The Official Discussion Thread for who is considered indiginous to Palestine?

[MJB12741]

Shusha has been asking about this and as biblical stories are central to the zionist narrative, I thought I'd give it a shot. Does this offer the Palestinian people any hope? I guess it depends if we can put science ahead of biblical tales, thus being able to change the narrative... and no, not an easy ask.

Back in 2002, two archeologists, Israel Finkelstein from Israel and Neil Asher Silberman from America, but who studied archeology at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, published a book that had the zionists going crazy because both of these men were highly respected in their field.
Israel Finkelstein - Wikipedia
Neil Asher Silberman - Wikipedia

What is strange is that this was not the first time that this information had been published. Their work actually replicated prior work that was done by another Israeli, Ze'ev Herzog, who published many of the same findings in 1999.

So, what are these findings and why did the zionists become enraged?

Herzog cites evidence supporting that "the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is the fact that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the god of Israel, Jehovah, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai".
Ze'ev Herzog - Wikipedia

...many of the most famous stories in the Bible—the wanderings of the patriarchs, the Exodus from Egypt, Joshua’s conquest of Canaan, and David and Solomon’s vast empire—reflect the world of the later authors rather than actual historical facts...
https://www.amazon.com/Bible-Unearthed-Archaeologys-Vision-Ancient/dp/0684869136&tag=ff0d01-20

Food for thought?

Well, you see Abi, the Bible is just a book of fairy tales, written by Jews & Christians. And if don't believe me, just ask any Palestinian supporter.

 

[Shusha]

Sigh, abi. What is your goal here? To "prove" that the Jewish people have no history and no homeland?

There is mountains of evidence that the Jewish people originated on that territory and have lived in it ever since. Anyone with a bone of honesty in them would know that. Out of curiosity, what evidence would you accept as "proof" of the Jewish people's history in that land? Because it certainly appears so far that you are willing to stick your fingers in your ears and babble, "I can't hear you" and completely ignore reality. What would it take, then, for you to acknowledge Jewish history in that land?

 

[Hollie]

Shusha has been asking about this and as biblical stories are central to the zionist narrative, I thought I'd give it a shot. Does this offer the Palestinian people any hope? I guess it depends if we can put science ahead of biblical tales, thus being able to change the narrative... and no, not an easy ask.

Back in 2002, two archeologists, Israel Finkelstein from Israel and Neil Asher Silberman from America, but who studied archeology at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, published a book that had the zionists going crazy because both of these men were highly respected in their field.
Israel Finkelstein - Wikipedia
Neil Asher Silberman - Wikipedia

What is strange is that this was not the first time that this information had been published. Their work actually replicated prior work that was done by another Israeli, Ze'ev Herzog, who published many of the same findings in 1999.

So, what are these findings and why did the zionists become enraged?

Herzog cites evidence supporting that "the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is the fact that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the god of Israel, Jehovah, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai".
Ze'ev Herzog - Wikipedia

...many of the most famous stories in the Bible—the wanderings of the patriarchs, the Exodus from Egypt, Joshua’s conquest of Canaan, and David and Solomon’s vast empire—reflect the world of the later authors rather than actual historical facts...
https://www.amazon.com/Bible-Unearthed-Archaeologys-Vision-Ancient/dp/0684869136&tag=ff0d01-20

Food for thought?

Shusha has been asking about this and as biblical stories are central to the zionist narrative, I thought I'd give it a shot. Does this offer the Palestinian people any hope? I guess it depends if we can put science ahead of biblical tales, thus being able to change the narrative... and no, not an easy ask.

Back in 2002, two archeologists, Israel Finkelstein from Israel and Neil Asher Silberman from America, but who studied archeology at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, published a book that had the zionists going crazy because both of these men were highly respected in their field.
Israel Finkelstein - Wikipedia
Neil Asher Silberman - Wikipedia

What is strange is that this was not the first time that this information had been published. Their work actually replicated prior work that was done by another Israeli, Ze'ev Herzog, who published many of the same findings in 1999.

So, what are these findings and why did the zionists become enraged?

Herzog cites evidence supporting that "the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is the fact that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the god of Israel, Jehovah, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai".
Ze'ev Herzog - Wikipedia

...many of the most famous stories in the Bible—the wanderings of the patriarchs, the Exodus from Egypt, Joshua’s conquest of Canaan, and David and Solomon’s vast empire—reflect the world of the later authors rather than actual historical facts...
https://www.amazon.com/Bible-Unearthed-Archaeologys-Vision-Ancient/dp/0684869136&tag=ff0d01-20

Food for thought?

What Zionists were going crazy?

Do you really think references to wiki are to be taken seriously?

 

[abi]

Because it certainly appears so far that you are willing to stick your fingers in your ears and babble, "I can't hear you" and completely ignore reality.

Isn't that what you just did... and do constantly?

 

[Shusha]

Because it certainly appears so far that you are willing to stick your fingers in your ears and babble, "I can't hear you" and completely ignore reality.

Isn't that what you just did... and do constantly?

Oh please, the OP is easy enough to refute. There is no point if you are just going to ignore it, though. What criteria would convince you that the Jewish people have a history in that land?

 

[abi]

Oh please, the OP is easy enough to refute

It isn't. It has been out for years and has yet to be refuted. You should read his whole book instead of basing your belief on, well, a belief.

Please refute what you can, though, I'm very interested.

 

[Shusha]

Oh please, the OP is easy enough to refute

It isn't. It has been out for years and has yet to be refuted. You should read his whole book instead of basing your belief on, well, a belief.

Please refute what you can, though, I'm very interested.

I read his book years ago. I know all of the definitive findings which prove them wrong. I understand how you've twisted the narrative. None of that matters if you won't accept any evidence. So....what evidence will you accept?

 

[MJB12741]

Oh please, the OP is easy enough to refute

It isn't. It has been out for years and has yet to be refuted. You should read his whole book instead of basing your belief on, well, a belief.

Please refute what you can, though, I'm very interested.

Have you read my book titled Palestinian Contributions To Peace, Mankind & Civilization?

 

[abi]

I read his book years ago. I know all of the definitive findings which prove them wrong. I understand how you've twisted the narrative. None of that matters if you won't accept any evidence. So....what evidence will you accept?

Show me the evidence and let's go from there. I call your bluff.

 

[Shusha]

2700 year old inscription written in proto-Hebrew found in Jerusalem. Proves the Jewish people were extant in Jerusalem nearly three thousand years ago. So, we done?

 

[MJB12741]

2700 year old inscription written in proto-Hebrew found in Jerusalem. Proves the Jewish people were extant in Jerusalem nearly three thousand years ago. So, we done?

YEP! That does it. Boy I'll bet Abi has you Zionists shakin' in your boots & praying he will be tossed off this board or just please leave us with all his wisdom & well documented facts. Oh Lord I think I love him. Seriously everyone, how can we get him to post here more often. Heh Heh!

 

[Shusha]

I could find an entire Jewish population which has remained hidden in Judean desert caves for 3000 years, reciting the Shema (in Hebrew) twice daily, and she still wouldn't believe that the Jewish people have a history there.

 

[abi]

2700 year old inscription written in proto-Hebrew found in Jerusalem. Proves the Jewish people were extant in Jerusalem nearly three thousand years ago. So, we done?

You mean this?

And I am snickering at proto-Hebrew. Can you translate?

I could find an entire Jewish population which has remained hidden in Judean desert caves for 3000 years, reciting the Shema (in Hebrew) twice daily, and she still wouldn't believe that the Jewish people have a history there.

I would, have a link? That would really be great.

 

[Shusha]

Snicker all you want. Do you accept it as evidence or not? If not, why not?

 

[abi]

Snicker all you want. Do you accept it as evidence or not? If not, why not?

It exists, but you haven't explained what you think it proves nor why.

 

[Shusha]

Snicker all you want. Do you accept it as evidence or not? If not, why not?

It exists, but you haven't explained what you think it proves nor why.

Actually, I have. It demonstrates that the Jewish people were extant in Jerusalem nearly 3000 years ago.

 

[abi]

Actually, I have. It demonstrates that the Jewish people were extant in Jerusalem nearly 3000 years ago.

It doesn't, but to the point you had asked prior.

The temple was totally destroyed in 70 AD, we agree there, right?

The hill called Zion and Jerusalem, the building there, that is to say, the temple, the Holy of Holies, the Altar, and whatever else was there dedicated to the glory of God have been utterly removed...
Eusebius

I never understood why the wall can’t just be from a Roman fort.

It [Jerusalem] is now demolished to the very foundations, and hath nothing left but that monument of it preserved, I mean the camp of those (Romans) that hath destroyed it, which still dwells upon its ruins.
Eleazer Ben Jair (Commander at Masada)

Now as to the Tower of Antonia, it might seem to be composed of several cities. For if we go up to this Tower of Antonia, we gain the city since we shall then be upon the top of the hill.
Josephus

 

[Shusha]

Abi, what is your point with this thread? This thread originated because I called for mutual recognition on another thread. What are you trying to prove on this thread?

That the Jewish people have no history there? That the Jewish people had a history there but were successfully invaded, conquered and expelled? That the Jewish people are faking our own history? What?

 

[abi]

I am not trying to prove anything. I am learning. I like to learn things, I'm a history nerd. But, ultimately, this may clear up the whole issue in Jerusalem.

Because, what if you are wrong and the temple was never there?

David then took up residence in the fortress and called it the City of David. He built up the area around it, from the terraces inward. 10 And he became more and more powerful, because the Lord God Almighty was with him.
2 Samuel 5-9/10

And Gad came that day to David, and said unto him: 'Go up, rear an altar unto the LORD in the threshing-floor of Araunah the Jebusite.'
2 Samuel 24-18

Then Solomon began to build the house of the LORD at Jerusalem in mount Moriah, where [the LORD] appeared unto David his father; for which provision had been made in the Place of David, in the threshingfloor of Ornan the Jebusite.
2 Chronicles 3-1

Doesn’t it make more sense that the temple was actually in the City of David as discussed in the Torah?

 

[Shusha]

Well, aside from your rule that we are not to use biblical stories as an historical reference, who cares? There is ample proof that a Jewish society existed in Jerusalem for roughly 3000 years. What is your point?