What do conservatives support?

[Correll]

In 12 pages no one has been able to rebut the general concept of the OP. In fact every effort by Conservatives result in more evidence in support of the claim that conservatives are defined by what they oppose,

Is it any wonder The Congress under the control of McConnell and Boehner/Ryan have done nothing of substance since gaining control.

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

 

[owebo]

In 12 pages no one has been able to rebut the general concept of the OP. In fact every effort by Conservatives result in more evidence in support of the claim that conservatives are defined by what they oppose,

Is it any wonder The Congress under the control of McConnell and Boehner/Ryan have done nothing of substance since gaining control.

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

 

[Wry Catcher]

In 12 pages no one has been able to rebut the general concept of the OP. In fact every effort by Conservatives result in more evidence in support of the claim that conservatives are defined by what they oppose,

Is it any wonder The Congress under the control of McConnell and Boehner/Ryan have done nothing of substance since gaining control.

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Hate, fear, scapegoats, a lack of compassion; blatant sexism and misogyny, racial and religious bigotry, a call for order - euphemism for authoritarianism - and attacks on the media, anti intellectualism, collaboration with corporate America, i.e. Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Farma and Wall Street, describe the far right!; a fascist by any other name is still a fascist.

Those who support Trump claim to be conservatives, hate liberals and progressives, gays and lesbians, and support government policies which have a negative impact on the working poor, the aged, infirm and even children and middle class Americans.

They claim to be conservative! If you read my posts without bias, you'll notice in my posts on the topic, I have called them "self described conservatives".

There is no doubt that Trump is a fascist, but putting that label aside, for it is used mostly as a pejorative, like leftist, there is nothing in his words to instill confidence that he supports two hundred plus years of democracy in America or that he would represent and have policies which benefit the many.

 

[owebo]

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Hate, fear, scapegoats, a lack of compassion; blatant sexism and misogyny, racial and religious bigotry, a call for order - euphemism for authoritarianism - and attacks on the media, anti intellectualism, collaboration with corporate America, i.e. Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Farma and Wall Street, describe the far right!; a fascist by any other name is still a fascist.

Those who support Trump claim to be conservatives, hate liberals and progressives, gays and lesbians, and support government policies which have a negative impact on the working poor, the aged, infirm and even children and middle class Americans.

They claim to be conservative! If you read my posts without bias, you'll notice in my posts on the topic, I have called them "self described conservatives".

There is no doubt that Trump is a fascist, but putting that label aside, for it is used mostly as a pejorative, like leftist, there is nothing in his words to instill confidence that he supports two hundred plus years of democracy in America or that he would represent and have policies which benefit the many.

No one questions you liberals have slipped into fascism....

 

[Wry Catcher]

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

 

[Correll]

YOu are talking crazy.

Have you heard of wikipedia?

They have a nice article on American conservatism.

Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."





YOur pretense of ignorance on this is silly.

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Hate, fear, scapegoats, a lack of compassion; blatant sexism and misogyny, racial and religious bigotry, a call for order - euphemism for authoritarianism - and attacks on the media, anti intellectualism, collaboration with corporate America, i.e. Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Farma and Wall Street, describe the far right!; a fascist by any other name is still a fascist.

Logical Fallacy of Shotgun Argumentation. And all lies to top it off.

Those who support Trump claim to be conservatives, hate liberals and progressives, gays and lesbians, and support government policies which have a negative impact on the working poor, the aged, infirm and even children and middle class Americans.

Logical Fallacy of Begging the Question. You assume your conclusion (ie that Trump's policies will hurt the working poor), and then judge people who disagree with you as though they agreed with you.

They claim to be conservative! If you read my posts without bias, you'll notice in my posts on the topic, I have called them "self described conservatives".

There is no doubt that Trump is a fascist, but putting that label aside, for it is used mostly as a pejorative, like leftist, there is nothing in his words to instill confidence that he supports two hundred plus years of democracy in America or that he would represent and have policies which benefit the many.

In my post, that you hit the reply button to, I went though Trump's main issues, and how they fit, or didn't, into the definition of conservative.


You stating that "Trump" is a fascist, is not a challenge to that, no matter how strongly or confidently or often you state it.


YOu should really go back and re-reply to that post, and this time without the Logical Fallacies, and WITH addressing my points.

 

[Correll]

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

 

[Wry Catcher]

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

"The Left's"? LOL, how many former Republican's have characterized Trump as dangerous? Your use of The Left is disingenuous at best.

 

[owebo]

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

"The Left's"? LOL, how many former Republican's have characterized Trump as dangerous? Your use of The Left is disingenuous at best.

Your ignorance is funny...

 

[hazlnut]

I've argued many times that conservatives are defined on what they oppose (gay marriage, taxes, change, the ERA, sex ed in school, abortion, free contraceptives, labor unions, the UN, democracy,
Affirmative Action/consent decrees, gun control, FEMA, the PPACA, Climate Change, a Government too large , (how large is too large for a nation of 300 + million?), public school teachers and other government employees - until they need them.

I've also posted the 14 points of Fascism, which, when applied to the statements / rhetoric of Trump are enlightening, and should IMO give pause to those opposed to an authoritarian federal government when considering a vote for the Republikan nominees. We don't need a Big Brother

Fourteen Defining Characteristics Of Fascism

Keep these sage comments i mind when in the voting booth:

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
MARTIN NIEMÖLLER

Great post!

 

[Correll]

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

"The Left's"? LOL, how many former Republican's have characterized Trump as dangerous? Your use of The Left is disingenuous at best.

So, because Jeb Bush agrees with you that makes it cool?


Simple Definition of demagogue

• : a political leader who tries to get support by making false claims and promises and using arguments based on emotion rather than reason
  

YOu are panic mongering. HIllary is panic mongering.

Fear is an emotion.

Your claims are certainly NOT reasonable, as I have repeated pointed out.


You are the Demagogue here.

 

[hazlnut]

Wow, way to exhausted to point out how evil the IRS, EPA, FEMA, PPACA, , and government are. I just did half of those in another thread.

My contribution will be against free contraceptives, public schooling, positive discrimination, and for the sake of controversy - "democracy."

Free contraceptives are not free. They come out of someones pocket. A victim who is going to get stolen from whether or not he wants to pay. Free contraceptives spit in the face of personal accountability. If you want to have safe sex, then you pay the bill yourself. Now only if we could get this through the entitled assholes plaguing this nation.

Public schooling can best be described through this meme

It is the training grounds for government slave workbots.

Positive discrimination has to be one of the worst and most contradictory policies the Democrats have come up with yet. First we are told everyone is equal, but to make up for past wrongs, which it must be noted that minorities of today were not subjected to, there has to be discriminatory policies in all walks of life? Do not get me started on how much affirmative action has fucked up higher education for non-minorities.

What happened to Malcolm X, and the other great black community leaders that demanded absolutely nothing except to be left alone by the government? Is there no pride anymore?

Finally, the western misconception of what a democracy is. If democracy is power for the people, I can guarantee you that neither liberals or conservatives act towards that end. The people have never had control in US history. Americans have always been lorded over by elitists and aristocrats, and the common slave wants to defend that as the status quo.

Now I cannot say whether or not many conservatives are hypocritical towards the things you stated, but if they are, then it is on them.

#2 and #3 are the same - but you'd know that if you had finished school.

 

[hazlnut]

LOL

#2 and #3 are identical.

#1m #4, #5 are nearly identical.


This pathetically stupid meme must have been created by someone who dropped out of school -- and now complains how bad school it.

Critical Thinking - it's not your enemy.

 

[owebo]

LOL

#2 and #3 are identical.

#1m #4, #5 are nearly identical.


This pathetically stupid meme must have been created by someone who dropped out of school -- and now complains how bad school it.

Critical Thinking - it's not your enemy.

Nice knowing you aspire to that goal...do let us know if you ever get there, won't you...

 

[Wry Catcher]

Today's brand of conservative would be attacked by William F. Buckley as he attacked the John Birch Society decades ago, calling it an extremist organization. Many well known conservatives have spoken out against the New Right and Trump, and even today Colin Powell called Trump a "National Disgrace".

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Hate, fear, scapegoats, a lack of compassion; blatant sexism and misogyny, racial and religious bigotry, a call for order - euphemism for authoritarianism - and attacks on the media, anti intellectualism, collaboration with corporate America, i.e. Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Farma and Wall Street, describe the far right!; a fascist by any other name is still a fascist.

Logical Fallacy of Shotgun Argumentation. And all lies to top it off.

Those who support Trump claim to be conservatives, hate liberals and progressives, gays and lesbians, and support government policies which have a negative impact on the working poor, the aged, infirm and even children and middle class Americans.

Logical Fallacy of Begging the Question. You assume your conclusion (ie that Trump's policies will hurt the working poor), and then judge people who disagree with you as though they agreed with you.

They claim to be conservative! If you read my posts without bias, you'll notice in my posts on the topic, I have called them "self described conservatives".

There is no doubt that Trump is a fascist, but putting that label aside, for it is used mostly as a pejorative, like leftist, there is nothing in his words to instill confidence that he supports two hundred plus years of democracy in America or that he would represent and have policies which benefit the many.

In my post, that you hit the reply button to, I went though Trump's main issues, and how they fit, or didn't, into the definition of conservative.


You stating that "Trump" is a fascist, is not a challenge to that, no matter how strongly or confidently or often you state it.


YOu should really go back and re-reply to that post, and this time without the Logical Fallacies, and WITH addressing my points.

The Thread is a question, "What do Conservatives Support?" The only response has been a quote from Wikipedia, and that does not describe the rhetoric of Trump (granted, he is not a traditional conservative, but his followers seem to believe being anti liberal, anti progressive, anti this and anti that makes him one).

So, I'll take your suggestion and rephrase the OP:

What do real conservatives support?

I will agree that they are anti social security, anti medicare/medicaid, anti Obamacare, anti government regulation; Opposed to the Income Tax, opposed to TANF, opposed to labor unions, opposed to public education. But what do they support?

Let's not be vague and simply respond with, they support, Freedom, Liberty, hot dogs, apple pie and baseball. I contend that today's conservative are callous and reject the teaching of Jesus Christ and what is known as Judeo-Christian Ethics.

I reject Fiscal Conservatism, as well as irresponsible spending. I support Fiscal Responsible Policies, fixing the roof when necessary, rather than kicking that can down the road. Doing so is stupid and irresponsible; austerity is total bullshit as is the concern that the national debt is a harbinger of economic collapse.

Of course I don't support or consider the massive debt to be a good thing, since much of it is wasted on wars of choice and protecting the jobs of each and every member of Congress by funding unnecessary projects in their state (something done by R's and D's as doing buisness as usual). Which is why I support a Constitutional Amendment giving the POTUS the line-item veto, holding him or her accountable, as well as each member of The Congress if such a veto is overridden.

Which Logical Fallacy are you accusing me of employing?

 

[Wry Catcher]

LOL

#2 and #3 are identical.

#1m #4, #5 are nearly identical.


This pathetically stupid meme must have been created by someone who dropped out of school -- and now complains how bad school it.

Critical Thinking - it's not your enemy.

Nice knowing you aspire to that goal...do let us know if you ever get there, won't you...

Ad hominem ^^^.

 

[Wry Catcher]

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

"The Left's"? LOL, how many former Republican's have characterized Trump as dangerous? Your use of The Left is disingenuous at best.

So, because Jeb Bush agrees with you that makes it cool?


Simple Definition of demagogue

• : a political leader who tries to get support by making false claims and promises and using arguments based on emotion rather than reason

YOu are panic mongering. HIllary is panic mongering.

Fear is an emotion.

Your claims are certainly NOT reasonable, as I have repeated pointed out.


You are the Demagogue here.

If you don't hear Trump's false claims and silly promises you are not a sagacious thinker. His promise to build a wall and make Mexico pay for it is absurd; his promise to round up and deport 11 million undocumented immigrants is absurd and would be way too expensive; his promise to make America great again is nebulous at best; his promises to reduce the debt and cut taxes while spending big bucks to hire Administrative Law Judges, Deputy US Attorney's; US Marshall's to find them and Defense Attorny's to represent them; pay for Detention Facilities to house those detained, secure Court Rooms to provide for Due Process, and medical care, food, clothing and shelter for the accused dependents is beyond absurd. Only fools believe he can do any of these things.

Trump fails to understand the limits to the office to which he aspires, his flips and flops even occur in mid-sentence; he reads what his handlers write, and then goes off on an emotional rant. Only fools will vote for this charlatan, demagogue and bully.

 

[Correll]

You have no clue what conservatism is...you're too far left to ever understand.....

You have no clue. There is no singular definition for 'conservatism'; a 21st Century self defined conservative is unlike conservatives in other decades / ERA's.

From my above excerpt.


"American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs "


You are seizing on the variation, and recent changes to pretend that they has been some massive sea change in Conservatism, which you then try to conflate with Fascism.



It is complete nonsense.


Here is the answer for you, that you are running away from so that you can insist that there is no answer, so that you can lie and smear your present day enemies.


"respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice."




Trump's anti-immigration stance fits the opposition to Multiculturalism.

Many conservatives have argued that Trump is trying to WEAKEN the Free Market, but I point out that the Free Market Policies have NOT delivered their promised results. The reason for that could be hidden barriers to trade slanted against US.


Trump can be seen to be "anti-communist" in his desire to cease confrontation with now non-communist Russia.


Trump is more of a Nationalist than a Conservative, but your panic mongering about Fascism is nothing but partisan slander.

Hate, fear, scapegoats, a lack of compassion; blatant sexism and misogyny, racial and religious bigotry, a call for order - euphemism for authoritarianism - and attacks on the media, anti intellectualism, collaboration with corporate America, i.e. Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Farma and Wall Street, describe the far right!; a fascist by any other name is still a fascist.

Logical Fallacy of Shotgun Argumentation. And all lies to top it off.

Those who support Trump claim to be conservatives, hate liberals and progressives, gays and lesbians, and support government policies which have a negative impact on the working poor, the aged, infirm and even children and middle class Americans.

Logical Fallacy of Begging the Question. You assume your conclusion (ie that Trump's policies will hurt the working poor), and then judge people who disagree with you as though they agreed with you.

They claim to be conservative! If you read my posts without bias, you'll notice in my posts on the topic, I have called them "self described conservatives".

There is no doubt that Trump is a fascist, but putting that label aside, for it is used mostly as a pejorative, like leftist, there is nothing in his words to instill confidence that he supports two hundred plus years of democracy in America or that he would represent and have policies which benefit the many.

In my post, that you hit the reply button to, I went though Trump's main issues, and how they fit, or didn't, into the definition of conservative.


You stating that "Trump" is a fascist, is not a challenge to that, no matter how strongly or confidently or often you state it.


YOu should really go back and re-reply to that post, and this time without the Logical Fallacies, and WITH addressing my points.

The Thread is a question, "What do Conservatives Support?" The only response has been a quote from Wikipedia, and that does not describe the rhetoric of Trump (granted, he is not a traditional conservative, but his followers seem to believe being anti liberal, anti progressive, anti this and anti that makes him one).

So, I'll take your suggestion and rephrase the OP:

What do real conservatives support?

I will agree that they are anti social security, anti medicare/medicaid, anti Obamacare, anti government regulation; Opposed to the Income Tax, opposed to TANF, opposed to labor unions, opposed to public education. But what do they support?

Let's not be vague and simply respond with, they support, Freedom, Liberty, hot dogs, apple pie and baseball. I contend that today's conservative are callous and reject the teaching of Jesus Christ and what is known as Judeo-Christian Ethics.

I reject Fiscal Conservatism, as well as irresponsible spending. I support Fiscal Responsible Policies, fixing the roof when necessary, rather than kicking that can down the road. Doing so is stupid and irresponsible; austerity is total bullshit as is the concern that the national debt is a harbinger of economic collapse.

Of course I don't support or consider the massive debt to be a good thing, since much of it is wasted on wars of choice and protecting the jobs of each and every member of Congress by funding unnecessary projects in their state (something done by R's and D's as doing buisness as usual). Which is why I support a Constitutional Amendment giving the POTUS the line-item veto, holding him or her accountable, as well as each member of The Congress if such a veto is overridden.

Which Logical Fallacy are you accusing me of employing?

The quote from Wikipedia was a fine answer. That you refuse to accept it, shows that you don't want a real answer.

YOu ask an enormous, broad question like, What do conservatives support, and then you complain that you get a broad answer. That is disingenuous of you.

Your list of what you believe conservatives to be opposed to is silly and self serving, written not to state what you think conservatives oppose, but to paint them, as a whole as being dangerous or bad.


Your contention the modern conservatives have rejected Judeo-Christian Ethics is, once again based on your assumption that your conclusion is correct, AND that conservatives agree with you on those conclusions, but then actively choose the Evul choices.

That reveals nothing but your inability to understand, let alone respect people that are different from you.

Fiscal conservatism is moot at this point. We are in a flat tail spin with no hope of recovery.

I specifically pointed out each logical fallacy you were using with each point you made. That is why I took the extra care to separate your points as I did. Your confusion is nothing but a defense mechanism, whether conscious or not.

The point you are missing, on purpose, is that you cannot judge other people by using YOUR assumptions of how the world works. Of course their actions will not pass muster IF you judge them based on your belief system.


If you do not grasp that, your asking a question about what other people believe is a complete waste of your time, because you are not listening to what people are saying.




READ IT AGAIN. This time try not to listen to the voices in your head offering editorial comments and footnotes with each sentence.


Conservatism in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



American Conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism, advocacy of American exceptionalism and a defense of Western culture from perceived threats posed by creeping socialism, moral relativism, multiculturalism, and liberal internationalism. Liberty is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government, and opposition to high taxes and to government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur. American conservatives consider individual liberty, within the bounds of conformity to American values as the fundamental trait of democracy, which contrasts with modern American liberals, who generally place a greater value on equality and social justice.

 

[sfchetzel]

Conservatives support Traditions, Values and the Rule of Law. The concepts of Law and Order along with Personal Responsibility are essential to Conservative ideology. A place for everyone, and everyone in their place.

Traditions and Values are the same fucking thing.

Meanwhile...WHOSE Traditions or Values?

The concept of "Law and Order"? Most Police are Democrats, nice try.

A place for everyone and everyone in their place:

Is a fucking Feudal concept enshrined in Dune. So Republicans admit they think they are the elite, and everyone else belongs beneath them llike slaves.

Pathetic shits.

Based on your choice of language, I guess I will wait to answer your posts about conservatives one you can base your criticisms on fact and not emotions. You seem too agry to have any sort of meaningful debate.

 

[Correll]

Wry Catcher knows where he stands, as do most liberals, and it unnerves him that we know too....

View attachment 90307

Trump is a demagogue, a charlatan and a bully. Those are facts anyone with average intelligence and even a rudimentary knowledge of world history fully understands.

The liberal and progressive mind is not dogged in dogma, as the post above #244) states we are - no one that I am aware of has tossed a liberal or a progressive under the bus as LINO or a PINO; only the right wing has decided that those who disagree with the dogma are RINO's.

The Left's constant panic mongering with regard to Trump, that you are completely supporting,


is an appeal to emotion, especially negative emotion, which is the defining hallmark of demagoguery.

"The Left's"? LOL, how many former Republican's have characterized Trump as dangerous? Your use of The Left is disingenuous at best.

So, because Jeb Bush agrees with you that makes it cool?


Simple Definition of demagogue

• : a political leader who tries to get support by making false claims and promises and using arguments based on emotion rather than reason

YOu are panic mongering. HIllary is panic mongering.

Fear is an emotion.

Your claims are certainly NOT reasonable, as I have repeated pointed out.


You are the Demagogue here.

If you don't hear Trump's false claims and silly promises you are not a sagacious thinker.

I pretty obviously was focusing on yours and Hillary's panic mongering. You have proved my accusation on that with nearly every post of yours in this thread, so I can see why you did not try to deny it.

Your assumption that because I disagree with you, that I am a poor thinker, is just you being a standard close minded lib. Again.

His promise to build a wall and make Mexico pay for it is absurd;

What do you base that "conclusion" on?

his promise to round up and deport 11 million undocumented immigrants is absurd

We catch and deport large numbers of illegals all the time. If we seal the border, and stop giving them jobs, to make it harder and less rewarding to return, it can be done.

and would be way too expensive;

Our federal budget is pushing FOUR TRILLION DOLLARS. And now suddenly you're concerned about costs? LOL!!!

his promise to make America great again is nebulous at best;

If his trade and immigration policies have the effect on Working Class and Middle CLass incomes that I expect, that would fit my vision of "Great Again".

his promises to reduce the debt and cut taxes

I don't believe that ANYONE can address our budget issues in the context of a Democratic Modern State with a Greying population.

Imo, it is a fundamental flaw of the First World model.

while spending big bucks to hire Administrative Law Judges, Deputy US Attorney's; US Marshall's to find them and Defense Attorny's to represent them; pay for Detention Facilities to house those detained, secure Court Rooms to provide for Due Process, and medical care, food, clothing and shelter for the accused dependents is beyond absurd.

You post "finding illegals" like it will be hard. When you have a population of ELEVEN MILLION people, you will not be able to AVOID them.

You act as though we will be looking for specific illegals.

Perhaps if/when the population of illegals gets down to the hundreds of thousands, it might start to get a little harder.

We can cross that bridge when we come to it.

Only fools believe he can do any of these things.

Only assholes think that stating something strongly and being insulting while they do it, is a supporting argument.

Trump fails to understand the limits to the office to which he aspires, his flips and flops even occur in mid-sentence; he reads what his handlers write, and then goes off on an emotional rant. Only fools will vote for this charlatan, demagogue and bully.

Trump is a Ivy League Graduate who has succeeded in THREE very competitive fields.

Your belief system that he does not understand something that you understand, is probably wrong.


He is operating on a level of persuasion and communication that you can't even see.

And you have repeatedly demonstrated that YOU and Hillary are the Demagogues here.

And your constant verbal insults? If you have a problem with bullies, you might want to consider if you really want to engage in constant verbal abuse.