Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

[Billo_Really]

Hey dickwad, questions and rhetorical statements don't promote anything!

 

[bripat9643]

The cheapest way is to create a strong enough deterrent so they don't come here in the first place. Lead by example. If you put out a welcome mat on our border, people are going to take that literally. Same holds true for a Not Welcome mat.

If your life and the life of your family is threatened in your own country and you come here seeking asylum as a last resort, inhuman pieces of shit like yourself have no right to stop them.

Wrong again, douchebag. Every native born American has a right to stop them. Furthermore, their lives aren't threatened, only their standard of living.

 

[bripat9643]

Just Trump getting elected with his pro-wall stance was enough to seriously quell illegals for a very long time. Just imagine what the wall would do. You think invite them?????????

There is no such thing as an illegal person.

Lame. This semantic word twisting has already been dealt with.

 

[Karl Rand]

Your stupidity is showing now, the States do the redistricting not congress and the majority of the State legislatures aren't liberal. In fact liberal States will be losing seats to more conservative States.

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Due to republican voter fraud like in North Carolina?

Something both sides of politics in the US haven’t woken up to yet. Putin is laughing himself stupid since he’s managed to make American politics into a mindless cat fight whilst using his Trump puppet to achieve his own ends. Just about every move Trump has made in foreign policy is from the Kremlin guide book.

 

[Karl Rand]

The cheapest way is to create a strong enough deterrent so they don't come here in the first place. Lead by example. If you put out a welcome mat on our border, people are going to take that literally. Same holds true for a Not Welcome mat.

If your life and the life of your family is threatened in your own country and you come here seeking asylum as a last resort, inhuman pieces of shit like yourself have no right to stop them.

Wrong again, douchebag. Every native born American has a right to stop them. Furthermore, their lives aren't threatened, only their standard of living.

If American hadn’t supported corrupt thuggish governments in Sth America for decades and given meaningful aid instead the economic and political nightmare those countries have become wouldn’t have as many wanting to escape.What goes around, comes around.

 

[WheelieAddict]

Why hasn't Mexico paid for that limited amount of new fences yet?

 

[Billo_Really]

So you live in a tent? That's still a fucking wall, live on the streets and when you wake up some Illegal Mexican steals your shoes..


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There's no such thing as illegal people, fuck-face.

 

[Billo_Really]

Wrong again, douchebag. Every native born American has a right to stop them. Furthermore, their lives aren't threatened, only their standard of living.

You're such a fuckin' liar. As well as a bad American.

 

[Billo_Really]

If American hadn’t supported corrupt thuggish governments in Sth America for decades and given meaningful aid instead the economic and political nightmare those countries have become wouldn’t have as many wanting to escape.What goes around, comes around.

Ask any Chilean what they think about our CIA?

 

[Wyatt earp]

So you live in a tent? That's still a fucking wall, live on the streets and when you wake up some Illegal Mexican steals your shoes..


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There's no such thing as illegal people, fuck-face.

Uhm so you don't know the laws Illegal?


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[Wyatt earp]

Wrong again, douchebag. Every native born American has a right to stop them. Furthermore, their lives aren't threatened, only their standard of living.

You're such a fuckin' liar. As well as a bad American.

A bad American like you who wants millions of Illegal rapist killer Mexicans in this country?

.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Why hasn't Mexico paid for that limited amount of new fences yet?

Uhm trump is not a fascist dictator like the Messiah was?

 

[dblack]

We aren't discussing "immigrants." We're discussing illegal aliens. Douchebags like you always like to blur the distinction between the two.

Sure we are. We're discussing immigrants and guest workers. The reason there are so many "illegals" here is because the laws limiting entry are too restrictive. If we changed that, if we made it easier for immigrants and workers to enter the country legally, we could focus on the remaining "illegals" knowing that they were up to no good.

As it is, you have little sympathy for the crackdown on "illegals" because people know that most of them are just trying to feed their families.

 

[dblack]

A bad American like you who wants millions of Illegal rapist killer Mexicans in this country?

I smell a new band name!

 

[Porter Rockwell]

You shouldn't try to educate the Trump is God supporters. Trump won because he got the most electoral votes. He lost the popular vote.

That leftist argument doesn't fly. It's like saying because football team A got more yards than football team B, football team A was the better team even though they lost.

We didn't have a race for the popular vote so nobody planned their strategy that way. Trump didn't waste time in highly populated liberal areas because it would have been a waste of time, and Hillary stuck to those areas because the others would have been a waste of time for her.

You can't claim victory over something that accidentally happened.

I suppose that if I had a leftist argument to make, you might be right. You have two problems:

It has been explained to you by more than one person on this thread that I am not a liberal. So, you don't have a clue as to what is going on in the world around you.

Secondly, whether Trump planned his campaign around right wing congressional districts or not, as it stands TODAY, there are far more people on the left than on the right with the Democrats holding the House of Representatives. In 2020 Congress redraws the congressional districts. That is the normal course of business once the Census has been taken. WHEN that happens, the Democrats will draw the lines to favor the left.

If I were a lefty, i wouldn't be trying to explain the way the world works. I'd just sit here and let you finish off this country. So, what has to happen is that you NEED to find solutions that both sides can live with; that the laws you pass will not get overturned to avenge the arrogant and pushy way the right has chosen to use.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

Do you bother paying attention? What makes you lie like a New York politician? You most assuredly HAVE BEEN shown how the enforcement of laws related to immigration affect your Rights. Are you going to force me to repeat the Printz decision (a pro-gun ruling) being used to justify Sanctuary Cities? Do I have to repeat that to you? Do you see why my posts to you cannot be brief? I'll help you out. Read what I read this morning:

Trump was right.

See posts 5 through 8. Maybe they can explain this so you get the picture.

Insofar as the all or nothing comment, I'll say this:

It would be easier and more prudent; cheaper and more likely to pass an idea to Congress a bill that both sides would sign. The thing of it is, some folks done figured it out. You've been had and that link above shows that you are about to be in a world of skeet... or how did they put it in the movie Full Metal Jacket?

I have no idea what that outdoors blog has to do with this conversation. As for the link that started it, it only explained how Trump was talking about closing down the border if Mexico wasn't going to help. What does that prove? The article talked about how gang members were planning to use our systems to enter the country illegally, and thankfully since we DO HAVE border agents, they busted them.

The border has nothing to do with my rights or yours. It didn't have anything to do with my rights last year, the year before, ten years before, or even twenty, and extending the border wall won't change that either.

You live in a state of denial. WHEN Nancy Pelosi sticks that gun up your arse, you are welcome to come back here and make the idiotic, irrelevant, stupid, and moronic statements you've become noted for.

Everything associated with that wall will have a cost - and I agree, it WILL be built. It will be built at a cost to your constitutional Liberties just as that link is also predicting. If you don't understand the correlation, you should read a few civics books and give it a rest on the posting. Those posts talked about a HELL of a lot more than what you claim. You must think that those who agree with you are total idiots and won't check it out for themselves. You may or may not be right, but if even one of them checks it out, they will begin thinking about the real costs of forfeiting their Liberty for a stupid wall.

Well I'll tell you what, if the wall is built and you lose some sort of liberty, start a topic on it and I'll be glad to be one of the first posters to tell you that you're right.

The Democrats have been trying to disarm America for as long as I remember. A wall won't change that pro or con. What secures our rights is not a wall, but an American unbiased Supreme Court which has already stopped Democrats from trying to make it more difficult and costly to secure our Second Amendment rights.

What you are trying to do is convince us that your predictions are set in stone. There is no truth to that. You can speculate all you want, but until you have some sort of evidence of your claim, it's moot just like anybody else's claims are here. When it comes to politics, you're not the only soothsayer in the bunch. Just read the topics on this service.

1) What you are giving up in order to get the wall is pretty much common sense. I realize that you have not grown up beyond believing in Santa Claus, but in order to get the wall passed, you have to give up something. That is simply reality Ray

2) We've discussed before how the draconian enforcement of the existing laws have eviscerated the Fourth Amendment when the Constitution Free Zone is being enforced against Americans:









3) Political strategists think like chess players - a game you and I know damn well you don't know squat about. You're more like the wrestler who allows his opponent to get behind him and outmaneuver you because you do not have the capability to think about what the opponent's next move is in advance.

But, since the build the wall guys don't understand basic legal principles, they are the same people that supported the Printz case in the United States Supreme Court (Hell some of the original Plaintiffs are today build the wall supporters.) Then, the legal principle followed that local and state LEOs do not have to enforce federal laws which led to the feds not being able to shut down Sanctuary Cities.

In the instant case, since the border will also impose on private property, the LEO community can do a warrant less search on your property on the pretext of maintaining their precious wall. There goes your private property Rights

4) Many people still don't realize that this obsession with pursuing undocumented foreigners from south of the border caused the first supporters of their cause to lose in court AND the judge ruled that the civilian border patrol violated the civil rights of the undocumented foreigners who trespassed over private property and entered the U.S. improperly.

The decision in that ruling ended the question of whether or not undocumented foreigners had constitutional rights in the United States. THAT, like the way the Printz case was decided in favor of the foreigners, is simply because people like Ray could not think and anticipate: SSN based National ID, profiling, warrant less searches, undocumented foreigners having constitutional rights, the end of innocent until proven guilty were all confirmed by the courts because people just like Ray want what they want and refuse to be told to think ahead

5) Finally, in this response, the build the wall guys have argued this is a legal issue (as differentiated from a military / National Security issue.) NOBODY could talk them out of it. While Ray is trying to be a smart ass with his comment about my alleged "predictions." In EVERY case cited above, people on the same side that Ray is on (like the link he tries to belittle) have tried to warn about the consequences predicated on a knowledge of legal precedents. Ray's kind cannot grasp the fact that they have LOST every single, solitary case regarding undocumented foreigners

6) With respect to Ray's uneducated and misinformed ideas about the United States Supreme Court and guns, the gun owners LOST EVERY TIME the United States Supreme Court has ruled in Ray's life.

One such case was Heller v DC wherein the Court RULED:

"Like most rights, the Second Amendment right is not unlimited."

That ruling is 180 degrees OPPOSITE of EVERY state court's FIRST interpretation of the Second Amendment and fully contradicts the United States Supreme Court's FIRST interpretation of the Second Amendment. By legislating from the bench, even conservatives have invalidated the Constitution and spit on that document. But, Ray, is so brainwashed and single minded, he cannot see the truth.

The supreme court has always been the largest impediment to liberty of our three branches. Because of the highly politicized cases they hear, there is no effective check on the power they assume. You might want to read Men in Black by Mark Levin, it demonstrates and analyzes case after case where the court has exceeded its constitutional authority. It is a bit of a tedious read though, because of the legal jargon.

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I've read it. It's the point I'm trying to make with the build the wall guys. As John Adams put it:

"But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.”

We have but one hope with respect to SCOTUS. It comes in the form of something else Adams said:

“It is the greatest absurdity to suppose it in the power of one, or any number of men, at the entering into society, to renounce their essential natural rights, or the means of preserving those rights; when the grand end of civil government, from the very nature of its institution, is for the support, protection, and defense of those very rights; the principle of which, as is before observed, are Life, Liberty, and Property. If men, through fear, fraud, or mistake, should in terms renounce or give up any essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the grand end of society would absolutely vacate such renunciation. The right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave” –John Adams, The Rights of the Colonists, November 20, 1772

 

[ColonelAngus]

If you guys really want to know about Communism, watch that video.

Their methodology has not changed.

To you cute little Bernie Supporters. This is your future. It never fails.

There is no dissent. Fall in line. The give in to the state, or die. It’s pretty simple.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

Trump was voted in because of the wall, that is building power.

Not from the majority of Americans.

You shouldn't try to educate the Trump is God supporters. Trump won because he got the most electoral votes. He lost the popular vote.

In 2020 the liberals get to change the federal Congressional districts. By pushing B.S. laws that offend the masses, the Republicans are absolutely guaranteeing they will be in the minority in just about every district in America after 2020.

I'm not a liberal, but once these arrogant build the wall guys get knocked on their ass, they can decide to fight or die. They are not strategists. 2020 won't come none too soon.

Your stupidity is showing now, the States do the redistricting not congress and the majority of the State legislatures aren't liberal. In fact liberal States will be losing seats to more conservative States.

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Redistricting is subject to Congressional approval. And I hate to bust your bubble son, but it is not liberals have been gaining so much ground, but in states where it REALLY matters - places where there are a lot of electoral college votes, the liberals have been taking over districts AND areas near red districts so as to be able to dilute the Republican votes in the future.

 

[Bonzi]

Why is anything wrong? And who gets to decide? Please don't tell me majority rules.... how many times has the majority been wrong....?

 

[Porter Rockwell]

Not just a problem for republicans, but for America in general

-Geaux

I totally disagree. People with Hispanic descent are not a problem. Third generation Hispanic immigrants contribute just as much to the nation as the native population, probably more.

I think you'd probably find that with any group of people. However it's unfair to others wanting to come here that we don't do anything about people from C/SA. Just because they border our country doesn't mean they should be able to cut in line which cuts other people out.

The number coming in illegal has no effect on legal immigration numbers.

It does if those illegals are taking jobs the legals could have. After all, if you have all the illegals you want, why would you hire more expensive legals who are governed by our wage and safety laws?

Legal immigrants can work anywhere in the country because they have documentation and they will pass verification.

Illegal immigrants are no threat to employment. Adult illegal immigrants are only about 3% of the workforce. Lack of language skills, documentation, and verifiable previous employment restricts most illegal immigrants to agriculture, housekeeping and manual labor often temp jobs, part time, and seasonal work.

Ray knows that the undocumented foreigners don't really threaten the job market. He works in an industry that is woefully lacking in people to fill the many positions available. There was a tv show on a few days ago showing a sikh that began driving a truck and he was being interviewed. He said he started driving a few years ago, having borrowed money to buy his first truck. Now he owns four trucks and a truck stop.

Opportunities are out there. While Ray wants to do something good for his race - and I dare not condemn him for that, this strategy of making undocumented foreigners the scapegoats for the white man's inability to get his fellow whites off their butts and back into the work force will end in inevitable defeat for him and those following that path to destruction.