Trump thinks he can change the Constitution via EO

[MACAULAY]

Source: CNBC.COM original story on Axios
Trump wants to sign an order to end birthright citizenship, setting up a constitutional battle

"President Donald Trump is planning to terminate birthright citizenship, according to a report by Axios, potentially setting up another stand-off between the U.S. president and the courts.

Trump plans to sign an executive order that would remove the right to citizenship for babies of non-citizens and unauthorized immigrants born on U.S. soil, he said Monday, according to Axios which used the exclusive interview to promote a new documentary series called "Axios on HBO."

"This would be the most dramatic move yet in Trump's hardline immigration campaign, this time targeting 'anchor babies' and 'chain migration'," Axios said in its report.


Trump's comments come as he continues to push a hard anti-immigration line ahead of the midterms this month, and many experts will highlight that it's not within the president's power to change birthright citizenship.

"It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump reportedly said, declaring he can do it by using an executive order.

Trump said he had run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed, despite likely controversy. However, during the same interview Trump expressed surprise that Axios knew about his secret plan: "I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one," he said."

Let the fun, games and gnashing of teeth begin.

This should be an interesting court battle if President Twitter follows through with the Executive Order since the courts have never ruled on the question of whether or not the 14th Amendment applies to illegal immigrants or foreigners with temporary legal status.

Personally I don't think he's going to win this battle but I guess we'll see.

"May you live in interesting times" -- Chinese Curse

I've often wondered why we didn't do this. If people are here illegally, why should their children be legal? It is a whole 'nother matter if the parents are here legally but not yet citizens.
I think there will be a Constitutional question about it, but why wouldn't an Amendment like that pass? Everyone says they don't support illegal immigration. So why would they support these children becoming US citizens?

_____

Finally, a Lucid Interval.

 

[Flash]

The filthy ass Liberals think they can negate the Bill of Rights by infringing upon the right to keep and bear arms on the state and local level. They also try to circumvent free speech and freedom of religion when it interferes with the left's agenda to make the US a socialist shithole.

That asshole Obama had no problem using EOs to circumvent anything standing in the way of his vile anti American agenda.

 

[candycorn]

I disagree with the calculus. Tinkering with the Constitution is disastrous. The hardcore Trump supporters may be on board...suburban soccer moms? No.

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

 

[Weatherman2020]

Trump plans to sign executive order ending birthright citizenship: Axios

More red meat for the masses. Even he is not stupid enough to think this will work.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

Americans love a President who’s not afraid to fight for what they believe is right. SCOTUS will rule on it.

In the meantime we get a week of the left screaming for more anchor babies.

 

[martybegan]

The "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" part.

Nope. It's never been adjudicated. It will be now, though. Guaranteeed.

it has been partially, but the case considered legal visitors to the US.

 

[skews13]

No upside for Trump I meant

Sure there is, he's getting his base fired up right before the mid terms on his signature issue, whether he follows through on this EO or not, the timing is purely political.

I thought it was kind of funny that during the interview he played coy about being surprised that Axios knew about the EO, I'd be willing to bet he's the one that ordered it to be leaked.

I disagree with the calculus. Tinkering with the Constitution is disastrous. The hardcore Trump supporters may be on board...suburban soccer moms? No.

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

No. He didn’t. And the only people that believe that are Trumpanzees.

Moot point. With a week before the election, only Trumpanzees care about the caravan. Nobody else, and that includes the majority of women, independents, seniors, minorities, and young voters do.

It’s all about healthcare, and Republicans taking it away, cutting social security and Medicare, and giving tax cuts to billionaires, that they don’t agree with, and curiously enough, Republicans are not running on.

 

[martybegan]

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

And a team can get more hits than the other and still lose a baseball game.

Runs matter in baseball, EV's (States) matter in Presidential Elections.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

The 14th ammendment was intended for slaves, people who came here against their will.

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject the jurisdiction thereof are citizens of the United States"

How the fuck is the Orange Ogre going to change that with an EO? . Show us where it says anything about slaves. If that was the intent it would say so. I don't believe that people can be this stupid​

You're even slower than I thought.

OK smart ass. Explain your legal theory that would allow him to do this.

There is no legal theory allowing him to do this.

Doing this merely moves the matter to the courts, and eventually to the SCOTUS, which is his intent. A clarification of "under the jurisdiction thereof" has long been needed.

That is almost a reasonable answer. However, there are problems with it. The courts have thus far ruled that the only people not " subject to the jurisdiction...…." are those who are subject to a foreign jurisdiction, such as agents of foreign governments and their children. I am hard pressed as to how the SCOTUS can get around the wording of the 14thwith regards to those who are clearly "subject to the jurisdiction"

Legislation would be equally problematic. I do believe that a Constitutional Amendment is necessary.

In addition, I don't think that Trump is smart enough or has the patience to go the long rout. He actually thinks that he can do this with an EO

What Does "Subject to the Jurisdiction" Mean? (with pictures)

 

[BrokeLoser]

Trump plans to sign executive order ending birthright citizenship: Axios

More red meat for the masses. Even he is not stupid enough to think this will work.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Learned what works from his predecessors. That such extra-constitutional maneuvers worked for them with a collective shrug of the shoulders does not excuse such an act but is indicative of the very old partisan game of 'its ok so long as my guy does it".

and that mentality is what built this shitpile of a gov we're in today. wrong is wrong and i don't care which side does it. if we are having such a problem working together that we have to take short cuts to get what OUR SIDE wants then that should be a HUGE FRIGGIN FLAG of what we need to fix first.

Again, that all sounds noble, it makes me warm and fuzzy inside...but FUCK warm and fuzzy...it’s time to do the right thing for the right people by ANY MEANS NECESSARY!

so you seem to be saying it's ok to do bullshit things as long as you get what you want.

gee. how did this bucket of shit become an ocean again???

If good Americans will clearly be the sole beneficiary then FUCK YES....By any means necessary!

 

[Wyatt earp]

Was it ever challenged in court the way people interpret it today?

It had to be

Nope. It's never been adjudicated. Ever.

Something else, and this is a more recent trend, I think about 7 countries have also revoked birthright citizenship over the last 20 years.

So the 2nd has been challenged a 10,000 times plus but not this part of the 14th interesting ..

 

[Meathead]

Yes there is an upside, if SCOTUS rules in favor of birthright citizenship for the children of illegals/temporary legal status (which I suspect it would) then Stare Decisis will be on the side of those children and they have much less to worry about when it comes to having their citizenship yanked by some future Executive and/or Congress.

No upside for Trump I meant

Sure there is, he's getting his base fired up right before the mid terms on his signature issue, whether he follows through on this EO or not, the timing is purely political.

I thought it was kind of funny that during the interview he played coy about being surprised that Axios knew about the EO, I'd be willing to bet he's the one that ordered it to be leaked.

I disagree with the calculus. Tinkering with the Constitution is disastrous. The hardcore Trump supporters may be on board...suburban soccer moms? No.

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Can you say "Supreme Court"?

 

[iceberg]

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

what the fuck is up with all the pyrrhic victories? never has this mattered and it doesn't matter here. it just seems to be a way to keep warm in your loss.

 

[Coyote]

Source: CNBC.COM original story on Axios
Trump wants to sign an order to end birthright citizenship, setting up a constitutional battle

"President Donald Trump is planning to terminate birthright citizenship, according to a report by Axios, potentially setting up another stand-off between the U.S. president and the courts.

Trump plans to sign an executive order that would remove the right to citizenship for babies of non-citizens and unauthorized immigrants born on U.S. soil, he said Monday, according to Axios which used the exclusive interview to promote a new documentary series called "Axios on HBO."

"This would be the most dramatic move yet in Trump's hardline immigration campaign, this time targeting 'anchor babies' and 'chain migration'," Axios said in its report.


Trump's comments come as he continues to push a hard anti-immigration line ahead of the midterms this month, and many experts will highlight that it's not within the president's power to change birthright citizenship.

"It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump reportedly said, declaring he can do it by using an executive order.

Trump said he had run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed, despite likely controversy. However, during the same interview Trump expressed surprise that Axios knew about his secret plan: "I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one," he said."

Let the fun, games and gnashing of teeth begin.

This should be an interesting court battle if President Twitter follows through with the Executive Order since the courts have never ruled on the question of whether or not the 14th Amendment applies to illegal immigrants or foreigners with temporary legal status.

Personally I don't think he's going to win this battle but I guess we'll see.

"May you live in interesting times" -- Chinese Curse

I hope not.

The idea that a president, any president can overturn a constitutional amendment by EO should scare the shit out of us.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Trump plans to sign executive order ending birthright citizenship: Axios

More red meat for the masses. Even he is not stupid enough to think this will work.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

SCOTUS Baby! Hang on to your pussyhat.

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

Where is the interpretation wiggle room in that?

Its been explained already. Illegals are not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States.

Mark

Oh? An illegal in our country is not subject to our laws?

Subject to our laws YES....subject to benefit via Constitution...FUCK NO!

 

[Wyatt earp]

Of course you do but then again you probably disagreed with the same "calculus" when Trump was doing the same "fire up the base on immigration" dance during the 2016 campaign, right? Seems to have worked for him then and I suspect the Presidents political advisors are in a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mode.

.. and there is no "Tinkering with the Constitution" going on, if he does actually do this EO (big IF) then it's just going to force SCOTUS to provide an interpretation of the 14th Amendment, which is something that is well within the purview of SCOTUS according to the current standards of judicial review, or do you not agree with SCOTUS having the authority to do judicial review?

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

Release the states voter data and it will be proven it was 3 million illegals.


.

 

[iceberg]

Trump plans to sign executive order ending birthright citizenship: Axios

More red meat for the masses. Even he is not stupid enough to think this will work.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Learned what works from his predecessors. That such extra-constitutional maneuvers worked for them with a collective shrug of the shoulders does not excuse such an act but is indicative of the very old partisan game of 'its ok so long as my guy does it".

and that mentality is what built this shitpile of a gov we're in today. wrong is wrong and i don't care which side does it. if we are having such a problem working together that we have to take short cuts to get what OUR SIDE wants then that should be a HUGE FRIGGIN FLAG of what we need to fix first.

Again, that all sounds noble, it makes me warm and fuzzy inside...but FUCK warm and fuzzy...it’s time to do the right thing for the right people by ANY MEANS NECESSARY!

so you seem to be saying it's ok to do bullshit things as long as you get what you want.

gee. how did this bucket of shit become an ocean again???

If good Americans will clearly be the sole beneficiary then FUCK YES....By any means necessary!

gee. and *the other side* feels the same way.

how again do we resolve this conflict?

 

[Natural Citizen]

it has been partially, but the case considered legal visitors to the US.

Not really. United States vs Wong Kim Ark was a case specific to a legal immigrant who was not eligible for citizenship.

It had nothing to do with automatic birthright citizenship of children of illegal immigrants. Nothing at all.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

what the fuck is up with all the pyrrhic victories? never has this mattered and it doesn't matter here. it just seems to be a way to keep warm in your loss.

Only because of Commiefornia. Without it, Trump wins by a million.

 

[candycorn]

He lost the PV and won the EC by 80,000 votes in 3 states. I hope they do try to overturn the Constitution by EO. What’s next? No more 1st Amendment?

Lib please Trump won the popular vote by 1 million votes in 49 of the 50 states, 30 states out right, and over 300 EC votes, Trump destroyed you.

Here is the root problem; your inability to accept facts.

The fact is your side lost, Trump is POTUS, ouch!

Hillary got 3M more votes than the blob

And a team can get more hits than the other and still lose a baseball game.

Runs matter in baseball, EV's (States) matter in Presidential Elections.

True.

It’s also true that HRC got 3M more votes than the blob. Why this triggers you guys is hilarious.

As for the political calculation of overturning the Constitution via EO, the margin was razor thin to start with. Thinking this will increase the numbers of votes you’ll get is dumb; thinking this will bind your margin is equally daft

 

[BrokeLoser]

Learned what works from his predecessors. That such extra-constitutional maneuvers worked for them with a collective shrug of the shoulders does not excuse such an act but is indicative of the very old partisan game of 'its ok so long as my guy does it".

and that mentality is what built this shitpile of a gov we're in today. wrong is wrong and i don't care which side does it. if we are having such a problem working together that we have to take short cuts to get what OUR SIDE wants then that should be a HUGE FRIGGIN FLAG of what we need to fix first.

Again, that all sounds noble, it makes me warm and fuzzy inside...but FUCK warm and fuzzy...it’s time to do the right thing for the right people by ANY MEANS NECESSARY!

so you seem to be saying it's ok to do bullshit things as long as you get what you want.

gee. how did this bucket of shit become an ocean again???

If good Americans will clearly be the sole beneficiary then FUCK YES....By any means necessary!

gee. and *the other side* feels the same way.

how again do we resolve this conflict?

NEGATIVE
The other side thinks our Constitution was written for Mexico. This isn’t complicated.