. Just the one thing, when it really mattered. When it was all on the line.

Saying that Trump could not have gotten us through the Cuban Missile Crisis is true. Then again, no one else could have. There was a plane called the Gimli Glider. It ran out of fuel, a new 757 aircraft and it ran out of gas. The pilots who landed the plane performed a near miracle in doing so. Every other pilot that was put in the simulator to try their hand at the problem, crashed. Every one. Only one man kept it from being a disaster. He’s not the only example of that. There are others.

Do we demand that all pilots are able to perform a miracle? Do we demand that all Presidents are able to read the play of the enemy and go against the advice of their advisors to do what eventually wins? No, we pick the best of the available choices, and we hope that it works out in the future.

This is where your analogy falls down. Hillary would not be any better. Her history is one of clever plans that were always just that hair short of clever enough to actually work. If Hillary had been President during the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Southern states would be radioactive ash for another fifty years.

Your response is well thought out - and well written. I enjoyed reading it.

Since we're dealing with the hypothetical - in addressing your first paragraph...did Kennedy's decision to green light the Bay of Pigs invasion, then not provide support send a signal to Khrushchev that Kennedy was weak? I think it unlikely that the red K' really wanted to risk nuclear war - he wanted those missiles out of Turkey - which ultimately he got. If Kennedy's behavior caused the missile crises, then I don't know how much he can be praised for ending it.

As a sentient being during the 60's, I can't help but wonder how different things might be today had John, Martin and Bobby been destined to die of old age.

The Bay of Pigs was an interesting thing. The Military assumed that Kennedy would fall for the in for a dime argument. He did not. What the Military learned, again, was that when the President puts limits on something, he isn’t joking.

As for how it influenced Krushchev, we know. Since the fall of the Soviet Union, many files once closed, have become open. The main influence was that Khrushchev agreed that Cuba was in danger of being invaded, and the threat was valid. It was the motivation behind the arming of Cuba with the nuclear weapons, including tactical nuclear weapons intended to be used in case the Marines landed on the beaches.

Thankfully, those charged with firing the weapons, showed greater restraint than their orders may have instructed them to have.

A curious coincidence happens here. The First Officer of the K-19 was given command of one of the Submarines that were the focal point of the Cuban Missile Crisis. It is interesting that in both situations, this enemy of freedom etc. showed great wisdom and considerations of what the actions would be viewed as by the Americans. There was a threat that if the K-19 exploded in nuclear hell, the Americans might believe that it was an attack on their fleet units. That could start the war nobody wanted. The same danger existed if he followed the letter of his orders and fired the Nuclear Tipped Torpedoes as instructed, when he was forced to surface by American Naval units.

Vasili Arkhipov - Wikipedia

Imagine going home to answer questions why you did not follow orders and start World War III. Questions asked in the way the Soviets asked them would have been uncomfortable to say the least.

The world continued spinning, babies continued being born, and the Americans and Soviets continued in the Cold War, because one man was wise enough to disobey his orders. One of our enemies, saved the world from Nuclear Hell.

 

[ThoughtCrimes]

and Obama doubled that debt, what's your point?

And Reagan nearly tripled the debt, so what the fuck is your entirely partisan point, Red?

For one ..

Who was in control of Congress you blithering idiot?

Two how can you compare what Reagan did to what obama did? He raised it more then all the presidents combined before him..

I can compare it quite easily, shit for brains, given the the CONTENT of the post to which I was responding, you jerkoff! Man, you're stuck on stupid, Gomer! Why the fuck didn't you read the background of what I posted to in response. Knee jerk often, ASSHOLE? And fuck your apples and oranges AND your atrophied grey matter!

 

[Cellblock2429]

...that would have turned out?

Can you see Trump achieving what Kennedy did? No you cannot. Just admit it - that would have been a terrifying time to be alive.

DemocRATS be honest. If 2 + 2 = 5 how would it affect the outcome of the 1960 World’s Series? Now think man, this is important.

 

[postman]

No other President before, or since could have. Any other President would have bowed to the demands of the Military to bomb the anti aircraft sites. That would have led to a retaliatory strike on either Berlin, or Florida. Only Kennedy would have the certainty to stand up and refuse the Military demands. Eisenhower would not, LBJ would not.

No one else could have done what Kennedy did. That is why he is so admired..

I'm not sure what Trump would have done. Trump may have called all the military intelligence "fake news", and instead done whatever fox news said he should do. That he would have escalated the crisis by calling them names, like "rocket man" or "little Castro". And told his secretary of state that negotiations were worthless.

 

[Cellblock2429]

No other President before, or since could have. Any other President would have bowed to the demands of the Military to bomb the anti aircraft sites. That would have led to a retaliatory strike on either Berlin, or Florida. Only Kennedy would have the certainty to stand up and refuse the Military demands. Eisenhower would not, LBJ would not.

No one else could have done what Kennedy did. That is why he is so admired..

I'm not sure what Trump would have done. Trump may have called all the military intelligence "fake news", and instead done whatever fox news said he should do. That he would have escalated the crisis by calling them names, like "rocket man" or "little Castro". And told his secretary of state that negotiations were worthless.

/—-/ Libtards, If if if flies didn’t have wings would we call them walks? Discuss