This is why we need to tax the wealthy

[pknopp]

we had roads and everything else before the monstrosity of a tax system we have today

We had taxes to build modern roads.

 

[Soupnazi630]

We had taxes to build modern roads.

We did not need income taxes for it

 

[BluesLegend]

They pay for the roads I drive on also. Why do you want me to go back to horses?

Did you flunk U.S. History in school? Look at the roads in NY, guess who built them...NOT government.

 

[Soupnazi630]

Can Americans legally travel today to Cuba and other nations that it has deemed America's enemies? If the US was once invaded by communist powers as Soviet Russia was in 1918 by the US, Britain, and France, among other capitalist powers, and then economically sanctioned and encircled, it might also have its own so-called "iron curtain", prohibiting its citizens from traveling outside its borders. Anyways..

After WW2, the US was essentially unscathed thanks to being surrounded by two vast oceans. The Soviet Union was invaded by 4 million Germans and lost 28 million of its citizens, of which 19 million were civilians with 9 million KIA on the battlefield. It lost about 14% of its population. Much of Soviet Russia's infrastructure was decimated, forcing them to rebuild without any assistance from the United States or any other country. They had to pick themselves up by their bootstraps. Uncle Sam had no "Marshal Plan" for the Soviets, but rather economic sanctions and a cold war-arms race.

The Soviet, socialist experiment had great accomplishments but it was a young country with a new political, economic, and social system, which required a commitment from its citizens, to contribute to its development (Marxist marketless socialism had never been tried before at a national scale).

Brain drain was a problem, because the US, which became the manufacturing hub of the world after WW2, with the most prosperous working class in the world (A "middle class"), was extremely enticing for a considerable number of the USSR's scientists, academia, and intelligentsia. They could easily move to the US and Western Europe and yes, enjoy a higher standard of living, as far as material goods and access to resources. Without a doubt, I don't deny that. The Iron Curtain was a means to stop such people from defecting (escaping), into the West, and taking their expertise and secrets with them to the enemy. An enemy who had been invading Soviet Russia and killing socialists since its birth in 1917.

The Soviets were essentially in a state of war for all of its 75 years with well-developed, powerful capitalist-run nations, except for a few years in the 1930s when all of the West was under a great economic depression. In the 1930s the "brain drain" was in reverse, with a considerable number of Western engineers and scientists migrating to the Soviet Union. Many Soviets were trained by Western engineers and scientists in the 1930s.

Socialistas didn't want to spend a considerable % of their resources on their military, they preferred to allocate that to infrastructural development and social services, unfortunately, after WW2 the wealthy American ruling elites who were forced in the 1930s by FDR into a "new deal" as a result of pressure from below, namely the American working class through a grassroots socialist-run labor movement:

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Decided to exact their revenge on American socialists and of course the USSR (i.e. United Soviet Socialist Republic).

​

The golden age of the US economy in the 1950s and 60s took place when the American workforce had the highest labor union membership in its history with good pay and a host of benefits providing it with the highest standard of living in the world. The CEOs of the largest corporations made an average of about 20x the salary of their average employee whereas today in 2023 they make as much as 1000x more and the working class can barely support themselves with one income, if at all. The tax rate back then for all who made over 200K anually was 91%. Regardless of whether the effective tax rate or what the wealthy actually paid was lower than the official, marginal tax rate, the rich still paid more than what they do today.

Why is it that the wealthy ruling elites have so much power today and the working class is barely scraping by? After WW2 America's big-money elites set out to reverse most of the gains of the "New Deal" and make sure progressive, socialist policies never influence or set the standard for the economy. The break up of labor unions, the gutting of the American manufacturing base in exchange for cheaper, lower-quality, foreign-produced consumer goods (turning American factories into product-distribution centers for imported products), stagnant wages, fewer worker rights, with a higher cost of living:

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The US was in a fortunate, unique position politically and economically after WW2, turning the USD into the world's reserve currency and becoming the world's main source of products. The American ruling elite set out to take back control of the US government and economy, and by the early 1980s, they achieved that, leading to the economic and political conditions we're in now. The Soviets lost the Cold War, after being burned out by the West's relentless effort to destroy it. Starting in the late 1950s, several years after the death of Stalin, the Soviets began to "reform" and thirty years later that led to its demise. The USSR was dissolved. Does that imply socialism and its objective, communism, failed? No, why would any thoughtful person believe that?

Did capitalism replace chattel slavery and feudalism overnight? It took centuries for the mercantile class and its Republicanism to take hold in Europe, replacing its monarchs and royal aristocracy. Material conditions had to be in place allowing the merchants to become the powerful industrialists of the 19th century, supporting parliamentary governance and greater freedom for everyone, including their employees (i.e. Working Class). If marketless socialism is going to replace market capitalism, do you believe it will occur with one single swoop of the sword or a single experiment like the USSR? No, most likely it won't.

I will argue that marketless socialism is the inevitable outcome of advanced automation and artificial intelligence. Powerful computers, advanced intelligent robotics, eventually forces society by necessity to adopt a non-profit, more democratic system of production. It might take 25 more years for that to happen, or maybe even 100+ years,but eventually, at a national scale, we;re going to have to adopt socialism in order to survive and thrive. The final end of this process leads to the individual consumer having complete control over the means of production. The ability to manufacture everything from home.

One day, thanks to technology, the American consumer is going to be able to draw water from the air (we have technology that can do that today). Provide themselves with their electricity through a micro-nuclear reactor (i.e. A fusion or advanced fission reactor) and produce all of their food, clothing, and housing (in the future real estate or the practice of living in one place permanently will become boring and obsolete, people will be mobile, living in communities/colonies of large vehicles of various kinds).

Oh OK, this government is being too overbearing, violating my freedoms, hence I'm packing up and going somewhere else. I don't need government services, I have the technology to survive and thrive with my family, anywhere I choose to settle. I can go to the asteroid belts and survive and thrive, I don't need an intrusive, overbearing government micromanaging my life.

Withering away of the state - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

"Communism (from Latin communis, 'common, universal')[1][2] is a left-wing to far-left sociopolitical, philosophical, and economic ideology within the socialist movement,[1] whose goal is the creation of a communist society, a socioeconomic order centered around common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange that allocates products to everyone in the society based on need.[3][4][5] A communist society would entail the absence of private property and social classes,[1] and ultimately money[6][non-primary source needed] and the state (or nation state).[7][8][9]"

Communism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Private property isn't personal property. Private property is essentially that which you employ within a capitalist market system to generate a profit or exploit other human beings for monetary gain. It's not your house, your vehicle/s, your PC, your phone, your fruit of the looms, tooth brush..etc.

Socialism according to Karl Marx and Fredrick Engels, leads to the "withering away of the state". The power of the government is greatly diminished due to public access to technology. The consumer becomes the owner and lord of production, without the assistance of a government or capitalist.

Socialism due to technology is inevitable it's just a question of when. Again, it might be in 25 years, or 250 years, but it will happen.

View attachment 885656

View attachment 885657​

Same old story from this guy.

Sci fi pictures do not support his argument but he always uses them

Thomas Woolf is a token masrxist in economic circles but proven to be an absolute fool

Marc was massively disproven in every way and his theories are disproven garbage.

Higher technology is what defeats socialism it will never lead to it and socialism is an absolute failure

At least for once this guy admits the soviets were desperate to keep people in. But hsi desperate spin is a failure. Of course they wannted a middle class life but also just a life . Not existyence as a slave which is what marxism is about.


And of course Mccarthy was proven more right than wrong in the end

 

[BluesLegend]

We had taxes to build modern roads.

LMAO riiiiight the NY throughway, paid for long ago...Dems still toll the fuck out of it.

 

[Edgetho]

Did you flunk U.S. History in school? Look at the roads in NY, guess who built them...NOT government.

Roads had a 'use tax' designed to build them. You don't buy gasoline, you don't pay road tax.

The stupidity of dims never ceases to amaze me.

BTW, Oil Companies make about 10 cents on a gallon of gasoline. The Feds get 18 cents on ever gallon of gas and 24 cents on ever gal of diesel.

How much does your State charge for the use of their wonderful, well-kept, roads??

 

[pknopp]

We did not need income taxes for it

Dirt roads? Maybe not. Quit yearning for the 19th century.

 

[Soupnazi630]

Dirt roads? Maybe not. Quit yearning for the 19th century.

 

[Soupnazi630]

Dirt roads? Maybe not. Quit yearning for the 19th century.

We do not need income taxes for good modern roads.

 

[pknopp]

LMAO riiiiight the NY throughway, paid for long ago...Dems still toll the fuck out of it.

A tax by any other name.

 

[pknopp]

We do not need income taxes for good modern roads.

If you say so. The government creates the money for you and you bitch to use some of it for infrastructure.

 

[BluesLegend]

How much does your State charge for the use of their wonderful, well-kept, roads??

This is out of date, in Jan, 2023 asshole Democrats jacked up the Washington gas tax another 50 cents a gallon. That's right while the poor and working class were trying to recover from the Dem Covid LOCKDOWNS that destroyed vast numbers of businesses in Washington State, then the Dems gut punched everyone with a 50 cent a gallon gas tax increase.

When lying Democrats claim to care about the poor and working class I just laugh in their faces.

 

[BluesLegend]

The government creates the money for you

LOL details please, was there a government bake sale? How did government create the money?

 

[Soupnazi630]

If you say so. The government creates the money for you and you bitch to use some of it for infrastructure.

No I never have.

My argument has always been against the system

 

[Edgetho]

If you say so. The government creates the money for you and you bitch to use some of it for infrastructure.

That is the most stupid, the most ignorant, the most uninformed piece of trash ever posted in here.

 

[beagle9]

The losers are so much dead weight at this point not even all the rich people's wealth can carry them. I recommend they get off their fat lazy ass, work and pay their own damn bills.

What, and abandon "wealth redistribution for retribution purposes" ? What in blue blazes are you trying to suggest the dependent Democrat's do with your words ? Democrat's who have staked their lives on this type of purpose or system will not relent now, otherwise they are too deep, and would torch this nation if they are attempted to be stopped by their political opponents that use slogans like MAGA etc.

Just ask Trump and he'll be glad to tell you how bad the situation has become with these tyrants.

 

[pknopp]

LOL details please, was there a government bake sale? How did government create the money?

No one is that ignorant.

 

[Edgetho]

LOL details please, was there a government bake sale? How did government create the money?

Yeah, if the goobermint 'creates' money, why do they need our tax dollars?

dimocraps aren't just scum, they're stupid as well

 

[pknopp]

Yeah, if the goobermint 'creates' money, why do they need our tax dollars?

dimocraps aren't just scum, they're stupid as well

It doesn't but then you get less.

 

[Edgetho]

No one is that ignorant.

You are because -- You said it.