Ron Paul: “Good News” That Secession Is Happening

[Geaux4it]

“Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of the ends for which it was established, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government ... Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of the ends for which it was established, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.”- The US Constitution

It seems you have confused the Constitution for the Declaration of Independence.

Um... indeed I did...

Demerits warranted

-Geaux

 

[dilloduck]

Besides, how will those states replace the income they get from the federal gov't? I doubt any of them send more taxes to Washington than they receive in federal monies.

You mean that fake "money" the Fed is printing like toilet paper ?

That "fake money" pays your bills, gets roads repaired, pays for doctor visits, and more. Yes, there are problems, but quitting the USA isn't a solution.

Don't you think preparing for the inevitable crash is wise ? There will be no federal government to rely on. They are playing with monopoly money

 

[kaz]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

 

[Wry Catcher]

Besides, how will those states replace the income they get from the federal gov't? I doubt any of them send more taxes to Washington than they receive in federal monies.

You mean that fake "money" the Fed is printing like toilet paper ?

That "fake money" pays your bills, gets roads repaired, pays for doctor visits, and more. Yes, there are problems, but quitting the USA isn't a solution.

Don't you think preparing for the inevitable crash is wise ? There will be no federal government to rely on. They are playing with monopoly money

How are you preparing for the "inevitable crash"? What would you do differently, or more realistically, what would Romney have done?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

When Obama started selectively choosing which laws to enforce he opened a floodgate of potential anarchy. Why is ANY law more important to enforce than any other? Who picks and chooses?

Every law MUST be enforced or all will be challenged eventually

This is ignorant and wrong.

The president is currently enforcing all laws.

That you disapprove of how the laws are being enforced does not constitute a 'lack' of enforcement.

Consequently, no “floodgate of potential anarchy” has been 'opened,' where attempting to justify the myth of 'secession' predicated on such a lie is partisan idiocy.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.
Thus it takes this form:

X is true, therefor, X is true.

As for the 10th Amendment, do you believe the people have the right to vote on referendums, which would have the force of law (a form of direct democracy); or more on point, the right to vote on an initiative, to add or repeal sections of a constitution?

How do you understand the words of the 10th:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

 

[WinterBorn]

Besides, how will those states replace the income they get from the federal gov't? I doubt any of them send more taxes to Washington than they receive in federal monies.

You mean that fake "money" the Fed is printing like toilet paper ?

That "fake money" pays your bills, gets roads repaired, pays for doctor visits, and more. Yes, there are problems, but quitting the USA isn't a solution.

Don't you think preparing for the inevitable crash is wise ? There will be no federal government to rely on. They are playing with monopoly money

Preparation for a crash is a good idea. However, that is not the topic here. The topic is states seceding from the Union.

 

[WinterBorn]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.
Thus it takes this form:

X is true, therefor, X is true.

As for the 10th Amendment, do you believe the people have the right to vote on referendums, which would have the force of law (a form of direct democracy); or more on point, the right to vote on an initiative, to add or repeal sections of a constitution?

How do you understand the words of the 10th:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

As long as those laws passed do not violate the US Constitution, that is great.

 

[WinterBorn]

When Obama started selectively choosing which laws to enforce he opened a floodgate of potential anarchy. Why is ANY law more important to enforce than any other? Who picks and chooses?

Every law MUST be enforced or all will be challenged eventually

This is ignorant and wrong.

The president is currently enforcing all laws.

That you disapprove of how the laws are being enforced does not constitute a 'lack' of enforcement.

Consequently, no “floodgate of potential anarchy” has been 'opened,' where attempting to justify the myth of 'secession' predicated on such a lie is partisan idiocy.

Why was there no cry for secession when Bush violated the constitution? Why was there no cry for secession when Reagan and George H. Bush pardoned so many illegal immigrants?

 

[kaz]

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.

Yes, something is wrong in America today. We have an ever growing central leftist authoritarian government which doesn't even consider Constitutional limits on their power to be a speed bump

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

It means the Federal government (google the meaning of the word Federal) is prohibited from doing anything it is not specifically authorized to do. That includes both exceeding it's authority and making up rights like the right to an abortion. Government is regulating interstate commerce, taking land from one citizen and giving it to another, confiscating and redistributing money and even requiring citizens to enter into private contracts with corporations. Our government is a rogue, criminal organization which is oppressing it's people.

Yeah, something is wrong in America today.

 

[bripat9643]

Peaceful secession would be great. But unfortunately the central government will never allow it, no matter who is POTUS, without a fight.

The last time it was tried force was used to prevent it, causing the deaths of 800k and destruction of half the nation.

Save the Union will be the statist dupe mantra...and they love killing for the state.

It happened in the Soviet Union, and it also happened in when the British Empire dissolved, so it's absurd to claim it can't happen here.

 

[kaz]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.
Thus it takes this form:

X is true, therefor, X is true.

As for the 10th Amendment, do you believe the people have the right to vote on referendums, which would have the force of law (a form of direct democracy); or more on point, the right to vote on an initiative, to add or repeal sections of a constitution?

How do you understand the words of the 10th:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

As long as those laws passed do not violate the US Constitution, that is great.

Exactly. I have yet to hear a Constitutional law being ignored by the States

 

[kaz]

Why was there no cry for secession when Bush violated the constitution? Why was there no cry for secession when Reagan and George H. Bush pardoned so many illegal immigrants?

I'm not sure I get the Reagan one, but W had a lot of people who gave him a pass on economics because they supported the war on terror. Now however, I think W is part of what is driving secession. We have since Reagan had 4 Presidents, two from each party, and all 4 were tax and spend liberals. We are fed up with it.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.
Thus it takes this form:

X is true, therefor, X is true.

As for the 10th Amendment, do you believe the people have the right to vote on referendums, which would have the force of law (a form of direct democracy); or more on point, the right to vote on an initiative, to add or repeal sections of a constitution?

How do you understand the words of the 10th:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

As long as those laws passed do not violate the US Constitution, that is great.

Yeah, that's clear in the text. However, when the argument for States Rights is presented, it is generally assumed that the right is one which the elected authority wants, not necessarily the people.

 

[paperview]

Didn't work out too good the last time it was tried here.

Won't work out any better if it's attempted again.

 

[Wry Catcher]

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.

Yes, something is wrong in America today. We have an ever growing central leftist authoritarian government which doesn't even consider Constitutional limits on their power to be a speed bump

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

It means the Federal government (google the meaning of the word Federal) is prohibited from doing anything it is not specifically authorized to do. That includes both exceeding it's authority and making up rights like the right to an abortion. Government is regulating interstate commerce, taking land from one citizen and giving it to another, confiscating and redistributing money and even requiring citizens to enter into private contracts with corporations. Our government is a rogue, criminal organization which is oppressing it's people.

Yeah, something is wrong in America today.

Wow, you really do hate our government, and many of the people who are or want to become Americans. Where do you suppose a government exists that would best suit you? I suppose time travel is out of the question, and most Americans don't want to go back to the Gilded Age or adopt Ayn Rand's vision of utopia.

 

[kaz]

Ron Paul is a nut job but why must you morons on the left ALWAYS assume or insinuate that all of those on the right want to go back to "the 50s or 40s" and all that entails (racially and gender related)? Is it because you would throw out the baby with that bathwater that you assume they would to? Or is it simple political propaganda?

When someone says something like "We will change America back" It naturally begs the question "Back to what"? Somehow their changing things back always sounds like changing it into something it has never been.

First, that isn't what begging the question means, you should look that up so you don't start your posts by looking stupid. Actually that's not enough, but it's a start anyway.

And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.
Thus it takes this form:

X is true, therefor, X is true.

As for the 10th Amendment, do you believe the people have the right to vote on referendums, which would have the force of law (a form of direct democracy); or more on point, the right to vote on an initiative, to add or repeal sections of a constitution?

How do you understand the words of the 10th:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

As long as those laws passed do not violate the US Constitution, that is great.

Yeah, that's clear in the text. However, when the argument for States Rights is presented, it is generally assumed that the right is one which the elected authority wants, not necessarily the people.

Give an example of a Federal law being ignored by the States that adheres to the 10th amendment

 

[RKMBrown]

Nonsense. I live in a society where my government invades my personal documents without a warrant, a society where my government can kill me for saying what I please. I live in a country that punishes me for following my dreams. It is authoritarian because it forces me to do all sorts of things that it should not.

You poor baby, having to live in a state of security you demanded because you were paranoid about terrorists.

Fuck you scum bag. I never asked for protection from those pansy ass pussies.

No one has ever chosen the country of their birth, If you hate it here so much then GTFO. Freest, safest country on earth and you spoiled brats still bitch even though you supported every step towards police state this country ever took, mostly because liberals opposed it.

Spoken like a true scum-bag criminal. Pay for the protection and like it or GTFO.

You're a fucking slave and you like it you pansy ass. First you scream nothing's wrong then you admit we are heading to a police state. Make up your mind.

Oh there's lots of stuff wrong, mostly because of conservatives' fearful short-sightedness and now people like you want to play dine-and-dash and skip out on the bill. A decade ago people like you were saying "Please protect us from terrorists Mr. Bush, I will gladly trade my privacy for security." and the classic "If you are doing nothing wrong you have nothing to worry about" while calling people terrorist sympathizers if they opposed domestic surveillance. I remember even if you choose to forget.

Fuck you ass hole, I've paid millions for this fucking security that I never asked for in the first place. I fought against this DHS nazi like organization from the start. You are nothing. You're a lying POS.

 

[kaz]

You're wrong. "We will change America back" is a premise, a premise which implies that something is wrong in America today, which didn't exist in past times.

Yes, something is wrong in America today. We have an ever growing central leftist authoritarian government which doesn't even consider Constitutional limits on their power to be a speed bump

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

It means the Federal government (google the meaning of the word Federal) is prohibited from doing anything it is not specifically authorized to do. That includes both exceeding it's authority and making up rights like the right to an abortion. Government is regulating interstate commerce, taking land from one citizen and giving it to another, confiscating and redistributing money and even requiring citizens to enter into private contracts with corporations. Our government is a rogue, criminal organization which is oppressing it's people.

Yeah, something is wrong in America today.

Wow, you really do hate our government, and many of the people who are or want to become Americans.

Yes, asshole, I'm a racist. I didn't say anything about immigration. This is why arguing with liberals is pointless and I just start insulting you. Go fuck yourself.

Where do you suppose a government exists that would best suit you? I suppose time travel is out of the question, and most Americans don't want to go back to the Gilded Age or adopt Ayn Rand's vision of utopia.

Follow the Constitution, including the 10th amendment and I'm happy. Wow, I wish I said that before, wait, I did, repeatedly. But you have the butt hurt that everyone who doesn't agree with you is a racist and you see it in every post that doesn't even discuss race or immigration.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

KAZ SAID:

“And all States are doing is reasserting the 10th amendment, and only a tiny portion of that. States are Constitutionally far more autonomous than the central state authoritarian leftists in DC have implemented.”

Ignorant nonsense.

States and local jurisdictions are subject to Federal laws and the rulings of Federal courts, as codified by Article VI of the Constitution (Cooper v. Aaron).

And as a fact of Constitutional case law the states may not 'secede' absent the consent of Congress and all the other states.(Texas v. White)

The states are in no way 'autonomous,' as the American citizens who reside in the states are first and foremost citizens of the United States, one people, citizens of one Nation, residents of the states subordinate to that – where state governments may not interfere with the relationship between the people and their Federal government, and the states may not take from the people their citizenship nor violate the inalienable rights of American citizens. (US Term Limits v. Thornton).