Someone explain to me how Trump "failed" on Covid?

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

You are going in circles Andy. You used evidence what I told you. REALLY?

Let me repeat it again. PAY ATTENTION when Coronavirus outbreak in China started Chines in general don’t know what they have and don’t know what to do even with the mask. They used mask because of dirty air over and over....... PAY ATTENTION when it started they used the same attitude using mask over and over. By the time they know it’s dangerous it’s too late. What part of that don’t you understand.

 

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

Where is your rebuttal to post #155?

The Coronavirus is very new how do they know how and what to contain at the beginning? Trump restrict travel to China but allowed only to non citizens but allowed at least 40,000 US citizens back to US.

According to you.... they should never had an outbreak to begin with. Are you serious? How the hell can you predict an outbreak? How can you predict a new virus?

You don’t even know how dirty is China then you based your opinion from Chinese that just travel to US.

You are trying to promote a US president that is so ignorant just doesn’t give a shit endangering human being.

 

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

Mask in China. Those Chinese wear mask even before the pandemic because of dirty air. Like i posted many times I have business in China since 1995 that is why I speak Mandarin Chinese. And I wear mask every time I travel to China.

How did Chinese got infected and thousands deaths even wearing a mask? Read my post do not stare at it. Because Chinese are dirty and they didn’t knew how deadly the virus was before it became a pandemic so it spread like hell. But in general populations they learned the lessons the hard way.
Here in US we have 2 problems A. People like you who refuse to believe in science like mask . B. Denials that we have a problems.

If Obama or Biden is the president he will encourage Americans to wear mask and social distancing. Listen to science. Compared to Trump arrogantly anti mask and social distancing against his own policy.


If mask doesn’t work you should write or call the CDC, NIH and Trump administration to change this policies that mask is bad.

Mask in China. Those Chinese wear mask even before the pandemic because of dirty air. Like i posted many times I have business in China since 1995 that is why I speak Mandarin Chinese. And I wear mask every time I travel to China.

And it stopped Covid-19 instantly. That's why it never got out of China, and never became a pandemic.

Because Chinese are dirty and they didn’t knew how deadly the virus was before it became a pandemic so it spread like hell. But in general populations they learned the lessons the hard way.

Oh.... so dirty, is more important the mask wearing? Because I don't hear any politician including Trump, saying to be dirty.

What I hear them saying is that masks are not effective. Which your own post states.

That said, I don't know what you are talking about. I'm not say you are wrong. I don't know. I can't live your experience.

But I know Chinese people, who escaped from China to come to the US. Not one is dirty.

If Obama or Biden is the president he will encourage Americans to wear mask and social distancing. Listen to science. Compared to Trump arrogantly anti mask and social distancing against his own policy.

No. No American is going to sit there saying "Oh.... Obama has a mask, therefore I should."
Not true.

If mask doesn’t work you should write or call the CDC, NIH and Trump administration to change this policies that mask is bad.

Originally they didn't support wearing masks, until political pressure was put on them to change the policy.

Even the World Health Organization does not suggest people wear masks.

There is no evidence masks are effective. I don't need to write anyone. The evidence is already there.

I never said it stop instantly. I gave you an exact usages of mask in China. And who are you to dispute a pandemic?

China is dirty. You don’t even know what mean. I mean dirty like kids running around in the provinces without pants and they shit just around their houses, they butchered live animals using the same chopping board when cooked, wet markets, toilet is just a hole on the ground etc etc etc. You can even Google which country is the top 10 most polluted country in the world.

Pay Attention let me repeat it again. Most are accustomed using mask before the Pandemic because of dirty air using it over and over just like me when I was there. I only replaced it because I don’t know where I placed it.... Then Coronavirus came.... they used the same attitude not replacing dirty mask, they learned the hard way. NOW it’s a different attitude. Read my post do not stare at it.

You did not hear them saying China is dirty? Why should you wait to tell you China is dirty. I based it from my own experience.


You heard from Chinese that mask is not effective. Really? Who? Do you have a proof?

According to you...... You know Chinese that escapes and they don’t look dirty. Do you expect them to fly with dirty clothes?

If Obama or Biden is the president they will ENCOURAGE people to wear mask. Pay attention read my post do not stare at it. Look at Biden encouraging people to wear mask blasting idiot Trump. Yes a president should set an example based from science not discouraged people not to wear mask.

According to you..... NIH and CDC was only pressured politically to wear mask? Really? Do you have a proof or a link?


If mask is not effective then we should see thousands of doctors and nurses that died of Coronavirus. Don’t you think? Scientists, experts, hospitals, nurses and doctors..... do not agree with you.

What evidence do you have that mask is not effective?


According to you the WHO organization does not suggest people wear mask. Really? I mean Really? Do you have any evidence to prove that?

Andy...... I’ve asked you several questions here #155 ...... Where is it?

 

[Andylusion]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

You are going in circles Andy. You used evidence what I told you. REALLY?

Let me repeat it again. PAY ATTENTION when Coronavirus outbreak in China started Chines in general don’t know what they have and don’t know what to do even with the mask. They used mask because of dirty air over and over....... PAY ATTENTION when it started they used the same attitude using mask over and over. By the time they know it’s dangerous it’s too late. What part of that don’t you understand.

That makes no sense. You are suggesting that masks only work, if they were not originally used because of dirty air? Now masks only work if your attitude is right?

They only work if you replace them over and over?

That's funny, because I don't know anyone anywhere, that is not using the same mask over and over. No one. The most hard core "must wear masks or the planet dies" people are all using the same mask over and over.

I'd be hard pressed to find a single person anywhere who is NOT using the same mask over and over.

If you really believe what you are saying, then I think you are nuts.

 

[Andylusion]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

Where is your rebuttal to post #155?

The Coronavirus is very new how do they know how and what to contain at the beginning? Trump restrict travel to China but allowed only to non citizens but allowed at least 40,000 US citizens back to US.

According to you.... they should never had an outbreak to begin with. Are you serious? How the hell can you predict an outbreak? How can you predict a new virus?

You don’t even know how dirty is China then you based your opinion from Chinese that just travel to US.

You are trying to promote a US president that is so ignorant just doesn’t give a shit endangering human being.

According to you.... they should never had an outbreak to begin with. Are you serious? How the hell can you predict an outbreak? How can you predict a new virus?

We're talking about, are masks effective. If wearing a mask prevents the spread of Covid-19.... then... by *YOUR* logic...... There never should have been a Pandemic.

According to *YOU* everyone in China was already wearing masks.
According to *YOU* masks are effective at stopping Covid-19.

So everything is based on what *YOU YOURSELF SAID*..... There should never have been a pandemic.

You keep asking me for proof, for evidence, for 'who-said-what'.... and the entire time I've been responding to you, with your own words.

I can't answer questions that are not valid question. I don't know why you keep pointing to post 155, when the answer to all those "where did you get that from" questions, is in your mirror.

YOU. That's where I got it from.

And all you have said in response is that..... well their 'attitude' was wrong, so the masks didn't work? Really? Masks effectiveness is based on attitude? Yeah, not convinced. Sorry, just not convinced.

 

[Jake Winker Frogen]

You are a coward Eagle, and you know it.

You have never risked your life for

Here is the other thing Eagle, why do all you fat cowards who have never served in the military claim the rest of the world does not matter?

You are like that inbred, retarded kid in Deliverance playing the banjo.

I've never said the rest of the world doesn't matter.........I also don't lie like a dog as you do.........

On one thread you are and Aussie.........another an American hero serving in our armed forces for 14 years.......

Splain your so easy to see LIES.................You are not Austrailia..........you are a Liar who can't even make up his mind which country you are from.

You are not really that intelligent I see Old Yeller.

But I will not put you down.

Americans can live in other countries.

If you are not a coward and pussy you get out about the world.

Question: why 14 years?
Just seems an odd number.... why not finish the 20 and get the retirement if you're gonna invest that much time?
Was it a medical retirement?
You get hurt?

That is an intelligent question.

And my answer is not all that intelligent.

I fell in love with an Aussie lady who made it clear she wanted to have children and wanted to live in Australia.

And so I did.

Best country in the world Australia, but still I often think of what might have been?

I don't want to knock true love or anything but a few more years and you could have been getting a check every month for the rest of your life.
Not big money, but it adds up.

And women are everywhere dude...... they're like the bus, just stand on the corner, one will come along.

Indeed when every I am paying bills I reflect on that.

I guess I am too romantic.

I have tried to destroy that habit with copious amounts of beer, which in Australia is amazing, but still that fool habit happens now and again.


Still life is what it is, I really do love Australia and would not have my son if I stayed in.

 

[eagle1462010]

You are a coward Eagle, and you know it.

You have never risked your life for

Here is the other thing Eagle, why do all you fat cowards who have never served in the military claim the rest of the world does not matter?

You are like that inbred, retarded kid in Deliverance playing the banjo.

I've never said the rest of the world doesn't matter.........I also don't lie like a dog as you do.........

On one thread you are and Aussie.........another an American hero serving in our armed forces for 14 years.......

Splain your so easy to see LIES.................You are not Austrailia..........you are a Liar who can't even make up his mind which country you are from.

You are not really that intelligent I see Old Yeller.

But I will not put you down.

Americans can live in other countries.

If you are not a coward and pussy you get out about the world.

Question: why 14 years?
Just seems an odd number.... why not finish the 20 and get the retirement if you're gonna invest that much time?
Was it a medical retirement?
You get hurt?

That is an intelligent question.

And my answer is not all that intelligent.

I fell in love with an Aussie lady who made it clear she wanted to have children and wanted to live in Australia.

And so I did.

Best country in the world Australia, but still I often think of what might have been?

I don't want to knock true love or anything but a few more years and you could have been getting a check every month for the rest of your life.
Not big money, but it adds up.

And women are everywhere dude...... they're like the bus, just stand on the corner, one will come along.

Indeed when every I am paying bills I reflect on that.

I guess I am too romantic.

I have tried to destroy that habit with copious amounts of beer, which in Australia is amazing, but still that fool habit happens now and again.


Still life is what it is, I really do love Australia and would not have my son if I stayed in.

Swans beer was awesome a long time ago........do they still serve that there........Premium of Fosters.

 

[Jake Winker Frogen]

You are a coward Eagle, and you know it.

You have never risked your life for

Here is the other thing Eagle, why do all you fat cowards who have never served in the military claim the rest of the world does not matter?

You are like that inbred, retarded kid in Deliverance playing the banjo.

I've never said the rest of the world doesn't matter.........I also don't lie like a dog as you do.........

On one thread you are and Aussie.........another an American hero serving in our armed forces for 14 years.......

Splain your so easy to see LIES.................You are not Austrailia..........you are a Liar who can't even make up his mind which country you are from.

You are not really that intelligent I see Old Yeller.

But I will not put you down.

Americans can live in other countries.

If you are not a coward and pussy you get out about the world.

Question: why 14 years?
Just seems an odd number.... why not finish the 20 and get the retirement if you're gonna invest that much time?
Was it a medical retirement?
You get hurt?

That is an intelligent question.

And my answer is not all that intelligent.

I fell in love with an Aussie lady who made it clear she wanted to have children and wanted to live in Australia.

And so I did.

Best country in the world Australia, but still I often think of what might have been?

I don't want to knock true love or anything but a few more years and you could have been getting a check every month for the rest of your life.
Not big money, but it adds up.

And women are everywhere dude...... they're like the bus, just stand on the corner, one will come along.

Indeed when every I am paying bills I reflect on that.

I guess I am too romantic.

I have tried to destroy that habit with copious amounts of beer, which in Australia is amazing, but still that fool habit happens now and again.


Still life is what it is, I really do love Australia and would not have my son if I stayed in.

Swans beer was awesome a long time ago........do they still serve that there........Premium of Fosters.

Yeah they do, that is a West Australian beer where I live.

My favourate is Coopers Sparking. Bottle fermented, full flavour with a real kick to it at 5.8%.

Sorry about being an asshole toward you last night mate....too much Coopers.

 

[BrokeLoser]

How can anyone not know what the answers to these questions are?

Whether you agree with them or not, whether you think they're valid or not, how in the hell can you not know them?

He never went full commie with C-19 and Dems need commie.
But when he went commie-lite and banned all travel from China you twisted Loons complained that he went too commie...So which is it, which do you prefer...too commie or commie lite?

 

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

You are going in circles Andy. You used evidence what I told you. REALLY?

Let me repeat it again. PAY ATTENTION when Coronavirus outbreak in China started Chines in general don’t know what they have and don’t know what to do even with the mask. They used mask because of dirty air over and over....... PAY ATTENTION when it started they used the same attitude using mask over and over. By the time they know it’s dangerous it’s too late. What part of that don’t you understand.

That makes no sense. You are suggesting that masks only work, if they were not originally used because of dirty air? Now masks only work if your attitude is right?

They only work if you replace them over and over?

That's funny, because I don't know anyone anywhere, that is not using the same mask over and over. No one. The most hard core "must wear masks or the planet dies" people are all using the same mask over and over.

I'd be hard pressed to find a single person anywhere who is NOT using the same mask over and over.

If you really believe what you are saying, then I think you are nuts.

You are spinning and twisting around like a wet pretzel.
I told you over and over the mask behavior and attitude they have before the pandemic using dirty mask over and over for several days...... They also ban selling exotic animals for consumptions....... You don’t know anything about China.

Mask only now works because they are not using the same dirty mask over and over. Of course...... What part of that don’t you understand? They even wear mask inside their home. And I KNOW how you are going to come back with your rebuttal.

You don’t know anyone NOT using the same mask over and over. I don’t. I replaced it twice a day depending how many times I go out. And I know several people and so are friends and families does do that.

You don’t know anyone NOT using same mask over and over. Are they using it over and over for several days?

Eight in 10 Americans wear mask. So you are the minority.

You don’t know any one NOT using the same mask over and over. That means they are using mask except you.

More Americans say they are regularly wearing masks in stores and other businesses

As the pandemic continues, a growing share of Americans say they are regularly wearing a face covering in stores and other businesses.

www.pewresearch.org

 

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

Where is your rebuttal to post #155?

The Coronavirus is very new how do they know how and what to contain at the beginning? Trump restrict travel to China but allowed only to non citizens but allowed at least 40,000 US citizens back to US.

According to you.... they should never had an outbreak to begin with. Are you serious? How the hell can you predict an outbreak? How can you predict a new virus?

You don’t even know how dirty is China then you based your opinion from Chinese that just travel to US.

You are trying to promote a US president that is so ignorant just doesn’t give a shit endangering human being.

According to you.... they should never had an outbreak to begin with. Are you serious? How the hell can you predict an outbreak? How can you predict a new virus?

We're talking about, are masks effective. If wearing a mask prevents the spread of Covid-19.... then... by *YOUR* logic...... There never should have been a Pandemic.

According to *YOU* everyone in China was already wearing masks.
According to *YOU* masks are effective at stopping Covid-19.

So everything is based on what *YOU YOURSELF SAID*..... There should never have been a pandemic.

You keep asking me for proof, for evidence, for 'who-said-what'.... and the entire time I've been responding to you, with your own words.

I can't answer questions that are not valid question. I don't know why you keep pointing to post 155, when the answer to all those "where did you get that from" questions, is in your mirror.

YOU. That's where I got it from.

And all you have said in response is that..... well their 'attitude' was wrong, so the masks didn't work? Really? Masks effectiveness is based on attitude? Yeah, not convinced. Sorry, just not convinced.

You are entirely very wrong and spinning Dude. I don’t need to convince you all I’m telling you is you are VERY wrong the way how you believe about mask.....

And sure is you don’t know about Pandemic just because they wear mask through could have prevented the pandemic. How the HELL anyone can predict a pandemic in China province till it’s too late or a new virus?

What I mean ACCORDING to you it means you NOT me. You came back YOU as me. Dude you are loosing the argument but I’m not going to let you go.

 

[charwin95]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

Mask in China. Those Chinese wear mask even before the pandemic because of dirty air. Like i posted many times I have business in China since 1995 that is why I speak Mandarin Chinese. And I wear mask every time I travel to China.

How did Chinese got infected and thousands deaths even wearing a mask? Read my post do not stare at it. Because Chinese are dirty and they didn’t knew how deadly the virus was before it became a pandemic so it spread like hell. But in general populations they learned the lessons the hard way.
Here in US we have 2 problems A. People like you who refuse to believe in science like mask . B. Denials that we have a problems.

If Obama or Biden is the president he will encourage Americans to wear mask and social distancing. Listen to science. Compared to Trump arrogantly anti mask and social distancing against his own policy.


If mask doesn’t work you should write or call the CDC, NIH and Trump administration to change this policies that mask is bad.

Mask in China. Those Chinese wear mask even before the pandemic because of dirty air. Like i posted many times I have business in China since 1995 that is why I speak Mandarin Chinese. And I wear mask every time I travel to China.

And it stopped Covid-19 instantly. That's why it never got out of China, and never became a pandemic.

Because Chinese are dirty and they didn’t knew how deadly the virus was before it became a pandemic so it spread like hell. But in general populations they learned the lessons the hard way.

Oh.... so dirty, is more important the mask wearing? Because I don't hear any politician including Trump, saying to be dirty.

What I hear them saying is that masks are not effective. Which your own post states.

That said, I don't know what you are talking about. I'm not say you are wrong. I don't know. I can't live your experience.

But I know Chinese people, who escaped from China to come to the US. Not one is dirty.

If Obama or Biden is the president he will encourage Americans to wear mask and social distancing. Listen to science. Compared to Trump arrogantly anti mask and social distancing against his own policy.

No. No American is going to sit there saying "Oh.... Obama has a mask, therefore I should."
Not true.

If mask doesn’t work you should write or call the CDC, NIH and Trump administration to change this policies that mask is bad.

Originally they didn't support wearing masks, until political pressure was put on them to change the policy.

Even the World Health Organization does not suggest people wear masks.

There is no evidence masks are effective. I don't need to write anyone. The evidence is already there.

I never said it stop instantly. I gave you an exact usages of mask in China. And who are you to dispute a pandemic?

China is dirty. You don’t even know what mean. I mean dirty like kids running around in the provinces without pants and they shit just around their houses, they butchered live animals using the same chopping board when cooked, wet markets, toilet is just a hole on the ground etc etc etc. You can even Google which country is the top 10 most polluted country in the world.

Pay Attention let me repeat it again. Most are accustomed using mask before the Pandemic because of dirty air using it over and over just like me when I was there. I only replaced it because I don’t know where I placed it.... Then Coronavirus came.... they used the same attitude not replacing dirty mask, they learned the hard way. NOW it’s a different attitude. Read my post do not stare at it.

You did not hear them saying China is dirty? Why should you wait to tell you China is dirty. I based it from my own experience.


** You heard from Chinese that mask is not effective. Really? Who? Do you have a proof?

According to you...... You know Chinese that escapes and they don’t look dirty. Do you expect them to fly with dirty clothes?

If Obama or Biden is the president they will ENCOURAGE people to wear mask. Pay attention read my post do not stare at it. Look at Biden encouraging people to wear mask blasting idiot Trump. Yes a president should set an example based from science not discouraged people not to wear mask.

** According to you..... NIH and CDC was only pressured politically to wear mask? Really? Do you have a proof or a link?


** If mask is not effective then we should see thousands of doctors and nurses that died of Coronavirus. Don’t you think? Scientists, experts, hospitals, nurses and doctors..... do not agree with you.

** What evidence do you have that mask is not effective?


** According to you the WHO organization does not suggest people wear mask. Really? I mean Really? Do you have any evidence to prove that?

Andy ....... This is my post #155.

** I asked you several questions here. Where are the answer?

 

[Andylusion]

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

You are going in circles Andy. You used evidence what I told you. REALLY?

Let me repeat it again. PAY ATTENTION when Coronavirus outbreak in China started Chines in general don’t know what they have and don’t know what to do even with the mask. They used mask because of dirty air over and over....... PAY ATTENTION when it started they used the same attitude using mask over and over. By the time they know it’s dangerous it’s too late. What part of that don’t you understand.

That makes no sense. You are suggesting that masks only work, if they were not originally used because of dirty air? Now masks only work if your attitude is right?

They only work if you replace them over and over?

That's funny, because I don't know anyone anywhere, that is not using the same mask over and over. No one. The most hard core "must wear masks or the planet dies" people are all using the same mask over and over.

I'd be hard pressed to find a single person anywhere who is NOT using the same mask over and over.

If you really believe what you are saying, then I think you are nuts.

You are spinning and twisting around like a wet pretzel.
I told you over and over the mask behavior and attitude they have before the pandemic using dirty mask over and over for several days...... They also ban selling exotic animals for consumptions....... You don’t know anything about China.

Mask only now works because they are not using the same dirty mask over and over. Of course...... What part of that don’t you understand? They even wear mask inside their home. And I KNOW how you are going to come back with your rebuttal

You don’t know anyone NOT using the same mask over and over. I don’t. I replaced it twice a day depending how many times I go out. And I know several people and so are friends and families does do that.

You don’t know anyone NOT using same mask over and over. Are they using it over and over for several days?

Eight in 10 Americans wear mask. So you are the minority.

You don’t know any one NOT using the same mask over and over. That means they are using mask except you.

More Americans say they are regularly wearing masks in stores and other businesses

As the pandemic continues, a growing share of Americans say they are regularly wearing a face covering in stores and other businesses.

www.pewresearch.org

Eight in 10 Americans wear mask. So you are the minority.

What are you even talking about?

I've been wearing a mask since March. I'm in the minority of what? Once again, you have no point, and so you make up stuff.

Its actually quite funny. You haven't been able to make a single valid argument yet, but every post you start shrieking about how I'm "spinning and twisting around"... but then *YOU* are the one that has to make false accusations about the other person, to try and have a point?

Nah, if anyone is "spinning and twisting around" it's you.

You know nothing about me, yet claim I'm in the minority of Americans who don't wear masks?

I have followed every single guideline given about this Covid-19 crap. I have worn masks, socially distanced, and haven't gone to Church since March. My church still isn't open even now. (online church of course, but we haven't met at the Church building).

I have not used personal experience in our conversation, because the evidence alone is enough. The fact you have failed to refute a single point I've made, is proof the evidence alone is enough.

But, one of the reasons that I personally am convinced that all the mask wearing and social distancing, and lock downs are completely ineffective, and pointless.... is because I personally followed all of your guidelines, and so did everyone I know, and everyone still got sick.

I got sick. My parents got sick. My friends and neighbors got sick. My co-workers all got sick. Everyone I know got sick, and we all... ALL.... followed the mask wearing, lock downs, and social distancing guidelines.

If does that work? If you follow all the Covid-19 rules, and everyone still got sick.... explain?

You can't. I'm you'll blather on that we must not have followed all the rules, but know for a fact we did... and we still got sick.

So.... Yeah. But we don't need my personal experience. We can just look at the facts. None those rules have worked anywhere. None of them. And I realize you think your posts somehow contradicted my points... but that's because you obviously don't realize your posts contradicted nothing. You didn't. You keep saying the same utterly irrelevant statements, acting like you have a point, but you don't. None of them were valid counter arguments.

Sorry, but you are just wrong. None of those were good points. Or even valid. Either masks work or they don't. All masks get dirty. I don't see a single person using new masks every day.

Even the WHO said they don't recommend that healthy people wear masks, or that mask wearing is effective at all.

 

[Lesh]

All masks get dirty. I don't see a single person using new masks every day.

Maybe that's why everyone you know got sick.

Newsflash...change your mask often and sanitize your hands after you take it off. Stay the hell away from people who don't live in your house with you.

If you go out to eat do NOT eat indoors...do not eat in an outdoor space with walls.(tents or whatever). I can't tell you the number of times i found an area too crowded and just walked away

It ain't rocket surgery.

I am in NY. Haven't gotten sick yet but then I'm ACTUALLY careful

 

[Andylusion]

All masks get dirty. I don't see a single person using new masks every day.

Maybe that's why everyone you know got sick.

Newsflash...change your mask often and sanitize your hands after you take it off. Stay the hell away from people who don't live in your house with you.

If you go out to eat do NOT eat indoors...do not eat in an outdoor space with walls.(tents or whatever). I can't tell you the number of times i found an area too crowded and just walked away

It ain't rocket surgery.

I am in NY. Haven't gotten sick yet but then I'm ACTUALLY careful

I don't know *ANYONE*.... ANYONE.... who has replaced their masks as often as they wash their hands.

If absolutely NO ONE ANYWHERE.... is doing that.... And that's the only way that masks are effective....

Then masks are not effective, and we can stop with this nonsense.

 

[eagle1462010]

You are a coward Eagle, and you know it.

You have never risked your life for

Here is the other thing Eagle, why do all you fat cowards who have never served in the military claim the rest of the world does not matter?

You are like that inbred, retarded kid in Deliverance playing the banjo.

I've never said the rest of the world doesn't matter.........I also don't lie like a dog as you do.........

On one thread you are and Aussie.........another an American hero serving in our armed forces for 14 years.......

Splain your so easy to see LIES.................You are not Austrailia..........you are a Liar who can't even make up his mind which country you are from.

You are not really that intelligent I see Old Yeller.

But I will not put you down.

Americans can live in other countries.

If you are not a coward and pussy you get out about the world.

Question: why 14 years?
Just seems an odd number.... why not finish the 20 and get the retirement if you're gonna invest that much time?
Was it a medical retirement?
You get hurt?

That is an intelligent question.

And my answer is not all that intelligent.

I fell in love with an Aussie lady who made it clear she wanted to have children and wanted to live in Australia.

And so I did.

Best country in the world Australia, but still I often think of what might have been?

I don't want to knock true love or anything but a few more years and you could have been getting a check every month for the rest of your life.
Not big money, but it adds up.

And women are everywhere dude...... they're like the bus, just stand on the corner, one will come along.

Indeed when every I am paying bills I reflect on that.

I guess I am too romantic.

I have tried to destroy that habit with copious amounts of beer, which in Australia is amazing, but still that fool habit happens now and again.


Still life is what it is, I really do love Australia and would not have my son if I stayed in.

Swans beer was awesome a long time ago........do they still serve that there........Premium of Fosters.

Yeah they do, that is a West Australian beer where I live.

My favourate is Coopers Sparking. Bottle fermented, full flavour with a real kick to it at 5.8%.

Sorry about being an asshole toward you last night mate....too much Coopers.

I loved that Swans beer on tap..........was great .........we pulled into Freemantle.........our ship was damaged by Friendly fire............Rest of the Midway group went to Perth..........but Perth was a blast.

Now Tiger beer in Kenya........was the worst beer I've ever had in my life........like getting kicked by a mule iin the moring.

 

[Andylusion]

All masks get dirty. I don't see a single person using new masks every day.

Maybe that's why everyone you know got sick.

Newsflash...change your mask often and sanitize your hands after you take it off. Stay the hell away from people who don't live in your house with you.

If you go out to eat do NOT eat indoors...do not eat in an outdoor space with walls.(tents or whatever). I can't tell you the number of times i found an area too crowded and just walked away

It ain't rocket surgery.

I am in NY. Haven't gotten sick yet but then I'm ACTUALLY careful

Stay the hell away from people who don't live in your house with you.

I have. And I live alone. There is no one in my house that lives with me.

If you go out to eat do NOT eat indoors

I have not eaten inside a restaurant since March.

do not eat in an outdoor space with walls.(tents or whatever).

I have not.

So I followed all your rules, and still got sick. Didn't work.

I am in NY. Haven't gotten sick yet but then I'm ACTUALLY careful

You don't know that. I forget the actual numbers, but well over 95% of people who get Covid-19, are entirely asymptomatic. Meaning, they have zero symptoms of having it.

Unless you have been tested every week, to the present, and I doubt that.... you don't know if you've had it or not. People have said they have false negatives on anti-bodies for Covid-19. So you may even come back negative, and still have had Covid-19, without even knowing it.

 

[Mac1958]

How can anyone not know what the answers to these questions are?

Whether you agree with them or not, whether you think they're valid or not, how in the hell can you not know them?

He never went full commie with C-19 and Dems need commie.
But when he went commie-lite and banned all travel from China you twisted Loons complained that he went too commie...So which is it, which do you prefer...too commie or commie lite?

Triple commie!

 

[eagle1462010]

How can anyone not know what the answers to these questions are?

Whether you agree with them or not, whether you think they're valid or not, how in the hell can you not know them?

He never went full commie with C-19 and Dems need commie.
But when he went commie-lite and banned all travel from China you twisted Loons complained that he went too commie...So which is it, which do you prefer...too commie or commie lite?

Triple commie!

Your TRIBE killed again in Denver last night....

Splain why I should give a shit about your Tribe.......when the police in Denver have to protect a library and a arts museum......

Could you show me on the art piece where the statue HURT YOU......

Poor things...........so abused by books and statues.

 

[charwin95]

Bologna.

"The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively."

“Our study demonstrates how important it is for countries which are facing an imminent outbreak to proactively plan a coordinated response which swiftly tackles the spread of the disease on a number of fronts."

When this report came out we had very few cases, however anyone with at brain understood what it meant for us.

Furthermore we had 50 state responses not a comprehensive national one.

Early And Combined Interventions Crucial In Tackling Covid-19 Spread In China | University of Southampton

A study by the University of Southampton examining non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) in response to the new coronavirus (COVID-19) in China shows that a range of early, coordinated and targeted measures are needed to help significantly reduce its spread.

www.southampton.ac.uk

I request that you find a different country to make that claim on.

I don't believe China. The only time China is not lying, is when they are not saying anything.

This is a country that jailed the doctors who warned them about Covid-19 to begin with. They have complete control over the media, and there is non-government journalism at all.

This is like believing the child mortality rates in Cuba, when we know doctors simply refuse to report deaths because the government will fire them, and they'll end up sifting through garbage cans.

Or Venezuela claiming the unemployment rate is low, because 4 million people fled the country, so they are no longer counted as unemployed.

If you are going to trust the numbers from China, then you might as well assume everything Trump says is divine truth as well.

So what if China is and was lying? Is that supposed to be an excuse for Trump failures handling the Coronavirus?

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant. Here in US are fighting of stupid mask.

Well yes, actually. The basis of the argument is "see china did it better"... right but if they lied... then no they didn't.

The difference between us and the Chinese general populations. They heavily wear mask even inside their homes, even before the pandemic and very compliant

TRUE TRUE TRUE! Yes. Correct. You got it.

Do you not realize that you blew up your own position?

You stated the truth about China. Now.... can you think logically about the implications?

1. You are blaming Trump for that fact that culturally we are different than China. Do you think that if Obama was president right now, that everyone would magically become compliant slaves to the government?

Do you know why they are complaint slaves to the government in China? Because if they don't comply, they end up disappearing.

Is that what you want Trump to do? Start secret police, and making people disappear? Because that is in fact what you are advocating when you point to the "success of China on Covid".

But there is a second implication of your factually true statement.

2. Yes... *YES*... Chinese in China wear masks all the time. Very compliant as you said.

Do you not see a problem there? Can you not see it?

Chinese wear masks all the time. Very compliant. Follow all the government dictations.

Still don't see the problem? Where did Covid-19 originate?

Let's review shall we? China which has an extremely compliant population, where the government tosses people in jail for not complying, which has been wearing masks constantly.

Please explain how if mask wearing is so effective, how did Covid-19 even start in China, let alone become a pandemic? They were wearing masks for years before now, yet not only did Covid-19 start in China and killed thousands, but it spread world wide. Those masks and being compliant worked so well, didn't it?

And I never said we should follow Chinese government rules. All I said was we should do our own to protect ourselves and STOP and enough already to keep blaming China.

SO WHAT if it came from China? We should just keep playing dumb don’t wear your fucking mask hug people don’t worry about it? Because that is what you are trying to imply.

You can tell when people have lost their argument, when they stop arguing the evidence, and start screaming about what they think other people are implying.

So are you done here?

No I’m not done. I have to do something more important than hanging around here. What evidence have you provided?

I used your evidence. You provided the evidence, that I used against you.

YOU said the Chinese were wearing masks even before the out break. I agreed, and cited that as the logical reasoning that masks do not prevent Covid-19, because they did, then it should have never left China. They should never have had an outbreak to begin with.

Further, you pointed out that the Chinese have a different culture, one of compliance to a dangerous authoritarian regime, that jails doctors. I agreed, and cited that no matter who was in office, Trump or anyone else, that Americans would still be Americans, and that we wouldn't bend over to every single edict given by government.

You are asking for evidence of my position, when YOU gave the evidence of my position.

You are going in circles Andy. You used evidence what I told you. REALLY?

Let me repeat it again. PAY ATTENTION when Coronavirus outbreak in China started Chines in general don’t know what they have and don’t know what to do even with the mask. They used mask because of dirty air over and over....... PAY ATTENTION when it started they used the same attitude using mask over and over. By the time they know it’s dangerous it’s too late. What part of that don’t you understand.

That makes no sense. You are suggesting that masks only work, if they were not originally used because of dirty air? Now masks only work if your attitude is right?

They only work if you replace them over and over?

That's funny, because I don't know anyone anywhere, that is not using the same mask over and over. No one. The most hard core "must wear masks or the planet dies" people are all using the same mask over and over.

I'd be hard pressed to find a single person anywhere who is NOT using the same mask over and over.

If you really believe what you are saying, then I think you are nuts.

You are spinning and twisting around like a wet pretzel.
I told you over and over the mask behavior and attitude they have before the pandemic using dirty mask over and over for several days...... They also ban selling exotic animals for consumptions....... You don’t know anything about China.

Mask only now works because they are not using the same dirty mask over and over. Of course...... What part of that don’t you understand? They even wear mask inside their home. And I KNOW how you are going to come back with your rebuttal

You don’t know anyone NOT using the same mask over and over. I don’t. I replaced it twice a day depending how many times I go out. And I know several people and so are friends and families does do that.

You don’t know anyone NOT using same mask over and over. Are they using it over and over for several days?

Eight in 10 Americans wear mask. So you are the minority.

You don’t know any one NOT using the same mask over and over. That means they are using mask except you.

More Americans say they are regularly wearing masks in stores and other businesses

As the pandemic continues, a growing share of Americans say they are regularly wearing a face covering in stores and other businesses.

www.pewresearch.org

Eight in 10 Americans wear mask. So you are the minority.

What are you even talking about?

I've been wearing a mask since March. I'm in the minority of what? Once again, you have no point, and so you make up stuff.

Its actually quite funny. You haven't been able to make a single valid argument yet, but every post you start shrieking about how I'm "spinning and twisting around"... but then *YOU* are the one that has to make false accusations about the other person, to try and have a point?

Nah, if anyone is "spinning and twisting around" it's you.

You know nothing about me, yet claim I'm in the minority of Americans who don't wear masks?

I have followed every single guideline given about this Covid-19 crap. I have worn masks, socially distanced, and haven't gone to Church since March. My church still isn't open even now. (online church of course, but we haven't met at the Church building).

I have not used personal experience in our conversation, because the evidence alone is enough. The fact you have failed to refute a single point I've made, is proof the evidence alone is enough.

But, one of the reasons that I personally am convinced that all the mask wearing and social distancing, and lock downs are completely ineffective, and pointless.... is because I personally followed all of your guidelines, and so did everyone I know, and everyone still got sick.

I got sick. My parents got sick. My friends and neighbors got sick. My co-workers all got sick. Everyone I know got sick, and we all... ALL.... followed the mask wearing, lock downs, and social distancing guidelines.


*** If does that work? If you follow all the Covid-19 rules, and everyone still got sick.... explain?

You can't. I'm you'll blather on that we must not have followed all the rules, but know for a fact we did... and we still got sick.

So.... Yeah. But we don't need my personal experience. We can just look at the facts. None those rules have worked anywhere. None of them. And I realize you think your posts somehow contradicted my points... but that's because you obviously don't realize your posts contradicted nothing. You didn't. You keep saying the same utterly irrelevant statements, acting like you have a point, but you don't. None of them were valid counter arguments.

Sorry, but you are just wrong. None of those were good points. Or even valid. Either masks work or they don't. All masks get dirty. I don't see a single person using new masks every day.

Even the WHO said they don't recommend that healthy people wear masks, or that mask wearing is effective at all.

Rotten Bologna. You’ve been fighting using mask from the beginning NOW suddenly you are wearing mask then your relatives got sick. BULLSHIT Dude. I know you are loosing by using my own words against me.

You are LYING..... You said it over and over mask is NOT good. You are 100% anti mask. Do you expect me to believe that you really wore mask? Then SUDDENLY (now you are loosing) now you’ve used mask. Very funny. All anti mask are the minorities. That includes your lousy president.


Spinning? That is sad. I don’t spin anything, every single point I made, never did, talked to you straight to the point. You were using my own words to spin around. Sadly.

Of course I used own my experience. What do you expect? Suddenly you are now using your experience to make a point. Sadly.

According to you. I mean you. I failed to refute every single point you made. WRONG. I BLASTED you all the way over and over.

You got sick, your parents got sick, your neighbors got sick, your co workers ALL got sick. And they all wear mask. How many people is that? MY GOD..... GOOD LORD did you made god angry? Are you the center of epidemic? An (now you are using your experience) anti-mask talking? Do you expect me to believe that? Nah! I don’t believe you. Zero. Did you watched them at home or they have kids? I doubt it.

I can tell you alone that hispanics here in California they do wear mask when they go out or work but they still got sick and die. High percentage of Covid deaths here are hispanics. You know why? (Explanation) Most have crowded home and apartments with maximum or over capacity, using the same restrooms, too close and dont wear mask inside the house.

Trump’s orbit 12 or more people got sick non of them wear mask. Look at Trump’s rallies thousands don’t wear mask. How many of those do you think that got sick that they denied? How many of those do you think wear mask in their daily routine or at home?

I will ask you the same question again. If mask is not good the way you portrayed it. Then we should see thousands and thousands of doctors and nurses that got sick and die. Correct? So where are they? Explain that.

You are saying mask is not good anyway. So we should follow your belief don’t wear mask because it’s not good? Explain that.

According to you Andy. You don’t see a single person using new mask every day. Why? Because you don’t have experience or just plain not telling the truth. Are you saying that your co workers or you use the same mask every day they when they come to work? Really? Explain.


You said....I mean you Andy. Even WHO said they don’t recommend healthy people wear mask..... Can you prove that? Any link?

That’s the dumbest thing I ever heard. Because I’m healthy I should recklessly do not wear mask.... What if sat next, following, took over a sit of an infected person? What do you think the percentage of catching it with out mask? And why should I risk my health because of stupidity?


*** My explanation......
*** My explanation......
1. 8 out 10 wear mask. In 331+ US populations ...... Only 7 millions+so far got infected. If Americans didn’t wear mask you should see far higher than 7+ millions. Don’t you think?

2. If they followed. If they followed they still got sick. How do you even know that they really followed? Did they followed rules at home? Did they have kids running around? There are lots of factors that a person can get infected.

I asked you 4 questions here in this post. I expect an answer.