Taxing the rich, for dummies

[owebo]

This is the real tax rate distribution:

Broken down to state and federal taxes:

The one tax graph you really need to know

So, how many millions of people do the poor employ?

 

[mudwhistle]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

You assume the business of America is making and selling "stuff"

Hasn't been that way in decades. The business of America is money. Banks and finance moving money from one place to another and making immense profit while doing it

Everyone makes money off the transactions but the taxpayer. We have created a myth where we call these financial wizards "job creators" and exempt them from paying taxes on their profits. When they screw up, like they did in 2007 ad 2008, we come in and bail them out. We take the risk, they reap the profit




.

The screwup was the new Democrat controlled congress that took over in 2007. It's not a coincidence that it happened on their watch. And the bailout was just payoffs to banks and unions that helped elect Democrats and put them in positions of power. The recession helped the rich get richer and the Middle-class paid for it.

 

[AntonToo]

The screwup was the new Democrat controlled congress that took over in 2007. It's not a coincidence that it happened on their watch

Absolutely not a coincidence, because when they got into office they ummm..well they uhhh...

That's as far as the explanation of the causality ever goes.

 

[NYcarbineer]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

Why tax anyone then? If everyone can pass the cost of their taxes on to someone else, which seems to be some wacky rightwing theory,

why not just reduce all taxes to zero and watch the tax revenue roll in?

Why not just get rid of the income tax and tax consumption?

You mean a regressive tax that puts a higher burden on lower income Americans? Sure, throw gas on the fire.

 

[NYcarbineer]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

You assume the business of America is making and selling "stuff"

Hasn't been that way in decades. The business of America is money. Banks and finance moving money from one place to another and making immense profit while doing it

Everyone makes money off the transactions but the taxpayer. We have created a myth where we call these financial wizards "job creators" and exempt them from paying taxes on their profits. When they screw up, like they did in 2007 ad 2008, we come in and bail them out. We take the risk, they reap the profit




.

The screwup was the new Democrat controlled congress that took over in 2007. It's not a coincidence that it happened on their watch. And the bailout was just payoffs to banks and unions that helped elect Democrats and put them in positions of power. The recession helped the rich get richer and the Middle-class paid for it.

Not a coincidence? Then list the pieces of legislation that the Democrats passed that caused the recession.

 

[rightwinger]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

You assume the business of America is making and selling "stuff"

Hasn't been that way in decades. The business of America is money. Banks and finance moving money from one place to another and making immense profit while doing it

Everyone makes money off the transactions but the taxpayer. We have created a myth where we call these financial wizards "job creators" and exempt them from paying taxes on their profits. When they screw up, like they did in 2007 ad 2008, we come in and bail them out. We take the risk, they reap the profit




.

The screwup was the new Democrat controlled congress that took over in 2007. It's not a coincidence that it happened on their watch. And the bailout was just payoffs to banks and unions that helped elect Democrats and put them in positions of power. The recession helped the rich get richer and the Middle-class paid for it.

Except you can't exactly point to anything they did in 2007 to cause a collapse in just six months

 

[owebo]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

You assume the business of America is making and selling "stuff"

Hasn't been that way in decades. The business of America is money. Banks and finance moving money from one place to another and making immense profit while doing it

Everyone makes money off the transactions but the taxpayer. We have created a myth where we call these financial wizards "job creators" and exempt them from paying taxes on their profits. When they screw up, like they did in 2007 ad 2008, we come in and bail them out. We take the risk, they reap the profit




.

The screwup was the new Democrat controlled congress that took over in 2007. It's not a coincidence that it happened on their watch. And the bailout was just payoffs to banks and unions that helped elect Democrats and put them in positions of power. The recession helped the rich get richer and the Middle-class paid for it.

Except you can't exactly point to anything they did in 2007 to cause a collapse in just six months

You don't remember that summer? Huh....

 

[TooTall]

Well, a lot of the 1% are getting away with paying next to nothing while using our resources. Do you think that is fair? I think at the very least they should pay the stated amount that they should....

It is unfair for all the people that do pay their taxes.

I don't think it is at all fair.

"The top-earning 1 percent of Americans will pay nearly half of the federal income taxes for 2014, the largest share in at least three years, according to a study.

According to a projection from the non-partisan Tax Policy Center, the top 1 percent of Americans will pay 45.7 percent of the individual income taxes in 2014-up from 43 percent in 2013 and 40 percent in 2012 (the oldest period available)."

The top 1% don't get to use 45.7% of our resources. They are the one that should be pissed.

 

[Skull Pilot]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

Why tax anyone then? If everyone can pass the cost of their taxes on to someone else, which seems to be some wacky rightwing theory,

why not just reduce all taxes to zero and watch the tax revenue roll in?

Why not just get rid of the income tax and tax consumption?

You mean a regressive tax that puts a higher burden on lower income Americans? Sure, throw gas on the fire.

It puts the same burden on everyone
IOW the very definition of fair.

 

[rightwinger]

Well, a lot of the 1% are getting away with paying next to nothing while using our resources. Do you think that is fair? I think at the very least they should pay the stated amount that they should....

It is unfair for all the people that do pay their taxes.

I don't think it is at all fair.

"The top-earning 1 percent of Americans will pay nearly half of the federal income taxes for 2014, the largest share in at least three years, according to a study.

According to a projection from the non-partisan Tax Policy Center, the top 1 percent of Americans will pay 45.7 percent of the individual income taxes in 2014-up from 43 percent in 2013 and 40 percent in 2012 (the oldest period available)."

The top 1% don't get to use 45.7% of our resources. They are the one that should be pissed.

The top 1% profit off of our resources more than any other group

I use the interstate highway system to visit grandma once in a while. The 1% use it to move supplies and products quickly and cheaply

 

[AntonToo]

It puts the same burden on everyone
IOW the very definition of fair.

20% tax rate burden when you are barely making ends meet is NOT SAME as 20%tax rate burden on higher income and not the same when you have kids to support.

 

[mudwhistle]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

Why tax anyone then? If everyone can pass the cost of their taxes on to someone else, which seems to be some wacky rightwing theory,

why not just reduce all taxes to zero and watch the tax revenue roll in?

Why not just get rid of the income tax and tax consumption?

You mean a regressive tax that puts a higher burden on lower income Americans? Sure, throw gas on the fire.

Isn't that what Obama did day-one? Raising excise taxes on 9 different staple items like booze, smokes, and fast-food?

 

[mudwhistle]

August 11, 2016
Shocking data revision by feds: Americans’ wages dropped 4.2% instead of rising in the first quarter
By Thomas Lifson
Wages for Americans are dropping at a rapid rate, instead of rising as the feds had claimed. This shocking news – making President Obama’s claim that the economy has recovered from the great recession laughable – was buried in a report on second-quarter earnings and has barely registered in the nation’s media, which are anxious to elect Hillary Clinton.

Neil Munro of Breitbart summarizes the changes:

“Real hourly compensation decreased 0.4 percent after revision, rather than the previously-published increase of 4.2 percent,” the BLS admitted. Compensation also fell another 1.4 percent in the second quarter, from April to June, the BLS admitted in the same report. That’s 2 percent drop in wages since December.

Pay shrank 0.3 percent in 2013, rose a mere 1.1 percent in 2014, but rose a promising 2.7 percent in 2015, according to the BLS.

Based on the erroneous data, President Obama has been taking victory laps on the economy.

Productivity and Costs, Second Quarter 2016, Preliminary

 

[AntonToo]

Isn't that what Obama did day-one? Raising excise taxes on 9 different staple items like booze, smokes, and fast-food?

WTF?

No dummy, first thing he did was pass stimulus that included significant tax cuts for low income brackets.

 

[rightwinger]

August 11, 2016
Shocking data revision by feds: Americans’ wages dropped 4.2% instead of rising in the first quarter
By Thomas Lifson
Wages for Americans are dropping at a rapid rate, instead of rising as the feds had claimed. This shocking news – making President Obama’s claim that the economy has recovered from the great recession laughable – was buried in a report on second-quarter earnings and has barely registered in the nation’s media, which are anxious to elect Hillary Clinton.

Neil Munro of Breitbart summarizes the changes:

“Real hourly compensation decreased 0.4 percent after revision, rather than the previously-published increase of 4.2 percent,” the BLS admitted. Compensation also fell another 1.4 percent in the second quarter, from April to June, the BLS admitted in the same report. That’s 2 percent drop in wages since December.

Pay shrank 0.3 percent in 2013, rose a mere 1.1 percent in 2014, but rose a promising 2.7 percent in 2015, according to the BLS.

Based on the erroneous data, President Obama has been taking victory laps on the economy.

Productivity and Costs, Second Quarter 2016, Preliminary

I blame the "Job Creators"

 

[Skull Pilot]

It puts the same burden on everyone
IOW the very definition of fair.

20% tax rate burden when you are barely making ends meet is NOT SAME as 20%tax rate burden on higher income and not the same when you have kids to support.

Of course it is the same.

And where did you get t 20% from? Certainly not me.

A flat income tax would not have to be 20%
A consumption tax would not have to be 20% and some things like clothing and food and prescription drugs can be exempt from a consumption tax

 

[AntonToo]

It puts the same burden on everyone
IOW the very definition of fair.

20% tax rate burden when you are barely making ends meet is NOT SAME as 20%tax rate burden on higher income and not the same when you have kids to support.

Of course it is the same.

You are clearly not from planet Earth. It seems that's what it takes to buy into right wing economics.

 

[Slade3200]

For many years the Democrats told us about all the "benefits" off raising taxes,

talkin' 'bout how they're going to fill the pot holes, how you're going to see infrastructure when you drive around, and how veterans are going to get a new motor scooter.

After years, and years, and years of hearing this BS and watching the government waste money, people had enough of politicians who want to raise taxes.

The Democrats switched to scare tactics. If you don't raise taxes, the National Debt will go berserk and you won't get Social Security.

The government collected more money, the National debt STILL went berserk, and every year they threaten to reduce Social Security.

The public was still against the idea of raising taxes.

-----------------------------------

Some Democrat came up with a genius idea, say "raise taxes on the rich". like someone else is going to pay the tax hikes. The Democrats have completely given up on trying to convince people, raising taxes will be beneficial.

-----------------------------------

A business has a cell phone made in China for 5 bucks each. They bring them to America and they sell them for $200 each, by doing this they become extremely wealthy.

Nearly every rich person in America is invested in business one way or another.

The public allows some politician to raise taxes "on the rich"

Ask yourself , which scenario is more probable...

1) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call my personal assistant, downgrade my house from 30 million to 2 million, tell the management team they're getting a pay cut, and tell the investors they're getting a profit cut!"

or

2) A CEO says "They just raised taxes on our business!" , "Call the sales manager and tell him to raise the price of out phones , 20 bucks!"



Who really pays the "tax on the rich"?

Are you talking about raised taxes on the CEOs personal income or on the business? Two very different things.

 

[Slade3200]

August 11, 2016
Shocking data revision by feds: Americans’ wages dropped 4.2% instead of rising in the first quarter
By Thomas Lifson
Wages for Americans are dropping at a rapid rate, instead of rising as the feds had claimed. This shocking news – making President Obama’s claim that the economy has recovered from the great recession laughable – was buried in a report on second-quarter earnings and has barely registered in the nation’s media, which are anxious to elect Hillary Clinton.

Neil Munro of Breitbart summarizes the changes:

“Real hourly compensation decreased 0.4 percent after revision, rather than the previously-published increase of 4.2 percent,” the BLS admitted. Compensation also fell another 1.4 percent in the second quarter, from April to June, the BLS admitted in the same report. That’s 2 percent drop in wages since December.

Pay shrank 0.3 percent in 2013, rose a mere 1.1 percent in 2014, but rose a promising 2.7 percent in 2015, according to the BLS.

Based on the erroneous data, President Obama has been taking victory laps on the economy.

Productivity and Costs, Second Quarter 2016, Preliminary

Sincere question... Do you put 100% of the responsibility for wage growth on the Fed government or do you put any responsibility in the hands of our corporations and business owners? If so, how much responsibility do you attribute to each and what role do you think each plays?

 

[owebo]

August 11, 2016
Shocking data revision by feds: Americans’ wages dropped 4.2% instead of rising in the first quarter
By Thomas Lifson
Wages for Americans are dropping at a rapid rate, instead of rising as the feds had claimed. This shocking news – making President Obama’s claim that the economy has recovered from the great recession laughable – was buried in a report on second-quarter earnings and has barely registered in the nation’s media, which are anxious to elect Hillary Clinton.

Neil Munro of Breitbart summarizes the changes:

“Real hourly compensation decreased 0.4 percent after revision, rather than the previously-published increase of 4.2 percent,” the BLS admitted. Compensation also fell another 1.4 percent in the second quarter, from April to June, the BLS admitted in the same report. That’s 2 percent drop in wages since December.

Pay shrank 0.3 percent in 2013, rose a mere 1.1 percent in 2014, but rose a promising 2.7 percent in 2015, according to the BLS.

Based on the erroneous data, President Obama has been taking victory laps on the economy.

Productivity and Costs, Second Quarter 2016, Preliminary

Sincere question... Do you put 100% of the responsibility for wage growth on the Fed government or do you put any responsibility in the hands of our corporations and business owners? If so, how much responsibility do you attribute to each and what role do you think each plays?

In a good economy, neither.....wage growth is the sole responsibility of the individual and their value.

In the wage growth depression of the past 8 years, it's the .govs fault, more specifically Obama and his horrid economy.....