Spare_change
Gold Member
- Jun 27, 2011
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I'm more interested in your definition of 'extreme positions' than I am in your characterization of conservatives. Just because they disagree with you doesn't necessarily make them 'extreme'.
Answer: Conservatives adopted extreme positions on wedge issues:
Additionally, fiscal conservatives have evolved into being fiscally irresponsible, and the Republican Leadership has put their jobs first and caved by supporting the extremism which has taken over the GOP.
- Gun control
- Immigration
- Gay & Lesbian equal rights
- Equal pay for equal work
- Minimum wage
- Voting Rights
- Abortion
- Failure to stand up to growing racism
- Calling all Republicans who challenge them on the above issues RINO's.
Both major parties, in the past, have taken the high road in terms of human rights. Today the Crazy New Right has shown nothing but contempt in their callous disregard for human rights.
Ask yourself if their ideology incorporates human rights into each of the bullet points above? Maybe they feel human rights need to be respected by China, Iran, Russia, etc. but not in the United States of America. Moral Relativism seems alive and well in the Right Wing in America.
Perhaps you could expand on that?
I can, and I will sense you are the first polite conservative I've run into recently.
Gun Control - There is no willingness on the right (I'll use 'right' to include all those who will not consider any aspect of gun control) to consider the consequences of the NRA's position on gun control. This position advocates more guns in the hands of more citizens (and as a consequence, more non citizens) including those convicted of crimes of crimes of violence. There should (IMO) be an open debate on gun control, the right absolutely refuses to do so and always falls back on the wording of the Second Amendment, without, apparently, any thought to the victims of gun violence
Immigration - The Senate passed a comprehensive bill over 500 days ago and the Boehner lead house has refused to take any action on the bill.
Gay & Lesbian Rights - essentially the right to marry. A full court press has been the policy of the GOP/social conservatives to deprive these citizens of the benefits of marriage.
Equal Pay for equal work - the GOP opposed the equal rights amendment; every Republican Senator vote NO; only 4 members of the H. of Rep. voted yes on the Lilly Ledbetter Bill.
Minimum wage - There is no support by member of the GOP in Congress to raise the MW.
Voting Rights - Why is the GOP interested in proper ID's and have not funded by an act the money and the proper form of ID? Why have GOP Governors limited access to the polls by changing hours, reducing the numbers and moving polling places from likely Democratic voters away from the community where they live?
Abortion - Members of state legislatures and Republican Governors have moved to make women who seek abortion to submit to unreasonable and unnecessary medical procedures, and closed clinics offering family planning.
Elected officials in the GOP rarely speak out on the growing racism in America. The last person in the GOP to do so, I recall, was Sen. McCain during the 2008 campaign ("He's an Arab").
I've used the GOP and Conservative to describe the right wing, since those I describe above would call those Republicans who are not extreme conservatives to be RINO's.
PS Those so called conservatives who posted above have answered the question. Yes, that type of conservative is dumb. Not less smart, DUMB! A shoutout to Lumpy and CrusaderFrank.
Being diametrically opposed to what you claim to believe does not make one an extremist. It merely makes him someone who disagrees with you.
With that in mind, I will counter-address your comments.
Gun Control - You can be assured that conservatives consider " the consequences of the NRA's position on gun control". They also consider the alternative - as prposed by the left and find it to be more abhorrent that the other. Too many people die because they don't have sufficient self protection. The police are 15 minutes away ... you can bleed to death in 15 seconds. In addition, we recognize the gun control proposals to be a direct attack on our personal freedoms, and resist mightily. Do we believe that the Second Amendment plays a significant part in controlling our government, rather than being controlled by your government? Damn right we do.
Immigration - You're absolutely right. Dems passed a 'comprehensive immigration bill' 500 days ago, and it has not passed through the House. Last time I checked, that was how the system worked.
Have you seriously looked at this supposedly 'comprehensive' immigration bill? You know ... the one with little or no strengthening of security on the border, the one that rewarded those who willingly broke our laws, the one that would allow criminals (keep in mind they are all criminals - they broke our laws) to remain in the country despite the catastrophic impacts on our healthcare, welfare, and education systems.
The bill, and most liberals, tend to treat immigration as an all-or-nothing problem. THEY are all alike, and we should treat them all the same! One answer fits all. Well, the fact is, they AREN'T all alike. There are murderers, thieves, rapists, and gang bangers in that group, and we have a responsibility to our citizenry to weed those people out and not allow them to bring their problem to our shores. And, as we begrudgingly learned with Reagan's amnesty effort, we can't trust the Dems to keep their word. He believed the Dem congress when they said they would handle the border security issue in subsequent laws. They didn't - and today, we have another 12 million illegal immigrants. Fix the border, and we'll talk. Don't fix the border, and we've fixed nothing.
Gay & Lesbian Rights - We have no desire to "deprive these citizens of the benefits of" marriage. This is an overt attempt of the liberal left to disenfranchise Christians and to chip away at the sanctity of the familial unit. Marriage is not a legal right - marriage is a religious ritual. When I got married, i had to sign two forms - one recognizing our union in the eyes of the church, and a second recognizing our union in the eyes of the state. Our 'marriage' - for purposes of the state - was a civil union, not a religious one. The same still applies today. If you want the 'benefits of marriage', join in a civil union. If there are laws that need to be amended to recognize same-sex civil unions, change them. The state has tried to co-opt the role of the church. Stay out of my church.
Equal pay for equal work - absolute nonsense. It is a fabricated issue intended to create a political advantage for one party over the other. There is no study that legitimately has proven otherwise in the past 10 years. The 77% supposed disparity has been proven to be a political lie. Are there women who get paid less for doing the same job? Of course - but, when you consider things like experience level, these disparities are quickly explained. Let me give you a hint - at one time, i had 89 women working in professional positions for me. Each and every one of them got exactly what it took for me to get them to join my company - not one cent more, and not one cent less. That's how it works ... When is the last time you saw an hourly or union job that dictated different pay scales for different sexes? It's nonsense - and it's a political ploy.
Minimum Wage Increase - I do not support minimum wage because I have yet to see a study that claims that the lower elements of our national salary structure get an increased lifestyle without a concordant increase up the scale, which, in turn, negates (and actually damages) the supposed gain of the increase. A sixth grade student can prove that a minimum wage increase penalizes the lower incomes more than any other group.
Voting Rights - I think you will agree that most cases of voter fraud have benefited Democrats, whether they be the voting of the dead in Chicago or Franken's solicitation of voter-ineligible convicts in Minnesota. The Republicans have proposed fixing the system in order to create a fair, and honest, system. It is naive to say no voter fraud has occurred. I wonder why the left doesn't WANT to create a foolproof system. You and I both know this supposed 'disenfranchising' of voters because they need an ID is a red herring. You need an ID to cash a check, buy beer, get gas, and a myriad of other things. Why you would be more concerned about my identity when I cash a check than you are when I vote completely mystifies me.
Abortion - It is inconceivable to me that the state feels it must cancel a parent's rights when their minor child is seeking a major medical procedure. Look - we'll agree to disagree. I believe life begins at conception - you don't. I believe God bestows that child with a life and a soul at that instant - you don't. You aren't going to change your mind - and neither am I.
Racism - We all recognize that some level of racism exists today, but we adamantly disagree at the level. In fact, we believe that the race baiting going on today is more divisive than the dying embers of racism in our society. We have laws that prevent racism - enforce them.
Liberals think in terms of emotion - 'it's only right', 'they deserve', 'we owe them' - Conservatives think in facts 'it will cost', 'right is right, and wrong is wrong' - the twain shall never meet.
As usual, the right answer is probably somewhere in the middle. The left, marching under the Obama banner, has shown no willingness to move to a compromise position. Their intransigence of the left can only be met with total resistance from the right. Show a willingness to compromise, and we'll talk.
Again, just because I disagree with you doesn't make me an extremist - in fact, from where I stand, it looks to me that you are the one taking extremist positions. But, you don't hear me attacking the left ... I believe in their sincerity, I just don't believe in their logic. We only ask that we are afforded the same respect for our sincerity.
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