"The Trouble with Rand Paul"

Because Obama said he would end U.S. torture. No more waterboarding. He kept his promise.

Extraordinary rendition still prospers- the liberal media, and their devoted acolytes, have just stopped caring. But I digress- why pour a little water on their face when assassination is so much more humane.
Shut the fuck up. The grownups are trying to have a conversation here.

How would you know?

Expand on the "U.S. doesn't torture" line. I'm sure if a U.S. bureacrat sent you to Egypt to be tortured, you'd blame the U.S., as would any rational person. Just like I'd blame the person who locked me in a room with a pack of rabid pit bulls.

The Obama foreign policy is the exact same as the Bush one, declare a borderless war, attack anywhere, state no goals and always coincidentally end up fighting in areas with oil (Libya, Uganda, etc).
 
NOWHERE WAS THERE PROOF THAT HE WAS USING IT! Thats my point. He could be. Not that I care cause truthfully I dont fucking care about terrorists and they all should be sent to meet Alla as quickly ans it can be arranged. I dont see jumping at shadows very helpful. I am getting tired of the the nutbags that have came with the Paul movement.

So we're still at you either not reading, or not understanding, the links provided.
Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Kevin's being nice, you are lying.

Although I do appreciate the laugh you provided when you called individual mandate loving Newt Gingrich a conservative. Is Obama also a conservative to you?
 
It's also called not cutting off your nose to spite your face. He's a passionate guy who has had the opportunity to get up close and personal to the true workings of the political game...he made a choice to concede some of what he'd want to get some of what he hopes for, rather than take a stand that would show no results in the end.
Yeah....Politics.

No.

Its sell your soul to line your pockets.

Its the Republican way.

Deny it if you want but we all know its true.

Even rw's know its true.

They won't admit it but they DO know it.

Like this guy?
 
So we're still at you either not reading, or not understanding, the links provided.
Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Kevin's being nice, you are lying.

Although I do appreciate the laugh you provided when you called individual mandate loving Newt Gingrich a conservative. Is Obama also a conservative to you?

I am not lying you turd so deal with it. The individual mandate ????? He at least admits when he was wrong . Now What conservative bills did your great Libertarian Pauls do ???Oh thats right not a fucking thing.


NOWHERE was thier proof that the Administration was using torture you fucking dummie. Nor do we know that they gave terrorists to other countries to be tortured. I get tired of you conspiracy theory nutbags.
 
Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Kevin's being nice, you are lying.

Although I do appreciate the laugh you provided when you called individual mandate loving Newt Gingrich a conservative. Is Obama also a conservative to you?

I am not lying you turd so deal with it. The individual mandate ????? He at least admits when he was wrong . Now What conservative bills did your great Libertarian Pauls do ???Oh thats right not a fucking thing.


NOWHERE was thier proof that the Administration was using torture you fucking dummie. Nor do we know that they gave terrorists to other countries to be tortured. I get tired of you conspiracy theory nutbags.

I guess I can't call a man who in his late 60's supported an individual mandate, I mean at what point at your supposed to obtain conservative values?

Here's some more fun with your "conservative" icon Gingrich lol.

Newt Gingrich's 13 Most Liberal Moments

It's not Paul's fault your beloved liberals like Gingrich and Bush won't vote in favor of his budget cuts and scaling back of gov't.

Is the US Outsourcing Torture, Again? | emptywheel

Has the Rendition Program Disappeared? | Common Dreams
 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XM5FKawx1No"]Obama: U.S. `Will Not Torture' - YouTube[/ame]


That's a big 10-FAIL, good buddy! I asked for a link to prove that Obama said he was going to end torture, and you give me a link that says "U.S. will not torture". There is a big difference. Obama kept his promise. The U.S. no longer tortures.

Bush owns the torture shame alone.

When the U.S. sends people to be tortured at CIA black sites in third world countries then it is indeed engaged in torture, regardless of whether an American does the actual torturing or not.

But your partisan response was certainly not unexpected.
 
Because Obama said he would end U.S. torture. No more waterboarding. He kept his promise.

Extraordinary rendition still prospers- the liberal media, and their devoted acolytes, have just stopped caring. But I digress- why pour a little water on their face when assassination is so much more humane.
Shut the fuck up. The grownups are trying to have a conversation here.

And this is a "grownup" response? Seriously?
 
Kevin's being nice, you are lying.

Although I do appreciate the laugh you provided when you called individual mandate loving Newt Gingrich a conservative. Is Obama also a conservative to you?

I am not lying you turd so deal with it. The individual mandate ????? He at least admits when he was wrong . Now What conservative bills did your great Libertarian Pauls do ???Oh thats right not a fucking thing.


NOWHERE was thier proof that the Administration was using torture you fucking dummie. Nor do we know that they gave terrorists to other countries to be tortured. I get tired of you conspiracy theory nutbags.

I guess I can't call a man who in his late 60's supported an individual mandate, I mean at what point at your supposed to obtain conservative values?

Here's some more fun with your "conservative" icon Gingrich lol.

Newt Gingrich's 13 Most Liberal Moments

It's not Paul's fault your beloved liberals like Gingrich and Bush won't vote in favor of his budget cuts and scaling back of gov't.

Is the US Outsourcing Torture, Again? | emptywheel

Has the Rendition Program Disappeared? | Common Dreams

You give me two links.....One talking about something that happened in 2004 ....Was Obama President then? Cause I never said I didn't think Bush did it cause I do believe he did send terrorist to other countries to get their just desserts I said Obama is to much a pussy to do it. The other sight is a Progressive blog........Um ....Not sure that's the most reliable site since it does nothing in the article but state opinion.

Now for the Newt link .....Most of it is his historical opinion and You might not like it but that doesn't mean he didn't do more for the conservative cause than ANY of the other candidates thus he has proven by his ACTIONS to be conservative not just the shit they spout....Lets talk liberal shall we when Ron Paul is left of the President in Foreign affairs ???
 
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I am not lying you turd so deal with it. The individual mandate ????? He at least admits when he was wrong . Now What conservative bills did your great Libertarian Pauls do ???Oh thats right not a fucking thing.


NOWHERE was thier proof that the Administration was using torture you fucking dummie. Nor do we know that they gave terrorists to other countries to be tortured. I get tired of you conspiracy theory nutbags.

I guess I can't call a man who in his late 60's supported an individual mandate, I mean at what point at your supposed to obtain conservative values?

Here's some more fun with your "conservative" icon Gingrich lol.

Newt Gingrich's 13 Most Liberal Moments

It's not Paul's fault your beloved liberals like Gingrich and Bush won't vote in favor of his budget cuts and scaling back of gov't.

Is the US Outsourcing Torture, Again? | emptywheel

Has the Rendition Program Disappeared? | Common Dreams

You give me two links.....One talking about something that happened in 2004 ....Was Obama President then? Cause I never said I didn't think Bush did it cause I do believe he did send terrorist to other countries to get their just desserts I said Obama is to much a pussy to do it. The other sight is a Progressive blog........Um ....Not sure that's the most reliable site since it does nothing in the article but state opinion.

Now for the Newt link .....Most of it is his historical opinion and You might not like it but that doesn't mean he didn't do more for the conservative cause than ANY of the other candidates thus he has proven by his ACTIONS to be conservative not just the shit they spout....Lets talk liberal shall we when Ron Paul is left of the President in Foreign affairs ???

Atta boy, just dismiss what's presented you by putting a label on the source, much more convenient than addressing truths that go against your agenda.

2009 he supports an individual mandate, then Obamacare comes out and all of a sudden Newt flip flops on a stance he's held his entire career. You can pretend he's doing this because of principle and not partisanship, but common sense would lead you to understand the truth.

Obama has the same foreign policy views as Bush, blow up and ask questions later all the while putting U.N. treaties and regulations before the Constitution. Ron Paul is against both, he has a crazy idea of following the Constitution and simply having Congress declare war when we want to go to war.

That's the main reason why reps and dems hate Ron Paul, because he respects the Constitution.
 
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I give credit to Rand for standing on the floor and opposing NDAA and for questioning McCain about the indefinite detention provisions in it. As well as opposing internet censorship. He has been a voice for liberty in the house up until now.

That being said I have some issues with him. One of them is that he voted for the sanctions against Iran. He did attempt to get the bill amended with language that stated that the bill was not to used as permission for military action if memory serves me. I see this as a concession where he tried to inject his ideals and I have mixed feelings about that.

Another thing I take issue with is I heard on the radio that he supports means testing for social security. This is nothing less than wealth redistribution. If I am forced to pay into that system then I should be allowed to have my money when I reach age regardless of how much money I have acquired over the years. This is theft pure and simple. I have not researched whether or not he said this yet but if he did I may not be able to support him anymore.

I am hoping the game the Paul's are playing is a version of "Good Cop, Bad Cop". Ron Paul is making stand and gathering power and basically saying "look if you don't give me concessions on what I want I can fracture the party" Then along comes Rand who says "Look I am not as extreme as he is and I can be a unifier, I will play ball if you give us some of what we want."

I think that the rate at which the Liberty Movement is growing might eliminate the need for compromise in the future but maybe there is a need for it now still and this is the fastest way to make some real changes without an all out war in the GOP.

I am giving him the benefit of the doubt for now but he shouild never assume he has us in his pocket because this movement is greater than one man and if he betrays us we will turn on him and run someone against him.
 
I give credit to Rand for standing on the floor and opposing NDAA and for questioning McCain about the indefinite detention provisions in it. As well as opposing internet censorship. He has been a voice for liberty in the house up until now.

That being said I have some issues with him. One of them is that he voted for the sanctions against Iran. He did attempt to get the bill amended with language that stated that the bill was not to used as permission for military action if memory serves me. I see this as a concession where he tried to inject his ideals and I have mixed feelings about that.

Another thing I take issue with is I heard on the radio that he supports means testing for social security. This is nothing less than wealth redistribution. If I am forced to pay into that system then I should be allowed to have my money when I reach age regardless of how much money I have acquired over the years. This is theft pure and simple. I have not researched whether or not he said this yet but if he did I may not be able to support him anymore.

I am hoping the game the Paul's are playing is a version of "Good Cop, Bad Cop". Ron Paul is making stand and gathering power and basically saying "look if you don't give me concessions on what I want I can fracture the party" Then along comes Rand who says "Look I am not as extreme as he is and I can be a unifier, I will play ball if you give us some of what we want."

I think that the rate at which the Liberty Movement is growing might eliminate the need for compromise in the future but maybe there is a need for it now still and this is the fastest way to make some real changes without an all out war in the GOP.

I am giving him the benefit of the doubt for now but he shouild never assume he has us in his pocket because this movement is greater than one man and if he betrays us we will turn on him and run someone against him.

I'm not sure anyone has given a better response to all of this. Good post. :thup:
 
Dr. Paul (the actual one, not the failed one who plays his son) will eagerly chuck every one of his principles in order to keep the Republican establishment from tanking his son - which they will do if Dr. Paul were to cause any problems come convention time.
 
I guess I can't call a man who in his late 60's supported an individual mandate, I mean at what point at your supposed to obtain conservative values?

Here's some more fun with your "conservative" icon Gingrich lol.

Newt Gingrich's 13 Most Liberal Moments

It's not Paul's fault your beloved liberals like Gingrich and Bush won't vote in favor of his budget cuts and scaling back of gov't.

Is the US Outsourcing Torture, Again? | emptywheel

Has the Rendition Program Disappeared? | Common Dreams

You give me two links.....One talking about something that happened in 2004 ....Was Obama President then? Cause I never said I didn't think Bush did it cause I do believe he did send terrorist to other countries to get their just desserts I said Obama is to much a pussy to do it. The other sight is a Progressive blog........Um ....Not sure that's the most reliable site since it does nothing in the article but state opinion.

Now for the Newt link .....Most of it is his historical opinion and You might not like it but that doesn't mean he didn't do more for the conservative cause than ANY of the other candidates thus he has proven by his ACTIONS to be conservative not just the shit they spout....Lets talk liberal shall we when Ron Paul is left of the President in Foreign affairs ???

Atta boy, just dismiss what's presented you by putting a label on the source, much more convenient than addressing truths that go against your agenda.

2009 he supports an individual mandate, then Obamacare comes out and all of a sudden Newt flip flops on a stance he's held his entire career. You can pretend he's doing this because of principle and not partisanship, but common sense would lead you to understand the truth.

Obama has the same foreign policy views as Bush, blow up and ask questions later all the while putting U.N. treaties and regulations before the Constitution. Ron Paul is against both, he has a crazy idea of following the Constitution and simply having Congress declare war when we want to go to war.

That's the main reason why reps and dems hate Ron Paul, because he respects the Constitution.
There was no proof in the progressive article it was opinion of a progressive blogger....It was about Bush anyway.

He already admitted to being wrong about the individual mandate Thats called having honor to admit when he is wrong. I am sad that you don't see that.

LOL Yes admittedly Obama did not turn out to be the coward he said he would be when running for election....How about this... Paul is left of the Presidents rhetoric that he used in the election....

The main reason reps hate Ron Paul is he is a dishonest asshole who thinks we are the cause of 9-11
 
You give me two links.....One talking about something that happened in 2004 ....Was Obama President then? Cause I never said I didn't think Bush did it cause I do believe he did send terrorist to other countries to get their just desserts I said Obama is to much a pussy to do it. The other sight is a Progressive blog........Um ....Not sure that's the most reliable site since it does nothing in the article but state opinion.

Now for the Newt link .....Most of it is his historical opinion and You might not like it but that doesn't mean he didn't do more for the conservative cause than ANY of the other candidates thus he has proven by his ACTIONS to be conservative not just the shit they spout....Lets talk liberal shall we when Ron Paul is left of the President in Foreign affairs ???

Atta boy, just dismiss what's presented you by putting a label on the source, much more convenient than addressing truths that go against your agenda.

2009 he supports an individual mandate, then Obamacare comes out and all of a sudden Newt flip flops on a stance he's held his entire career. You can pretend he's doing this because of principle and not partisanship, but common sense would lead you to understand the truth.

Obama has the same foreign policy views as Bush, blow up and ask questions later all the while putting U.N. treaties and regulations before the Constitution. Ron Paul is against both, he has a crazy idea of following the Constitution and simply having Congress declare war when we want to go to war.

That's the main reason why reps and dems hate Ron Paul, because he respects the Constitution.
There was no proof in the progressive article it was opinion of a progressive blogger....It was about Bush anyway.

He already admitted to being wrong about the individual mandate Thats called having honor to admit when he is wrong. I am sad that you don't see that.

LOL Yes admittedly Obama did not turn out to be the coward he said he would be when running for election....How about this... Paul is left of the Presidents rhetoric that he used in the election....

The main reason reps hate Ron Paul is he is a dishonest asshole who thinks we are the cause of 9-11

That last sentence shows you to be nothing more than a Hannity-parrot.

I have no idea why republicans think gov't officials are incapable of making mistakes in foreign policy.
 
Atta boy, just dismiss what's presented you by putting a label on the source, much more convenient than addressing truths that go against your agenda.

2009 he supports an individual mandate, then Obamacare comes out and all of a sudden Newt flip flops on a stance he's held his entire career. You can pretend he's doing this because of principle and not partisanship, but common sense would lead you to understand the truth.

Obama has the same foreign policy views as Bush, blow up and ask questions later all the while putting U.N. treaties and regulations before the Constitution. Ron Paul is against both, he has a crazy idea of following the Constitution and simply having Congress declare war when we want to go to war.

That's the main reason why reps and dems hate Ron Paul, because he respects the Constitution.
There was no proof in the progressive article it was opinion of a progressive blogger....It was about Bush anyway.

He already admitted to being wrong about the individual mandate Thats called having honor to admit when he is wrong. I am sad that you don't see that.

LOL Yes admittedly Obama did not turn out to be the coward he said he would be when running for election....How about this... Paul is left of the Presidents rhetoric that he used in the election....

The main reason reps hate Ron Paul is he is a dishonest asshole who thinks we are the cause of 9-11

That last sentence shows you to be nothing more than a Hannity-parrot.

I have no idea why republicans think gov't officials are incapable of making mistakes in foreign policy.
What it shows is that I actually listen to what he said instead of drooling over the idea of legal pot.
 
I am without a doubt the lest biggest fan of Ron Paul there will ever be cause I think he is a dishonest , thieving old asshole that hates his own country and is to cheap to pay for his grandchildrens defense. I also think he would have been more accurate to run as a democrat.

That being said this thread is about Rand Paul and his support of his parties candidate. Now I see the young pot head Paulbots screaming and it just shows that you all need to wake up to reality. Time to stop dreaming about legal pot and getting down to saving the country.
 
There was no proof in the progressive article it was opinion of a progressive blogger....It was about Bush anyway.

He already admitted to being wrong about the individual mandate Thats called having honor to admit when he is wrong. I am sad that you don't see that.

LOL Yes admittedly Obama did not turn out to be the coward he said he would be when running for election....How about this... Paul is left of the Presidents rhetoric that he used in the election....

The main reason reps hate Ron Paul is he is a dishonest asshole who thinks we are the cause of 9-11

That last sentence shows you to be nothing more than a Hannity-parrot.

I have no idea why republicans think gov't officials are incapable of making mistakes in foreign policy.
What it shows is that I actually listen to what he said instead of drooling over the idea of legal pot.

I've never touched pot in my life, but since everyone who supports Paul is a pothead according to your list of Hannity's talking points, you ignore reality and stick with the brainless, baseless talking points.

Any small gov't conservative would want pot legalized. Tyranny lovers get off on the idea of gov't regulating what plants people grow, regulating what's in the air they breath in, and regulating what people do in the privacy of their own homes.

Have a good one, I can see you're far too deep into the standard idiot Hannity statist neocon agenda to ever be able to see reality.
 

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