Trump's trade war with China

[Brain357]

We have lots of wealth and lots of jobs. Our problem is not trade policy.

We have generations of wage stagnation, relative to our productivity growth and previous historical trends.


Trade policy is at least part of the reason(s) for that.

Yes we do, but wealth has been growing. Were does all that wealth go?

To the stockholders and employers.


Time for the workers to get some. I would say, at least for the next 50 years, to be fair.

Correct. So we have plenty of wealth, its just going to the wrong people. That is not at all a trade problem.

It is flowing the way it is, because of the trade policy, as your post with Milton discussed.


It is going to one group of people more than it has been to others, for quite some time.


At the very least, is it the turn of the others, for at least the next 60 years, to be fair.

You can't tie our wages to trade policy. China isn't telling our companies to pay little. That is an internal issue.

 

[Brain357]

Our wage problems are much closer to home.

A federal judge has approved a $415 million settlement that ends a lengthy legal saga revolving around allegations that Apple, Google and several other Silicon Valley companies illegally conspired to prevent their workers from getting better job offers.

The case focused on a “no-poaching” pact prohibiting Apple, Google and other major employers from recruiting each other’s workers. Lawyers for the employees argued the secret agreement illegally suppressed the wages of the affected workers.

Judge approves settlement in Apple, Google wage case

 

[Brain357]

Another way wages are being help down, not trades fault.
Non-Compete Clauses Are Strangling Our Lowest Paid Workers

 

[Brain357]

Again, the problem is right here:

Right-to-work is wrong for Missouri: A breadth of national evidence shows why Missouri voters should reject RTW law

RTW laws are associated with lower wages and benefits for both union and nonunion workers. In RTW states, the average worker makes 3.1 percent less in hourly wages than the average worker with similar characteristics in non-RTW states. This pattern of lower wages in RTW states is also true for women workers and workers of color.

 

[Brain357]

And more internal problems:
Does Monopoly Power Explain Workers’ Stagnant Wages?

 

[danielpalos]

Our wage problems are much closer to home.

A federal judge has approved a $415 million settlement that ends a lengthy legal saga revolving around allegations that Apple, Google and several other Silicon Valley companies illegally conspired to prevent their workers from getting better job offers.

The case focused on a “no-poaching” pact prohibiting Apple, Google and other major employers from recruiting each other’s workers. Lawyers for the employees argued the secret agreement illegally suppressed the wages of the affected workers.

Judge approves settlement in Apple, Google wage case

should we get into equality and conspire to suppress CEO wages?

 

[danielpalos]

Again, the problem is right here:

Right-to-work is wrong for Missouri: A breadth of national evidence shows why Missouri voters should reject RTW law

RTW laws are associated with lower wages and benefits for both union and nonunion workers. In RTW states, the average worker makes 3.1 percent less in hourly wages than the average worker with similar characteristics in non-RTW states. This pattern of lower wages in RTW states is also true for women workers and workers of color.

Labor should have an actual Right to Work in those States.

 

[Paulie]

The Chinese are patient, and Xi Jinping is a very patient man. They are used to five, ten, and twenty year plans. Xi is also politically savvy. He knows Trump is a very unpopular President and is getting more unpopular everyday as his trade war becomes more serious..Because of his 15% tariff, prices on popular consumer goods go up big time beginning Sept. 1.

Trump has until November 2020 to make some progress. So far his trade war has been disastrous, and Wall Street has been treading water since Jan. 2018. Today, even Trump is concerned about a possible recession.

All Xi has to do is wait him out. Actually, in Chinese terms, Xi doesn't have long to wait. Thirteen months, that is thirteen seconds on the Chinese clock.

Wait him out for WHAT exactly? What is Xi hoping to gain in this?

Xi is hoping to get a new president that is more reasonable and willing to negotiate and does not conduct diplomacy via tweets.

I sincerely hope this is true. I am pretty damn confident that it is not.

It looks to me that XI is looking to restore China as the premier world power. Limiting US control over international markets and putting China there would basically achieve this. The reason that the US can essentially bully the world into doing what is in the interest of the US is because the planet's economy is tied to us. IF Trump had leveraged the rest of our allies to address China's bad faith trade policies then he may have forced them to the table. What Trump has done instead is try and take them on 1 to 1 and they are responding by shoring up their position in the global economy instead of ours.

I no longer thing that Xi really wants a deal with the US. I think he would rather see us isolated so that China can exert much more influence on the rest of the world.

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Wait him out for WHAT exactly? What is Xi hoping to gain in this?

Xi is hoping to get a new president that is more reasonable and willing to negotiate and does not conduct diplomacy via tweets.

I sincerely hope this is true. I am pretty damn confident that it is not.

It looks to me that XI is looking to restore China as the premier world power. Limiting US control over international markets and putting China there would basically achieve this. The reason that the US can essentially bully the world into doing what is in the interest of the US is because the planet's economy is tied to us. IF Trump had leveraged the rest of our allies to address China's bad faith trade policies then he may have forced them to the table. What Trump has done instead is try and take them on 1 to 1 and they are responding by shoring up their position in the global economy instead of ours.

I no longer thing that Xi really wants a deal with the US. I think he would rather see us isolated so that China can exert much more influence on the rest of the world.

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

 

[FA_Q2]

China's bad actions are pretty obvious. That you ignore them only tells me you are not interested in honest discussion.

That you ignore the US' bad actions tells me you don't understand international trade.

edit...By 'bad actions' I mean arbitrarily increasing tariffs on allies using spurious 'national security' concerns as an excuse to break agreements. How bad can a trade partner get?

Except I have not ignored our bad actions.

 

[Paulie]

Xi is hoping to get a new president that is more reasonable and willing to negotiate and does not conduct diplomacy via tweets.

I sincerely hope this is true. I am pretty damn confident that it is not.

It looks to me that XI is looking to restore China as the premier world power. Limiting US control over international markets and putting China there would basically achieve this. The reason that the US can essentially bully the world into doing what is in the interest of the US is because the planet's economy is tied to us. IF Trump had leveraged the rest of our allies to address China's bad faith trade policies then he may have forced them to the table. What Trump has done instead is try and take them on 1 to 1 and they are responding by shoring up their position in the global economy instead of ours.

I no longer thing that Xi really wants a deal with the US. I think he would rather see us isolated so that China can exert much more influence on the rest of the world.

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

 

[danielpalos]

I sincerely hope this is true. I am pretty damn confident that it is not.

It looks to me that XI is looking to restore China as the premier world power. Limiting US control over international markets and putting China there would basically achieve this. The reason that the US can essentially bully the world into doing what is in the interest of the US is because the planet's economy is tied to us. IF Trump had leveraged the rest of our allies to address China's bad faith trade policies then he may have forced them to the table. What Trump has done instead is try and take them on 1 to 1 and they are responding by shoring up their position in the global economy instead of ours.

I no longer thing that Xi really wants a deal with the US. I think he would rather see us isolated so that China can exert much more influence on the rest of the world.

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

 

[Paulie]

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

You add literally nothing with any of your posts.

 

[Bush92]

DJT Ned’s to increase the pressure on the Chi Coms

 

[FA_Q2]

Wait him out for WHAT exactly? What is Xi hoping to gain in this?

Xi is hoping to get a new president that is more reasonable and willing to negotiate and does not conduct diplomacy via tweets.

I sincerely hope this is true. I am pretty damn confident that it is not.

It looks to me that XI is looking to restore China as the premier world power. Limiting US control over international markets and putting China there would basically achieve this. The reason that the US can essentially bully the world into doing what is in the interest of the US is because the planet's economy is tied to us. IF Trump had leveraged the rest of our allies to address China's bad faith trade policies then he may have forced them to the table. What Trump has done instead is try and take them on 1 to 1 and they are responding by shoring up their position in the global economy instead of ours.

I no longer thing that Xi really wants a deal with the US. I think he would rather see us isolated so that China can exert much more influence on the rest of the world.

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

You are supposed to use our markets as leverage to force them into it. Instead, he tried to use that leverage in mini wars with everyone at once. I cannot fathom how this is so complicated for most here. YOU DO NOT WILLINGLY FIGHT A 2 FRONT WAR. PERIOD. That is the most moronic way to do things possible.

And working so far? In what way is it working at all? We have gained absolutely nothing so far on trade anywhere. NOTHING. If Trump does manage to make real gains here I will absolutely give him credit. The fact that you have to resort to outright bullshit like "it probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians" just highlights the fact that you have nothing to support these actions. Who are my 'favorite' politicians? Who is it that I would have been falling over to support LIKE YOU ARE DOING HERE WITH A FAILED TRADE POLICY? Look in a mirror lately?

 

[danielpalos]

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.
Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

You add literally nothing with any of your posts.

women gossip; Men have arguments.

 

[Bush92]

That is long term. Short term, he wants to keep the massive trade surplus.

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.

And our "allies" were never going to back US. They are too used to the US being the world's bitch on trade.

Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

Fair trade. It’s a two way street.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Everything in the US is slowing, job growth, manufacturing orders, GDP growth and more.

You say that the market traded "sideways" for a while, well that while is now up to almost 600 days since the start of the trade war, with no real end in sight. That is a good, long while.

Ironically we had a nice jump on Thursday thanks to China saying they want to negotiate more, a stance they have never walked away from. But it is almost as if China is playing with our stock market, they do things to make it go up while they let Trump do things that drive it down.

We do not have a good track record for Trump creating deals that have been worth much. From all reports the trade deal worked out with Japan is basically the exact same thing that was in the TPP, just two years later. The USMCA is nothing more than a couple minor tweaks to NAFTA. If the deal he gets from China is like these two, then there is no way it was worth the pain.

Also, as the tariffs get higher, the US consumer gets hurt more. And none of this addresses the damage done to US Ag industry, which may have lost a major market, permanently.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.
Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

Fair trade. It’s a two way street.

Fair trade is a myth, because fair does not exist. It is something parents tell their kids to make the feel better, but most adults know that life is never fair.

 

[danielpalos]

Based on?

Why would he want to support action for the short term that is 100 percent counter to his long term goal? That is nonsensical.
Going "back?" Who said anything about going back. The US has ENORMOUS economic influence over most of the word, over virtually all of the productive world. Rather than beat China over the head with every trading partner we have, Trump goes on a bunch of trade battles with out allies at the same time as taking on China. That is asinine. He should deal with China from the greatest position of power. A position that used all the European markets as well. Instead, we are dealing with China from a weaker position than we could be in.

For someone that is supposedly sup[posed to be good at making a deal, this is the most basic rule in negotiating.

What the fuck are you supposed to do when none of them have any balls to do it? No one has had any balls to take these people on in over 20 years. Not to mention, im sure Europe’s leaders don’t get to make that decision unilaterally because of the fucking EU. It’s amazing to me that even in the face of what trump is trying to do, which seems to be working so far, you still can’t be happy. It probably infuriates you that it wasn’t one of your favorite politicians that did it instead.

In what way does what Trump is doing seem to be working?

Manufacturers are moving their operations out of China and its hurting china’s economy during a time when they’re already in a slowing economy and have already reduced their currency about as much as they can. Now they’re lowering their reserve requirement so their banks can lend out more money. Their only answer is to inflate. We have a strong economy right now that gives us leeway to weather the little downsides to tariffs in the near term and china’s facing the reality that they don’t get to just have it their way anymore and that’s why they’re meeting next month to discuss a trade deal. I don’t understand why you or anyone else is fighting this. America is finally standing up to China and the same people who we all know would’ve been gushing over this move if Obama had done it are furious about it instead. We just had Powell say yesterday that he doesn’t see a recession in the forecast, while less jobs were added then expected there were other numbers in that report that gave a rosier outlook on the economic future, and the markets are still responding favorably to all of it. The market traded sideways for a while because of uncertainty over a trade policy we haven’t see our government utilize in decades. But as they get more of a taste of the way it’s going to work out we’ve seen that the tensions have eased for investors and they’re starting to buy back in again. We’ve had tariffs on the table for over a year now and the economy is still moving and growing. This is good for EVERYONE the same way it would’ve been good for everyone if Obama had done it instead. I only wish he would’ve so wed be further along with this process already and maybe already had a better trade deal. I don’t care WHO does this, it needed to be done.

Because commerce is about trade not "gun boat diplomacy with our exorbitantly expensive superpower".

Fair trade. It’s a two way street.

how is a trade war, fair trade?