Trump says Hillary started the Birther Movement. Not True!

[Skylar]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (You must submit one of the following. Photocopies and notarized copies are not acceptable):

• Previously issued, undamaged, and fully valid U.S. Passport (5 year for minors or 10 years for adults)
• Certified U.S. birth certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by the City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
  • Photocopies and notarized copies are unacceptable
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
• Naturalization Certificate
• Certificate of Citizenship

First Time Applicants

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Birth


Event: Birth

Cost of copy: $10.00

Address:
State Department of Health
Office of Health Status Monitoring
Vital Records Section
P.O. Box 3378
Honolulu, HI 96801-9984

Remarks: State office has some records as early as 1853. Additional copies ordered at the same time are $4.00 each.

Cashier's check, certified check, or money order should be made payable to State Department of Health. Personal checks are not accepted. To verify current fees, the telephone number is (808) 586-4533. This is a recorded message. Information on how to obtain certified copies is also available via the Hawaii State Department of Health, Vital Records website.

Where to Write for Vital Records - Hawaii

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

 

[Syriusly]

....which is in a vault in the Department of Health in Hawaii.

Oh wait- the nation already knows about that- and has for 4 years.

Again, why do you confuse yourself? The "one" in the so called vault, if real, should be matching identically to the one that Obama or his parents were first issued as the original. Where is Obama's original? Not the copy that he provided via the state in 2007.

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

 

[Skylar]

....which is in a vault in the Department of Health in Hawaii.

Oh wait- the nation already knows about that- and has for 4 years.

Again, why do you confuse yourself? The "one" in the so called vault, if real, should be matching identically to the one that Obama or his parents were first issued as the original. Where is Obama's original? Not the copy that he provided via the state in 2007.

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Says you. Prove that Obama's parents were issued an 'original birth certificate'. You can't. Its just you, citing you. And you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Worse, the State Department contradicts on what is required to get a passport. Recognzing that a certified copy of a birth certificate is perfectly fine. Even linking to the CDC which links to Hawaii....where they issue certified copies.

You're literally offering us your imagination as evidence. Imagining that Obama has an original birth certificate. Imagining that the State Department won't accept a certified copy.

And for no particular reason, ignoring Hawaii, the State Department and the CDC on Obama's original vital documents. Hell, you've even ignored your own sources that affirmed that original vital documents are held by the State that issued them.

Your willful ignorance is not evidence. You can't get around that.

 

[Syriusly]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (You must submit one of the following. Photocopies and notarized copies are not acceptable):

• Previously issued, undamaged, and fully valid U.S. Passport (5 year for minors or 10 years for adults)
• Certified U.S. birth certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by the City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
  • Photocopies and notarized copies are unacceptable
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
• Naturalization Certificate
• Certificate of Citizenship

First Time Applicants

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Birth


Event: Birth

Cost of copy: $10.00

Address:
State Department of Health
Office of Health Status Monitoring
Vital Records Section
P.O. Box 3378
Honolulu, HI 96801-9984

Remarks: State office has some records as early as 1853. Additional copies ordered at the same time are $4.00 each.

Cashier's check, certified check, or money order should be made payable to State Department of Health. Personal checks are not accepted. To verify current fees, the telephone number is (808) 586-4533. This is a recorded message. Information on how to obtain certified copies is also available via the Hawaii State Department of Health, Vital Records website.

Where to Write for Vital Records - Hawaii

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

You said it perfectly- and this is really the Birther mantra

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

 

[Roudy]

Again, why do you confuse yourself? The "one" in the so called vault, if real, should be matching identically to the one that Obama or his parents were first issued as the original. Where is Obama's original? Not the copy that he provided via the state in 2007.

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007. And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

 

[Roudy]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (You must submit one of the following. Photocopies and notarized copies are not acceptable):

• Previously issued, undamaged, and fully valid U.S. Passport (5 year for minors or 10 years for adults)
• Certified U.S. birth certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by the City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
  • Photocopies and notarized copies are unacceptable
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
• Naturalization Certificate
• Certificate of Citizenship

First Time Applicants

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Birth


Event: Birth

Cost of copy: $10.00

Address:
State Department of Health
Office of Health Status Monitoring
Vital Records Section
P.O. Box 3378
Honolulu, HI 96801-9984

Remarks: State office has some records as early as 1853. Additional copies ordered at the same time are $4.00 each.

Cashier's check, certified check, or money order should be made payable to State Department of Health. Personal checks are not accepted. To verify current fees, the telephone number is (808) 586-4533. This is a recorded message. Information on how to obtain certified copies is also available via the Hawaii State Department of Health, Vital Records website.

Where to Write for Vital Records - Hawaii

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

You said it perfectly- and this is really the Birther mantra

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

What mantra is that? Asking what happened to Obama's OWN birth certificate, not the one the state issued in 2007 makes one a birther? Ha ha ha.

 

[Roudy]

Again, why do you confuse yourself? The "one" in the so called vault, if real, should be matching identically to the one that Obama or his parents were first issued as the original. Where is Obama's original? Not the copy that he provided via the state in 2007.

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Says you. Prove that Obama's parents were issued an 'original birth certificate'. You can't. Its just you, citing you. And you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Worse, the State Department contradicts on what is required to get a passport. Recognzing that a certified copy of a birth certificate is perfectly fine. Even linking to the CDC which links to Hawaii....where they issue certified copies.

You're literally offering us your imagination as evidence. Imagining that Obama has an original birth certificate. Imagining that the State Department won't accept a certified copy.

And for no particular reason, ignoring Hawaii, the State Department and the CDC on Obama's original vital documents. Hell, you've even ignored your own sources that affirmed that original vital documents are held by the State that issued them.

Your willful ignorance is not evidence. You can't get around that.

How about this, where is Obama "certified copy" pre 2007? Did he not have one, was it lost?

I never said a certified copy doesn't replace an original, legally speaking. A copy is a copy OF THE ORIGINAL, that either the state holds or the individual, or both.

 

[Skylar]

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Says you. Prove that Obama's parents were issued an 'original birth certificate'. You can't. Its just you, citing you. And you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Worse, the State Department contradicts on what is required to get a passport. Recognzing that a certified copy of a birth certificate is perfectly fine. Even linking to the CDC which links to Hawaii....where they issue certified copies.

You're literally offering us your imagination as evidence. Imagining that Obama has an original birth certificate. Imagining that the State Department won't accept a certified copy.

And for no particular reason, ignoring Hawaii, the State Department and the CDC on Obama's original vital documents. Hell, you've even ignored your own sources that affirmed that original vital documents are held by the State that issued them.

Your willful ignorance is not evidence. You can't get around that.

How about this, where is Obama "certified copy" pre 2007? Did he not have one, was it lost?

As you already know, it was sent to Factcheck.org who posted numerous pictures of it that you can view right now:

Born in the U.S.A.

This from 2008. With the State of Hawaii affirming both that they issued such a COLB and that Obama was born in Hawaii.

All of which you'll ignore...because you're a birther. But again, your willful ignorance isn't evidence. Rendering your perspective meaningless gibberish.

I never said a certified copy doesn't replace an original, legally speaking. A copy is a copy OF THE ORIGINAL, that either the state holds or the individual, or both.

Your own sources affirm that the state holds the originals. This from 'VISA HQ', your source. With the State of Hawaii affirming that they have Obama's original vital records.. You're literally ignoring the State Department, the CDC, the State of Hawaii and your own sources to cling to your little turd of a conspiracy.

Which is why you're a birther.

 

[Skylar]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (You must submit one of the following. Photocopies and notarized copies are not acceptable):

• Previously issued, undamaged, and fully valid U.S. Passport (5 year for minors or 10 years for adults)
• Certified U.S. birth certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by the City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
  • Photocopies and notarized copies are unacceptable
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
• Naturalization Certificate
• Certificate of Citizenship

First Time Applicants

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Birth


Event: Birth

Cost of copy: $10.00

Address:
State Department of Health
Office of Health Status Monitoring
Vital Records Section
P.O. Box 3378
Honolulu, HI 96801-9984

Remarks: State office has some records as early as 1853. Additional copies ordered at the same time are $4.00 each.

Cashier's check, certified check, or money order should be made payable to State Department of Health. Personal checks are not accepted. To verify current fees, the telephone number is (808) 586-4533. This is a recorded message. Information on how to obtain certified copies is also available via the Hawaii State Department of Health, Vital Records website.

Where to Write for Vital Records - Hawaii

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

You said it perfectly- and this is really the Birther mantra

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

What mantra is that? Asking what happened to Obama's OWN birth certificate, not the one the state issued in 2007 makes one a birther? Ha ha ha.

Insisting that you'll only accept an answer from Obama....who you've already insisted you can't trust and you'll ignore.

That's just batshit crazy.

And of course, ignoring the State of Hawaii on its own vital documents, despite your OWN SOURCES affirming that the State holds the original vital documents. You're literally offering us your own willful ignorance as evidence.

Which is even batshit crazier.

 

[Skylar]

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007.

Your claim is that Obama has an original. If its a 'fact', it will be remarkably easy to prove.

If you're talking about of your ass about a topic you clearly don't understand, then you'll just give us excuses why you can't.

I won't hold my breath.

And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

First off, absolute bullshit. His COLB is still on the White House website. He gave a press conference on the topic in April of 2011.




Making your claims either useless ignorance, or naked lies. Either renders you a piss poor source.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just conclude that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Second, you've already insisted that you don't believe Obama. Making your babble about what 'obama said' more hysteric nonsennse. As you've already committed to ignoring the very source you're demanding.

That's crazy.

Third, the State of hawaii already affirmed his place of birth as Hawaii. You simply ignore the State of Hawaii for no particular reason. And make up whatever batshit you wish. That's not an argument. That's imagination.

 

[Syriusly]

The original birth certificate is in the vault in Hawaii- as the State of Hawaii says.

That is the original.

Everything else is just a certified copy.

And every single certified copy- and original- is legal proof of anyone's place of birth.

Not that you will believe anything but your preconceived notions.

Such is the lot of a Birther.

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007. And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

Why would he have ever mentioned a missing copy of his birth certificate? As I said before- I don't have a clue where the copy I had originally is- haven't seen it in decades. IF for any bizarre reason I needed one now, I would request a certified copy. And no one would care what happened to the missing certified copy.

Whatever he may have had originally is frankly immaterial- if there were ever any discrepancy between the two- the original on file in Hawaii would be the actual legal evidence.

And you have seen a copy of the original on file in Hawaii- and you refuse to believe it.

And you refuse to believe anything Obama tells you.

Hence you are as doomed to frustration as every 9/11 Truther.

 

[Roudy]

Wrong. The state issues an original shortly after a child's birth, usually upon request. The birth certificate and information provided by the state on behalf of Obama occurred in 2007. So where is his prior, perhaps original birth certificate that was used to obtain his first U.S. passport?

Passport Requirements for United States Passports

Passport requirements - proof of US citizenship
You can prove your US citizenship with one of the following:

• Original Birth Certificate (if born in the United States);
• or Old (undamaged) passport;
• or Original Certificate of Citizenship or FS-240, DS-1350 ( if born outside the US );
• or Original Certificate of Naturalization issued by the Immigration and Naturalization Office.

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007.

Your claim is that Obama has an original. If its a 'fact', it will be remarkably easy to prove.

If you're talking about of your ass about a topic you clearly don't understand, then you'll just give us excuses why you can't.

I won't hold my breath.

And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

First off, absolute bullshit. His COLB is still on the White House website. He gave a press conference on the topic in April of 2011.




Making your claims either useless ignorance, or naked lies. Either renders you a piss poor source.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just conclude that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Second, you've already insisted that you don't believe Obama. Making your babble about what 'obama said' more hysteric nonsennse. As you've already committed to ignoring the very source you're demanding.

That's crazy.

Third, the State of hawaii already affirmed his place of birth as Hawaii. You simply ignore the State of Hawaii for no particular reason. And make up whatever batshit you wish. That's not an argument. That's imagination.

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

 

[Syriusly]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (You must submit one of the following. Photocopies and notarized copies are not acceptable):

• Previously issued, undamaged, and fully valid U.S. Passport (5 year for minors or 10 years for adults)
• Certified U.S. birth certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by the City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
  • Photocopies and notarized copies are unacceptable
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
• Naturalization Certificate
• Certificate of Citizenship

First Time Applicants

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Birth


Event: Birth

Cost of copy: $10.00

Address:
State Department of Health
Office of Health Status Monitoring
Vital Records Section
P.O. Box 3378
Honolulu, HI 96801-9984

Remarks: State office has some records as early as 1853. Additional copies ordered at the same time are $4.00 each.

Cashier's check, certified check, or money order should be made payable to State Department of Health. Personal checks are not accepted. To verify current fees, the telephone number is (808) 586-4533. This is a recorded message. Information on how to obtain certified copies is also available via the Hawaii State Department of Health, Vital Records website.

Where to Write for Vital Records - Hawaii

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

You said it perfectly- and this is really the Birther mantra

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

What mantra is that? Asking what happened to Obama's OWN birth certificate, not the one the state issued in 2007 makes one a birther? Ha ha ha.

Barack Obama's own birth certificate is on file in Hawaii.

Asking where the original is, after the State of Hawaii has told you, is part of the Birther Mantra to always rely upon speculation, innuendo and lies- and ignore any official documents or sources.

 

[Syriusly]

You shouldn't rely upon an unreliable third party business for your information.

Here is what the State Department says is required- note- no requirement of an original birth certificate- there is a requirement for an original(not photocopy) of a certified U.S. Birth Certificate.

The birth certificate issued by Hawaii in 2007 to Obama meets those requirements, as does the certified photocopy Hawaii gave Obama in 2011
.
How to Apply for a Passport

Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
You must submit one of the following original documents as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship (photocopies are not acceptable):

• Certified U.S. Birth Certificate (must meet all of the following requirements):
  • Issued by City, County, or State of birth
  • Lists bearer's full name, date of birth, and place of birth
  • Lists parent(s) full names
  • Has date filed with registrar's office (must be within one year of birth)
  • Has registrar's signature
  • Has embossed, impressed, or multicolored seal of registrar
• Previous U.S. Passport (may be expired, must be undamaged)
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization/Citizenship

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007.

Your claim is that Obama has an original. If its a 'fact', it will be remarkably easy to prove.

If you're talking about of your ass about a topic you clearly don't understand, then you'll just give us excuses why you can't.

I won't hold my breath.

And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

First off, absolute bullshit. His COLB is still on the White House website. He gave a press conference on the topic in April of 2011.




Making your claims either useless ignorance, or naked lies. Either renders you a piss poor source.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just conclude that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Second, you've already insisted that you don't believe Obama. Making your babble about what 'obama said' more hysteric nonsennse. As you've already committed to ignoring the very source you're demanding.

That's crazy.

Third, the State of hawaii already affirmed his place of birth as Hawaii. You simply ignore the State of Hawaii for no particular reason. And make up whatever batshit you wish. That's not an argument. That's imagination.

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

So you are ignoring every point Skylar made?

 

[Skylar]

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

The evidence doesn't say one way or the other. What is proven is that he got a certified copy in 2007...the State of Hawaii affirms he got a certified copy. And the State of Hawaii affirms that they have the original vital documents. And that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Just shredding your entire argument.

As for your 'decision', its meaningless. The moment you made up an 'original birth certificate held by Obama', you proved that evidence isn't your standard. A fact you've reiterated repeatedly by ignoring your own source, ignoring the State Department, ignoring the CDC, and of course, ignoring every Hawaii State Offical and document produced by Hawaii.

You simply don't let evidence effect your beliefs. A rational person does.

 

[Roudy]

Oh, and here's the US government's requirements for establishing US citizenship for a passport:

All of which are met by a certified copy. A fact only emphasized by the fact that when you click on Birth Certificate it directs you to the CDC website which provides the following information for birth certificates for the State of Hawaii:

Where you get a (gasp) certified copy.

When they say 'original' birth certificate, they mean it can't be a photocopy or notarized copy of an official document. It has to be an official document itself. In the case of a birth certificate, a certified copy issued by the State that has the original vital records.

This according the US government. Which explicitly contradicts you.

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

He is such a Birther.

He whines about how he believes Obama is a total liar- and how he can't believe anything he says.

And then demands that Obama explain why Obama has not released a document that only Roudy says he must have.

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

You said it perfectly- and this is really the Birther mantra

Absolutely. Demanding an explanation for a source he's already sworn he'll ignore. And of course, ignoring any official from the State of Hawaii or any document produce by Hawaii because its not the source he's sworn he'll ignore.

Its a perfect circle of bullshit. His argument is literally that he will only accept verification and information from sources he will ignore.

You can't teach that kind of batshit. Its something that has to be bred into you over generations.

What mantra is that? Asking what happened to Obama's OWN birth certificate, not the one the state issued in 2007 makes one a birther? Ha ha ha.

Barack Obama's own birth certificate is on file in Hawaii.

Asking where the original is, after the State of Hawaii has told you, is part of the Birther Mantra to always rely upon speculation, innuendo and lies- and ignore any official documents or sources.

Don't be ignorant. Obama and / or his parents must had a birth certificate in order to obtain a passport. Obviously the birth certificate mentions US as country / place of birth otherwise he would not have been issued a US passport in the first place. I am just interested in seeing that birth certificate and comparing that, to the one that was presented to the public in 2007 by the state. I am also interested in why Obama asked the state to issue a certified copy, and didn't present his own, nor has he mentioned that if he had / has one in his possession. Very strange and perplexing.

 

[Roudy]

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

The evidence doesn't say one way or the other. What is proven is that he got a certified copy in 2007...the State of Hawaii affirms he got a certified copy. And the State of Hawaii affirms that they have the original vital documents. And that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Just shredding your entire argument.

As for your 'decision', its meaningless. The moment you made up an 'original birth certificate held by Obama', you proved that evidence isn't your standard. A fact you've reiterated repeatedly by ignoring your own source, ignoring the State Department, ignoring the CDC, and of course, ignoring every Hawaii State Offical and document produced by Hawaii.

You simply don't let evidence effect your beliefs. A rational person does.

Original birth certificates are issued to US born individuals as well. The original is supposed to match what the state has. And that's what I'm interesting in seeing, especially when there is a controversy about the place of birth, or whether documents have been forged.

 

[Skylar]

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

The evidence doesn't say one way or the other. What is proven is that he got a certified copy in 2007...the State of Hawaii affirms he got a certified copy. And the State of Hawaii affirms that they have the original vital documents. And that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Just shredding your entire argument.

As for your 'decision', its meaningless. The moment you made up an 'original birth certificate held by Obama', you proved that evidence isn't your standard. A fact you've reiterated repeatedly by ignoring your own source, ignoring the State Department, ignoring the CDC, and of course, ignoring every Hawaii State Offical and document produced by Hawaii.

You simply don't let evidence effect your beliefs. A rational person does.

Original birth certificates are issued to US born individuals as well.

Prove that Obama has an original birth certificate.

 

[Roudy]

That doesn't negate the fact that U.S. Born citizens are issued an original. You are simply wrong and uninformed.

Your bizarre personal opinion does not constitute a fact.

You have shown you to be as wrong and uninformed in this thread as every Birther is.

If as you claim you actually work with birth certificates, I cannot imagine how many clients you have screwed over because of your ignorance.

My opinion is based on fact, that Obama asked the state to issue a copy, which occurred in 2007.

Your claim is that Obama has an original. If its a 'fact', it will be remarkably easy to prove.

If you're talking about of your ass about a topic you clearly don't understand, then you'll just give us excuses why you can't.

I won't hold my breath.

And he never showed or mentioned anything about an original or copy that he may have had in the past. So where's his original or copy that was used to get a passport, apply for govt. jobs, etc. Did he not have one ever? Why not show your's to show that it matches the state records?

First off, absolute bullshit. His COLB is still on the White House website. He gave a press conference on the topic in April of 2011.




Making your claims either useless ignorance, or naked lies. Either renders you a piss poor source.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just conclude that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Second, you've already insisted that you don't believe Obama. Making your babble about what 'obama said' more hysteric nonsennse. As you've already committed to ignoring the very source you're demanding.

That's crazy.

Third, the State of hawaii already affirmed his place of birth as Hawaii. You simply ignore the State of Hawaii for no particular reason. And make up whatever batshit you wish. That's not an argument. That's imagination.

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

So you are ignoring every point Skylar made?

The point both you and he have made over and over, is that Obama was issued a certified copy BY THE STATE and THE STATE verified the copy by comparing it to the THE STATE'S original. I am not contesting that claim and taking it as face value until proven otherwise. However, my point is, where was Obama's past original or certified birth certificate, and why hasn't he said anything about it's status?

 

[Roudy]

So Obama never held an original or certified copy, prior to 2007? I'll make my decision when I see or hear what Obama says about his own birth certificate.

The evidence doesn't say one way or the other. What is proven is that he got a certified copy in 2007...the State of Hawaii affirms he got a certified copy. And the State of Hawaii affirms that they have the original vital documents. And that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Just shredding your entire argument.

As for your 'decision', its meaningless. The moment you made up an 'original birth certificate held by Obama', you proved that evidence isn't your standard. A fact you've reiterated repeatedly by ignoring your own source, ignoring the State Department, ignoring the CDC, and of course, ignoring every Hawaii State Offical and document produced by Hawaii.

You simply don't let evidence effect your beliefs. A rational person does.

Original birth certificates are issued to US born individuals as well.

Prove that Obama has an original birth certificate.

Easy. He would have had to have an original or certified copy pre 2007 in order to get US passport, a govt. job, etc. Where is that pre 2007 birth certificate, and / or what is it's status?