Why do the God-haters persist?

[GISMYS]

... and God connects with me.

really, can you characterize a conversation you've recently had with the Almighty ??? -

or just before posting have God declare an event before it happens and let us know what it is ... we'll know for sure then, the degree of your "sanity" - complete or just partially (disabled) -

good luck, Bossy ...

.

Nothing I tell you will be viewed without skepticism. God doesn't convey future events to me or provide psychic ability. God provides more of a guidance, inspiration, personal strength and courage. Whenever I encounter a problem, a decision, a choice, a moral dilemma, a crisis in my life... I can take it to God and gain insight as to how I should proceed, and to my recollection, God has never let me down. That's not to say I've never made a bad decision, sometimes I have failed to listen to my spiritual guidance and suffered the consequences. Sometimes I have been too lazy to follow my spiritual guidance, and again, I paid the price. It is through these repeated experiences I have developed a great amount of trust in how I am guided spiritually, and I always try to follow it. Again.... what am I supposed to do with this? Abandon it so I can be one of the "cool" kids?

That's what I did. I told you until about a month ago I thought the same way you did. But the more debate and research I did the more I realized I'm talking to an imaginary person that I have no concrete reason in believing, and based on all the evidence, praying does nothing for anyone. It may make you feel good but statistically prayers are just not answered. One person says they were saved and it was a miracle but then the reason 1000 people died is because it was the lords will? Silly. And I guess we wouldn't care so much but you want to use your fantasies to wage wars, ban stem cell, fly planes into buildings, the spanish inquisition, burning people for being witches, trying to put prayer into school and our laws. These are the reasons we object.

And I love my friends who say I don't want to believe. Really? Who wouldn't want to believe? But WANT's got nothing to do with it. I also wonder if you stopped believing in God and in the future talked to yourself instead of talking to an imaginary man, wouldn't you be able to help yourself out and give yourself good advice? You really think it was the lord or your subconscience that you were talking to?

GOD HAS WORDS FOR YOU!!====Only a fool would say to himself, “There is no God.” And why does he say it?Because of his wicked heart, his dark and evil deeds. His life is corroded with sin.PSALM 53:1

 

[Boss]

But based on other things you've said, would it be more accurate to say that your concept of god is of something intelligent but simply without concerns of a human nature? That while god may have as little concern about most of what humanity does, god also is a highly intelligent entity with reasoning and purpose, simply beyond human comprehension?

I get the impression that, to use some common generalizations, you believe much more of a watchmaker god than the personal god of the Abrahamic religions. When you talk about connecting with god, however, it muddles things somewhat.

I have said before that perhaps "intelligence" is not the right word to apply to God. Try to imagine a level beyond or above "intelligent" in our sense of comprehension. We humans can't really relate because there is nothing about ourselves or the nature around us to relate it to, so we assign this attribute of "intelligence" to God because that's the best fit from our perspective as humans.

Reasoning and purpose, or "concern" are human attributes as well. We assign these to our various incarnations of God because we have no other basis of reference we can relate to. I believe we very much connect with God through spiritual awareness but our human minds grapple with trying to comprehend the magnitude. Therefore, it is our tendency to apply humanistic characteristics to God, which leads to various religious incarnations.

 

[Boss]

The difference is I can understand how electricity works.

Exactly, and that has been my whole point. We understand how electricity works, that's the ONLY difference here. Now.... DID electricity still work the way it does before we discovered how it worked? Of course a rational mind will conclude that it certainly did, we just didn't understand it. The fact that we can't comprehend or understand something, doesn't mean it isn't real or doesn't exist. It just means we don't understand it.

We don't understand spiritual nature. Perhaps one day we will? Theoretical Physics is now exploring the possibility of multiple universes and dimensions where our physical sciences are essentially worthless because they simply may not apply. That means the thing we call "logic" may also not apply in another universe or dimension. It's a completely mind-blowing thought, but very much on the white boards of science as we speak.

Going back to electricity, or the physics property known as "electromagnetism" in specific... Can you explain to me WHY it exists in our universe? You see, you can explain HOW things work all day long, and that is great and wonderful, it leads to knowledge and wisdom of the universe around us, but you can't really ever explain WHY. What I am always left with in any debate with someone who doesn't believe in God or Spiritual Nature, is "just because!" That seems to suffice as the cure-all answer to everything... "It just so happens that _________." To me, that is the complete and utter abandonment of the Scientific Method and an adoption of faith in disbelief.

 

[Boss]

That's what I did. I told you until about a month ago I thought the same way you did. But the more debate and research I did the more I realized I'm talking to an imaginary person that I have no concrete reason in believing, and based on all the evidence, praying does nothing for anyone. It may make you feel good but statistically prayers are just not answered. One person says they were saved and it was a miracle but then the reason 1000 people died is because it was the lords will? Silly. And I guess we wouldn't care so much but you want to use your fantasies to wage wars, ban stem cell, fly planes into buildings, the spanish inquisition, burning people for being witches, trying to put prayer into school and our laws. These are the reasons we object.

And I love my friends who say I don't want to believe. Really? Who wouldn't want to believe? But WANT's got nothing to do with it. I also wonder if you stopped believing in God and in the future talked to yourself instead of talking to an imaginary man, wouldn't you be able to help yourself out and give yourself good advice? You really think it was the lord or your subconscience that you were talking to?

It sounds to me, in conversing with you these past days, that what has happened is a disillusionment in whatever religious teaching you were following. There are many reasons for such a thing, and honestly, there are reasons stemming from the religious dogma itself sometimes. As I said earlier, organized religions are flawed because man is flawed. That said, one of our biggest flaws is trying to rationalize God and what God allows, doesn't allow, lets happen, doesn't prevent from happening, etc. We imagine if WE were God, what WE would do, how things would be if WE were in charge. Well.... We're NOT GOD!

You said something very interesting and introspective... Who wouldn't want to believe? This tells me that you do understand we have some kind of hard-wired intrinsic awareness of something greater than ourselves. Of course you want to believe, it's part of your DNA. Do you honestly and truthfully believe you don't have a soul? A spirit and essence of who you are? That everything around you in this most amazing universe is completely without meaning or purpose and all a big cosmic accident? If you really DO believe that, I feel sad for you, really I do.

 

[Steven_R]

The difference is I can understand how electricity works.

Exactly, and that has been my whole point. We understand how electricity works, that's the ONLY difference here. Now.... DID electricity still work the way it does before we discovered how it worked? Of course a rational mind will conclude that it certainly did, we just didn't understand it. The fact that we can't comprehend or understand something, doesn't mean it isn't real or doesn't exist. It just means we don't understand it.

We don't understand spiritual nature. Perhaps one day we will? Theoretical Physics is now exploring the possibility of multiple universes and dimensions where our physical sciences are essentially worthless because they simply may not apply. That means the thing we call "logic" may also not apply in another universe or dimension. It's a completely mind-blowing thought, but very much on the white boards of science as we speak.

Going back to electricity, or the physics property known as "electromagnetism" in specific... Can you explain to me WHY it exists in our universe? You see, you can explain HOW things work all day long, and that is great and wonderful, it leads to knowledge and wisdom of the universe around us, but you can't really ever explain WHY. What I am always left with in any debate with someone who doesn't believe in God or Spiritual Nature, is "just because!" That seems to suffice as the cure-all answer to everything... "It just so happens that _________." To me, that is the complete and utter abandonment of the Scientific Method and an adoption of faith in disbelief.

You're missing the point. I can understand electricity because it is demonstrable. I can observe it, measure it, quantify it, build a hypothesis around it, construct a falsifiable test to see if my hypothesis is correct, and then tell other people my results. I can do none of that with God. You can't use the scientific method to back up your belief in the supernatural. It isn't the same thing.

As far as science answering the question "why" the universe is laid out like it is, you're better off asking a philosopher. Science isn't interested in why, only how. We're interested in understanding the mechanism that ended up with gravity, EM, Strong and Weak nuclear, quantum physics, particles, black holes, space-time, and a gajillion other topics, but the universe is laid out how it's laid out.

 

[sealybobo]

BELIEVERS have the entire universe and life as proof of God,how much more proof do fools need???

Pointing to the universe or to living things and saying that's your proof of God is very ignorant and not proof of a god at all. This is a God of the Gaps approach. Your lack of understanding concerning the universe does not mean god holds any explanatory value.

P.S. How do you look at the universe and come up with adam and eve, noah's ark, talking snakes, people who lived 800 years, etc? You don't. Man made all that stuff up soon after he invented the concept of god.

What proof do atheists need? A God actually proving its own existence is what would convince an atheist. Why does he hide? Seems pretty petty to me.

HOW SAD!!! Must you feel the flames of eternal hell before you wise up????? Far too late then!!! think!

Is that the best you got? If I don't believe you cockameme story I'll burn in hell. This is why we must keep religion out of our laws/government. Fucking retards trying to impose their nonsensical American version of Sharia law on the rest of us. Listen lady/buddy, you believe a fairy tale and the fact that all you have for a response is to try to scare me into blindly believing the bullshit you believe should tell you something, but I'm sure it doesn't. You must know deep down the entire story you believe was made up to control you, because the rich people that have controlled our societies since the beginning have used religion to keep you under their control. In fact I bet you that the rich are paying close attention to how many people are religious. If the day comes where 51% of us are too smart to believe bullshit stories they will somewhat lose their control over us. Although chnaces are all the smart people who become enlightened will most likely live in blue states and the red states in the bible belt will stay ignorant for another couple hundreds of years and that is how the rich will continue to control us, even when the majority of us are no longer brainwashed from birth to believe the unbelievable, which you do by the way.

Notice there were other gods before the old testament? And the old testament and new testament stole from those older religions. Those older religions had virgin births and resurrections too. They had a messiah who healed the sick and performed other miracles. So your religion isn't even original. And if all the other religions are bullshit, which I'm sure you agree with me they are, then why can't your's be bullshit too?

The easy answer is "I'll burn in hell for even questioning". That is what your pedophile priest or molesting minister wants you to believe. If you even question them you will upset God because he's a jealous petty god and gives a fuck what you or I think.

 

[koshergrl]

So much hate packed into one post.

We're good with keeping religion out of laws.

We also want laws kept out of religion. That's what statist pigs don't get. You don't get to regulate our religion. So fuck off. And then die and enjoy your eternity.

 

[thebrucebeat]

That's what I did. I told you until about a month ago I thought the same way you did. But the more debate and research I did the more I realized I'm talking to an imaginary person that I have no concrete reason in believing, and based on all the evidence, praying does nothing for anyone. It may make you feel good but statistically prayers are just not answered. One person says they were saved and it was a miracle but then the reason 1000 people died is because it was the lords will? Silly. And I guess we wouldn't care so much but you want to use your fantasies to wage wars, ban stem cell, fly planes into buildings, the spanish inquisition, burning people for being witches, trying to put prayer into school and our laws. These are the reasons we object.

And I love my friends who say I don't want to believe. Really? Who wouldn't want to believe? But WANT's got nothing to do with it. I also wonder if you stopped believing in God and in the future talked to yourself instead of talking to an imaginary man, wouldn't you be able to help yourself out and give yourself good advice? You really think it was the lord or your subconscience that you were talking to?

It sounds to me, in conversing with you these past days, that what has happened is a disillusionment in whatever religious teaching you were following. There are many reasons for such a thing, and honestly, there are reasons stemming from the religious dogma itself sometimes. As I said earlier, organized religions are flawed because man is flawed. That said, one of our biggest flaws is trying to rationalize God and what God allows, doesn't allow, lets happen, doesn't prevent from happening, etc. We imagine if WE were God, what WE would do, how things would be if WE were in charge. Well.... We're NOT GOD!

You said something very interesting and introspective... Who wouldn't want to believe? This tells me that you do understand we have some kind of hard-wired intrinsic awareness of something greater than ourselves. Of course you want to believe, it's part of your DNA. Do you honestly and truthfully believe you don't have a soul? A spirit and essence of who you are? That everything around you in this most amazing universe is completely without meaning or purpose and all a big cosmic accident? If you really DO believe that, I feel sad for you, really I do.

LOL!!!
Who wouldn't want to believe?
Everyone has the same fears, doubts and wonders.
Who wouldn't want a facile answer that would wipe that all away?
Buddy, you've come to the right place!
Boss will throw you a life preserver.

 

[Steven_R]

So much hate packed into one post.

We're good with keeping religion out of laws.

We also want laws kept out of religion. That's what statist pigs don't get. You don't get to regulate our religion. So fuck off. And then die and enjoy your eternity.

Who wants to? Believe what you want to, shout it from the street corners if you like, just don't use your God(s) to form laws, don't put it in classrooms, and don't use public resources to promote your religion.

 

[orogenicman]

So much hate packed into one post.

We're good with keeping religion out of laws.

No you aren't. Evangelicals try to get religion into our laws all the time.

We also want laws kept out of religion.

Actually, you people have been trying to make your religion the law.

That's what statist pigs don't get. You don't get to regulate our religion. So fuck off. And then die and enjoy your eternity.

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

 

[Steven_R]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I seem to remember somebody saying something about rendering unto Caesar what is Caesar's. Ten internets to whoever can name that guy.

 

[orogenicman]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I seem to remember somebody saying something about rendering unto Caesar what is Caesar's. Ten internets to whoever can name that guy.

Jesus Christ, of course.

 

[Montrovant]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I seem to remember somebody saying something about rendering unto Caesar what is Caesar's. Ten internets to whoever can name that guy.

As I understand it, a religious organization doesn't automatically get tax exempt status, and non-religious organizations also can be tax exempt. There are certain conditions, non-profit being the major one.

Is my understand incorrect? I've only looked into it in the most superficial manner.

 

[Boss]

The difference is I can understand how electricity works.

Exactly, and that has been my whole point. We understand how electricity works, that's the ONLY difference here. Now.... DID electricity still work the way it does before we discovered how it worked? Of course a rational mind will conclude that it certainly did, we just didn't understand it. The fact that we can't comprehend or understand something, doesn't mean it isn't real or doesn't exist. It just means we don't understand it.

We don't understand spiritual nature. Perhaps one day we will? Theoretical Physics is now exploring the possibility of multiple universes and dimensions where our physical sciences are essentially worthless because they simply may not apply. That means the thing we call "logic" may also not apply in another universe or dimension. It's a completely mind-blowing thought, but very much on the white boards of science as we speak.

Going back to electricity, or the physics property known as "electromagnetism" in specific... Can you explain to me WHY it exists in our universe? You see, you can explain HOW things work all day long, and that is great and wonderful, it leads to knowledge and wisdom of the universe around us, but you can't really ever explain WHY. What I am always left with in any debate with someone who doesn't believe in God or Spiritual Nature, is "just because!" That seems to suffice as the cure-all answer to everything... "It just so happens that _________." To me, that is the complete and utter abandonment of the Scientific Method and an adoption of faith in disbelief.

You're missing the point. I can understand electricity because it is demonstrable. I can observe it, measure it, quantify it, build a hypothesis around it, construct a falsifiable test to see if my hypothesis is correct, and then tell other people my results. I can do none of that with God. You can't use the scientific method to back up your belief in the supernatural. It isn't the same thing.

As far as science answering the question "why" the universe is laid out like it is, you're better off asking a philosopher. Science isn't interested in why, only how. We're interested in understanding the mechanism that ended up with gravity, EM, Strong and Weak nuclear, quantum physics, particles, black holes, space-time, and a gajillion other topics, but the universe is laid out how it's laid out.

No, you are missing the point. Before you (or man) knew how to observe it, measure it, quantify it, build a hypothesis or falsify tests around it, or tell others about it... it STILL existed, it STILL was real. The fact that at some point you (or man) discovered this, did not suddenly make it become a reality where it wasn't reality before. You're right, I can't use the scientific method to back up my believe in God or Spiritual Nature, just like if you went back in time, man could not use the scientific method to back up beliefs regarding electricity. Electricity was once considered very much a "supernatural" power.

YES... WHY? Is very much a philosophical question and science can't answer it.

 

[Boss]

So much hate packed into one post.

We're good with keeping religion out of laws.

We also want laws kept out of religion. That's what statist pigs don't get. You don't get to regulate our religion. So fuck off. And then die and enjoy your eternity.

Who wants to? Believe what you want to, shout it from the street corners if you like, just don't use your God(s) to form laws, don't put it in classrooms, and don't use public resources to promote your religion.

Sorry but we don't live under authoritarian atheist rule... yet.

We have the freedom to exercise our religion, and that certainly includes whatever influence our religious beliefs have on our politics. We cannot divorce ourselves from our religious beliefs in the name of policy and still be exercising religious freedom. Religious people have just as much right to lobby for their views and use public resources as you do. You can't silence their political voice and still claim they have religious freedom. It's like telling black folks they can have "equal rights" but they just can't vote or hold public office.

 

[Clement]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I like this plan. I will be able to say anything I want to say in the pulpit, endorse candidates for office, support or condemn political issues and causes, the possibilies are endless.

And there wouldn't be a damn thing you could do to stop me.

Go ahead, make my day.

 

[Hollie]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I like this plan. I will be able to say anything I want to say in the pulpit, endorse candidates for office, support or condemn political issues and causes, the possibilies are endless.

And there wouldn't be a damn thing you could do to stop me.

Go ahead, make my day.

There's nothing preventing you from doing that now.

Lose the creepy martyr complex. It's, well, creepy.

 

[orogenicman]

Actually, nothing would please me more than see the tax exempt status of religion taken away. The rest of us have to pay our taxes. You are no better than anyone else, so ante up.

I like this plan. I will be able to say anything I want to say in the pulpit, endorse candidates for office, support or condemn political issues and causes, the possibilies are endless.

You mean like now?

Notice that I fixed the attribution that was messed up in your post.

 

[Clement]

I like this plan. I will be able to say anything I want to say in the pulpit, endorse candidates for office, support or condemn political issues and causes, the possibilies are endless.

And there wouldn't be a damn thing you could do to stop me.

Go ahead, make my day.

There's nothing preventing you from doing that now.

Lose the creepy martyr complex. It's, well, creepy.

Yeah, there is something preventing me from doing it. Get a clue.

 

[BreezeWood]

Who wants to? Believe what you want to, shout it from the street corners if you like, just don't use your God(s) to form laws, don't put it in classrooms, and don't use public resources to promote your religion.

Sorry but we don't live under authoritarian atheist rule... yet.

We have the freedom to exercise our religion, and that certainly includes whatever influence our religious beliefs have on our politics. We cannot divorce ourselves from our religious beliefs in the name of policy and still be exercising religious freedom. Religious people have just as much right to lobby for their views and use public resources as you do. You can't silence their political voice and still claim they have religious freedom. It's like telling black folks they can have "equal rights" but they just can't vote or hold public office.

Ahh. The race card.

Sorry but we don't live under authoritarian atheist rule... yet.

as though authoritarian religiosity isn't why the 1st amendment was written to separate church from State .... as an abatement from the brutality religion has inflicted throughout humanities existence.

.