Why Are Republicans So Relentlessly Cruel to the Poor?

[Skull Pilot]

Some states have food not taxed, other I believe have healthy food not taxed.

Well, it is up to society to coerce people to do things, it happens ALL THE TIME. So many decisions are made by government where this happens.

So you don't want to control people for their own good? You don't want laws against murder? Laws against stealing? Laws against violence?

You're an anarchist then!

Every example you gave are laws that address harm done to OTHER people, not harm done to themselves. Next.

Here's a hint you might want to try. Motorcycle helmet laws.

Actually I think you're wrong. If it were legal to murder, I could murder, but I could also be murdered. It protects me that I can't murder or be murdered. But then again you could have responded to the point I was making.

You conflated "control people for their own good" with "laws against murder".

Oh really. So why do we have a law against murder? Why not go Discworld and make it okay as long as you're in a guild or something?

Why is making a law against murder not about controlling people for their own good?

It's about preventing people from doing harm to other people. That's controlling people for the good of others, not for their own good.

Controlling them for their own good assumes that they're too stupid to make good decisions for themselves and need a nanny state to take care of them. Ultimately, why do you think ANYONE has/ should have the authority to make those decisions for other people?

the law doesn't stop people who want to murder from murdering it merely sets out a punishment for the crime

 

[hadit]

Evidence?

Prove he is wrong. Until you can do that, we can only assume he is correct

Sorry, that's not the way it works. When you make a claim, it's up to you to prove it, not someone else to disprove it. Here's a good example:

I claim that friction is the result of extremely tiny demons that leap out from the surfaces of the two objects being rubbed together and hold hands. According to you, someone would have to prove I am wrong. Until they can do that, we can only assume I am correct. Of course, that's bunk. It's up to me to prove my assertion. Likewise for him.

Nonsense

Using Trumponian logic, the burden shifts to you until YOU to prove what he said is wrong. Until you can do that, his claim must be taken as fact

I'm not Trump. If you want to use "Trumponian logic", then Hillary is guilty and should be in jail.

That is our Presidents intent

Hey, I don't make the rules....I just live by them
Trumpian logic says you can make any absurd claim you want and until it is proven wrong...it is assumed to be a fact

Now, suppose I made the absurd claim that 3-5 million illegal voters voted for Hillary
The burden is on you to prove they didn't...it is assumed to be a fact until you do

I did not create this Bizarro World....I just live in it

When you're arguing with Trump, be sure to use that logic. I'm not Trump.

 

[Correll]

Right.

Because Trade Surpluses is why Japan and South Korean and China have experienced such poor economic performance over the last 50 years.

Japan has suffered a poor economy for decades is that they have repeatedly made efforts, as did petulant former President Barack Hussein Obama's stimulus programs. Like ours, theirs failed.

China was having excellent growth and is still having above 6%.

I've not followed South Korea.

Previous to that, Japan's rise from the ashes was driven by massive TRade Surpluses. And despite recent economic stagnation, they are still top tier.

South Korean has been following in those foot steps, as is China.

 

[rightwinger]

Sorry pal...It doesn't work like that

This is Trump's America...I get to make the claim, It is up to you to disprove it

Ball is in your court

that's not how it works in this country.

You have to prove that a person is guilty

Trumpian logic proves you wrong

I get to make my claim...I have done my part
Now, it is up to you to prove me wrong
Until you can do that, what I said gets accepted as a fact

sorry but there is no such thing just like there is no such thing as liberal logic

Ahhhhh...Bubble boy chimes in on his view of Trumpian America

so if I say you're guilty of murder then you are and you have to prove to me you didn't do it

OK pedophile child rapist baby killer you're guilty

Yea...Basically

Look at Trump accusing Hillary of killing Vince Foster and Ted Cruz's dad killing JFK

This s Trumpian America......Part of making America great again

 

[rightwinger]

Prove he is wrong. Until you can do that, we can only assume he is correct

Sorry, that's not the way it works. When you make a claim, it's up to you to prove it, not someone else to disprove it. Here's a good example:

I claim that friction is the result of extremely tiny demons that leap out from the surfaces of the two objects being rubbed together and hold hands. According to you, someone would have to prove I am wrong. Until they can do that, we can only assume I am correct. Of course, that's bunk. It's up to me to prove my assertion. Likewise for him.

Nonsense

Using Trumponian logic, the burden shifts to you until YOU to prove what he said is wrong. Until you can do that, his claim must be taken as fact

I'm not Trump. If you want to use "Trumponian logic", then Hillary is guilty and should be in jail.

That is our Presidents intent

Hey, I don't make the rules....I just live by them
Trumpian logic says you can make any absurd claim you want and until it is proven wrong...it is assumed to be a fact

Now, suppose I made the absurd claim that 3-5 million illegal voters voted for Hillary
The burden is on you to prove they didn't...it is assumed to be a fact until you do

I did not create this Bizarro World....I just live in it

When you're arguing with Trump, be sure to use that logic. I'm not Trump.

You voted for him...not me

 

[Skull Pilot]

that's not how it works in this country.

You have to prove that a person is guilty

Trumpian logic proves you wrong

I get to make my claim...I have done my part
Now, it is up to you to prove me wrong
Until you can do that, what I said gets accepted as a fact

sorry but there is no such thing just like there is no such thing as liberal logic

Ahhhhh...Bubble boy chimes in on his view of Trumpian America

so if I say you're guilty of murder then you are and you have to prove to me you didn't do it

OK pedophile child rapist baby killer you're guilty

Yea...Basically

Look at Trump accusing Hillary of killing Vince Foster and Ted Cruz's dad killing JFK

This s Trumpian America......Part of making America great again

I don't talk to child raping baby killers so unless you prove your innocence don't bother responding

 

[Redfish]

You're right that there are rich people in socialist countries.

They are the politicians and their friends.

Politicians never get rich in government except on the backs of the people

all russian politicians are million and billionaires

American politicians are the same

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

 

[rightwinger]

Trumpian logic proves you wrong

I get to make my claim...I have done my part
Now, it is up to you to prove me wrong
Until you can do that, what I said gets accepted as a fact

sorry but there is no such thing just like there is no such thing as liberal logic

Ahhhhh...Bubble boy chimes in on his view of Trumpian America

so if I say you're guilty of murder then you are and you have to prove to me you didn't do it

OK pedophile child rapist baby killer you're guilty

Yea...Basically

Look at Trump accusing Hillary of killing Vince Foster and Ted Cruz's dad killing JFK

This s Trumpian America......Part of making America great again

I don't talk to child raping baby killers so unless you prove your innocence don't bother responding

Now you are getting it....Welcome to Trump's America!

 

[sakinago]

Why Are Republicans So Relentlessly Cruel to the Poor?

Interesting article and much of it chimes with what we see in the UK.

It has to be coated with a thin veneer of religion to make it acceptable but in essence right wing politics is based on a selfish me me me doctrine. DISCUSS

This is an op-ed...with the headline why are the republicans so cruel to the poor.

Straw man
A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument which was not advanced by that opponent.

What's cruel to the poor is equating health insurance with actual healthcare in the ACA, then having their life expectancy drop for the first time in half a century.

Selfish me me me doctrine (as you put it) is what an overwhelming majority of humanity follows (wether they know it or not), ESPECIALLY THOSE IN GOVERNMENT. A flag lapel pin, or a R or D in front of your name does not exclude you from acting in your self interest. It actually gives you a greater ability to do so. Capitalism is the first system ever in which humanity incentivized serving humanity, and surprise surprise, it has brought 2 billion people world wide out of poverty. We have essentially solved most starvation, plague, and war (which has plagued humanity since its emergence). We have not been practicing capitalism in a long time, especially in the health care realm. Instead government has become a tool for the rich to stamp out competition, this is cronyism, NOT CAPITALISM. What we need to do is limit the ability of those in power to act in their own self interest. Our politicians are becoming very very rich despite being public "servants".

Top 10 wealthiest senators

 

[rightwinger]

all russian politicians are million and billionaires

American politicians are the same

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

Hate to inform you....But Congress and their staff had to take Obamacare as their personal medical policy when the bill was passed

The Grassley and Vitter Amendments and What They Illuminate About the Cost of Health Insurance

Senator Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa)1 proposed an amendment to Section 1312 of PPACA removing all members of Congress and their staffs from the Federal Employee Health Benefits (“FEHB”) program and forcing them to enter the newly-formed PPACA insurance exchanges.2As Grassley explained in 2009, “[t]he exchange…is designed to give participants the same kind of choices and options for health care coverage as federal employees. My interest in having members of Congress participate in the exchange is consistent with my long-held view that Congress should live under the same laws it passes for the rest of the country.”3 Surprisingly, the amendment passed,

 

[hadit]

Sorry, that's not the way it works. When you make a claim, it's up to you to prove it, not someone else to disprove it. Here's a good example:

I claim that friction is the result of extremely tiny demons that leap out from the surfaces of the two objects being rubbed together and hold hands. According to you, someone would have to prove I am wrong. Until they can do that, we can only assume I am correct. Of course, that's bunk. It's up to me to prove my assertion. Likewise for him.

Nonsense

Using Trumponian logic, the burden shifts to you until YOU to prove what he said is wrong. Until you can do that, his claim must be taken as fact

I'm not Trump. If you want to use "Trumponian logic", then Hillary is guilty and should be in jail.

That is our Presidents intent

Hey, I don't make the rules....I just live by them
Trumpian logic says you can make any absurd claim you want and until it is proven wrong...it is assumed to be a fact

Now, suppose I made the absurd claim that 3-5 million illegal voters voted for Hillary
The burden is on you to prove they didn't...it is assumed to be a fact until you do

I did not create this Bizarro World....I just live in it

When you're arguing with Trump, be sure to use that logic. I'm not Trump.

You voted for him...not me

Like I said, use that logic when you argue with Trump. I'm not Trump.

 

[sakinago]

American politicians are the same

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

Hate to inform you....But Congress and their staff had to take Obamacare as their personal medical policy when the bill was passed

The Grassley and Vitter Amendments and What They Illuminate About the Cost of Health Insurance

Senator Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa)1 proposed an amendment to Section 1312 of PPACA removing all members of Congress and their staffs from the Federal Employee Health Benefits (“FEHB”) program and forcing them to enter the newly-formed PPACA insurance exchanges.2As Grassley explained in 2009, “[t]he exchange…is designed to give participants the same kind of choices and options for health care coverage as federal employees. My interest in having members of Congress participate in the exchange is consistent with my long-held view that Congress should live under the same laws it passes for the rest of the country.”3 Surprisingly, the amendment passed,

Obamacare: Congress Exempt From Affordable Care Act

They did exempt themselves for 5 years.

 

[Redfish]

American politicians are the same

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

Hate to inform you....But Congress and their staff had to take Obamacare as their personal medical policy when the bill was passed

The Grassley and Vitter Amendments and What They Illuminate About the Cost of Health Insurance

Senator Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa)1 proposed an amendment to Section 1312 of PPACA removing all members of Congress and their staffs from the Federal Employee Health Benefits (“FEHB”) program and forcing them to enter the newly-formed PPACA insurance exchanges.2As Grassley explained in 2009, “[t]he exchange…is designed to give participants the same kind of choices and options for health care coverage as federal employees. My interest in having members of Congress participate in the exchange is consistent with my long-held view that Congress should live under the same laws it passes for the rest of the country.”3 Surprisingly, the amendment passed,

wrong again, winger

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelcannon/2016/04/15/congress-is-getting-a-special-exemption-from-obamacare-and-no-its-not-legal/#7b8b3b8f7823

 

[Redfish]

to the OP, Which is better for an able bodied poor person? A job or an EBT card? self reliance or dependence?

The dems want a permanent under class that is dependent on govt for everything and will continue to vote for dems to keep the welfare coming. This will destroy our country if allowed to continue.

 

[rightwinger]

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

Hate to inform you....But Congress and their staff had to take Obamacare as their personal medical policy when the bill was passed

The Grassley and Vitter Amendments and What They Illuminate About the Cost of Health Insurance

Senator Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa)1 proposed an amendment to Section 1312 of PPACA removing all members of Congress and their staffs from the Federal Employee Health Benefits (“FEHB”) program and forcing them to enter the newly-formed PPACA insurance exchanges.2As Grassley explained in 2009, “[t]he exchange…is designed to give participants the same kind of choices and options for health care coverage as federal employees. My interest in having members of Congress participate in the exchange is consistent with my long-held view that Congress should live under the same laws it passes for the rest of the country.”3 Surprisingly, the amendment passed,

Obamacare: Congress Exempt From Affordable Care Act

They did exempt themselves for 5 years.

No they didn't

President Obama worked on the Obamacare exemption for Congress which says that “the government can continue to make a contribution to the health care premiums of members of Congress and their aides

Previously, when covered under FEHB, Congressional members and their staff received an employer contribution to their healthcare expenses....much like you would get a contribution from your employer

This employer contribution was carried over to Obamacare

 

[rightwinger]

to the OP, Which is better for an able bodied poor person? A job or an EBT card? self reliance or dependence?

The dems want a permanent under class that is dependent on govt for everything and will continue to vote for dems to keep the welfare coming. This will destroy our country if allowed to continue.

Why don't Republicans get these people good paying jobs? They will vote Republican forever

 

[JoeNormal]

To answer the question in the OP, it's because conservatives are selfish pieces of shit,.

but they give more to charity than liberals??

I'll repeat:

Conservatives tend to donate to their churches (tax deductable) which in turn, contribute a small amount of that back to actual charities. The predominant church in my area considers itself a charitable organization for the tax benefits but the actual amount of charity is about 1%.

How do you know that? Are you a member of the church or did you just grab that 1% out of your ass?

Because I worked the numbers. That's what the predominant religion in my area contributes. Maybe some religions are more generous - but I doubt it's by much.

 

[rightwinger]

true,,but the difference is the american politicians made their money mostly before entering politics ,,not so much the Russians

Not true. Harry Reid had nothing when he went to congress. He retired a multi millionaire and never in his life had a real job. Corruption exists in both the USA and Russia.

there are always exceptions red but I did say mostly ,,Most of our people made most of their bread away from politics imho,,,,,Don't get me wrong I hate the garbage in our congress and insider trading legal?

some were rich before going to DC, but many got rich after getting there. Being in congress should not be a lifetime career. It should be a short term sacrifice for your country. We have allowed congress to become much too lucrative. Term limits would help. Making congress live to the laws they pass for us would also help. If congress had to deal with obamacare for their personal medical care, it would never have passed.

Hate to inform you....But Congress and their staff had to take Obamacare as their personal medical policy when the bill was passed

The Grassley and Vitter Amendments and What They Illuminate About the Cost of Health Insurance

Senator Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa)1 proposed an amendment to Section 1312 of PPACA removing all members of Congress and their staffs from the Federal Employee Health Benefits (“FEHB”) program and forcing them to enter the newly-formed PPACA insurance exchanges.2As Grassley explained in 2009, “[t]he exchange…is designed to give participants the same kind of choices and options for health care coverage as federal employees. My interest in having members of Congress participate in the exchange is consistent with my long-held view that Congress should live under the same laws it passes for the rest of the country.”3 Surprisingly, the amendment passed,

wrong again, winger

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelcannon/2016/04/15/congress-is-getting-a-special-exemption-from-obamacare-and-no-its-not-legal/#7b8b3b8f7823

You didn't read what you linked to did you?

The Affordable Care Act threw members and staff out of the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program, and basically says they can only get health benefits through one of the law's new Exchanges. Under pressure from Congress and the president himself, the federal Office of Personnel Management (which administers benefits for federal workers, including Congress) decided the House and Senate would participate in the District of Columbia's "Small Business Health Options Program," or "SHOP" Exchange, rather than the Exchanges that exist for individuals. The reason is that federal law would not allow members and staff to keep receiving a taxpayer contribution of up to $12,000 toward their premiums if they enrolled in individual-market Exchanges.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Yes, you can. You can also eat sugary food whether it's taxed highly or not taxed at all....

it's not up to the fucking government to try to alter behavior via taxes. If a person wants to eat chocolate covers salted nuts sprinkled on deep fired Twinkies and a bowl of ice cream for supper every night it's none of your god damned business

But again, it happens and you've shown you have no problem when the govt does it for negative reasons.

I don't have a problem with a person eating chocolate or sugar. But like I've said, how many times now, that a lot of the bad food is coming out cheaper than it should be.

People pay tax on things, and they don't pay tax on other stuff. Some states don't charge you tax for groceries and will charge you for buying a book. Someone's already making these decisions. It's not about me wanting to decide what someone eats, it's about not having sugary food dirt cheap and healthy food expensive, just because the sugary food keeps easily and the multinationals are shipping the stuff around and getting all the tax breaks. But again, you seem to like that.

when the government does what for negative reasons and what negative reasons?

and what tax breaks to candy companies get that healthy food companies don't get?

people have choices. Those companies you mention only exist because people CHOOSE to buy their products and those choices are none of yours or the government's business

Yes, people have choices. People often choose to buy inferior shit because it's cheaper, or because they've been advertised to death and just zombie walk into buy things.

If people had the choice to buy healthier food for cheaper, would they then buy healthy food or would they still buy the sugary shit? I know when I was a young adult I ate too much shit because it was cheaper and I didn't have much money.

I'm not talking about taking choices away from people. I'm talking about adjusting the choices so they make more sense to people.

When sugary drinks are cheaper than healthy drinks, what do people buy? They buy the sugary drinks because they can afford those. Give people the choice to buy healthy food at affordable prices and then they have a real choice.

Your "choice" is that they have cheap sugary drinks and expensive healthy food and then they're making a choice, it's still a choice if healthy food is cheaper and sugary drinks more expensive than they are now.

healthy food is NOT more expensive than processed crap
Soda is not cheaper than water or even iced tea you make at home

like I said if you eat off the dollar menu for every meal every day you spend more than enough money to buy real food for the week

The problem here is that people CAN do things cheaper, but they need to be EDUCATED in how to do things, this is becoming a cycle of you compartmentalizing things and then dismissing them all, but then finding out that what you said shouldn't happen is what should happen to deal with the next thing.

 

[Redfish]

to the OP, Which is better for an able bodied poor person? A job or an EBT card? self reliance or dependence?

The dems want a permanent under class that is dependent on govt for everything and will continue to vote for dems to keep the welfare coming. This will destroy our country if allowed to continue.

Why don't Republicans get these people good paying jobs? They will vote Republican forever

its already happening. Employers are investing in American facilities, hiring American workers. "America first".

thanks for acknowledging that the dem party is self destructing with its far left failed ideology.