The 50 most developed countries in the world and Universal Healthcare.

[Crixus]

I’ll never forget old man explaining why he did all he did to get us here. He worked in a tire shop in Scotland, and traveled to Alaska to can fish. He ended up at port Hueneme partying with Seabees. He really liked Americans. He liked the potentials to earn, and finally, he had an impacted tooth that made him very sick. He was fixed in three days.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Explain how our ranking in life expectancy is related to our health care system?

Healthcare saves lives which naturally increases the average life expectancy in a country.

Except it doesn't work that way. The reason American life expectancy is less than many of our counterparts is we have higher rates of automobile fatalities, we have higher rates of death due to poor eating habits and lack of exercise (Americans are fat and lazy) and we have higher rates of drug related deaths. None of that has anything to do with our health care system. It has to do with poor cultural habits.

With Universal Healthcare, people would have better access to doctors, nurses and others that could give advise and help with the conditions you describe. It would have a dramatic effect on U.S. life expectancy. The reason U.S. life expectancy is low, is that it gets brought down by those who live in poverty or near the poverty level and don't have access to low cost quality food and healthcare. It makes a huge differences in the averages and is why the United States continues to lag behind so many other countries in the developed world in life expectancy.

The evidence is obvious. Universal Healthcare would benefit millions of people in the lower class and in poverty in the United States. It would improve U.S. life expectancy and standard of living. Its the right, moral thing to do for people and the country as a whole will benefit. Yet, because some people are blinded by outdated ideology, they will not support the common sense thing to do to help people.

Asserting that something is a fact does not constitute evidence of anything except that YOU think so.

Try PROVING that healthcare is the cause of life expectancy rates, that "universal healthcare" will produce the effects you claim, pretty much prove anything you've asserted.

FACT: People in countries with Universal Healthcare on average live longer than people in countries without Universal Healthcare.

Its immoral in the wealthiest country in the world, to not provide healthcare for every citizen.

Fact: Ignoring a post and restating your opinion as a fact doesn't make it a fact, but it DOES make you look like a lying partisan who has been treated with far more respect and courtesy than he deserves.

Fact: You don't determine what's best for other people, and you sure as shit don't determine morality for them.

Fact: If I said the law should be changed based on MY personal view of immorality, your panties would be bunched so far up your ass that you'd be tasting cotton.

Fact: Nothing that has spewed from your piehole is anything but your opinion.

 

[g5000]

Universal health care is coming to the US. It's just a matter of time.

You know why?

Because the GOP has never offered a comprehensive solution to skyrocketing health care costs.

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

 

[Cecilie1200]

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-co...dians-increasingly-come-to-us-for-health-care


Crossing the Border for Care
Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.



Why do they come here if it’s so good in Canada ? Are you just not going to answer? Name a country and people from that country come here to receive treatment for cancer and major illnesses. Why?

Its the assumption that the wealthiest country in the world has the best healthcare. The same assumption that drives people to go the hospital as best in the country. The reality though is much different.

Were not talking about the few with money who choose to travel because they believe something is better. Were talking about average life expectancy in each country and which countries are providing their citizens with Universal Healthcare. Most Europeans do not go to America to get healthcare. They stay in their countries and on average live longer than Americans. That last fact is by FAR the most relevant.

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

You are right. Those little examples true or not are irrelevent to you because you haven’t had to address them yet, or you have enough money that it’s just not an issue to you. Same for all the rich people in Europe, Canada or wherever you want. When the crap hits the fan they come here to the US for major treatments. If this is so awesome, who don’t American polititions enter the program with the rest of us? And why don’t rich people in Europe go into their government health care systems?

The vast majority of people, rich or poor, in Europe, use their own countries healthcare. On average they live longer than Americans. Were talking about National policy here. What is best for the most people. We can't bend a national policy for 300 million people because it might be better for this particular individual or that particular individual. We have to do what is best for the country as a whole.

You're lying, and you know you're lying.

Know how I can tell? Because you make statements without proof, and when you're asked to prove them, you just stuff your fingers in your ears and say them again.

If your bullshit was worth anything, you wouldn't have to lie about it.

 

[g5000]

Seventy percent of Americans support 'Medicare for all' in new poll

 

[Cecilie1200]

The common sense thing? 2005 I needed drugs. The drug was an injectable. It was four shots a month, one month supply cost $1,750 bucks per month. The pills I took with the shot cost $375 a month. On Obama care it’s $120+- plus any specialist. I payed nothing for that and no, I didn’t get medicade, I made to much money. I went to the drug company, provided a W2 and I got all those drugs for free. Today, I take drugs for my lungs. Those are $460 a month. Since polititions in Washington who still get the best private insurance tax payers can provide messed with healthcare, drug companies no longer have these programs. If you like it so much move where they have it. If you already live in a place that has it, keep it.

Sorry, but the facts of life expectancy and Universal Healthcare coverage show that the United States would benefit from a system of Universal Healthcare. Europeans have it, they live longer on average than Americans. That's an indisputable fact.

Unless they are being run over by a Box Truck in Nice France, or beheaded by a Muslim in London? Then you have to wait 6 months or more to get into their emergency rooms to see if they can help you, and if they cant, you get 2 aspirin and are told to go home and die..

If that were the case, they would have a MUCH lower life expectancy. They don't. ITs higher.

Then go there. Live longer.

I want Americans to live longer, better, healthier lives. The patriotic thing to do then, is to fight for Universal Healthcare in the United States since that will improve the country's standard of living, life expectancy, etc.

Liar. Everything you say is a lie, coming from someone who deludes himself that his standards are something other people give a fuck about meeting.

Ask me if I give a shit about being "patriotic" according to the definitions of a lying propaganda tool. Ask me if I want anything that would be defined as an "improvement" by the likes of you.

Ask me if I respect and trust a single lying word out of your mouth.

 

[g5000]

Its the assumption that the wealthiest country in the world has the best healthcare. The same assumption that drives people to go the hospital as best in the country. The reality though is much different.

Were not talking about the few with money who choose to travel because they believe something is better. Were talking about average life expectancy in each country and which countries are providing their citizens with Universal Healthcare. Most Europeans do not go to America to get healthcare. They stay in their countries and on average live longer than Americans. That last fact is by FAR the most relevant.

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

You are right. Those little examples true or not are irrelevent to you because you haven’t had to address them yet, or you have enough money that it’s just not an issue to you. Same for all the rich people in Europe, Canada or wherever you want. When the crap hits the fan they come here to the US for major treatments. If this is so awesome, who don’t American polititions enter the program with the rest of us? And why don’t rich people in Europe go into their government health care systems?

The vast majority of people, rich or poor, in Europe, use their own countries healthcare. On average they live longer than Americans. Were talking about National policy here. What is best for the most people. We can't bend a national policy for 300 million people because it might be better for this particular individual or that particular individual. We have to do what is best for the country as a whole.

You're lying, and you know you're lying.

Know how I can tell? Because you make statements without proof, and when you're asked to prove them, you just stuff your fingers in your ears and say them again.

If your bullshit was worth anything, you wouldn't have to lie about it.

You can see for yourself that 42 countries have longer average life expectancies than we do: Life Expectancy for Countries

France, Germany, Great Britain, Italy, Canada, Ireland, Spain, Norway, Finland, Netherlands...

 

[Crixus]

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

You are right. Those little examples true or not are irrelevent to you because you haven’t had to address them yet, or you have enough money that it’s just not an issue to you. Same for all the rich people in Europe, Canada or wherever you want. When the crap hits the fan they come here to the US for major treatments. If this is so awesome, who don’t American polititions enter the program with the rest of us? And why don’t rich people in Europe go into their government health care systems?

The vast majority of people, rich or poor, in Europe, use their own countries healthcare. On average they live longer than Americans. Were talking about National policy here. What is best for the most people. We can't bend a national policy for 300 million people because it might be better for this particular individual or that particular individual. We have to do what is best for the country as a whole.

You're lying, and you know you're lying.

Know how I can tell? Because you make statements without proof, and when you're asked to prove them, you just stuff your fingers in your ears and say them again.

If your bullshit was worth anything, you wouldn't have to lie about it.

You can see for yourself that 43 countries have longer average life expectancies than we do: Life Expectancy for Countries

Probably. Do they consume tobacco, alcohol and illicit drugs like Americans do? Lots of stuff factors into stats for anything and everything. This debate here is opinion backed by facts we choose to support our individual points. Fact is, many other countries most wealthy supporters of government health care come here to be treated for serious illnesses. American rich people and political elite don’t use the exchange. They don’t because they know it sucks.

 

[g5000]

We currently spend $3.5 trillion a year on health care: Historical - Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services


That's $35 trillion over ten years, and will probably be even more than that since health care costs have been skyrocketing for decades.

So to whine that UHC would cost $32 trillion over ten years...

Yeah...

 

[Redfish]

Universal health care is coming to the US. It's just a matter of time.

You know why?

Because the GOP has never offered a comprehensive solution to skyrocketing health care costs.

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

70% probably support free booze too. Everyone likes free stuff, but the hard cold truth is that nothing is free. Do you really want your medical care decided by a marginally intelligent GS5 sitting in a cubicle in bangla desh? Because that's what you are asking for, and if you don't think the admin of it would be outsourced you are dumber than I thought.

 

[g5000]

Universal health care is coming to the US. It's just a matter of time.

You know why?

Because the GOP has never offered a comprehensive solution to skyrocketing health care costs.

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

70% probably support free booze too. Everyone likes free stuff, but the hard cold truth is that nothing is free. Do you really want your medical care decided by a marginally intelligent GS5 sitting in a cubicle in bangla desh? Because that's what you are asking for, and if you don't think the admin of it would be outsourced you are dumber than I thought.

Can you show me which UHC countries outsource their health care decisions to Bangladesh?

Thanks.

Also, do you think insurance companies don't make the exact same cost decisions? If not, then I think we all know who the idiot here is.

 

[Redfish]

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

You are right. Those little examples true or not are irrelevent to you because you haven’t had to address them yet, or you have enough money that it’s just not an issue to you. Same for all the rich people in Europe, Canada or wherever you want. When the crap hits the fan they come here to the US for major treatments. If this is so awesome, who don’t American polititions enter the program with the rest of us? And why don’t rich people in Europe go into their government health care systems?

The vast majority of people, rich or poor, in Europe, use their own countries healthcare. On average they live longer than Americans. Were talking about National policy here. What is best for the most people. We can't bend a national policy for 300 million people because it might be better for this particular individual or that particular individual. We have to do what is best for the country as a whole.

You're lying, and you know you're lying.

Know how I can tell? Because you make statements without proof, and when you're asked to prove them, you just stuff your fingers in your ears and say them again.

If your bullshit was worth anything, you wouldn't have to lie about it.

You can see for yourself that 42 countries have longer average life expectancies than we do: Life Expectancy for Countries

France, Germany, Great Britain, Italy, Canada, Ireland, Spain, Norway, Finland, Netherlands...

take illegals and abortion out of the calculation for the US, and we are at the top.

 

[Rustic]

Universal health care is coming to the US. It's just a matter of time.

You know why?

Because the GOP has never offered a comprehensive solution to skyrocketing health care costs.

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

Lol
Where did you get that number from? And even if it was true what about the millions of Americans that want no part of it?

You will not find a single real conservative that wants any part a Medicare for all, you stupid ass motherfucker... shut the fuck up

 

[Redfish]

Universal health care is coming to the US. It's just a matter of time.

You know why?

Because the GOP has never offered a comprehensive solution to skyrocketing health care costs.

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

70% probably support free booze too. Everyone likes free stuff, but the hard cold truth is that nothing is free. Do you really want your medical care decided by a marginally intelligent GS5 sitting in a cubicle in bangla desh? Because that's what you are asking for, and if you don't think the admin of it would be outsourced you are dumber than I thought.

Can you show me which UHC countries outsource their health care decisions to Bangladesh?


Thanks.

can you tell me which of those countries have 330,000,000 people and 20 million illegals? Comparing the US to Norway is like comparing a mouse to an elephant.

 

[Crixus]

Seventy percent of Americans support 'Medicare for all' in new poll

Hell, so would I, but when they find out it isn’t free?

 

[g5000]

I'm opposed to UHC, by the way. I've made that very clear over the years. I have also taken great pains many times to describe what I believe we need to do to reform health care and have LESS government in our health care.

Unfortunately, I have done more than the Republican party in this respect. Because the Republicans have done NOTHING. For DECADES.

And that is why we are going to end up with UHC sooner or later.

The dumb rubes were fucking stupid enough to bleev the GOP's horseshit that they would repeal and replace Obamacare if they were given all the power. Then, once the rubes gave the GOP all the power, the stupid fucks STILL didn't catch on they were hoaxed when the Republicans once again did NOTHING. They never even wrote a bill to repeal Obamacare, much less replace it.

So the dumb fucking cucks deserve UHC.

 

[g5000]

That's right, over 50% of Americans support Universal Healthcare. Universal Healthcare is coming to the United States whether these anti-healthcare types like it or not.

That's wrong.

Actually, 70 percent of Americans support Medicare for all.

70% probably support free booze too. Everyone likes free stuff, but the hard cold truth is that nothing is free. Do you really want your medical care decided by a marginally intelligent GS5 sitting in a cubicle in bangla desh? Because that's what you are asking for, and if you don't think the admin of it would be outsourced you are dumber than I thought.

Can you show me which UHC countries outsource their health care decisions to Bangladesh?


Thanks.

can you tell me which of those countries have 330,000,000 people and 20 million illegals? Comparing the US to Norway is like comparing a mouse to an elephant.

What does the size of the population have to do with anything?

Man, that's one of the lamest dodges I've ever seen!

 

[Crixus]

I'm opposed to UHC, by the way. I've made that very clear over the years. I have also taken great pains many times to describe what I believe we need to do to reform health care and have LESS government in our health care.

Unfortunately, I have done more than the Republican party in this respect. Because the Republicans have done NOTHING. For DECADES.

And that is why we are going to end up with UHC sooner or later.

The dumb rubes were fucking stupid enough to bleev the GOP's horseshit that they would repeal and replace Obamacare if they were given all the power. Then, once the rubes gave the GOP all the power, the stupid fucks STILL didn't catch on they were hoaxed when the Republicans once again did NOTHING. They never even wrote a bill to repeal Obamacare, much less replace it.

So the dumb fucking cucks deserve UHC.

Pretty much you are right.

 

[g5000]

60 Republican repeals of Obamacare when they knew their repeal would be vetoed by Obama.

Then, once they had a huckster Republican in the White House, the Republicans didn't write ONE repeal of Obamacare in two years!

How fucking stupid of a dumb fucking cuck do you have to be to not catch on you've been hoaxed?

Seriously.

 

[forkup]

Its the assumption that the wealthiest country in the world has the best healthcare. The same assumption that drives people to go the hospital as best in the country. The reality though is much different.

Were not talking about the few with money who choose to travel because they believe something is better. Were talking about average life expectancy in each country and which countries are providing their citizens with Universal Healthcare. Most Europeans do not go to America to get healthcare. They stay in their countries and on average live longer than Americans. That last fact is by FAR the most relevant.

Let me ask you this:

Timely Medical | Timely Surgery at Affordable Prices

This is a company. It's a company operating out of Canada. The entire purpose of this company, is to setup patient, primarily in Canada, with doctors and hospitals in the US.

They charge money, obviously to provide this service.
This is an additional charge to the cost of getting whatever treatment or surgery they get in the US.

The company was started by a Canadian doctor, who was fed up watching patients die while waiting.

So my question to you is this.....

Canada has universal care, that is "free". Please explain to me how Timely medical can find enough consistent flow of customers, willing to pay thousands of dollars for surgery in the US, and to pay them to set them up for that surgery.... if those same customers can all get surgery for 'free'?

If government run health care is so great in Canada, how can this company started by a Canadian doctor, end up with thousands of customers every year willing to pay for health care? How can they find enough people willing to spend thousands of dollar for health care, to escape their Canadian system if it is so great?

Can you explain that to me?

Don't have to. These little individual examples, whether they are true or not, are irrelevant. What matters is the overall averages on life expectancy and the countries that provide Universal Healthcare. Look FRANCE, GERMANY, SWEDEN, NORWAY, ITALY etc. Most people in the top 50 most developed countries in the world stay in their own countries when it comes to healthcare. At least 34 of those countries citizens live longer than Americans on average. One's personal experience, or some off hand example will not change that reality.

You are right. Those little examples true or not are irrelevent to you because you haven’t had to address them yet, or you have enough money that it’s just not an issue to you. Same for all the rich people in Europe, Canada or wherever you want. When the crap hits the fan they come here to the US for major treatments. If this is so awesome, who don’t American polititions enter the program with the rest of us? And why don’t rich people in Europe go into their government health care systems?

The vast majority of people, rich or poor, in Europe, use their own countries healthcare. On average they live longer than Americans. Were talking about National policy here. What is best for the most people. We can't bend a national policy for 300 million people because it might be better for this particular individual or that particular individual. We have to do what is best for the country as a whole.

Not how it works here. And the fact remains, when wealthy people in Europe are told “no” the come here. Poor people in Europe have to deal with it. Cool, people in Europe live longer, but tell that to a dude who has been told they need an organ transplant and they will likely die before they get one, or that they are to old to be considered for one. It like you say, our health care system sucks, yet our crappy healthcare system manages to be number 4 on a list of why people immigrate here. Why?


Why people migrate: 11 surprising reasons

Undoubtedly there are some treatments that the US gives access to, which are less available in other countries. On the other hand the reverse is also true. I'm European, my wife's American. Unlike you, I have actual first hand experience in both healthcare and social systems. Are you willing to make an actual comparison?