Dagosa
Gold Member
- Oct 22, 2012
- 20,950
- 5,669
Exactly. By definition, he is a mass shooter.Great way to promote senseless killing on top of senseless rioting.
I'm beyond disgusted by what's happening on all sides.
Everyone seems to listen to the same echo chamber here. The so-called claims of "violent rape and assault" and "pedophilia" were deliberately made up to slander them. How low can you go West short of killing someone? Here's an idea for a start - go to the WI Sex Offender Registry and type in his name. Anything pop up? That is a start at trying untangle this complete mess of layered fakery, bogus claims, and incitements for more violence on both sides.
Second. If you claim these three men (2 dead and 1 injured) were rioters, please show it. Acts of rioting, looting and arson are illegal, we all agree on that. Show us that is what THOSE THREE PEOPLE were doing. Are you claiming EVERYONE at the protest was engaged in arson and looting? Then that must include the kid and the armed private militia people right? Or - wait - are you going to make some distinctions? hmmm....how about Right = lawful, Left = unlawful = legitimate target....cause that's where you guys are going with this. That's a good starting point for killing people on a political basis huh? No need to mess around trying to figure out who is engaged in unlawful activity and who is not. Now, if only there is some way to identify them before we kill them and have to make up crap to justify it AFTER THE FACT.
So what happened here?
Here's one news account with no speculation:
Social media footage surfaced surrounding the late-night fatal shooting during unrest. Witness accounts and video indicate the gunman first shot someone at a car lot just before midnight, but details on what sparked that shooting weren't immediately clear. The alleged gunman then jogged away, fell in the street, and opened fire again as members of the crowd closed in on him, some appearing to kick and grab at his weapon. According to witness accounts and video footage, police apparently let the gunman walk past them and leave the scene with a rifle over his shoulder and his hands in the air as members of the crowd were yelling for him to be arrested because he had shot people.When asked why the gunman was not arrested in the moment, Kenosha County Sheriff David Beth said he couldn't say for certain, but noted the chaos surrounding officers that night.
Since it's all caught on video, it's pretty damn hard to JUSTIFY but easier to UNDERSTAND the shootings - the fact he was there and (illegally) armed to begin with and the fact he was allowed to simply walk away and return to another state and the fact that in that video there was NO criminal behavior being conducted by any of the dead or injured victims speak for themselves. The rest is speculation, differing accounts, deliberate disinformation, witness statements and armchair quarterbacks dissecting a brief video.
So here are the questions:
WHY WAS A 17 YEAR OLD THERE????? WITH THAT KIND OF WEAPON???? Regardless of what was going on....no one else got shot. Regardless of how I personally feel about private militias (which, as you know, is pretty negative) - THEY didn't shoot anyone either. The police refused to deputize these citizens...for good reason, but they were and imo it's fine to do so - allowed to guard private property. That is FINE. That is what this kid was supposed to be doing, but he LEFT his spot. If he had stayed there nothing would have happened! He was in over his head and he panicked, understandably, when people in the crowd tried to restrain him and get rid of his weapon. As far as anyone could see - the kid was another mass shooter...like Parkland, or any number of events. How could anyone know otherwise when they witness a man shot in the head and another man trotting away with a rifle? He wasn't law enforcement. No badge. No ID. WE FAILED HIM BY ALLOWING HIM TO BE THERE! He is not a hero. He is not a thug. He's a mixed up kid, who badly wanted to be a policeman, who idolized law enforcement, who carried a MEDIC bag in case any protestors needed help, and damn, I just end up crying for HIM, for this one ruined life, someone who really did not seem to have any malice. The dead are dead, but he will have to live with this. It's so wrong.
WHO SHOULD WE BLAME for the riots? Oh, I know the answer that will come from some - commie lefties. Democrats. Sheesh. Get a new playbook. Responsibility ultimately comes down on the mayor. He, along with the city council are responsible for ensuring the safety of his citizens, and their livelyhoods and their homes. Just like if you are the president - it doesn't really matter what you do or don't do - the buck stops here.
But there is a bit more than that because nothing is really simple unless you are a business that got burned out, or the fiancé, with a 2 yr old daughter, of a man who is now dead and slandered, or a 17 year old kid who will now be facing a life he never envisioned, or the family of a man brutally shot in the back at close range, and you just want justice.
What could have been done differently?
Let's start at the beginning. What sparked the demonstrations that then turned into rioting?
A video. A video showing police come up to a man, leaning into his car, grabbing him by the shirt, pulling him back and pumping multiple rounds into his back at close range. It was brutal and against the backdrop of so many videos showing (justifiable and unjustifiable) police violence - there should be no surprise at public reaction. I don't care who the man was, there is no way to watch that (if you are a normal person) and not be horrified. This is our new reality - videos. Of EVERYTHING. Harder to sweep things under the rug, easier to spin, misconstrue, take out of context. Easier to inflame "the masses". Easier to see wrong doing.
What preceded that? Attempts at police reform by the Wisconsin governor, stalled by the legislature. Maybe, just maybe, if people see that something is happening and something is being done, and there is transparency the potential for violence is less. The governor is attempting, AGAIN, to pass it
Yet, the mayor himself appears to be tone deaf to his constituency. If he doesn't listen to the other half, and he fails to provide law and order, he's going to deservedly lose re-election. One example - curfews. A good way to tamp down the potential for violence which always seems to escalate at night. There are demonstrations ongoing described as "mostly peaceful". There is supposed to be a curfew. It's NOT BEING ENFORCED. What the hell?
What is your solution? Blame "commies"? Get real. We have a perfect storm with bitter political divisions at EVERY LEVEL, widespread public anger and unrest, a lot of restrictions and confusion with a pandemic, widespread distrust of our leadership, huge unemployment, Congress incapable of doing their job, a hugely divisive and incompetent president, and the worst recession in ages and more internet disinformation than ever before. Take your pick - it all feeds into the unrest.
But I will say this, I was wrong on one thing, I am now agreeing with you that we need law and order more than ever - we need to stop the violence and that means addressing ALL the participants, not politicizing who to go after. But that can't be with private militias, because they become PART of the problem, fed by the same disinformation as the rest of us. Private entities can guard private property but they have no business roaming the streets or public areas and if they kill someone, they face the law on that. The police and our national guard are the ones who need to be doing this. It's their job, it's what they are trained for. Crowd control. Arresting looters and arsonists. Enforcing curfews.
This kid is not a hero. He's a victim. And we are all to blame.
A few things are missing from your play by play of the events all caught on video.
Again. Like I said. Armchair Quarterbacks dissecting a video. You weren't there.
First guy shot was caught on video leading a group chasing Rittenhouse.
Does the video show what Rittenhouse did prior to that? No. Does the video show why he left his post guarding private property? No.
It's a useless speculation.
Earlier in the night he was filmed strutting around shouting at armed men defending property "shoot me, nigga!" as if to imply that bullets would only make him angry.
So what? There are a lot of assholes out there. On all sides. Haven't you noticed? Being an asshole is not a death sentence nor is it illegal. And, guess what - POLICE are trained to deal with that. They are mature trained adults. 17 year old kids are NOT.
Same guy threw a flaming object at Rittenhouse a moment before he cornered him in a parking lot and thats when you could hear shots fired. Rittenhouse then calls 911 to report that he had shot someone, also caught on video.
Debunked. That's part of the river of false information surrounding this. The only thing thrown was what appeared to be a lightweight bag of trash.
Yes. Rittenhouse did call 911. He did the right thing. He wasn't a bad kid. He was in the wrong place and the ADULTS who allowed it ought to take some responsibility.
Rosenbaum's assholish behavior sheds light onto the mindset that compelled him to begin chasing a guy armed with a rifle. He obviously took for granted that the men with guns were unlike himself, very restrained and disciplined, plus he was obviously intoxicated by mob mentality and probably a lifetime of leftist indoctrination into thinking that nothing bad could ever happen to him. I'll speculate that RIttenhouse "left his post" because the mob, like a pack of hyenas, recognized him as the weakest member of the herd and intentionally separated him from the group. That's what it looks like to me.
ASSHOLERY is not a CRIME. It's certainly not a death sentence. And, you are probably right - he was intoxicated with mob mentality (hardly confined to the left). You can speculate all you want but it doesn't change one important fact - it's speculation.
I can speculate too.
That he got angered by taunting and let loose.
Or, he saw a situation he thought he should get involved in.
Or, he decided to play "hero"
Or any number of things that don't change the essentials facts:
- He is not a policeman, trained to deal with volatile crowds and assholes.
- He had no business being there, illegally armed and underage.
- He had no business leaving his post and "patrolling" public streets.
One can only speculate what he planned to do once he caught Rittenhouse. Probably nothing good I'm guessing. Was he just supposed to just accept a beating and end up like this guy?
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FYI, people carry guns to avoid ending up beaten half to death in the street by angry mobs.
Ok...so you've essentially GUTTED your whole "good guy with a gun" theory. We now know it's based on partisan politics.
Would they have beaten him? Possibly. They just witnessed him SHOOTING AN UNARMED MAN IN THE HEAD for god's sakes. Or, maybe the other guy with the gun (who, if he were a rightist would be a "good guy with a gun") might have held him at gunpoint until the police came.
Either way, it does not change the fact he shot and killed one two people and badly wounded another. None were committing illegal acts. Two, were trying to stop him from escaping after he killed the first.
The kid was heavily armed, NOT the police. No uniform. No authority. Could have been just another mass shooter shooting into a crowd.
Take the partisan politics out of the situation and what does it look like?
Rosenbaum was an angry little man with a history of violence boasting with stereotypical street-thug bravado. He chased the kid down, intending to do him harm and got what he quite literally asked for. You keep saying none of them committed illegal acts but ignore the fact that they were attacking him. Is assault not illegal? Do you have to wait until your blood is spilled before you're legally permitted to defend yourself? Nobody would have been shot if they had just left him alone. But no, they decided to chase him and corner him in a parking lot. The other two guys shot are also seen in the background during Rosenbaum's little "shoot me nigga" display so it's not like they were heroes confused about the situation into thinking it was a random mass-shooting type deal.
First Fact: the kid should not have been there and he was illegally armed.
No. Rosenbaum didn't ask for it. No evidence the kid was defending himself against Rosenbaum, that's your speculation. Words are words. No one is calling Rosenbaum any kind of hero. He's just a man. Who was unarmed I might add, and acting like jerk. None of which justifies murder.
The fact that people have to make up crap, like he was a child rapist, in order to justify it, kind of indicates that the case for killing him is weak and lawless and desperate.
Again. Assholery is not a crime. If it were, most of us here would be executed.
When a guy with a high-powered weapon starts shooting UNARMED people who are not actively engaged in crime, HE BECOMES A POTENTIAL MASS SHOOTER and at best - an ACTIVE SHOOTER.
