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Truth be told, even celebrating the birth of Jesus at Christmastime (i.e. late December) is nothing more than co-opting the traditional pagan celebration of the winter solstice, when the year turns. Lots of Christian holidays somehow managed to end up being celebrated at the same time that pagan/non-Christians celebrated...go figure!Lol, not every Christian religious holiday is about Jesus, doofus.Macey's did not define Thanksgiving Day, idjit, the Pilgrims and Abraham Lincoln did.Thanksgiving Day is the special day set aside to thank....GOD....for all the many blessings He has given us.[
What does God have to do with Thanksgiving? Or a gold sticky star?
Now what does that have to do with God?
I do not understand your question.
I'll believe Thanksgiving is a religious holiday when Maceys has a giant Jesus balloon.
Maceys has pilgrims and turkeys. No Jesus.
That is absolutely true, but I don't see how it matters now.Truth be told, even celebrating the birth of Jesus at Christmastime (i.e. late December) is nothing more than co-opting the traditional pagan celebration of the winter solstice, when the year turns. Lots of Christian holidays somehow managed to end up being celebrated at the same time that pagan/non-Christians celebrated...go figure!Lol, not every Christian religious holiday is about Jesus, doofus.Macey's did not define Thanksgiving Day, idjit, the Pilgrims and Abraham Lincoln did.Thanksgiving Day is the special day set aside to thank....GOD....for all the many blessings He has given us.
Now what does that have to do with God?
I do not understand your question.
I'll believe Thanksgiving is a religious holiday when Maceys has a giant Jesus balloon.
Maceys has pilgrims and turkeys. No Jesus.
30 years ago it would have been "obvious" that I was a Communist, now it's "obvious" I'm a Muslim because... because you find the common enemy, then you label anyone who disagrees with you with that label.
No, you're a Muslim because you claimed to be, and then did not deny it when given the chance.
Oh, I claim to be, do I?
Really. And where did you make this up from? Or was it when I claimed to be Muslim, Jewish and Buddhist at the same time?
Message #11.
So we should just impose religion on people then, because it's tradition. You don't like us waking you up at 5am with loud noise over speakers and forcing you to go to pray, then feck off and go to another country.
Well, OK.^^^ I am meaning there that if other things can be brought outside the home, religion can be brought outside the home too.
God bless you always!!!
Holly
P.S. Now do you get what I am saying here?
I loved the nativity play, the Christmas carols, the Christmas card making, the Christmas tree, and so on. My parents are atheists and I'm agnostic, but I still loved the stories about Jesus and the nativity and all the rest, and I still do. I don't think I want it all taken out of Christmas just because some people don't believe in it. There is little to take offence at in these traditions and they harm no-one, so I'd prefer them to stay, and those that don't like them need not attend.Well, you have a point there. Could get a bit time consuming, although I'm sure there are schools in Europe which do just that. I do find it sad to think of losing Christmas and Easter at school even though I'm not religious myself. They were lovely times of the year to be in school.They aren't being bullied and they are opting out if they want to. Can't change the whole system because some kids or people have different beliefs, and it would be grossly unfair to make them participate. That's the solution, rather than changing everything for the many to completely accommodate the few.I see education as something that should be done by smart people.
I know kids learn better when they're comfortable. Not when they're being bullied. Not when they're made to be singled out.
So, let's have Muslim stuff, Jewish stuff, Buddhist stuff etc, then anyone who wants to opt out can opt out.
Can't change the system? Why not just take religion out of schools, it doesn't belong in schools. School is for EDUCATION, not for fairy stories.
Christmas is a nice time of year. But why? Is it the religious, or is it just that people celebrate something? Having a "winter festival", no religious, with things that make it fun, present giving, decorations and the like, what's wrong with that? If kids want to have it as Christmas, then fine, but everyone should be allowed to partake in this, and unless the school is 100% of a faith, then it isn't going to happen.
No it was before you added in the other religions. It was when you referred to you and the adhan etc.30 years ago it would have been "obvious" that I was a Communist, now it's "obvious" I'm a Muslim because... because you find the common enemy, then you label anyone who disagrees with you with that label.
No, you're a Muslim because you claimed to be, and then did not deny it when given the chance.
Oh, I claim to be, do I?
Really. And where did you make this up from? Or was it when I claimed to be Muslim, Jewish and Buddhist at the same time?
I don't do jokes. I mean every word of what I say here. If everything else in the world does not have to be confined to the home, religion shouldn't have to be confined to the home either.Well, OK.^^^ I am meaning there that if other things can be brought outside the home, religion can be brought outside the home too.
God bless you always!!!
Holly
P.S. Now do you get what I am saying here?
And no, not really.
I guess you're a joker of one kind or another.
But, God bless anyway. Lol.
Voices raised only in praise of their lord, otherwise verboten.SInging is supposedly a no no too. Yet..they sing in church.Did they drink alcohol and dance?I grew up with Lutherans and Episcopalians-----mostly. The only holidays I saw were easter and Christmas and the only persons of importance were Jesus and
---Mary --------except Mary was more important for catholics----than she was for
Lutherans and Episcopalians. -----later on I stumbled into Baptists------who somehow did not play cards
You know why Baptists dont believe in sex while standing up? For fear it might lead to the sin of dancing.
I see what you're saying, FW, but the truth is it can be read both ways. I really think the most difficult attitudes to convey in writing on a message board are irony and sarcasm etc. And I still believe you need to try to moderate your emotional responses. And I'm not being anything other than earnest about that.30 years ago it would have been "obvious" that I was a Communist, now it's "obvious" I'm a Muslim because... because you find the common enemy, then you label anyone who disagrees with you with that label.
No, you're a Muslim because you claimed to be, and then did not deny it when given the chance.
Oh, I claim to be, do I?
Really. And where did you make this up from? Or was it when I claimed to be Muslim, Jewish and Buddhist at the same time?
Message #11.
I don't like insulting people, so I'm just going to talk about your actions. Stupidity that knows no bounds.
So we should just impose religion on people then, because it's tradition. You don't like us waking you up at 5am with loud noise over speakers and forcing you to go to pray, then feck off and go to another country.
Read it. READ IT. If you can't understand what is written, then don't reply.
I'm not going to explain it for people who fail to read it properly.
Apparently it matters to some people who equate such holidays strictly as Christian celebrations when, in fact, such celebrations predate Christianity by millennia. Why some folks take umbrage at so-called "Christian" holidays is beyond me.That is absolutely true, but I don't see how it matters now.Truth be told, even celebrating the birth of Jesus at Christmastime (i.e. late December) is nothing more than co-opting the traditional pagan celebration of the winter solstice, when the year turns. Lots of Christian holidays somehow managed to end up being celebrated at the same time that pagan/non-Christians celebrated...go figure!Lol, not every Christian religious holiday is about Jesus, doofus.Macey's did not define Thanksgiving Day, idjit, the Pilgrims and Abraham Lincoln did.I'll believe Thanksgiving is a religious holiday when Maceys has a giant Jesus balloon.
Maceys has pilgrims and turkeys. No Jesus.
I see what you're saying, FW, but the truth is it can be read both ways. I really think the most difficult attitudes to convey in writing on a message board are irony and sarcasm etc. And I still believe you need to try to moderate your emotional responses. And I'm not being anything other than earnest about that.30 years ago it would have been "obvious" that I was a Communist, now it's "obvious" I'm a Muslim because... because you find the common enemy, then you label anyone who disagrees with you with that label.
No, you're a Muslim because you claimed to be, and then did not deny it when given the chance.
Oh, I claim to be, do I?
Really. And where did you make this up from? Or was it when I claimed to be Muslim, Jewish and Buddhist at the same time?
Message #11.
I don't like insulting people, so I'm just going to talk about your actions. Stupidity that knows no bounds.
So we should just impose religion on people then, because it's tradition. You don't like us waking you up at 5am with loud noise over speakers and forcing you to go to pray, then feck off and go to another country.
Read it. READ IT. If you can't understand what is written, then don't reply.
I'm not going to explain it for people who fail to read it properly.
Growing up, admittedly a very long time ago, All the Pentecostals I knew said that these were pagan holidays and they were prohibited from observing them.We're Pentecostal and we celebrate all of the holidays and even more Holy Days.....feasts, etc...Well if you are talking about Protestants that only celebrate Jesus, generally you are talking about Protestant fundamentalists. The Seven Main Stream Protestant denominations, (Episcopalian, Presbyterian, Northern Baptists, Congregationalists, Methodists, Christian Church, and Lutherans) observe cultural holidays that are compatible with their own religious culture.huh??? well----catholics do have SAINT's days-------but in general---my impression from protestants I have known is----JESUS IS IT. Thanksgiving
is SUCCOTH---------a very nice story ------that of Jesus' great great.... grandma---
ruth and lover BOAZ
Only people I have ever known to be so centered on Jesus only that they would not observe other holidays were fundamentalists, 'primitive' evangelicals and some Pentecostals. That is a small fragment of the Church world wide.
Back in the times prior to a 365 day year calendar, easily identifiable dates such as the winter solstice and spring equinox were used by a g reat many different nations, not to steal holidays but to simply have the festival or religious event easily calculable.Apparently it matters to some people who equate such holidays strictly as Christian celebrations when, in fact, such celebrations predate Christianity by millennia. Why some folks take umbrage at so-called "Christian" holidays is beyond me.
I personally would not like to see Islamic holidays celebrated in regular schools. I'm not sure how this all works in the US, but in Europe there are muslim schools for families who want to stick with their beliefs and not be involved with anything other than Islamic rites and traditions. I would not want my children being exposed to the ceremonies of a religion that honours a man who waged war, married a nine year old, practiced deceit and murdered people. I might not be religious myself, but I do emphatically believe Jesus and his message is a much better example to expose children to. I don't really understand how anyone, other than a Muslim, could have a problem with that. I fully appreciate that you are going to despise this post. Sorry.I loved the nativity play, the Christmas carols, the Christmas card making, the Christmas tree, and so on. My parents are atheists and I'm agnostic, but I still loved the stories about Jesus and the nativity and all the rest, and I still do. I don't think I want it all taken out of Christmas just because some people don't believe in it. There is little to take offence at in these traditions and they harm no-one, so I'd prefer them to stay, and those that don't like them need not attend.Well, you have a point there. Could get a bit time consuming, although I'm sure there are schools in Europe which do just that. I do find it sad to think of losing Christmas and Easter at school even though I'm not religious myself. They were lovely times of the year to be in school.They aren't being bullied and they are opting out if they want to. Can't change the whole system because some kids or people have different beliefs, and it would be grossly unfair to make them participate. That's the solution, rather than changing everything for the many to completely accommodate the few.
So, let's have Muslim stuff, Jewish stuff, Buddhist stuff etc, then anyone who wants to opt out can opt out.
Can't change the system? Why not just take religion out of schools, it doesn't belong in schools. School is for EDUCATION, not for fairy stories.
Christmas is a nice time of year. But why? Is it the religious, or is it just that people celebrate something? Having a "winter festival", no religious, with things that make it fun, present giving, decorations and the like, what's wrong with that? If kids want to have it as Christmas, then fine, but everyone should be allowed to partake in this, and unless the school is 100% of a faith, then it isn't going to happen.
So you're not offended by it so it's okay?
What if you had Muslim holidays and went through all of that, would you be offended? Maybe not. But how many right wingers do you think WOULD BE offended by it?
This is the point. If people would not accept one thing, why should minorities be forced to accept the majority?
Again, does religion have a place in schools? Education is about learning REAL THINGS.
How about the minorities make other arrangements?I loved the nativity play, the Christmas carols, the Christmas card making, the Christmas tree, and so on. My parents are atheists and I'm agnostic, but I still loved the stories about Jesus and the nativity and all the rest, and I still do. I don't think I want it all taken out of Christmas just because some people don't believe in it. There is little to take offence at in these traditions and they harm no-one, so I'd prefer them to stay, and those that don't like them need not attend.Well, you have a point there. Could get a bit time consuming, although I'm sure there are schools in Europe which do just that. I do find it sad to think of losing Christmas and Easter at school even though I'm not religious myself. They were lovely times of the year to be in school.They aren't being bullied and they are opting out if they want to. Can't change the whole system because some kids or people have different beliefs, and it would be grossly unfair to make them participate. That's the solution, rather than changing everything for the many to completely accommodate the few.
So, let's have Muslim stuff, Jewish stuff, Buddhist stuff etc, then anyone who wants to opt out can opt out.
Can't change the system? Why not just take religion out of schools, it doesn't belong in schools. School is for EDUCATION, not for fairy stories.
Christmas is a nice time of year. But why? Is it the religious, or is it just that people celebrate something? Having a "winter festival", no religious, with things that make it fun, present giving, decorations and the like, what's wrong with that? If kids want to have it as Christmas, then fine, but everyone should be allowed to partake in this, and unless the school is 100% of a faith, then it isn't going to happen.
So you're not offended by it so it's okay?
What if you had Muslim holidays and went through all of that, would you be offended? Maybe not. But how many right wingers do you think WOULD BE offended by it?
This is the point. If people would not accept one thing, why should minorities be forced to accept the majority?
Again, does religion have a place in schools? Education is about learning REAL THINGS.
What I meant is that when Christianity spread there is no doubt that the evangelists at the time made use of existing pagan holidays and melded things together. I don't think that matters to Christians today, and I would be surprised if it mattered to God, if s/he exists.Apparently it matters to some people who equate such holidays strictly as Christian celebrations when, in fact, such celebrations predate Christianity by millennia. Why some folks take umbrage at so-called "Christian" holidays is beyond me.That is absolutely true, but I don't see how it matters now.Truth be told, even celebrating the birth of Jesus at Christmastime (i.e. late December) is nothing more than co-opting the traditional pagan celebration of the winter solstice, when the year turns. Lots of Christian holidays somehow managed to end up being celebrated at the same time that pagan/non-Christians celebrated...go figure!Lol, not every Christian religious holiday is about Jesus, doofus.Macey's did not define Thanksgiving Day, idjit, the Pilgrims and Abraham Lincoln did.
Maceys has pilgrims and turkeys. No Jesus.
Apparently it matters to some people who equate such holidays strictly as Christian celebrations when, in fact, such celebrations predate Christianity by millennia. Why some folks take umbrage at so-called "Christian" holidays is beyond me.That is absolutely true, but I don't see how it matters now.Truth be told, even celebrating the birth of Jesus at Christmastime (i.e. late December) is nothing more than co-opting the traditional pagan celebration of the winter solstice, when the year turns. Lots of Christian holidays somehow managed to end up being celebrated at the same time that pagan/non-Christians celebrated...go figure!Lol, not every Christian religious holiday is about Jesus, doofus.Macey's did not define Thanksgiving Day, idjit, the Pilgrims and Abraham Lincoln did.
Maceys has pilgrims and turkeys. No Jesus.
There is something we agree on, FW, school should be about learning 'real' things. But I'm not sure that little episodes at Christmas and Easter necessarily hamper that. Of course, if schools had to accommodate every religion on the map, 'real' things could begin to take a back seat.I loved the nativity play, the Christmas carols, the Christmas card making, the Christmas tree, and so on. My parents are atheists and I'm agnostic, but I still loved the stories about Jesus and the nativity and all the rest, and I still do. I don't think I want it all taken out of Christmas just because some people don't believe in it. There is little to take offence at in these traditions and they harm no-one, so I'd prefer them to stay, and those that don't like them need not attend.Well, you have a point there. Could get a bit time consuming, although I'm sure there are schools in Europe which do just that. I do find it sad to think of losing Christmas and Easter at school even though I'm not religious myself. They were lovely times of the year to be in school.They aren't being bullied and they are opting out if they want to. Can't change the whole system because some kids or people have different beliefs, and it would be grossly unfair to make them participate. That's the solution, rather than changing everything for the many to completely accommodate the few.
So, let's have Muslim stuff, Jewish stuff, Buddhist stuff etc, then anyone who wants to opt out can opt out.
Can't change the system? Why not just take religion out of schools, it doesn't belong in schools. School is for EDUCATION, not for fairy stories.
Christmas is a nice time of year. But why? Is it the religious, or is it just that people celebrate something? Having a "winter festival", no religious, with things that make it fun, present giving, decorations and the like, what's wrong with that? If kids want to have it as Christmas, then fine, but everyone should be allowed to partake in this, and unless the school is 100% of a faith, then it isn't going to happen.
So you're not offended by it so it's okay?
What if you had Muslim holidays and went through all of that, would you be offended? Maybe not. But how many right wingers do you think WOULD BE offended by it?
This is the point. If people would not accept one thing, why should minorities be forced to accept the majority?
Again, does religion have a place in schools? Education is about learning REAL THINGS.
