The Official Zimmerman Trial Verdict Thread

[RKMBrown]

Could not see the teen standing right next to him at the T?

I have a very dark hallway. When my roomie comes out of his room to go to the bathroom, which is in the hallway where all the doors to all the bedrooms are....and I come out of my bedroom and he is standing there waiting for me to pass, I can't count the number of times I soiled myself from being startled with him being there and me not seeing him. HE always gets a kick out of it, though, lol. Every time, he asks "should I be cheshire cat from now on and grin so you can see me?".
He is black.

So yeah. Trayvon could have been standing there and Z not seeing him. Z was heading back to his car. Trayvon made it home. What was trayvon doing out there AFTEr he made it home? He went to confront Z, that's what.

You folks have mentioned that quite a few times. Home to me has a number of qualifications, USA, TX, County, Sub-Division, 15acres, house, computer desk... Which home did Tray reach? He had just come back from the 7-Eleven.. perhaps home was in his gated neighborhood where he thought he was safe, up till the night the crazzy guy followed him around his home neighborhood and parked in front of him and got out and followed him down his home's sidewalk.

 

[testarosa]

Yes you are correct...he described it as a court...so he figured if he walked to the other side he knew he would be on his street and would just need to see an apartment number to give a complete address.

Yes you are correct...I misspoke...it was an apt # not a street sign.

And it was very observant for him to notice the body further down the walk...but the flashlight brings it back. Give the guy some credit.

DONT TAZE ME, BRO!

Hands swinging.. stuff like key chains get tossed. Where's the blood? Where did the witnesses place the fight.. how did they get there... rolling over and over and over and over ... nah.. GZ may have gone where he said but he did, but he did not go back to the truck, he saw TM and went down the sidewalk toward TM. Could not see the teen standing right next to him at the T? BS.

Tossed? That'd be a THROW.

 

[legaleagle_45]

784.048 Stalking; definitions; penalties.—
(1) As used in this section, the term:
(a) “Harass” means to engage in a course of conduct directed at a specific person which causes substantial emotional distress to that person and serves no legitimate purpose.
(b) “Course of conduct” means a pattern of conduct composed of a series of acts over a period of time, however short, which evidences a continuity of purpose. The term does not include constitutionally protected activity such as picketing or other organized protests.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

You posted a definition in a stalking statue which tells you what "harass" and "course of conduct"... but not stalking.

Stalking consist of:

(2) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows, harasses, or cyberstalks another person commits the offense of stalking, a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

Regardless of anything else and pursuant to Florida law, there must be seperate and distinct factual episodes of following or harrasment (or cybestalking) for the definition to apply. STATE OF FLORIDA vs JOHN FRANCIS JONES. Of course, you may wish to take this up with Angela Cory and explain to her why it is still stalking. Perhaps you can get her to amend the charging instrument to include stalking? In that way she could have charged GZ with 1st Degree Murder instead of 2nd and even if that did not work, could add some additional time to his sentence, as stalking is not a "lesser included crime" of 2nd degree murder.

I am sure Angela Cory will be thrilled with your expertise and insight as legal wizard of the US Message Boards and amend her charging instruments at once... heck she would probably hire you for big bucks as a legal consultant because you obviously know about Florida Law than she does.

You can contact her here:

Courthouse Annex
220 East Bay Street
Jacksonville, Florida, 32202
(904) 630-2400

 

[The Infidel]

Sorry dumbshit. That insult doesnt work in Texas. We dont have basements.

With all that traveling,doesnt your boyfriend get lonely?

There you go projecting again you Texas Faggot.

Last time I was in a Texas Airport (I wouldn't bother to leave, that place is such a crap hole), I saw unbelievably obese people there.

How the fuck do you mount your boyfriend with all that belly fat? Just curious you fag.

Please stay out of my state. And you would more then likely get our ass kicked if you left the airport. We dont like your kind around here. Left wing pussy.

Hey SALLOW... you got burned

Oh, and my friend is correct... stay at the airport, its probably best

 

[testarosa]

784.048 Stalking; definitions; penalties.—
(1) As used in this section, the term:
(a) “Harass” means to engage in a course of conduct directed at a specific person which causes substantial emotional distress to that person and serves no legitimate purpose.
(b) “Course of conduct” means a pattern of conduct composed of a series of acts over a period of time, however short, which evidences a continuity of purpose. The term does not include constitutionally protected activity such as picketing or other organized protests.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

You posted a definition in a stalking statue which tells you what "harass" and "course of conduct"... but not stalking.

Stalking consist of:

(2) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows, harasses, or cyberstalks another person commits the offense of stalking, a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

Regardless of anything else and pursuant to Florida law, there must be seperate and distinct factual episodes of following or harrasment (or cybestalking) for the definition to apply. STATE OF FLORIDA vs JOHN FRANCIS JONES. Of course, you may wish to take this up with Angela Cory and explain to her why it is still stalking. Perhaps you can get her to amend the charging instrument to include stalking? In that way she could have charged GZ with 1st Degree Murder instead of 2nd and even if that did not work, could add some additional time to his sentence, as stalking is not a "lesser included crime" of 2nd degree murder.

I am sure Angela Cory will be thrilled with your expertise and insight as legal wizard of the US Message Boards and amend her charging instruments at once... heck she would probably hire you for big bucks as a legal consultant because you obviously know about Florida Law than she does.

You can contact her here:

Courthouse Annex
220 East Bay Street
Jacksonville, Florida, 32202
(904) 630-2400

When you contact her, tell her we said Hi!! and that we think her boys are doing an awesome job!

 

[Amelia]

<snipped>

Stop talking unless you know the facts, please.

You too.

But you'll glibly continue to spout off guilty-whether-or-not-it's-proven conjecture, while you ignore the facts we discuss.

Good job. lol

 

[TemplarKormac]

Tray had grass all the way up his legs. He was found by the police officer laying face down with his arms under him.

I have to get some work done.

What?

Give a link or you are bullshitting this so called evidence. Oh and btw make sure you send it to the Prosecution because obviously they missed what you know.

The officer who came on the scene testified to it not that you would be commenting from any informed stance. He turned him over and tried to revive him. Air was coming from Tray's chest so he asked another person to get him Saran Wrap. They gave him plastic bags instead.

The witness was very graphic, had jurors crying.

Stop talking unless you know the facts, please.

LOL!!!! They have not shown the jurors at all during the trial! Please just shut the fuck up Sarah!

 

[25Caliber]

I do agree with you...I just think its different when someone is shot dead. Look, I think they screwed this up...they didnt arrest...then they did arrest...then they set bail...then they set bail higher because of the "finance" issue.

I think you arrest...set bail...gather evidence and let the chips fall where they may. The truth willl set you free. Unfortunately, someones son has been killed...and the killers account for the happenings that night wouldnt be enough for me if my son had been shot.

My point is, outside of his account, there wasnt that deep of an investigation...my son? I want a deep investigation and I want both sides presented...for example had they talked to the person Trayvon was speaking to on the phone? No she wasnt the best witness at all, but you are choosing not to arrest before you even know these facts...just my opinion.

This is why I am making so much of GZ getting out of his truck. The police discourage this, because this is what can happen. You may have been acting in self defense, but now your life is turned upside down...someones kid was shot.

I see your point...but conversely...after Zimmerman had stopped following Martin and Martin was gone from the scene, IMO Zimmerman getting out of his truck becomes moot.

Well no.

And nothing Zimmerman did made any sense.

He gets out of his truck, because, what? He didn't know where he was?

He lives in a gated community with 3 streets. Additionally..he's patrolling it as part of the watch, frequently.

And what? He thinks Martin may be armed yet he walks through a dark pathway to get the street name? That make any sense whatsoever?

Then when he meets Martin..who may have jumped from some phantom Bushes..oh wait he changed that to..emerged from the darkness..

Martin is walking toward him and they exchange 2 sentences..then Martin hits him. Really?

Then Martin slams his head against the pavement and smothers his mouth. How the fuck is Zimmerman screaming? And why would Martin be screaming if he intended to kill him. What? He wanted an audience?

Nothing this guy says makes any sense at all.

Very good points also, sallow. Especially, the part in bold...which is what I have a problem with also.

He initially set out to follow someone (in his late teens) in the dark and rain who he thought may be carrying a weapon...we know this because he tells the 911 operator...."he's got his hands in his waistbands....hes coming towards me.....he has something in his hands....i dont know what his deal is...how long till you get an officer here?".

Good points. He should have stayed in his truck and waited for the police...hes done his job. The situation has escalated (according to his description) and not much good can come from chasing on foot....stating the obvious there...look what happened...lol.

 

[ScienceRocks]

100% backing Zimmermans case up so far. You people are bias as you hate someone defending himself. How would you feel if some thug(of any race) was pounding your head into the ground?

 

[KissMy]

I agree...grabbing or reaching for something in the dark when asked why you are following could be a big problem...and it was. The prosecution is making a huge mistake not addressing this...it is only us in here discussing the reaching.

DD nor anyone else said Martin said gun at any time. And no one saw a gun until after.

 

[RKMBrown]

I do agree with you...I just think its different when someone is shot dead. Look, I think they screwed this up...they didnt arrest...then they did arrest...then they set bail...then they set bail higher because of the "finance" issue.

I think you arrest...set bail...gather evidence and let the chips fall where they may. The truth willl set you free. Unfortunately, someones son has been killed...and the killers account for the happenings that night wouldnt be enough for me if my son had been shot.

My point is, outside of his account, there wasnt that deep of an investigation...my son? I want a deep investigation and I want both sides presented...for example had they talked to the person Trayvon was speaking to on the phone? No she wasnt the best witness at all, but you are choosing not to arrest before you even know these facts...just my opinion.

This is why I am making so much of GZ getting out of his truck. The police discourage this, because this is what can happen. You may have been acting in self defense, but now your life is turned upside down...someones kid was shot.

I see your point...but conversely...after Zimmerman had stopped following Martin and Martin was gone from the scene, IMO Zimmerman getting out of his truck becomes moot.

You make a great point...and I have been thinking about this. The very reason that Trayvon called out ot GZ suggests that GZ was in retreat or going back to his truck...so just let the guy go back to his truck and you go back to your house...I get it.

However, it turns out he actually did not stop following TM. According to GZ's own testimony he apparently "passed" TM who had gone right down the T. Then GZ backtracked to where TM was, which incidentally was also in the direction where he parked. Or GZ is lying...

 

[legaleagle_45]

You folks have mentioned that quite a few times. Home to me has a number of qualifications, USA, TX, County, Sub-Division, 15acres, house, computer desk... Which home did Tray reach? He had just come back from the 7-Eleven.. perhaps home was in his gated neighborhood where he thought he was safe, up till the night the crazzy guy followed him around his home neighborhood and parked in front of him and got out and followed him down his home's sidewalk.

Dee Dee testified that TM told her he was "by" the home. In the context of the questioning it is clear that she believed that TM was telling her that he was "directly adjacent to" the home because context involves why TM did not run to his home instead of confronting GZ.

Of course we do not know if Dee Dee understood TM correctly, but that is her testimony.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

For someone unclear on "baring arms" you really shouldn't be posting your own ignorant opinions.
The claim of self defense stands no matter what. The only way to defeat it is to show that it was not a legitimate case of self defense.

For someone that can't read, you sure post your ignorant opinions. Look at the statute I posted. Self defense is not in and of itself a defense for man slaughter of a minor, according to the Florida statute. It is for murder.

You get your ass handed to you and continue babbling on. Did you not read your own post?
Here:

782.07&#8195;Manslaughter; aggravated manslaughter of an elderly person or disabled adult; aggravated manslaughter of a child; aggravated manslaughter of an officer, a firefighter, an emergency medical technician, or a paramedic.&#8212;
(1)&#8195;The killing of a human being by the act, procurement, or culpable negligence of another, without lawful justification according to the provisions of chapter 776 and in cases in which such killing shall not be excusable homicide or murder, according to the provisions of this chapter, is manslaughter, a felony of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.

Note the bold part. Now what is Chapter 776?
Here:

776.012&#8195;Use of force in defense of person.&#8212;A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other&#8217;s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1)&#8195;He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2)&#8195;Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.

So no matter what the prosecutor charged self defense is an affirmative defense to the charge.
Have you had enough for today? Aren't you embarrassed at being so ignorant?
If you have a modicum of integrity you will admit I am right here. Just as I was in the "Right to Bare Arms" fiasco. Just as I was in the income tax disaster. Just as I was in the Libertarian borrasco.

Okay. But I referred to the third definition (listed below) for manslaughter; not the first. In that definition; if it is a minor, the 'without lawful justification' is omitted. I'm no lawyer, but that seems like the self defense law is not a defense if there is otherwise culpable negligence. But, I'm not lawyer. It's an interesting question and one that I doubt you'll be qualified to answer within the next five minutes. It's something to keep an eye out for.

(3)&#8195;A person who causes the death of any person under the age of 18 by culpable negligence under s. 827.03(2)(b) commits aggravated manslaughter of a child, a felony of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.

 

[Sarah G]

What?

Give a link or you are bullshitting this so called evidence. Oh and btw make sure you send it to the Prosecution because obviously they missed what you know.

The officer who came on the scene testified to it not that you would be commenting from any informed stance. He turned him over and tried to revive him. Air was coming from Tray's chest so he asked another person to get him Saran Wrap. They gave him plastic bags instead.

The witness was very graphic, had jurors crying.

Stop talking unless you know the facts, please.

LOL!!!! They have not shown the jurors at all during the trial! Please shut the fuck up Sarah!

Just so you know, the murderer isn't walking away scott free. Believe it or not, I don't care anything about you or your not so firm grasp of facts. On Zimmerman or anything else around here.

You're a joke.

 

[RKMBrown]

I see your point...but conversely...after Zimmerman had stopped following Martin and Martin was gone from the scene, IMO Zimmerman getting out of his truck becomes moot.

Well no.

And nothing Zimmerman did made any sense.

He gets out of his truck, because, what? He didn't know where he was?

He lives in a gated community with 3 streets. Additionally..he's patrolling it as part of the watch, frequently.

And what? He thinks Martin may be armed yet he walks through a dark pathway to get the street name? That make any sense whatsoever?

Then when he meets Martin..who may have jumped from some phantom Bushes..oh wait he changed that to..emerged from the darkness..

Martin is walking toward him and they exchange 2 sentences..then Martin hits him. Really?

Then Martin slams his head against the pavement and smothers his mouth. How the fuck is Zimmerman screaming? And why would Martin be screaming if he intended to kill him. What? He wanted an audience?

Nothing this guy says makes any sense at all.

Very good points also, sallow. Especially, the part in bold...which is what I have a problem with also.

He initially set out to follow someone (in his late teens) in the dark and rain who he thought may be carrying a weapon...we know this because he tells the 911 operator...."he's got his hands in his waistbands....hes coming towards me.....he has something in his hands....i dont know what his deal is...how long till you get an officer here?".

Good points. He should have stayed in his truck and waited for the police...hes done his job. The situation has escalated (according to his description) and not much good can come from chasing on foot....stating the obvious there...look what happened...lol.

He escalated it by parking right where TM was walking, in the left lane no less, thus forcing TM to "walk" around him. Can we give GZ a parking ticket?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Prosecution is still trying to establish the fact that somehow size mattered when Zimmerman was getting beat into the ground. O'Mara is now cross referencing Sarino.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Show me the Florida law that says following, watching or reporting someone is a crime or illegal.

Martin the racist had the agenda to kill a creepy ass cracker. The race groups, community organizers, schools, politicians & media keep preaching to the black community to hate white crackers who are oppressing them.

784.048&#8195;Stalking; definitions; penalties.—
(1)&#8195;As used in this section, the term:
(a)&#8195;“Harass” means to engage in a course of conduct directed at a specific person which causes substantial emotional distress to that person and serves no legitimate purpose.
(b)&#8195;“Course of conduct” means a pattern of conduct composed of a series of acts over a period of time, however short, which evidences a continuity of purpose. The term does not include constitutionally protected activity such as picketing or other organized protests.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Zimmerman was not charged with stalking. He did not repeatedly stalk Martin over a long period in a pattern of conduct or series of acts to causes substantial emotional distress. GZ reported & attempted to keep an eye on him until police arrived shortly. There is no law against that. Martin escalated his race fueled rage agression against Zimmerman after GZ screamed HELP!, did not harm him, & retreated. Martin was a criminal breaking many laws as he, attacked, beat & attempted to kill GZ.

However there are laws against inciting riots & racist hate crimes committed by Martin, his family, Al Sharpton, NBC, Eric Holder & Obama.

I don't believe that's a correct interpretation of the law. You could follow a different girl home every night and that would still be stalking. Martin broke no law.

 

[TemplarKormac]

The officer who came on the scene testified to it not that you would be commenting from any informed stance. He turned him over and tried to revive him. Air was coming from Tray's chest so he asked another person to get him Saran Wrap. They gave him plastic bags instead.

The witness was very graphic, had jurors crying.

Stop talking unless you know the facts, please.

LOL!!!! They have not shown the jurors at all during the trial! Please shut the fuck up Sarah!

Just so you know, the murderer isn't walking away scott free. Believe it or not, I don't care anything about you or your not so firm grasp of facts. On Zimmerman or anything else around here.

You're a joke.

Haha, you are a joke each time you posit your arguments about this case! He isn't a murderer, it has never been established that he murdered Martin, and he never profiled Martin!

Are you paying attention, woman? You don't care about my positions because I keep rebutting yours. Running away now, aren't we?

 

[25Caliber]

Cant just not arrest someone just because they CLAIM self defense. What precedent would that send? It sucks...but thats the way it has to be, imo. Evidence has to be gathered to substantiate his claim.

I think their should be an investigation of every shooting. But if there is no evidence of wrongdoing, then charges cannot be supported and should not be filed. I disagree an arrest should happen automatically. That's taking away someone's freedom before there is an investigation. I feel that's wrong. At first I felt this was overcharging. After seeing the "evidence" presented by the P, or I should say lack of evidence, I now believe GZ should be acquitted. This is bogus BS. His story is consistent with the witnesses statements, for all practical purposes, and the P has no case. Let. Him. Go!

This is a political show trial for using a gun & profiling a black man. The anti gun nuts want anyone who kills automatically charged so they can jail them or break them financially for killing, profiling or using a gun. That is why states like Florida passed Stand Your Ground laws to prevent this. Otherwise when you get attacked you will be ruined or killed by the attacker or the justice system. It is illegal to defend your life or carry on as before.

NY & DC laws say you must use every opportunity to retreat before defending yourself & they automatically arrest anyone who kill criminals to preserve life. Thus the state attacks the victim again with trial, costly defense, loss of income & family.

However Zimmerman did call police, did not harm Martin, yelled for help many times & retreated before using deadly force as his last resort to save his life. He should never have been arrested or charged for defending his life. The state is punishing the victim again. Not to mention wasting tax dollars on this nonsense.

Hmm...this is interesting...I think you are right...well said.

 

[RKMBrown]

You folks have mentioned that quite a few times. Home to me has a number of qualifications, USA, TX, County, Sub-Division, 15acres, house, computer desk... Which home did Tray reach? He had just come back from the 7-Eleven.. perhaps home was in his gated neighborhood where he thought he was safe, up till the night the crazzy guy followed him around his home neighborhood and parked in front of him and got out and followed him down his home's sidewalk.

Dee Dee testified that TM told her he was "by" the home. In the context of the questioning it is clear that she believed that TM was telling her that he was "directly adjacent to" the home because context involves why TM did not run to his home instead of confronting GZ.

Of course we do not know if Dee Dee understood TM correctly, but that is her testimony.

Like I said "by home" probably means in gated neighborhood. Walk the time line, he did not have time to walk home and come back to the T.