We are experiencing the biggest scandal in America's political history right now.

[Oldestyle]

The search warrant ruling is enough authority to take them away and prepare for trial.

The former President is one of the three greatest political criminals in our history,

Americans in the future are going to spit on the memory of Trump and MAGA. He is the leader of the American Hamas.

You think a ruling from a "Magistrate" trumps the authority given to a US President to classify materials? Not your brightest post, John!

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Trump is not the final authority when he is out office.

He has no authority,

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

You think a ruling from a "Magistrate" trumps the authority given to a US President to classify materials? Not your brightest post, John!

He has no authority when out of office. He defied subpoenas. He will be convicted.

 

[Marener]

Who is it that you think Trump needed to tell? What person is the highest authority on classification required to tell what he has or hasn't classified?

We keep dancing around this, Marener and the cental issue doesn't change! The President is the ultimate authority on classification. If he wants to take home ANYTHING then he has been given that authority! Until the DOJ gets a ruling from the Supreme Court negating that authority then it exists and Trump was well within his rights to tell that Grand Jury to go pound sand! Unlike Hunter Biden's illegal ignoring of a subpoena Donald Trump has the authority to ignore that Grand Jury subpoena!

It’s not relevant whether he’s the ultimate authority on anything. What’s relevant is what he did or didn’t do with that authority.

You are dancing around the fact that no one was told that these documents were declassified or person and no one in their right minds would have any reason to think these highly classified military documents had been declassified or were somehow personal documents.

And since the DoJ is certainly in their right mind, they behaved perfectly rationally by recovering these documents by subpoena and when that failed by search warrant.

 

[Oldestyle]

It’s not relevant whether he’s the ultimate authority on anything. What’s relevant is what he did or didn’t do with that authority.

You are dancing around the fact that no one was told that these documents were declassified or person and no one in their right minds would have any reason to think these highly classified military documents had been declassified or were somehow personal documents.

And since the DoJ is certainly in their right mind, they behaved perfectly rationally by recovering these documents by subpoena and when that failed by search warrant.

You keep making the point that Trump was somehow required to tell someone that he was declassifying documents but you can't seem to decide who that person would be! Who does the President have to get approval from when it comes to the classification of documents?

As for the DOJ's behavior? Showing up with a Swat team armed with assault weapons over a documents dispute between the National Archives and a former President of the United States is "rational" to you? LOL Wow!!!!!!!!!

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

No, Oldestyle, you can't reframe the discussion.
,
It s "obstruction of justice." He had no authority to defy the subpoenas and to lie about what he had in his possession and when.

He had no presidential immunity, which evaporated when he left office.

Watch SCOTUS put an end to that immunity nonsense ric tick.

 

[Marener]

You keep making the point that Trump was somehow required to tell someone that he was declassifying documents but you can't seem to decide who that person would be! Who does the President have to get approval from when it comes to the classification of documents?

As for the DOJ's behavior? Showing up with a Swat team armed with assault weapons over a documents dispute between the National Archives and a former President of the United States is "rational" to you? LOL Wow!!!!!!!!!

I never said he needed anyone‘s approval, but the fact remains that declassifying information is pretty meaningless unless he tells someone. The government would need to know what has been declassified in order to be able to respond to FOIA requests as well as protect national security from the effects of this declassification.

The DoJ was treating the documents as highly classified state secrets because that’s exactly what they appeared to be and to this day we have no reason to believe otherwise. It is very very very rational to execute a search warrant to get these documents back. This is a national security issue.

 

[Oldestyle]

No, Oldestyle, you can't reframe the discussion.
,
It s "obstruction of justice." He had no authority to defy the subpoenas and to lie about what he had in his possession and when.

He had no presidential immunity, which evaporated when he left office.

Watch SCOTUS put an end to that immunity nonsense ric tick.

When those boxes were packed and shipped to Florida? Was Donald Trump still President? The answer to that is yes which means he totally had the authority to have those documents in his possession! What you on the left want to do is go back and take that authority away retroactively. It doesn't work that way!

 

[Oldestyle]

I never said he needed anyone‘s approval, but the fact remains that declassifying information is pretty meaningless unless he tells someone. The government would need to know what has been declassified in order to be able to respond to FOIA requests as well as protect national security from the effects of this declassification.

The DoJ was treating the documents as highly classified state secrets because that’s exactly what they appeared to be and to this day we have no reason to believe otherwise. It is very very very rational to execute a search warrant to get these documents back. This is a national security issue.

For the love of God! Who does he need to tell in order for him to have that authority? The Government? Could you be more vague? Who in the Government does a President of the United States have to TELL that he's classifying or declassifying documents?

 

[Oldestyle]

I never said he needed anyone‘s approval, but the fact remains that declassifying information is pretty meaningless unless he tells someone. The government would need to know what has been declassified in order to be able to respond to FOIA requests as well as protect national security from the effects of this declassification.

The DoJ was treating the documents as highly classified state secrets because that’s exactly what they appeared to be and to this day we have no reason to believe otherwise. It is very very very rational to execute a search warrant to get these documents back. This is a national security issue.

So let me get this straight...
It's an urgent "national security issue" yet when the FBI visited Mar A Lago shortly before the "raid" their only request was to put another lock on the storage room door?

 

[Marener]

For the love of God! Who does he need to tell in order for him to have that authority? The Government? Could you be more vague? Who in the Government does a President of the United States have to TELL that he's classifying or declassifying documents?

I’ve been pretty specific. This has nothing to do with this authority and everything to do with the fact that declassifying information without telling anyone is pretty meaningless.

You’d think once he realized he was under investigation for illegally retaining classified documents he would have told the DoJ they weren’t classified, but he didn’t.

 

[Marener]

So let me get this straight...
It's an urgent "national security issue" yet when the FBI visited Mar A Lago shortly before the "raid" their only request was to put another lock on the storage room door?

You’re distorting what happened. The FBI came to take custody of the classified documents. All of them. The lawyer signed a statement saying they looked everywhere and turned over every single classified document.

Based on the statement from Trump’s lawyer, they would have believed that there were no documents left.

But we soon found out there was plenty of reason to believe Trump was lying to everyone.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

When those boxes were packed and shipped to Florida? Was Donald Trump still President? The answer to that is yes which means he totally had the authority to have those documents in his possession! What you on the left want to do is go back and take that authority away retroactively. It doesn't work that way!

The day he left the WH, the authority evaporated. The Iron Dome of Immunity was gone. And he had no right to withhold them when asked to return them.

 

[Mac1958]

You’re distorting what happened.

They don't read the indictments. Any of them.

If they do, they don't understand them.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

May heaven help MAGA when Taylor Swift calls on all American women to register and vote.

 

[Oldestyle]

You’re distorting what happened. The FBI came to take custody of the classified documents. All of them. The lawyer signed a statement saying they looked everywhere and turned over every single classified document.

Based on the statement from Trump’s lawyer, they would have believed that there were no documents left.

But we soon found out there was plenty of reason to believe Trump was lying to everyone.

I'm distorting what happened? Did the FBI NOT visit Mar A Lago...look at the storage room where they suspected the alleged classified documents were...and then simply tell the people in charge of security that they should put another pad lock on the door? You tell me, Marener...is that what you do when you suspect that highly classified documents that are a threat to national security are at risk? You KNOW that it isn't! Which means the FBI office in Florida didn't think there was any real risk...it was only when the Garland DOJ decided it was time to stage a raid on Trump's home with a heavily armed FBI Swat team that they flew down specially from DC to cut the local FBI out of the loop that this became an urgent national security issue! To be blunt? That NEVER passed the smell test!

 

[Oldestyle]

The day he left the WH, the authority evaporated. The Iron Dome of Immunity was gone. And he had no right to withhold them when asked to return them.

You didn't answer my question, John! Was Donald Trump President of the United States when those boxes were shipped from the Oval Office to Florida?

 

[Marener]

I'm distorting what happened? Did the FBI NOT visit Mar A Lago...look at the storage room where they suspected the alleged classified documents were...and then simply tell the people in charge of security that they should put another pad lock on the door? You tell me, Marener...is that what you do when you suspect that highly classified documents that are a threat to national security are at risk? You KNOW that it isn't! Which means the FBI office in Florida didn't think there was any real risk...it was only when the Garland DOJ decided it was time to stage a raid on Trump's home with a heavily armed FBI Swat team that they flew down specially from DC to cut the local FBI out of the loop that this became an urgent national security issue! To be blunt? That NEVER passed the smell test!

The FBI went to Mar a Lago to take custody of the classified documents that they had subpoenaed Trump for. Trump’s lawyer said they searched everywhere and every document was in the envelope they handed over.

The FBI asked to see the storage room. Trump’s lawyers agreed but forbade the FBI from looking in any of the boxes.

Tell me, what were they supposed to do then? They had no legal authority to overrule Trump. Searching the boxes would have been illegal and prevented any of that evidence from being used in court.

I’ll tell you what you do. You go back, build a case for a search warrant and take the documents back by force. That’s the only legal option they had.

What do you think they should have done?

 

[Marener]

They don't read the indictments. Any of them.

If they do, they don't understand them.

The second it comes to referencing any of the indictments, the argument then shifts to “well I don’t believe the DoJ anyway so it doesn’t matter”.

 

[Mac1958]

The second it comes to referencing any of the indictments, the argument then shifts to “well I don’t believe the DoJ anyway so it doesn’t matter”.

They're an intellectual brick wall. Pointless.