"What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"

[hunarcy]

Actually America did exist as a colony of Britain.

There was no United States colony of Britain. You wrote U.S. existed in 1640. Distracts from your credibility.

No it does not distract from my credibility. You wan to play word games and then play the game of we did not exist until the constitution was ratified That's childish and you do this to avoid the issue.

It's a matter of language. He is right. The U.S. did not exist in 1640.

You should have said "America."

Again, I know this and I don't care. This thread was not created to argue this and the most important and correct fact I did state was that on July 4th 1776, blacks were not free from any tyranny and that if we cannot discuss slavery or the racism of the founders because it is too long ago, then we should not be celebrating this day that happened 241 years ago. If I am living in the past because i mention slavery and the damages caused to blacks, the you are living in the past by celebrating this day. If we are supposed to be grateful to whites wo did not fight to win our freedom from slavery in the civil war then whites certainly need to be grateful to the slaves who fought in the revolutionary war who gained no freedom after it was done and those slaves who gave their lives whites to be free from Britain. And if no one here was around for slavery, no one today was around on July 4th 1776. So ifi we cannot hold those in the past accountable for their racism we cannot credit them without being hypocrites.

Some blacks were freedmen in 1776. Other former slaves won their freedom by fighting for the patriot side. Your hatred renders you blind to the truth.

And I would point out that the nation of Liberia was established to accept former slaves who wanted to return to Africa. If you are here, it's because your ancestors CHOSE to stay in the United States.

 

[MizMolly]

A bunch of whites did not die to end slavery. That is an inaccurate statement. In every thread all you do is talk about how slavery is over when the thread topic has never been slavery.

Well, there went evey shred a of credibility you ever had, out the window, you might as well deny the earth is round. What a waste.

My credibility is just fine You are the one with none. Whites did not die to free the slaves. This thread is about how you guys want to tell everyone to not talk about slavery because it was 150 years ago but yet you talk abut something that happened 241 years ago that you had nothing to do with. Rush Limbaugh has nothing to do with this thread topic.

There is nothing wrong about talking about slavery, it happened, it was wrong, it is still wrong. The problem is when white people today only are accused of benefitting from it, white people today are being linked to it, etc etc.

 

[MizMolly]

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

This thread is dead, Fred. We are post racial, slavery is dead and gone. Things have changed since abolition, haven't you heard? Over 65 thousand anonymous white guys fought to free the slaves. Racism is bad, you are totally right about that. And why haven't blacks got over it? There is two sides to a equation. Lets be honest here, why haven't blacks tried harder to get over this racial inertia? That's is the bigger question. What the hell does it take?

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

This thread is dead, Fred. We are post racial, slavery is dead and gone. Things have changed since abolition, haven't you heard? Over 65 thousand anonymous white guys fought to free the slaves. Racism is bad, you are totally right about that. And why haven't blacks got over it? There is two sides to a equation. Lets be honest here, why haven't blacks tried harder to get over this racial inertia? That's is the bigger question. What the hell does it take?

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

yes the United states has been without slavery almost twice as long as it had it

Actually the US had slaves beginning in 1640. But this thread is not about the white folks claims of how slavery is over.and how it was 150 years ago s get over it. The issue here is that July 4, 1776 was 241 years ago and by your own standard things that happened that long ago are irrelevant today.

It is relevant today because we, as a country, no longer belong to Britain.

 

[MizMolly]

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

If you chose to not celebrate July 4th, that's your business. We are all free to choose what we do or do not want to celebrate. Yes, we do have that right. If you choose to dwell on the horrible past, that is also your right.

 

[Yarddog]

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

In 1776, slavery was widely practiced througout the world. The Founders based our nation upon principles which caused the abolition of slavery. Sad that you don't appreciate it.

Here, try reading this for some perspective:

Speech on the 150th Anniversary of the Declaration of Independence | Teaching American History

I am not reading your bullshit. I know what's what. The fact is slavery could have been ended in this nation when the nation started. Not on principles that lead to an end of slavery eventually. I don't have to appreciate that.

Slavery could have ended when the Benin Empire and Nigerians stopped building their economy around the slave trade. But wait, they didnt. They didn't have a document saying all people were created equal either.
A lot of things could have been, should have been, and then weren't. America , is a great country that a lot of people around the world are trying to come to for self advancment. To bad you can't be part of that.

The Benin Empire and Nigeria have nothing to do with what happened in America.. Lets stop using Africa as an excuse. Part of the supposed greatness pf this nation that I participate in is the right to air my grievance peacefully as a citizen. This is the right people like you want to try silencing. That you try doing this is un-American.

You have the right to grieve and i have the right to give my opinion. The Benin Empire and other west Africans have everything to do with what happened in America. They were dealing in the slave trade long before Europeans got involved and the networks were already in place. And Europeans were taken as slaves first through the eastern slave trade anyway, slavery was nothing new to the world.

 

[katsteve2012]

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

Very brave of you to take a strong stand against slavery, after white guys defeated it for you.

Slavery ended by default in order to preserve the union.

A bloody war is not fought to end something by default.

Please. Preserving the union was first and foremost. Slaves were absolutely freed by default.

They were considered to be the equivalent of cattle during that era.
In some cases even less.

Executive Mansion,
Washington, August 22, 1862.

Hon. Horace Greeley:
Dear Sir.

I have just read yours of the 19th. addressed to myself through the New-York Tribune. If there be in it any statements, or assumptions of fact, which I may know to be erroneous, I do not, now and here, controvert them. If there be in it any inferences which I may believe to be falsely drawn, I do not now and here, argue against them. If there be perceptable in it an impatient and dictatorial tone, I waive it in deference to an old friend, whose heart I have always supposed to be right.

As to the policy I "seem to be pursuing" as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt.

I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time saveslavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is noteither to save or to destroy slavery.
. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personalwish that all men every where could be free.

Yours,
A. Lincoln.

 

[IM2]

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

In 1776, slavery was widely practiced througout the world. The Founders based our nation upon principles which caused the abolition of slavery. Sad that you don't appreciate it.

Here, try reading this for some perspective:

Speech on the 150th Anniversary of the Declaration of Independence | Teaching American History

I am not reading your bullshit. I know what's what. The fact is slavery could have been ended in this nation when the nation started. Not on principles that lead to an end of slavery eventually. I don't have to appreciate that.

Slavery could have ended when the Benin Empire and Nigerians stopped building their economy around the slave trade. But wait, they didnt. They didn't have a document saying all people were created equal either.
A lot of things could have been, should have been, and then weren't. America , is a great country that a lot of people around the world are trying to come to for self advancment. To bad you can't be part of that.

The Benin Empire and Nigeria have nothing to do with what happened in America.. Lets stop using Africa as an excuse. Part of the supposed greatness pf this nation that I participate in is the right to air my grievance peacefully as a citizen. This is the right people like you want to try silencing. That you try doing this is un-American.

You have the right to grieve and i have the right to give my opinion. The Benin Empire and other west Africans have everything to do with what happened in America. They were dealing in the slave trade long before Europeans got involved and the networks were already in place. And Europeans were taken as slaves first through the eastern slave trade anyway, slavery was nothing new to the world.

Well you have that right but you also have the right to be told how you are wrong by someone black who has studied the issue of slavery deeper than you have. You see the trade of slaves were done by transactions, The slaves came over here from Benin on either Dutch or Portuguese ships primarily This means that a Dutchmen or a Portuguese individual or shipping company purchased the slaves. The slaves were not given away. So then if there is no purchase there is no slave trade.

So stop using Africa to excuse what whites have done.

There fore to say that slavery in the America/United States could have ended with the law written in in the constitution which forbade slavery immediately is correct. You offer noting but excuses. But this is par for the course around here. You guys have an excuse for everything whites do that is wrong. You guys are quick to tell others how they are making excuses, but you feel it fine that you can. That is childish.

If we don't talk about slavery and try discussing how whites benefitted from segregation, well that didn't happen either. I mean you guys lie to yourselves completely about how things have happened for you here in this country. And it is very sad that people choose to live with such a refusal to accept reality to such an extent as you conservatives.

 

[IM2]

A bunch of whites did not die to end slavery. That is an inaccurate statement. In every thread all you do is talk about how slavery is over when the thread topic has never been slavery.

Well, there went evey shred a of credibility you ever had, out the window, you might as well deny the earth is round. What a waste.

My credibility is just fine You are the one with none. Whites did not die to free the slaves. This thread is about how you guys want to tell everyone to not talk about slavery because it was 150 years ago but yet you talk abut something that happened 241 years ago that you had nothing to do with. Rush Limbaugh has nothing to do with this thread topic.

There is nothing wrong about talking about slavery, it happened, it was wrong, it is still wrong. The problem is when white people today only are accused of benefitting from it, white people today are being linked to it, etc etc.

Well you did benefit from it. And that's just the way it is.

 

[IM2]

There was no United States colony of Britain. You wrote U.S. existed in 1640. Distracts from your credibility.

No it does not distract from my credibility. You wan to play word games and then play the game of we did not exist until the constitution was ratified That's childish and you do this to avoid the issue.

It's a matter of language. He is right. The U.S. did not exist in 1640.

You should have said "America."

Again, I know this and I don't care. This thread was not created to argue this and the most important and correct fact I did state was that on July 4th 1776, blacks were not free from any tyranny and that if we cannot discuss slavery or the racism of the founders because it is too long ago, then we should not be celebrating this day that happened 241 years ago. If I am living in the past because i mention slavery and the damages caused to blacks, the you are living in the past by celebrating this day. If we are supposed to be grateful to whites wo did not fight to win our freedom from slavery in the civil war then whites certainly need to be grateful to the slaves who fought in the revolutionary war who gained no freedom after it was done and those slaves who gave their lives whites to be free from Britain. And if no one here was around for slavery, no one today was around on July 4th 1776. So ifi we cannot hold those in the past accountable for their racism we cannot credit them without being hypocrites.

Some blacks were freedmen in 1776. Other former slaves won their freedom by fighting for the patriot side. Your hatred renders you blind to the truth.

And I would point out that the nation of Liberia was established to accept former slaves who wanted to return to Africa. If you are here, it's because your ancestors CHOSE to stay in the United States.

And I will point out that I don't give a damn what Libera was for. The fact is that they were Americans and they did not have to go any damn where.

 

[IM2]

This thread is dead, Fred. We are post racial, slavery is dead and gone. Things have changed since abolition, haven't you heard? Over 65 thousand anonymous white guys fought to free the slaves. Racism is bad, you are totally right about that. And why haven't blacks got over it? There is two sides to a equation. Lets be honest here, why haven't blacks tried harder to get over this racial inertia? That's is the bigger question. What the hell does it take?

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

This thread is dead, Fred. We are post racial, slavery is dead and gone. Things have changed since abolition, haven't you heard? Over 65 thousand anonymous white guys fought to free the slaves. Racism is bad, you are totally right about that. And why haven't blacks got over it? There is two sides to a equation. Lets be honest here, why haven't blacks tried harder to get over this racial inertia? That's is the bigger question. What the hell does it take?

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

yes the United states has been without slavery almost twice as long as it had it

Actually the US had slaves beginning in 1640. But this thread is not about the white folks claims of how slavery is over.and how it was 150 years ago s get over it. The issue here is that July 4, 1776 was 241 years ago and by your own standard things that happened that long ago are irrelevant today.

It is relevant today because we, as a country, no longer belong to Britain.

You had nothing to do with this. You were not here when it happened. It happened 241 years ago. Stop living in the past.

 

[IM2]

What to a slave is July 4th?

A beacon of hope that he may one day be free. That has happened in the U.S.

If the OP really cared about Slavery, he'd spend his ire on the issue of present day slaves...of which there are an estimated 21 Million worldwide (compare that to the aggregate less than half a million that were imported to North America over 240+ years).

And note, Latin and South America imported over 90% of the slaves from Africa. Why doesn't the OP hold those societies accountable?

There never should have been that beacon of hope. Blacks should have been free in July 4th, 1776 just like whites. This is the problem with your arguments. You want to pretend that saying it offered a beacon of hope for freedom for those slaves like is supposed to be a positive that we should be happy for. Why don't I hold those other societies responsible? Because I don't live in those other societies and most of those societies got rid of the colonizers who imported the slaves into those paces in the first place.

You don't get to tell me what I am going to spend my ire on. I live here in America, I am spending my ire on American racism. You aren't interested in todays slavery, You only mention it because I talk about how whites are still practicing racism.

If you chose to not celebrate July 4th, that's your business. We are all free to choose what we do or do not want to celebrate. Yes, we do have that right. If you choose to dwell on the horrible past, that is also your right.

Pathetic.

 

[IM2]

Actually America did exist as a colony of Britain.

There was no United States colony of Britain. You wrote U.S. existed in 1640. Distracts from your credibility.

No it does not distract from my credibility. You wan to play word games and then play the game of we did not exist until the constitution was ratified That's childish and you do this to avoid the issue.

It's a matter of language. He is right. The U.S. did not exist in 1640.

You should have said "America."

Again, I know this and I don't care. This thread was not created to argue this and the most important and correct fact I did state was that on July 4th 1776, blacks were not free from any tyranny and that if we cannot discuss slavery or the racism of the founders because it is too long ago, then we should not be celebrating this day that happened 241 years ago. If I am living in the past because i mention slavery and the damages caused to blacks, the you are living in the past by celebrating this day. If we are supposed to be grateful to whites wo did not fight to win our freedom from slavery in the civil war then whites certainly need to be grateful to the slaves who fought in the revolutionary war who gained no freedom after it was done and those slaves who gave their lives whites to be free from Britain. And if no one here was around for slavery, no one today was around on July 4th 1776. So ifi we cannot hold those in the past accountable for their racism we cannot credit them without being hypocrites.

Some blacks were freedmen in 1776. Other former slaves won their freedom by fighting for the patriot side. Your hatred renders you blind to the truth.

Well you see the problem with that is I know some blacks were freedmen. But the issue here is that EVERY black should have been a freedmen not just some.

 

[Auld Phart]

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

No white guys fought to free the slaves. But this thread is about the fourth of July. A day that happened 240 years ago which means its too long ago to be celebrated or discussed by your standards, it is too old for this because none of you were here on July 4th , 1776. because this happened 241 years ago, it is irrelevant to today based upon the argument many of you have made.

Really? I am trying hard to figure out what the hell you saying here. As a one to one human thing. Yes, a bunch of white people died to end slavery. We all get that slavery was bad. It's gone with the freakin' wind. 150 + years ago. Limbaugh is like Colbert or Kathy Griffin. Entertainers that use outrage like waving a a red flag in front of a bull. We get it.

yes the United states has been without slavery almost twice as long as it had it

Actually the US had slaves beginning in 1640. But this thread is not about the white folks claims of how slavery is over.and how it was 150 years ago s get over it. The issue here is that July 4, 1776 was 241 years ago and by your own standard things that happened that long ago are irrelevant today.

It is relevant today because we, as a country, no longer belong to Britain.

You had nothing to do with this. You were not here when it happened. It happened 241 years ago. Stop living in the past.

You were not here when it happened. It happened 241 years ago.

Nor were you

Stop living in the past.

Take your own advice

 

[Correll]

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

Very brave of you to take a strong stand against slavery, after white guys defeated it for you.

Slavery ended by default in order to preserve the union.

A bloody war is not fought to end something by default.

Please. Preserving the union was first and foremost. Slaves were absolutely freed by default.

They were considered to be the equivalent of cattle during that era.
In some cases even less.

Executive Mansion,
Washington, August 22, 1862.

Hon. Horace Greeley:
Dear Sir.

I have just read yours of the 19th. addressed to myself through the New-York Tribune. If there be in it any statements, or assumptions of fact, which I may know to be erroneous, I do not, now and here, controvert them. If there be in it any inferences which I may believe to be falsely drawn, I do not now and here, argue against them. If there be perceptable in it an impatient and dictatorial tone, I waive it in deference to an old friend, whose heart I have always supposed to be right.

As to the policy I "seem to be pursuing" as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt.

I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time saveslavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is noteither to save or to destroy slavery.
. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personalwish that all men every where could be free.

Yours,
A. Lincoln.

He was trying to be diplomatic and avoid a civil war. Understandable.


But there is no way that the South would not have surrendered sooner and easier if slavery was still on the table.


His actions reveal his words to be lies.

 

[sealybobo]

you will get rude back.

And you don't see any correlation between rude discourse and the declining fortunes of the left?

That's like saying you're going to punish your slave for talking back. Should he be happy? Will you be nicer to your rape victim if they don't fight back?

I see a correlation between the rich owning our government and middle class whites slipping into poverty.

 

[fncceo]

That's like saying you're going to punish your slave for talking back.

I will NEVER have a slave that talks back ...

Particularly not a protocol droid...

 

[katsteve2012]

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

Very brave of you to take a strong stand against slavery, after white guys defeated it for you.

Slavery ended by default in order to preserve the union.

A bloody war is not fought to end something by default.

Please. Preserving the union was first and foremost. Slaves were absolutely freed by default.

They were considered to be the equivalent of cattle during that era.
In some cases even less.

Executive Mansion,
Washington, August 22, 1862.

Hon. Horace Greeley:
Dear Sir.

I have just read yours of the 19th. addressed to myself through the New-York Tribune. If there be in it any statements, or assumptions of fact, which I may know to be erroneous, I do not, now and here, controvert them. If there be in it any inferences which I may believe to be falsely drawn, I do not now and here, argue against them. If there be perceptable in it an impatient and dictatorial tone, I waive it in deference to an old friend, whose heart I have always supposed to be right.

As to the policy I "seem to be pursuing" as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt.

I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time saveslavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is noteither to save or to destroy slavery.
. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personalwish that all men every where could be free.

Yours,
A. Lincoln.

He was trying to be diplomatic and avoid a civil war. Understandable.


But there is no way that the South would not have surrendered sooner and easier if slavery was still on the table.


His actions reveal his words to be lies.

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

Very brave of you to take a strong stand against slavery, after white guys defeated it for you.

Slavery ended by default in order to preserve the union.

A bloody war is not fought to end something by default.

Please. Preserving the union was first and foremost. Slaves were absolutely freed by default.

They were considered to be the equivalent of cattle during that era.
In some cases even less.

Executive Mansion,
Washington, August 22, 1862.

Hon. Horace Greeley:
Dear Sir.

I have just read yours of the 19th. addressed to myself through the New-York Tribune. If there be in it any statements, or assumptions of fact, which I may know to be erroneous, I do not, now and here, controvert them. If there be in it any inferences which I may believe to be falsely drawn, I do not now and here, argue against them. If there be perceptable in it an impatient and dictatorial tone, I waive it in deference to an old friend, whose heart I have always supposed to be right.

As to the policy I "seem to be pursuing" as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt.

I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time saveslavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is noteither to save or to destroy slavery.
. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personalwish that all men every where could be free.

Yours,
A. Lincoln.

He was trying to be diplomatic and avoid a civil war. Understandable.


But there is no way that the South would not have surrendered sooner and easier if slavery was still on the table.


His actions reveal his words to be lies.

And none of you were here on July 4th, 1776, none of you fought the British for your freedom either. And since most of you are from ancestors who came here after this happened, your ancestors did not fight to win your freedom from Britain either.

So without further ado, one of the greatest speeches in American history.

What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"
FREDERICK DOUGLASS SPEECH, 1852

Fellow citizens, pardon me, allow me to ask, why am I called upon to speak here today? What have I, or those I represent, to do with your national independence? Are the great principles of political freedom and of natural justice, embodied in that Declaration of Independence, extended to us? and am I, therefore, called upon to bring our humble offering to the national altar, and to confess the benefits and express devout gratitude for the blessings resulting from your independence to us?

For the rest of the speech:

http://www.freemaninstitute.com/douglass.htm

Very brave of you to take a strong stand against slavery, after white guys defeated it for you.

Slavery ended by default in order to preserve the union.

A bloody war is not fought to end something by default.

Please. Preserving the union was first and foremost. Slaves were absolutely freed by default.

They were considered to be the equivalent of cattle during that era.
In some cases even less.

Executive Mansion,
Washington, August 22, 1862.

Hon. Horace Greeley:
Dear Sir.

I have just read yours of the 19th. addressed to myself through the New-York Tribune. If there be in it any statements, or assumptions of fact, which I may know to be erroneous, I do not, now and here, controvert them. If there be in it any inferences which I may believe to be falsely drawn, I do not now and here, argue against them. If there be perceptable in it an impatient and dictatorial tone, I waive it in deference to an old friend, whose heart I have always supposed to be right.

As to the policy I "seem to be pursuing" as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt.

I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time saveslavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is noteither to save or to destroy slavery.
. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personalwish that all men every where could be free.

Yours,
A. Lincoln.

He was trying to be diplomatic and avoid a civil war. Understandable.


But there is no way that the South would not have surrendered sooner and easier if slavery was still on the table.


His actions reveal his words to be lies.

Whether his words were in fact lies or he was exercising "diplomacy" is nothing but speculating in the oursuit of a romanticized version of how slavery actially ended. Lincoln did not complete his term due to his assasinatoon. All that is left are his words. Slaves ceased to be slaves after slavery by default but were still not freed from 2nd class citizenship..

 

[Iceweasel]

Well you see the problem with that is I know some blacks were freedmen. But the issue here is that EVERY black should have been a freedmen not just some.

Blacks weren't the only humans suffering from slavery. Your devotion to racism limits that. The website isn't big enough to list man's inhumanity to man throughout the ages, nor does perpetual hand wringing accomplish anything fruitful. People listen to losers like you or they make the best of things. The later types are those that gain success in the world.

 

[Iceweasel]

Slaves ceased to be slaves after slavery by default but were still not freed from 2nd class citizenship..

WE? How old are you?

 

[katsteve2012]

Slaves ceased to be slaves after slavery by default but were still not freed from 2nd class citizenship..

WE? How old are you?

Feel free to point out where I used the word "We".