White man shoots innocent black teen....

[Si modo]

I don't get how Martin landed on his back after being shot.

Anyone want to speculate?

Ravi, I answered that in some detail in one of these threads; I forget which. The short answer is, he could have fallen either way, depending on which way he was leaning when the bullet hit, neuromuscular effect of the bullet impact (which is highly variable), and other factors. (I had understood Martin fell face down). A person hit by a bullet does not necessarily fall either in the direction of the shot, or away from it. The autopsy findings should enable an accurate reconstruction of the relative positions of Zimmerman and Martin at the moment the shot was fired, in any event.

I can see him falling on his side, but not his front, if he was straddling Zimmerman when he was shot.

I don't believe we know if he was straddling Zimmerman at the time the shot occurred.

Even someone who is standing straight up has a good chance of falling on their stomach when shot. If he was shot from the front, there is often a reflex causing a bit of doubling over, then the fall would be on the front. If he were shot from the back, that reflex is different, so flip a coin on what side he will fall.

The physics of a bullet compared with that of a 160 lb body doesn't cause folks to fly backwards with a bullet to their front. That's for the movies, but simple mechanics won't allow for it.

 

[SFC Ollie]

About a thousand different ways. Especially since only Zimmerman saw it happen....

So did Martin.

Care to speculate? I see one or two scenarios....the blast from the gun knocked Martin backwards. Or it made him fall forward on top Zimmerman. So how did he end up face down with his hands under his body?

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

 

[alan1]

Thread title

White man shoots innocent black teen....

Just thought I'd remind everybody of the race baiting title ABikerSailor used.

 

[saveliberty]

He just acted like an angry adolescent who had managed to turn the tables; fear gave way to adolescent pride and rage; getting even became more important than getting away. He couldn't have known that he had now put an armed man on the defensive

What fear? Why would a 6'3" football player be afraid of a pudgy hispanic man? Listen to Zimmerman's 911 call. "He's coming toward me.... he's checking me out... he has a hand in his waistband..." This was the African trying to intimidate Zimmerman. If you're afraid of someone watching you, you keep moving, probably pretending that you didn't see the person you're afraid of. If you're close to where you're going, you probably run. If you're really afraid, you use that cell phone and call the police.

The police told Zimmerman not to follow only because it's dangerous to follow a criminal (not because there's anything sinister about following a suspect), and the African demonstrated this danger.

The African, caught casing the neighborhood, acted more like a punk than anything else. He attacked someone who was no threat to him, and he intended to do extreme bodily harm.

Homeboy was running an errand for his family you bitch.

 

[Si modo]

Thread title

White man shoots innocent black teen....

Just thought I'd remind everybody of the race baiting title ABikerSailor used.

Well, to give him credit, the police report and the press both refer to Zimmerman as a white guy.

That doesn't mean he is, though.

 

[saveliberty]

About a thousand different ways. Especially since only Zimmerman saw it happen....

So did Martin.

Care to speculate? I see one or two scenarios....the blast from the gun knocked Martin backwards. Or it made him fall forward on top Zimmerman. So how did he end up face down with his hands under his body?

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

 

[Ariux]

Homeboy was running an errand for his family you bitch.

The African should have stuck to that mission, instead of casing the neighborhood.

 

[saveliberty]

Homeboy was running an errand for his family you bitch.

The African should have stuck to that mission, instead of casing the neighborhood.

He was moving through the neighborhood on a path home. Followed by a killer.

 

[Si modo]

So did Martin.

Care to speculate? I see one or two scenarios....the blast from the gun knocked Martin backwards. Or it made him fall forward on top Zimmerman. So how did he end up face down with his hands under his body?

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

 

[California Girl]

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

So.... are you saying that the movies aren't real life?

 

[Si modo]

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

So.... are you saying that the movies aren't real life?

(Newton's Third)

 

[saveliberty]

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

However, there is a myth, kept alive by portrayals of shooting victims on television and in films being hurled backwards, that victims are actually "knocked down" or displaced by being struck with the force of a bullet. In fact, real gunshot victims relate that they had no immediate reaction. (Fackler, 1998) The maximum momentum transferred from different small arms projectiles, inluding large caliber rifles and shotguns, to an 80 kg body is only 0.01 to 0.18 m/s, negligible compared to the 1 to 2 m/s velocity of a pedestrian. (Karger and Knewbuehl, 1996)

FIREARMS TUTORIAL

 

[Si modo]

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

However, there is a myth, kept alive by portrayals of shooting victims on television and in films being hurled backwards, that victims are actually "knocked down" or displaced by being struck with the force of a bullet. In fact, real gunshot victims relate that they had no immediate reaction. (Fackler, 1998) The maximum momentum transferred from different small arms projectiles, inluding large caliber rifles and shotguns, to an 80 kg body is only 0.01 to 0.18 m/s, negligible compared to the 1 to 2 m/s velocity of a pedestrian. (Karger and Knewbuehl, 1996)

FIREARMS TUTORIAL

Negligible. Right.

 

[saveliberty]

Note the example suggests the person is moving toward the shooter. If moving away, the momentum should continue backwards.

 

[SFC Ollie]

So did Martin.

Care to speculate? I see one or two scenarios....the blast from the gun knocked Martin backwards. Or it made him fall forward on top Zimmerman. So how did he end up face down with his hands under his body?

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

And you've seen how many take a bullet? You simply never know.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

No, the physics do not.

That happens in the movies.

However, there is a myth, kept alive by portrayals of shooting victims on television and in films being hurled backwards, that victims are actually "knocked down" or displaced by being struck with the force of a bullet. In fact, real gunshot victims relate that they had no immediate reaction. (Fackler, 1998) The maximum momentum transferred from different small arms projectiles, inluding large caliber rifles and shotguns, to an 80 kg body is only 0.01 to 0.18 m/s, negligible compared to the 1 to 2 m/s velocity of a pedestrian. (Karger and Knewbuehl, 1996)

FIREARMS TUTORIAL

Actually it depends on the caliber of the firearm and knock down power. If a person of average size get's hit with a 45 acp hollow point 230 grain round they will fall backwards.

 

[saveliberty]

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

And you've seen how many take a bullet? You simply never know.

Yes, I noticed my quoted site was showing the bullets tubbling in flight (yaw), corkscrewing and a few other motions you don't normally consider in a trajectory.

 

[Si modo]

Note the example suggests the person is moving toward the shooter. If moving away, the momentum should continue backwards.

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

But, if you would like Wikipedia: "Hollywood depictions of firearm victims being thrown through plate-glass windows are inaccurate. Were this to be the case, the shooter would also be thrown backwards with equal force. Gunshot victims frequently fall or collapse when shot; this is less a result of the momentum of the bullet pushing them over, but is primarily caused by physical damage or psychological effects, perhaps combined with being off-balance. This is not the case if the victim is hit by heavier projectiles such as 20 mm cannon shell, where the momentum effects can be enormous; this is why very few such weapons can be fired without being mounted on a weapons platform or involve a recoilless system (e.g. a recoilless rifle)."

 

[saveliberty]

Note the example suggests the person is moving toward the shooter. If moving away, the momentum should continue backwards.

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

But, if you would like Wikipedia: "Hollywood depictions of firearm victims being thrown through plate-glass windows are inaccurate. Were this to be the case, the shooter would also be thrown backwards with equal force. Gunshot victims frequently fall or collapse when shot; this is less a result of the momentum of the bullet pushing them over, but is primarily caused by physical damage or psychological effects, perhaps combined with being off-balance. This is not the case if the victim is hit by heavier projectiles such as 20 mm cannon shell, where the momentum effects can be enormous; this is why very few such weapons can be fired without being mounted on a weapons platform or involve a recoilless system (e.g. a recoilless rifle)."

No, if moving away, your motion should continue in that direction. Also, the shooter has some type of recoil Si.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Purely speculation.

He was hit, grabbed his chest and fell forward........

6'3" 140 pound kid gets shot in the cheat. Physics says the lever should propel him backwards

And you've seen how many take a bullet? You simply never know.

Wasn't it truth matter who once claimed that a 357 mag hollow point would penetrated a engine block?