Vietnam War and question for the boomer generation

[Dayton3]

Why should they have?

Because we sacrificed almost 100,000 lives

That doesn't mean the tragic loss of those lives should've resulted in the U.S. benefiting any. That isn't the way the world tends to work.

 

[rightwinger]

Why should they have?

Because we sacrificed almost 100,000 lives

That doesn't mean the tragic loss of those lives should've resulted in the U.S. benefiting any. That isn't the way the world tends to work.

Our current military strategy in a nutshell

Deploy around the globe not benefitting the American people

 

[Dayton3]

Why should they have?

Because we sacrificed almost 100,000 lives

That doesn't mean the tragic loss of those lives should've resulted in the U.S. benefiting any. That isn't the way the world tends to work.

Our current military strategy in a nutshell

Deploy around the globe not benefitting the American people

You sound like Donald Trump and his accursed obsession with everything being "transactional".

 

[Desperado]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

 

[Dayton3]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Why do you figure that?

 

[9thIDdoc]

Why should they have?

Because we sacrificed almost 100,000 lives

That doesn't mean the tragic loss of those lives should've resulted in the U.S. benefiting any. That isn't the way the world tends to work.

Our current military strategy in a nutshell

Deploy around the globe not benefitting the American people

The government does that with "foreign aid" to a much greater extent not that you're competent to judge loss vs gain. You just like to pretend you are.

 

[Desperado]

Why should they have?

Because we sacrificed almost 100,000 lives

That doesn't mean the tragic loss of those lives should've resulted in the U.S. benefiting any. That isn't the way the world tends to work.

Our current military strategy in a nutshell

Deploy around the globe not benefitting the American people

The government does that with "foreign aid" to a much greater extent not that you're competent to judge loss vs gain. You just like to pretend you are.

Didn't your parents tell you that you cannot buy your friends?
That is exactly what we are doing with foreign aid.

 

[Desperado]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Why do you figure that?

Is there any other reason we should put American lives at risk?

 

[Dayton3]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Why do you figure that?

Is there any other reason we should put American lives at risk?

Assist American allies.

 

[Desperado]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Why do you figure that?

Is there any other reason we should put American lives at risk?

Assist American allies.

Before the wars Korea an Vietnam were are allies?
Iraq and Afghanistan were our allies

 

[9thIDdoc]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Why do you figure that?

Is there any other reason we should put American lives at risk?

"We" don't put American lives at risk. The government does, sometimes for good reason. Sometimes not. Either way the average American citizen will never know all the factors that played into a foreign policy decision and that's exactly as it should be because giving enemies critical information about what we are doing or intend to do next also puts lives at risk. The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Consc

Americans were willing to die rather than allow communists to enslave a peaceful ally who wanted no part of them.

Most were enslaved via the draft and expected to needlessly give their lives for a meaningless military escapade.

The thing I’m most proud of my Boomer Generation doing was getting rid of the the draft.

Nobody has gotten rid of the draft. It's just not presently being used. Doesn't mean it won't be back in use tomorrow or fifteen minutes from now.

There would be hell to pay if they even tried to bring it back,
No Presidential candidate could get away with supporting the draft

People said the same thing last time. Then they drafted me. Tends to make people a bit skeptical.

The nature of military service has changed in the last 50 years.
It s not as labor intensive and is more specialized and high skilled
A Volunteer service is optimal

What changes in the military is peacetime vs wartime. We have had a basically peacetime military since Vietnam. But you forget that highly skilled/trained people were prime targets of the draft and will be again. Those folks tend to be highly successful and well paid in cushy civilian employment. Do you honestly think they are going to run out and enlist for a drastic cut in pay, and horrible living conditions away from their loved ones (to possibly never see them again)? Should war come our more effeminate soldiers will be leaving the military post haste and will need to be replaced. I am-and always have been-against the draft. Nations that require slave armies to exist simply don't deserve to. If citizens are unwilling to attend to the duties and responsibilities of citizenship they deserve to become slaves to whoever will take them.

Conscription is NOT SLAVERY. You also forget (in the United States) the relationship between conscription and volunteering. That is historically a substantial number of Americans volunteered for service in part due to the existence of a draft so they would have some control over their fates.

I forget nothing. You forget that I've been there; done that and paid attention. I received my draft notice but enlisted for the very reason you state. I suspected I might be allergic to assorted chunks of metal penetrating my body. I was offered my choice of Army schools based on my scores on entrance testing but was required to commit to an additional 1-2 years service. I signed up and-following basic training-was indeed transported to my chosen school where I was promptly informed that the Army had completed it's contract by sending me to the school. I could be reassigned at any time at the army's discretion for any reason. Make no mistake, when you enter the military (government) owns you and retains the option to reclaim you for decades after you "get out". If you willfully or negligently damage yourself you will be charged with "Damaging Government Property" and penalized. Elsewhere slaves are considered an investment and are reasonably housed and fed but, as in other forms of slavery, in the military if you prove to be more a liability than an asset seriously bad things will happen to you which may include death or dismemberment.
Don't misunderstand. I do believe citizenship comes with a duty to serve the Nation if needed and would do it again if necessary and am proud of, and pleased with, my service. But signing up should always be optional rather than forced. If America is to be a free country it must not do so through slavery.

I forgot nothing. I simply did not pay attention with you to begin with.

Actually World War Two had higher percentage of draftees serving in the military than Vietnam did.

Would you suggest the U.S. should not have drafted so many millions in World War Two? Wasn't it worth it to help defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan?

I suggest that if the US had not been able to defeat Nazi Germany, and Imperial Japan without conscription she did not deserve to do so. If the people will not support and defend the Country they are citizens of, they do not deserve that country. Freedom and slavery do not mix. I believe that the people of that generation would have done just fine without conscription. They still believed in duty honor and Country. The cowards of the Vietnam era-dodged the draft and went went to Canada while others were conscripted to go in harms way in their stead. And quite a few never came back. They should have never been allowed to come back and to this day deserve to be deported. If and when the draft is restarted the cowards will simply leave again, allow others to fight and die in their place, reassured that they will be welcomed back with open arms when all the unpleasantness is over.

There has not been a war since WW2 that was worth fighting in. None of the so called wars we have been involved in since Korea was not worth any American Blood or treasure. If there still was a draft, I could understand people avoiding it, These wars play no part in making America safer or Freer

And if you had been around you would have said the same thing about any other war this country has fought. You think there is no cause that is worth risking one drop of your overly precious blood for. You are just trying to excuse cowardice rather than discussing ideology.

Ill make it easy for you, How did Korea or Vietnam make the United States more free or more secure?

Why should they have?

Because those are the only reasons the US should go to war.

Untrue. And again who are you to say so? You certainly have a right to have and express an opinion but why would anyone mistake your opinion for fact among a few hundred million other idiotic opinions? No support for your opinion?

 

[rightwinger]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

 

[rightwinger]

The government does that with "foreign aid" to a much greater extent not that you're competent to judge loss vs gain. You just like to pretend you are.

Yes I am competent and so is every other American. That is why we have the vote

It is up to the Government to convince the people they are making wise decisions

 

[Dayton3]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

How do you figure that? Would the U.S. have been better off if South Korea had been conquered by the North Koreans?

I'm pretty sure the answer is definitely no.

 

[9thIDdoc]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

Oh please. When exactly was the last time you made a policy decision for the Nation? You can vote for who you like but whoever gets elected/appointed makes the decisions. And I think you're fooling yourself if you think anyone gives a crap what your foreign policy opinions past, present or future are.

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years
At times yes and at times no. But better by far than "listening to the voice of the people" as Congress claimed to do re; Vietnam.

 

[rightwinger]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

Oh please. When exactly was the last time you made a policy decision for the Nation? You can vote for who you like but whoever gets elected/appointed makes the decisions. And I think you're fooling yourself if you think anyone gives a crap what your foreign policy opinions past, present or future are.

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years
At times yes and at times no. But better by far than "listening to the voice of the people" as Congress claimed to do re; Vietnam.

Voters made a policy decision in Vietnam

Get the Fuk out

 

[rightwinger]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

How do you figure that? Would the U.S. have been better off if South Korea had been conquered by the North Koreans?

I'm pretty sure the answer is definitely no.

We blew our policy decision when MacArthur ignored the Chinese and decided to conquer North Korea
He got his ass handed to him and cost 40,000 US lives

 

[Dayton3]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

Oh please. When exactly was the last time you made a policy decision for the Nation? You can vote for who you like but whoever gets elected/appointed makes the decisions. And I think you're fooling yourself if you think anyone gives a crap what your foreign policy opinions past, present or future are.

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years
At times yes and at times no. But better by far than "listening to the voice of the people" as Congress claimed to do re; Vietnam.

Voters made a policy decision in Vietnam

Get the Fuk out

When did they do that?

 

[Dayton3]

The job of the citizen is to elect wise leaders who will make wise decisions and ,if they fail to do this to do this, replace them with someone better.

It is up to “wise leaders” to convince the public that their decision to risk the lives of their children is justified

Trust us, we have our reasons has not worked out well over the last 50 years

How do you figure that? Would the U.S. have been better off if South Korea had been conquered by the North Koreans?

I'm pretty sure the answer is definitely no.

We blew our policy decision when MacArthur ignored the Chinese and decided to conquer North Korea
He got his ass handed to him and cost 40,000 US lives

Most Americans killed in the Korean War were killed during the two years of stalemate AFTER MacArthur was relieved of command.

And the U.S. lost 33,000 killed in the Korean War. Not 40,000.