Why do the God-haters persist?

[MrMax]

You never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality, and you want ME to prove my statement that you never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality. The lack of your proof is my proof. Get it? You fucking noob.

Well the proof is, we make spiritual connection and other animals don't. We also have a sense of right and wrong and other animals don't.
This would also be the biological conclusion of any other species ever examined. If salmon only swim upstream to spawn and you observe a salmon swimming upstream, it's probably not going sightseeing. If cherry blossoms only bloom on cherry trees in the spring and you see cherry blossoms on a tree, it's safe to say it's a cherry tree in spring. If you witness someone on a message board who is unable to make their points and resorts to personal insults and denigrations, they are probably an idiot.

Now, do you have any scientific evidence to offer, that the unique human attribute of spirituality and the unique human attribute of knowing right from wrong are unrelated?

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

 

[Newby]

You never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality, and you want ME to prove my statement that you never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality. The lack of your proof is my proof. Get it? You fucking noob.

Well the proof is, we make spiritual connection and other animals don't. We also have a sense of right and wrong and other animals don't.
This would also be the biological conclusion of any other species ever examined. If salmon only swim upstream to spawn and you observe a salmon swimming upstream, it's probably not going sightseeing. If cherry blossoms only bloom on cherry trees in the spring and you see cherry blossoms on a tree, it's safe to say it's a cherry tree in spring. If you witness someone on a message board who is unable to make their points and resorts to personal insults and denigrations, they are probably an idiot.

Now, do you have any scientific evidence to offer, that the unique human attribute of spirituality and the unique human attribute of knowing right from wrong are unrelated?

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

How delightful, yet another militant, hateful atheist running around calling someone else a noob when the idiot's just joined the board himself this month. Does it get any better?

 

[Newby]

Just the fact that this thread has gone 642 posts attracting every militant athesit on the board and even new ones, is testimony proving the op's premise.

 

[MrMax]

Well the proof is, we make spiritual connection and other animals don't. We also have a sense of right and wrong and other animals don't.
This would also be the biological conclusion of any other species ever examined. If salmon only swim upstream to spawn and you observe a salmon swimming upstream, it's probably not going sightseeing. If cherry blossoms only bloom on cherry trees in the spring and you see cherry blossoms on a tree, it's safe to say it's a cherry tree in spring. If you witness someone on a message board who is unable to make their points and resorts to personal insults and denigrations, they are probably an idiot.

Now, do you have any scientific evidence to offer, that the unique human attribute of spirituality and the unique human attribute of knowing right from wrong are unrelated?

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

How delightful, yet another militant, hateful atheist running around calling someone else a noob when the idiot's just joined the board himself this month. Does it get any better?

I noticed though, that you couldn't refute my post. Gee, another noob who can only attack the poster, not the post.

 

[Newby]

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

How delightful, yet another militant, hateful atheist running around calling someone else a noob when the idiot's just joined the board himself this month. Does it get any better?

I noticed though, that you couldn't refute my post. Gee, another noob who can only attack the poster, not the post.

There's nothing there worth refuting, you refute hate by ignoring it. Hey, and at least you can be accurate calling me that since at least it's my name, otherwise you just look like a total idiot!

 

[Boss]

You never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality, and you want ME to prove my statement that you never proved the connection between knowing right and wrong and spirituality. The lack of your proof is my proof. Get it? You fucking noob.

Well the proof is, we make spiritual connection and other animals don't. We also have a sense of right and wrong and other animals don't.
This would also be the biological conclusion of any other species ever examined. If salmon only swim upstream to spawn and you observe a salmon swimming upstream, it's probably not going sightseeing. If cherry blossoms only bloom on cherry trees in the spring and you see cherry blossoms on a tree, it's safe to say it's a cherry tree in spring. If you witness someone on a message board who is unable to make their points and resorts to personal insults and denigrations, they are probably an idiot.

Now, do you have any scientific evidence to offer, that the unique human attribute of spirituality and the unique human attribute of knowing right from wrong are unrelated?

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

Didn't say Occam's was an irrefutable principle, or that I could give you physical scientfic evidence of something spiritual. Most non-retards understand that physical science can't currently evaluate the spiritual. So now you are presenting arguments ad absurdum. You asked for evidence of a connection and that's what I gave you. Now, I've asked you for evidence to suggest there is not a connection, and you've not provided an answer. Punk!

 

[MrMax]

Well the proof is, we make spiritual connection and other animals don't. We also have a sense of right and wrong and other animals don't.
This would also be the biological conclusion of any other species ever examined. If salmon only swim upstream to spawn and you observe a salmon swimming upstream, it's probably not going sightseeing. If cherry blossoms only bloom on cherry trees in the spring and you see cherry blossoms on a tree, it's safe to say it's a cherry tree in spring. If you witness someone on a message board who is unable to make their points and resorts to personal insults and denigrations, they are probably an idiot.

Now, do you have any scientific evidence to offer, that the unique human attribute of spirituality and the unique human attribute of knowing right from wrong are unrelated?

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

Didn't say Occam's was an irrefutable principle, or that I could give you physical scientfic evidence of something spiritual. Most non-retards understand that physical science can't currently evaluate the spiritual. So now you are presenting arguments ad absurdum. You asked for evidence of a connection and that's what I gave you. Now, I've asked you for evidence to suggest there is not a connection, and you've not provided an answer. Punk!

Problem is, Occam's razor isn't proof. So what is the connection? You haven't shown one yet for me to refute.

 

[BreezeWood]

Other animals lack the ability to spiritually connect, and thus, lack the ability to reason moral right and wrong or behave accordingly. They naturally behave by primal instinct.

... does that include all that is Flora as well is without a spiritual connection ?


why wouldn't religious people "persist" against such an insidious characterization evolved from an obviously depraved soul.

.

 

[Boss]

Occam's razor says no such thing, you fucking noob.
"In science, Occam's Razor is used as a heuristic (discovery tool) to guide scientists in the development of theoretical models rather than as an arbiter between published models.[8][9] In the scientific method, Occam's Razor is not considered an irrefutable principle of logic or a scientific result.[1][10][11]".
You offer nothing to prove your point and want scientific evidence to refute your claim? Why don't YOU offer up some real scientific evidence to prove your claim first? You can't? Gee, what a surprise.

Didn't say Occam's was an irrefutable principle, or that I could give you physical scientfic evidence of something spiritual. Most non-retards understand that physical science can't currently evaluate the spiritual. So now you are presenting arguments ad absurdum. You asked for evidence of a connection and that's what I gave you. Now, I've asked you for evidence to suggest there is not a connection, and you've not provided an answer. Punk!

Problem is, Occam's razor isn't proof. So what is the connection? You haven't shown one yet for me to refute.

No, Occam's isn't proof and I didn't say it was. Occam's Razor is a principle of parsimony, a way to evaluate answers to questions. I presented it in support of my answer to the question because the question involves something non-physical that physical sciences alone are unable to confirm. Again, the "connection" is obvious, we are spiritual and we have a sense of morality judgement and act upon it. The later comes from the former, and Occam's Razor supports this. Biological observation and behavioral information of other species also supports this. I could also throw in 'common sense' but you seem to be lacking in that department.

Now, a salmon and how it reproduces is totally physical, we can derive an answer to the question of why salmon only spawn when they swim upstream at certain times of the year because we're dealing with physical nature. But if we had no physical way to evaluate the question, Occam's Razor would apply. Salmon obviously must swim upstream to spawn, since that seems to always be what happens whenever they swim upstream at certain times of the year. It's not an unrelated coincidence. The two unique circumstances are related. Occam's Razor doesn't "prove" this, but it helps to support the argument.

While we're on the subject, let's talk a moment about "proof" and what that means. In a purely philosophical sense, NOTHING is proven. Not even reality. Proof is subjective. It is dependent on personal evaluation of what you are willing to accept as valid evidence. You may say, "well, I can prove gravity by doing an experiment..." No, you can prove gravity to yourself because you are willing to accept the evidence of your experiment as valid. If I am not willing to accept your evidence as valid, you've not proven gravity to me.

In the case of spiritual nature and things related to spirituality, you refuse to acknowledge they exist because there is no physical evidence. I can't change that fact. I'm never going to be able to present you with valid physical evidence of spiritual nature, and if I could do that, it would immediately cease to be spiritual nature, so we have a logic dichotomy. I don't know which is more stupid and idiotic, a person who thinks there can be physical proof of something spiritual or someone who posts on a public forum as if they expect such evidence to be presented. Repeatedly doing this doesn't make you any smarter.

 

[Boss]

Other animals lack the ability to spiritually connect, and thus, lack the ability to reason moral right and wrong or behave accordingly. They naturally behave by primal instinct.

... does that include all that is Flora as well is without a spiritual connection ?


why wouldn't religious people "persist" against such an insidious characterization evolved from an obviously depraved soul.

.

Show me evidence Flora has awareness of right and wrong and acts upon it, and I will agree that Flora has spiritual awareness. Until then, I can't say I see evidence of this, it's an interesting proposition and maybe you are correct, but you need more than an opinion to validate your argument.

 

[daws101]

How is the promise of an "afterlife" not a bribe? How is the hell not a threat? Granted that to those who believe they don't have that perception but to those that don't that is how they appear. If you are good I will give you some candy and it you are bad I will send you to your room. Same concepts of carrot and stick.

Wow sounds like you hate God because you don't understand him.

I guess that makes sense.

My point is, if God do has never paid a bribe to anyone to slant or falsify a study to make a *scientific* point, and then portray that *science* as beyond question.

And when did I say that there were no threats with God? Those who aren't saved will go to hell. There can be no righteousness, no judgement, without punishment. Hell is the just punishment for rejection of God. If you don't like it, oh well, why does it make you so angry at God? You don't believe in God, remember?

who is god do?.....you're always correct Tiara is slipping.

 

[daws101]

Your join date is March 2014, Mr. Max. Boss has 2 years on you.

Whoops your slip is showing.

another fine example of kosher hag's meaningless ranking system....

 

[daws101]

Your join date is March 2014, Mr. Max. Boss has 2 years on you.

Whoops your slip is showing.

Wtf does that have to do with anything?

bump!

 

[daws101]

Pascal's wrong.

God will not forgive the atheists. They rejected God, and they will suffer the consequences.

I know. Dirty word. Atheists hate God because they recognize that he will impose consequences upon them for rejecting him, repeatedly.

Oh well.

right! now prove pascals wrong..since it's a mathematical exercise and you are not a mathematician by any stretch of the imagination, this should be fun.

 

[daws101]

So then why do people like myself and millions more have no profound spiritual connection? Are we then unable to "rationalize right from wrong"?
Your spiritual connection is part of religion, so is your "Creator".

for the most part you've shown yourself unable, yes......I see people killing unborn children, I see racism, I see drug abuse, I see war......none of those things are taught by religion......

really.....
Religious war quotes:

“There is a religious war going on in our country for the soul of America”

Patrick Buchanan quotes

“We had better dispense with the personification of evil, because it leads, all too easily, to the most dangerous kind of war: religious war.”

Konrad Lorenz quotes (Austrian Zoologist, 1903-1989)


The fruits of Christianity were religious wars, butcheries, crusades, inquisitions, extermination of the natives of America and the introduction of African slaves in their place”

Arthur Schopenhauer quotes (German Philosopher, 1788-1860)


“We all remember how many religious wars were fought for a religion of love and gentleness; how many bodies were burned alive with the genuinely kind intention of saving souls from the eternal fire of hell”

Karl Popper

“After all, it [the Internet] was designed to withstand nuclear war, not just the puny huffs and puffs of politicians and religious fanatics.”

Denise Caruso quotes (Digital commerce columnist, New York Times)

“In the long term we can hope that religion will change the nature of man and reduce conflict. But history is not encouraging in this respect. The bloodiest wars in history have been religious wars.”

Richard M. Nixon quotes (American 37th US President (1969-74), 1913-1994)

“CROSS, n. An ancient religious symbol erroneously supposed to owe its significance to the most solemn event in the history of Christianity, but really antedating it by thousands of years. By many it has been believed to be identical with the _crux ansata_ of the ancient phallic worship, but it has been traced even beyond all that we know of that, to the rites of primitive peoples. We have to-day the White Cross as a symbol of chastity, and the Red Cross as a badge of benevolent neutrality in war. Having in mind the former, the reverend Father Gassalasca Jape smites the lyre to the effect following:

"Be good, be good!" the sisterhood Cry out in holy chorus, And, to dissuade from sin, parade Their various charms before us.


But why, O why, has ne'er an eye Seen her of winsome manner And youthful grace and pretty face Flaunting the White Cross banner?



Now where's the need of speech and screed To better our behaving? A simpler plan for saving man

(But, first, is he worth saving?)

Is, dears, when he declines to flee From bad thoughts that beset him, Ignores the Law as 't were a straw, And wants to sin --don't let him.”

Ambrose Bierce quotes (American Writer, Journalist and Editor, 1842-1914)
Book: Devil's Dictionary quotes


“The Revolution was effected before the War commenced. The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments of their duties and obligations. This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people, was the real American Revolution.”

John Adams quotes (American 2nd US President (1797-1801), 1735-1826)

 

[Boss]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Fuck... time to put the ol' scroll button to use folks!
This idiot is going to prattle on for 30-40 more posts.

Just keep on scrolling!

 

[daws101]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Fuck... time to put the ol' scroll button to use folks!
This idiot is going to prattle on for 30-40 more posts.

Just keep on scrolling!

yes folks follow boosy's advice he will yammer nonsense for many posts to come.

 

[MrMax]

Didn't say Occam's was an irrefutable principle, or that I could give you physical scientfic evidence of something spiritual. Most non-retards understand that physical science can't currently evaluate the spiritual. So now you are presenting arguments ad absurdum. You asked for evidence of a connection and that's what I gave you. Now, I've asked you for evidence to suggest there is not a connection, and you've not provided an answer. Punk!

Problem is, Occam's razor isn't proof. So what is the connection? You haven't shown one yet for me to refute.

No, Occam's isn't proof and I didn't say it was. Occam's Razor is a principle of parsimony, a way to evaluate answers to questions. I presented it in support of my answer to the question because the question involves something non-physical that physical sciences alone are unable to confirm. Again, the "connection" is obvious, we are spiritual and we have a sense of morality judgement and act upon it. The later comes from the former, and Occam's Razor supports this. Biological observation and behavioral information of other species also supports this. I could also throw in 'common sense' but you seem to be lacking in that department.

Now, a salmon and how it reproduces is totally physical, we can derive an answer to the question of why salmon only spawn when they swim upstream at certain times of the year because we're dealing with physical nature. But if we had no physical way to evaluate the question, Occam's Razor wouuld apply. Salmon obviously must swim upstream to spawn, since that seems to always be what happens whenever they swim upstream at certain times of the year. It's not an unrelated coincidence. The two unique circumstances are related. Occam's Razor doesn't "prove" this, but it helps to support the argument.

While we're on the subject, let's talk a moment about "proof" and what that means. In a purely philosophical sense, NOTHING is proven. Not even reality. Proof is subjective. It is dependent on personal evaluation of what you are willing to accept as valid evidence. You may say, "well, I can prove gravity by doing an experiment..." No, you can prove gravity to yourself because you are willing to accept the evidence of your experiment as valid. If I am not willing to accept your evidence as valid, you've not proven gravity to me.

In the case of spiritual nature and things related to spirituality, you refuse to acknowledge they exist because there is no physical evidence. I can't change that fact. I'm never going to be able to present you with valid physical evidence of spiritual nature, and if I could do that, it would immediately cease to be spiritual nature, so we have a logic dichotomy. I don't know which is more stupid and idiotic, a person who thinks there can be physical proof of something spiritual or someone who posts on a public forum as if they expect such evidence to be presented. Repeatedly doing this doesn't make you any smarter.

So in other words for you, proof doesn't exist, ever. Ok, so you admit you have no proof. You thinking that something is obvious with no proof whatsoever is not refutable as there's still nothing to refute except your opinion, which is just an opinion, no biggie. Got it.

 

[GISMYS]

The Perfect Revelation of the Lord

To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David.
19 The heavens declare the glory of God;
And the firmament shows His handiwork.
2
Day unto day utters speech,
And night unto night reveals knowledge.
3
There is no speech nor language
Where their voice is not heard.
4
Their line has gone out through all the earth,
And their words to the end of the world.
In them He has set a tabernacle for the sun,
5
Which is like a bridegroom coming out of his chamber,
And rejoices like a strong man to run its race.
6
Its rising is from one end of heaven,
And its circuit to the other end;
And there is nothing hidden from its heat.
7
The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul;
The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple;
8
The statutes of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart;
The commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes;
9
The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever;
The judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.
10
More to be desired are they than gold,
Yea, than much fine gold;
Sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
11
Moreover by them Your servant is warned,
And in keeping them there is great reward.
12
Who can understand his errors?
Cleanse me from secret faults.
13
Keep back Your servant also from presumptuous sins;
Let them not have dominion over me.
Then I shall be blameless,
And I shall be innocent of great transgression.
14
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Your sight,
O Lord, my strength and my Redeemer.

 

[Boss]

Problem is, Occam's razor isn't proof. So what is the connection? You haven't shown one yet for me to refute.

No, Occam's isn't proof and I didn't say it was. Occam's Razor is a principle of parsimony, a way to evaluate answers to questions. I presented it in support of my answer to the question because the question involves something non-physical that physical sciences alone are unable to confirm. Again, the "connection" is obvious, we are spiritual and we have a sense of morality judgement and act upon it. The later comes from the former, and Occam's Razor supports this. Biological observation and behavioral information of other species also supports this. I could also throw in 'common sense' but you seem to be lacking in that department.

Now, a salmon and how it reproduces is totally physical, we can derive an answer to the question of why salmon only spawn when they swim upstream at certain times of the year because we're dealing with physical nature. But if we had no physical way to evaluate the question, Occam's Razor wouuld apply. Salmon obviously must swim upstream to spawn, since that seems to always be what happens whenever they swim upstream at certain times of the year. It's not an unrelated coincidence. The two unique circumstances are related. Occam's Razor doesn't "prove" this, but it helps to support the argument.

While we're on the subject, let's talk a moment about "proof" and what that means. In a purely philosophical sense, NOTHING is proven. Not even reality. Proof is subjective. It is dependent on personal evaluation of what you are willing to accept as valid evidence. You may say, "well, I can prove gravity by doing an experiment..." No, you can prove gravity to yourself because you are willing to accept the evidence of your experiment as valid. If I am not willing to accept your evidence as valid, you've not proven gravity to me.

In the case of spiritual nature and things related to spirituality, you refuse to acknowledge they exist because there is no physical evidence. I can't change that fact. I'm never going to be able to present you with valid physical evidence of spiritual nature, and if I could do that, it would immediately cease to be spiritual nature, so we have a logic dichotomy. I don't know which is more stupid and idiotic, a person who thinks there can be physical proof of something spiritual or someone who posts on a public forum as if they expect such evidence to be presented. Repeatedly doing this doesn't make you any smarter.

So in other words for you, proof doesn't exist, ever. Ok, so you admit you have no proof. You thinking that something is obvious with no proof whatsoever is not refutable as there's still nothing to refute except your opinion, which is just an opinion, no biggie. Got it.

Again, try to comprehend this in your pea-sized little brain... PROOF is subjective. ALL PROOF! It is totally dependent on what you accept as valid evidence. I presented evidence, you rejected it. You did not refute it, you rejected it. We're all free to reject anything we please, it does not ever mean that we refuted it.