The Fallacy of Forcing Higher Wages

[The Rabbi]

Is there any benefit to forcing companies to provide a safe work environment or not pollute? Why not companies decide whether or not they can make more money by deciding those issues for themselves?

Those regulations like most government involvement have gone overboard and are costing companies far more than are necessary. How about addressing what I said instead of trying to change the subject?

If corporations are willing to employ Chinese factory workers for 50 cents an hour, then they're certainly willing to employ Americans at the same wages;

all they need to accomplish that is the removal of impediments to market forces being allowed to work,

and some time.

Is that what you really want for this country?

They would certainly like to pay 50 cents an hour. You'd like to earn $100/hr. Neither side gets what it wants. The get what they can.
I was assuming for the sake of argument you actually worked. I know better of course.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

Is there any benefit to forcing companies to provide a safe work environment or not pollute? Why not companies decide whether or not they can make more money by deciding those issues for themselves?

Good point!

Not a great point at all, it was an attempt to change the subject. It's called a deflection, he had no point to answer my on topic points.

Lol. I know. Sometimes liberals run smack dab into the truth and ya gotta acknowledge it. Let businesses decide. They will do the right thing when it make good business sense.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

I have come to the side that raising the minimum wage wouldn't be a bad worse thing that could happen.
(1) We have real world examples of $15 being the starting McDonald's wage in North Dakota and the price of ND McDonald's food is less than it is in Chicago. I guarantee ND doesn't have a 100th of the traffic Chicago has. ND has gone to machines. Lack of worker than the workers have the power.
(2) The conservative argument is if wages increase then those jobs will be replaced by machines. It's a flawed argument. If the fast food industry could replace people with machines so easily they would have done it a while ago. Same with shipping the drive through to India.
(3) Ith won't effect manufacturing. Manufacturing and assembly already pays a ton more than $15 an hour.
(4) Loss of jobs. I don't buy that argument either. It is most service jobs that are at the minimum wage level. These jobs can't be outsourced or they already would have been. Maybe some downsizing, but not the do and gloom many of see.

I wouldn't have as drastic effect as conservatives make it out to be. I personally think they should trade a $13 minimum wage for draconian immigration reform. By draconian one that starts with a 3 layer border fence, the national guard on the border, eVerify and well becomes an all out war on illegal immigration. Won't happen with this President.



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A robot could just as easily say "have a nice day" instead of a meaningful "thank you for eating here so I can have a job", when serving my food.

 

[MaxGrit]

Is there any benefit to forcing companies to provide a safe work environment or not pollute? Why not companies decide whether or not they can make more money by deciding those issues for themselves?

Those regulations like most government involvement have gone overboard and are costing companies far more than are necessary. How about addressing what I said instead of trying to change the subject?

If corporations are willing to employ Chinese factory workers for 50 cents an hour, then they're certainly willing to employ Americans at the same wages;

all they need to accomplish that is the removal of impediments to market forces being allowed to work,

and some time.

Is that what you really want for this country?

Free market is different than pseudo-free market.

 

[Erand7899]

An argument we often see here from the lib side is that if businesses would raise wages, their employees would be able to afford to buy their products, increasing sales and paying for itself. They often point to Ford, who offered much higher wages, supposedly to allow his workers to buy his automobiles.

.

That argument is frequently made here? Isn't the real argument made that increasing wages increases overall consumption, thus benefiting our consumer driven economy overall?

That is also a false argument. Wages cannot be increased without costs being raised, and that causes prices to rise. The worker makes more, and pays more, and his/her standard of living does not change. The economy does not improve much because much of what consumers buy is made overseas, and that is where the economic improvement takes place.

The correct term for this theory is wage inflation. Workers today make five times what their parents made, and don't live one damn bit better. Everything costs five times what it did then.

Usually, wage inflation takes place when the unemployment rate drops below four percent, and businesses have to pay higher wages to attract and keep quality workers. The liberal/socialists want to do the same thing through government fiat.

 

[OKTexas]

I have come to the side that raising the minimum wage wouldn't be a bad worse thing that could happen.
(1) We have real world examples of $15 being the starting McDonald's wage in North Dakota and the price of ND McDonald's food is less than it is in Chicago. I guarantee ND doesn't have a 100th of the traffic Chicago has. ND has gone to machines. Lack of worker than the workers have the power.
(2) The conservative argument is if wages increase then those jobs will be replaced by machines. It's a flawed argument. If the fast food industry could replace people with machines so easily they would have done it a while ago. Same with shipping the drive through to India.
(3) Ith won't effect manufacturing. Manufacturing and assembly already pays a ton more than $15 an hour.
(4) Loss of jobs. I don't buy that argument either. It is most service jobs that are at the minimum wage level. These jobs can't be outsourced or they already would have been. Maybe some downsizing, but not the do and gloom many of see.

I wouldn't have as drastic effect as conservatives make it out to be. I personally think they should trade a $13 minimum wage for draconian immigration reform. By draconian one that starts with a 3 layer border fence, the national guard on the border, eVerify and well becomes an all out war on illegal immigration. Won't happen with this President.



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You have learned absolutely nothing from this thread, the Mcdonalds paying 15 per hour in ND are only in the area of the oil boom. Labor there for everything is scarce and wages are up in just that area. That is the way the market works.

 

[The Rabbi]

Washington State. Highest Minimum wage in country going through economic boom. I really don't know how many times republicans must be shown their beliefs are BS but it sure is fun doing so.

Correlation is not causation.
/fail.

Facts scare you I know...its ok to admit it.

Yes, the fact is that you cannot point to one factor as a cause of another. This is logic, a field you clearly have no knowledge of.

Washington state is 29th in unemployment. Well behind many otehr states with lower min wages, like Vermont. Imagine what their UE rate would be if they didnt have such a high min wage?

 

[The Rabbi]

Washington State's April unemployment rate decreases again; down to 6.1% - Tacoma Career Management | Examiner.com

Its sinking lower and lower.

Along with most states as the job market recovers, tepidly. So what? Correlation is not causation.