Why dont we solve the problem, instead of executing people ?

A person who is falsely imprisoned may be released when his innocence is later proven. A dead man cannot be brought back to life.

So a guy spends 20 years in prison, gets let out at the age of 60 into the real world, and you're okay with that.

The only people that were ever released from prison are those who were found innocent because of DNA technology which we use on all murder cases today, or in a few very rare instances, a witness responsible for the prisoner being put in prison came forward and admitted they lied.

That's besides the fact I'm all for putting people to death where there was absolutely no question of their guilt. Video cameras, past death threats, DNA evidence, cases with empirical evidence the accused was no doubt the murderer.
I am confident that American juries have convicted innocent people whom they believed were guilty beyond a shadow of doubt. You should read "To Kill A Mockingbird".
Outside of the USA money is not considered so important.

Considering the number of prisoners we have due to the lack of real punishment in our system, the cost of our prison system is a major issue here in the US. Executing our felons and moral criminals would greatly reduce our Justice System costs and probsbly reduce social spending as well.
In America, prisons are Big Business.

You are misinformed.

You, continue to be uninformed. I have asked you for proof on executed innocent people in the last 50 years and you ignore the question meaning you have no clue.

Here is my proof that your beloved European countries have more violent crime than does the USA.

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.
By James Slack
UPDATED:18:14 EST, 2 July 2009

Britain's violent crime record is worse than any other country in the European union, it has been revealed.

Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and even South Africa - widely considered one of the world's most dangerous countries.

The figures comes on the day new Home Secretary Alan Johnson makes his first major speech on crime, promising to be tough on loutish behaviour.

84c77444-9f81-4a40-b4de-986eb206f652_zpsm4p8cbp2.jpg


The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 920 and South Africa 1,609.

Shadow Home Secretary Chris Grayling said: 'This is a damning indictment of this government's comprehensive failure over more than a decade to tackle the deep rooted social problems in our society, and the knock on effect on crime and anti-social behaviour.

Read more: The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S. | Daily Mail Online
Britain is leaving the European Union.

So seven of the highest crime rates in the world are EU members. Also Britains numbers are taken while Britain was still in the EU.
This article was comparing Britain mainly to other EU countries. It is not that comprehensive.

It shows that crime rates are higher in the EU over the US. More comprehensive articles show that the gunless EU has a much higher crime rate than the US. Pretty easy to sort out.
I'm sorry but the report is a sensational piece of reporting from 8 years ago by James Slack who writes for the tabloid hard right Daily Mail. I do not trust it.
 
Still waiting for that list of innocent prisoners executed in error over the past fifty years.

Eloy cannot produce such a list which makes this whole thread bogus.

Once again, two years to carry out all appeals after being sentenced to death. Then carry out the sentence and move on to the next.
Your request is unreasonable because we do not have all the data. I can provide a sample of some known wrongful executions in Southern states.:

Carlos DeLuna was executed in Texas in December 1989. Subsequent investigations cast strong doubt upon DeLuna's guilt for the murder of which he had been convicted.
The wrong Carlos: how Texas sent an innocent man to his death

Jesse Tafero was convicted of murder and executed via electric chair in May 1990 in the state of Florida for the murders of two Florida Highway Patrol officers. The conviction of a co-defendant was overturned in 1992 after a recreation of the crime scene indicated a third person had committed the murders.
Jesse Tafero - Wikipedia

Johnny Garrett of Texas was executed in February 1992 for allegedly raping and murdering a nun. In March 2004 cold-case DNA testing identified Leoncio Rueda as the rapist and murderer of another elderly victim killed four months earlier. Immediately following the nun's murder, prosecutors and police were certain the two cases were committed by the same assailant.
1992: Johnny Frank Garrett, "kiss my ass because I'm innocent"

Cameron Todd Willingham was executed in February 2004 for murdering his three young children by arson at the family home in Corsicana, Texas. Nationally known fire investigator Gerald Hurst reviewed the case documents, including the trial transcriptions and an hour-long videotape of the aftermath of the fire scene, and said in December 2004 that "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire."
Death by Fire

In 2015, the Justice Department and the FBI formally acknowledged that nearly every examiner in an FBI forensic squad overstated forensic hair matches for two decades before the year 2000. Of the 28 forensic examiners testifying to hair matches in a total of 268 trials reviewed, 26 overstated the evidence of forensic hair matches and 95% of the overstatements favored the prosecution. Defendants were sentenced to death in 32 of those 268 cases.
Report: DOJ, FBI Admit Years of Flawed Testimony From Forensic Unit

The only story that could be overturned was the last story. The second one is the guy already raped and murdered someone except he didn't kill the nun? So the other rape and murder is wrongful to? Lol! Again, not heavy proof on most of these stories.
 
Still waiting for that list of innocent prisoners executed in error over the past fifty years.

Eloy cannot produce such a list which makes this whole thread bogus.

Once again, two years to carry out all appeals after being sentenced to death. Then carry out the sentence and move on to the next.
Your request is unreasonable because we do not have all the data. I can provide a sample of some known wrongful executions in Southern states.:

Carlos DeLuna was executed in Texas in December 1989. Subsequent investigations cast strong doubt upon DeLuna's guilt for the murder of which he had been convicted.
The wrong Carlos: how Texas sent an innocent man to his death

Jesse Tafero was convicted of murder and executed via electric chair in May 1990 in the state of Florida for the murders of two Florida Highway Patrol officers. The conviction of a co-defendant was overturned in 1992 after a recreation of the crime scene indicated a third person had committed the murders.
Jesse Tafero - Wikipedia

Johnny Garrett of Texas was executed in February 1992 for allegedly raping and murdering a nun. In March 2004 cold-case DNA testing identified Leoncio Rueda as the rapist and murderer of another elderly victim killed four months earlier. Immediately following the nun's murder, prosecutors and police were certain the two cases were committed by the same assailant.
1992: Johnny Frank Garrett, "kiss my ass because I'm innocent"

Cameron Todd Willingham was executed in February 2004 for murdering his three young children by arson at the family home in Corsicana, Texas. Nationally known fire investigator Gerald Hurst reviewed the case documents, including the trial transcriptions and an hour-long videotape of the aftermath of the fire scene, and said in December 2004 that "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire."
Death by Fire

In 2015, the Justice Department and the FBI formally acknowledged that nearly every examiner in an FBI forensic squad overstated forensic hair matches for two decades before the year 2000. Of the 28 forensic examiners testifying to hair matches in a total of 268 trials reviewed, 26 overstated the evidence of forensic hair matches and 95% of the overstatements favored the prosecution. Defendants were sentenced to death in 32 of those 268 cases.
Report: DOJ, FBI Admit Years of Flawed Testimony From Forensic Unit

The only story that could be overturned was the last story. The second one is the guy already raped and murdered someone except he didn't kill the nun? So the other rape and murder is wrongful to? Lol! Again, not heavy proof on most of these stories.
Legal opinion disagrees with you. I can tell you are a speed reader since your post was made after several articles were cited and a documentary from Frontline that lasts an hour.

I cannot argue with you any further on the matter of the common miscarriage of justice in the USA.
 
Still waiting for that list of innocent prisoners executed in error over the past fifty years.

Eloy cannot produce such a list which makes this whole thread bogus.

Once again, two years to carry out all appeals after being sentenced to death. Then carry out the sentence and move on to the next.
Your request is unreasonable because we do not have all the data. I can provide a sample of some known wrongful executions in Southern states.:

Carlos DeLuna was executed in Texas in December 1989. Subsequent investigations cast strong doubt upon DeLuna's guilt for the murder of which he had been convicted.
The wrong Carlos: how Texas sent an innocent man to his death

Jesse Tafero was convicted of murder and executed via electric chair in May 1990 in the state of Florida for the murders of two Florida Highway Patrol officers. The conviction of a co-defendant was overturned in 1992 after a recreation of the crime scene indicated a third person had committed the murders.
Jesse Tafero - Wikipedia

Johnny Garrett of Texas was executed in February 1992 for allegedly raping and murdering a nun. In March 2004 cold-case DNA testing identified Leoncio Rueda as the rapist and murderer of another elderly victim killed four months earlier. Immediately following the nun's murder, prosecutors and police were certain the two cases were committed by the same assailant.
1992: Johnny Frank Garrett, "kiss my ass because I'm innocent"

Cameron Todd Willingham was executed in February 2004 for murdering his three young children by arson at the family home in Corsicana, Texas. Nationally known fire investigator Gerald Hurst reviewed the case documents, including the trial transcriptions and an hour-long videotape of the aftermath of the fire scene, and said in December 2004 that "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire."
Death by Fire

In 2015, the Justice Department and the FBI formally acknowledged that nearly every examiner in an FBI forensic squad overstated forensic hair matches for two decades before the year 2000. Of the 28 forensic examiners testifying to hair matches in a total of 268 trials reviewed, 26 overstated the evidence of forensic hair matches and 95% of the overstatements favored the prosecution. Defendants were sentenced to death in 32 of those 268 cases.
Report: DOJ, FBI Admit Years of Flawed Testimony From Forensic Unit

The only story that could be overturned was the last story. The second one is the guy already raped and murdered someone except he didn't kill the nun? So the other rape and murder is wrongful to? Lol! Again, not heavy proof on most of these stories.
Legal opinion disagrees with you. I can tell you are a speed reader since your post was made after several articles were cited and a documentary from Frontline that lasts an hour.

I cannot argue with you any further on the matter of the common miscarriage of justice in the USA.

That is because your argument isn't valid. I accept your defeat.
 
View attachment 135176

The fact of the matter is, is that most people on death row, belong in a place shown in the photo...
Starting at around age 15 to 18, for the rest of their lives.... or for a long time.
Based on their mental functioning, their intelligence scores, and their education and their personal background.


Why don't we do that, instead of executing people ?
Link? Many murderers are of above average intelligence.
 
Your request is unreasonable because we do not have all the data. I can provide a sample of some known wrongful executions in Southern states.:

Carlos DeLuna was executed in Texas in December 1989. Subsequent investigations cast strong doubt upon DeLuna's guilt for the murder of which he had been convicted.
The wrong Carlos: how Texas sent an innocent man to his death

Jesse Tafero was convicted of murder and executed via electric chair in May 1990 in the state of Florida for the murders of two Florida Highway Patrol officers. The conviction of a co-defendant was overturned in 1992 after a recreation of the crime scene indicated a third person had committed the murders.
Jesse Tafero - Wikipedia

Johnny Garrett of Texas was executed in February 1992 for allegedly raping and murdering a nun. In March 2004 cold-case DNA testing identified Leoncio Rueda as the rapist and murderer of another elderly victim killed four months earlier. Immediately following the nun's murder, prosecutors and police were certain the two cases were committed by the same assailant.
1992: Johnny Frank Garrett, "kiss my ass because I'm innocent"

Cameron Todd Willingham was executed in February 2004 for murdering his three young children by arson at the family home in Corsicana, Texas. Nationally known fire investigator Gerald Hurst reviewed the case documents, including the trial transcriptions and an hour-long videotape of the aftermath of the fire scene, and said in December 2004 that "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire."
Death by Fire

In 2015, the Justice Department and the FBI formally acknowledged that nearly every examiner in an FBI forensic squad overstated forensic hair matches for two decades before the year 2000. Of the 28 forensic examiners testifying to hair matches in a total of 268 trials reviewed, 26 overstated the evidence of forensic hair matches and 95% of the overstatements favored the prosecution. Defendants were sentenced to death in 32 of those 268 cases.
Report: DOJ, FBI Admit Years of Flawed Testimony From Forensic Unit

Tafero, In Florida, if you are present when a felony is committed and someone is killed, you are also guilty of murder. Zip

Willingham, a fair trial, all sides presented. Later a book was written by someone, one person, said it might not have been arson. Zip

How many of the 32 have been executed based solely on hair matches? Zip

IF a frog had wings it wouldn't keep bumping it's behind every time it hit the ground.

So you've got nothing but flimsy allegations from folks like yourself. Grasping at straws.
 
I'm sorry but the report is a sensational piece of reporting from 8 years ago by James Slack who writes for the tabloid hard right Daily Mail. I do not trust it.

Nothing sensational, it simply lists facts. As objectionable as they are to you.

James Slack, the person you do not trust. Who do you trust? O.J. Simpson?
James Slack is a British journalist. Previously Home Affairs editor of the title, he was appointed political editor of the Daily Mail in October 2015 in succession to James Chapman, who had been appointed as spokesman for George Osborne, then Chancellor of the Exchequer.[1]

Slack wrote the controversial Enemies of the People front page article on the 4th November 2016 criticising and abusing Senior Judges in the High Court in England who had made a decision the British Daily Mail newspaper did not agree with.

At the Daily Mail, as Home Affairs editor, he was involved in the campaign to stop Gary McKinnon, who suffers from Asperger's Syndrome, from being extradited to the United States to face charges relating to computer hacking.[1][2][3]

At the end of January 2017 it appeared that Slack was to be appointed as prime minister Theresa May's official spokesman,[4][5] which was confirmed on 10 February.

Violent Crime is More Common in Europe than the USA
October 20, 2015
An interesting 2011 paper looks at crime rates since 1970 in the United States and 8 major European countries. The authors, mostly Italian, come to a conclusion that will surprise many people: Europe has become more dangerous than the United States:

In 1970 the aggregate crime rate in the seven European countries we consider was 63% of the corresponding US figure, but by 2007 it was 85% higher than in the United States. This striking reversal results from a steady increase in the total crime rate in Europe during the last 40 years, and the decline in the US rate after 1990. The reversal of misfortunes is also observed for property and violent crimes.

Violent Crime is More Common in Europe than the USA
 
Your request is unreasonable because we do not have all the data. I can provide a sample of some known wrongful executions in Southern states.:

Carlos DeLuna was executed in Texas in December 1989. Subsequent investigations cast strong doubt upon DeLuna's guilt for the murder of which he had been convicted.
The wrong Carlos: how Texas sent an innocent man to his death

Jesse Tafero was convicted of murder and executed via electric chair in May 1990 in the state of Florida for the murders of two Florida Highway Patrol officers. The conviction of a co-defendant was overturned in 1992 after a recreation of the crime scene indicated a third person had committed the murders.
Jesse Tafero - Wikipedia

Johnny Garrett of Texas was executed in February 1992 for allegedly raping and murdering a nun. In March 2004 cold-case DNA testing identified Leoncio Rueda as the rapist and murderer of another elderly victim killed four months earlier. Immediately following the nun's murder, prosecutors and police were certain the two cases were committed by the same assailant.
1992: Johnny Frank Garrett, "kiss my ass because I'm innocent"

Cameron Todd Willingham was executed in February 2004 for murdering his three young children by arson at the family home in Corsicana, Texas. Nationally known fire investigator Gerald Hurst reviewed the case documents, including the trial transcriptions and an hour-long videotape of the aftermath of the fire scene, and said in December 2004 that "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire."
Death by Fire

In 2015, the Justice Department and the FBI formally acknowledged that nearly every examiner in an FBI forensic squad overstated forensic hair matches for two decades before the year 2000. Of the 28 forensic examiners testifying to hair matches in a total of 268 trials reviewed, 26 overstated the evidence of forensic hair matches and 95% of the overstatements favored the prosecution. Defendants were sentenced to death in 32 of those 268 cases.
Report: DOJ, FBI Admit Years of Flawed Testimony From Forensic Unit

Tafero, In Florida, if you are present when a felony is committed and someone is killed, you are also guilty of murder. Zip
Walter Rhodes was present when the felony was committed (he was the shooter) but he was not charged with murder because he turned state's evidence (by committing perjury).

Willingham, a fair trial, all sides presented. Later a book was written by someone, one person, said it might not have been arson. Zip
No, not later and more than "a book" has been written about the wrongful killing of Willingham by the people of Texas. He always claimed his innocence (refusing a plea bargain), and the arson investigation used to convict him was questioned by leading experts before Willingham was executed. He did not receive a fair trial because the judge allowed incompetent forensic so-called experts to give evidence that the fire was deliberately started. He also allowed the testimony of a jailhouse snitch who claimed that Willingham had confessed to him! There was no motive for Willingham to kill his three children. Then before the execution Willingham’s conviction documented evidence was sent to the Governor and parole board which showed that the conviction was unsafe because it was based on erroneous forensic analysis.

[QUOTE="Markle, post: 17595174, member: 57289"How many of the 32 have been executed based solely on hair matches? Zip[/QUOTE]
I do not have access to a law library but you seem callously unconcerned about wrongful convictions which sent people to their deaths based on false testimony.
 
I'm sorry but the report is a sensational piece of reporting from 8 years ago by James Slack who writes for the tabloid hard right Daily Mail. I do not trust it.

Nothing sensational, it simply lists facts. As objectionable as they are to you.

James Slack, the person you do not trust. Who do you trust? O.J. Simpson?
James Slack is a British journalist. Previously Home Affairs editor of the title, he was appointed political editor of the Daily Mail in October 2015 in succession to James Chapman, who had been appointed as spokesman for George Osborne, then Chancellor of the Exchequer.[1]

Slack wrote the controversial Enemies of the People front page article on the 4th November 2016 criticising and abusing Senior Judges in the High Court in England who had made a decision the British Daily Mail newspaper did not agree with. ...
Enough said. For American readers here, all they need to know is that the Daily Mail is a sensationalist hard right rag that supported Adolf Hitler, continues to be racist, and promotes the Conservative Party's line. Slack is a hack.

Daily%20Mail_zpsri4xkcjp.jpg

The current "Viscount" Rothermere has inherited more than a title from his great grandfather who met Hitler and used his newspaper, the Daily Mail, to promote fascism.
 
They got themselves on death row. It's not my problem to get them off death row.
No they didn't put themselves on death row.
The Government put them there.
And its time the Government didn't.


Are you suggesting that the government goes out on the street and arbitrarily gabs someoe and puts them on death row? That's sure what it sounds like.

People on death row heinously took another's life. The prerequisites for sentencing someone to death are pretty narrow. The are convicted of a prescribed crime in such a brutal and inhuman manner that death is warranted. The go thru a fair trial, many time weeks to argue and counter-argue evidence (Within that last 5 years I sat on a jury in a murder trial). If the jury sentences the convicted to death, there are many years of appeals before the sentence is carried out.

The mentally deficient are usually not sentenced to death. And those that are such that they can't participate or understand what is going on in their trial, don't even go to trial. They are committed to a secure mental institution. While not a capital murder case, a prime example is John Hinckley Jr. (who is still institutionalized) and his attempted assassination Of Ronald Reagan.

Granted, in years past, innocent people were executed. But since the advent of DNA collection and testing, the number has greatly decreased, add to that the formation and success of such groups as The Innocence Project that number has decreased even more. Also, more and more governors are granting Clemence to many inmates and their sentence are to change to life without parole.

99.999% of there for reasons unfathomable to civilized human beings. We cannot even imagine the depravity required to commit such and act. Can you honesty relate to the to Timothy McVay in his premeditated murder of 160 men, women, and children in Oklahoma City? How about Jeffery Dahmer and the murder and cannibalizing of young men and boys?

I believe you're a bleeding heart Liberal that wants to coddle and pamper the vicious, inhuman, deranged (notice I didn't say insane, many of them aren't) dregs of society.

We put down rabid, and vicious, dogs.
 
They got themselves on death row. It's not my problem to get them off death row.
No they didn't put themselves on death row.
The Government put them there.
And its time the Government didn't.

We could always just deport them to Afghanistan. Works for me.

How about they are reported to the state's mental health system by the schools that they attend, and they're taken off the streets and put into the facility in the photograph,
before they do more serious crimes.

You mean fight precrime, like Minority Report?
 
I really think child predators should be killed. They serve no purpose to society except for menace and terror. Their crimes are usually always premeditated and they are manipulative beings by nature because that is part of what makes them the evil monsters that they are. They cannot be cured of their sick disease either. There is always going to be a risk to children when you release one of these pedophiles into society.

There has been a pedophile posting on another forum that I'm at, advocating for being able to sex up our children without interference by the law. It should be a "choice" of the children he says. That just proves to me that this guy should be killed. That is the logical thing to do, IMO. I wouldn't mind strangling him myself. I don't have any pity for him whatsoever.
The more you write, the more you make my point that brutal people are in favor of killing.

Killing them is not brutal. It is doing society in general a favor. Anyone who targets children is not worthy of being treated like a human being.
You are wrong to dehumanize any person. When you start doing that, to have taken the step in the road to state murder.

"You are wrong to dehumanize any person"

Nope, they chose to dehumanize themselves by committing the atrocity(s) they did. It's as simple as that.
 
Many Whites in Alabama if poled would probably vote to bring back racial segregation now, segregation tomorrow, and segregation forever.

You really are clueless, aren't you.

I imagine a very small minority just might do that. However a vast majority would find the thought objectionable.

You watch too much Hollywood. The people in the south drive cars now, they gave up the horse and buggies just last year. Farmers sold their plow mules a few months ago and bought tractors. They know what an airplane is, and a few of them have actually flown in one. They, honest to god, have electric lights and don't have to pull a chain/string to turn them on. They gave up their old hand crank telephones and will have cell phones next week. The Televisions they bought from the Sear & Roebuck catalogue should be there in a day or two.

Idiot.

I'm sure that being from the vaunted (and going broke) EU, combined with your European snobbery and your belief in your superiority, you know exactly how Americans think and feel.

We broke from England, and by extension Europe as well, 241 years ago. I think we made it quite clear that we didn't desire to be like you in any way, shape, or form. We defeated the British, with a little help from France (who seemed to be in perpetual war with England anyway), and became self sufficient with our own leaders, legislative body, and courts. We drafted a Constitution that often influenced other nations after gaining their freedom. While most of them adopted the Parliamentary model, the freedoms for their citizens and limits on their government reflect our Constitution. While not our Constitution, even Ho Che Minh's deceleration of independence for Vietnam took passages from from our Deceleration.

Sorry to get long winded, but a European's faux superiority and their need to tell us what we should do pisses me off to no end. That a conglomerate of countries with what, 20-30 million people each(?), trying to school us, a country of 320 million, on what is right, true, and correct is over the top. Their Socialist ideals aren't what most of us here strive for. They evidently look down their noses at our Representative Republic.
 
Stop beating off.

That's not something I do, as you well know. Grows hair in your palms and sends ya straight to Hell.

Of course people like you prefer favoring the criminals and the immoral over the good and decent people of the world.
 
For those who support our lowest forms of life, consider the following example:

Guy breaks into your house. There are witnesses and the culprit lacks an alibi. He rapes and then kills your little girl. His DNA is everywhere. He even admits guilt.

Give me ONE good reason this guy should live longer than a week after declared guilty. Additionally, these types of cases should be expedited as priority.

We all know our courts are jammed with bureaucrats, but I promise you, that wouldn't be the case if we stopped pampering leaches, including the attorneys who represent them.

Say, were any snowflakes able to respond to this scenario, or is it just better to ignore reality and support liberal rhetoric?
 
For those who support our lowest forms of life, consider the following example:

Guy breaks into your house. There are witnesses and the culprit lacks an alibi. He rapes and then kills your little girl. His DNA is everywhere. He even admits guilt.

Give me ONE good reason this guy should live longer than a week after declared guilty. Additionally, these types of cases should be expedited as priority.

We all know our courts are jammed with bureaucrats, but I promise you, that wouldn't be the case if we stopped pampering leaches, including the attorneys who represent them.
Plain and simple: I do not trust the court system that much.

Note: in this area, four people were knowingly and deliberately framed for murder by the FBI...the only reason none were executed was the Supreme Court stopping executions.
 

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