Why would anyone continue to claim the iraqi war was a failure?

[JakeStarkey]

The neo-con skunk returns to spread his stink on the Bush years.

 

[JRK]

Jake
no-one cares what you say
Your have for over 3000 posts attacked me and not one time did you say anything about the troops

I put you on ignore twice.No-one has anything to say to you Jake

 

[JakeStarkey]

Jake
no-one cares what you say
Your have for over 3000 posts attacked me and not one time did you say anything about the troops

I put you on ignore twice.No-one has anything to say to you Jake

You can't prove that. Now you lie. You are a skunk. I don't care whether you have me on ignore; you will continue to be wrongly defending a criminal administration.

I honored a veteran today on the Board, as a matter of fact. And I will not cheapen my own service by discussing it with likes of you.

 

[Mac1958]

.

Evidently some people are willing to defend paying $20 for a $4 gallon of milk.

They don't seem to comprehend the cost/benefit side of things. They ignore the costs. They don't WANT to know the costs.

If only my analogy were about milk, instead of American blood and lives and minds and families.

.

 

[JRK]

Mac I do not talk to any-one who dis respects our military
I do not have anything else to say

 

[Billo_Really]

You have a link of those 850 bases?
That sounds like allot to me.

That is a lot!

II. More than 1000 US Bases and/or Military Installations

The main sources of information on these military installations (e.g. C. Johnson, the NATO Watch Committee, the International Network for the Abolition of Foreign Military Bases) reveal that the US operates and/or controls between 700 and 800 military bases Worldwide.

In this regard, Hugh d’Andrade and Bob Wing's 2002 Map 1 entitled "U.S. Military Troops and Bases around the World, The Cost of 'Permanent War'", confirms the presence of US military personnel in 156 countries.

The US Military has bases in 63 countries. Brand new military bases have been built since September 11, 2001 in seven countries.

In total, there are 255,065 US military personnel deployed Worldwide.

These facilities include a total of 845,441 different buildings and equipments. The underlying land surface is of the order of 30 million acres. According to Gelman, who examined 2005 official Pentagon data, the US is thought to own a total of 737 bases in foreign lands. Adding to the bases inside U.S. territory, the total land area occupied by US military bases domestically within the US and internationally is of the order of 2,202,735 hectares, which makes the Pentagon one of the largest landowners worldwide (Gelman, J., 2007).

I would close almost all of those bases, unless the country having them, pays for all expenses in running it.

Indefinite detention? There POW's. what would you have us do with them?

I'm not talking about POW's, I'm talking about US citizens.

Al Qaeda was in Iraq before we invaded, I can find no better reason than to invade and as we did now

You can only invade if you yourself was attacked, or you receive authorization from the UNSC. We were not attacked by Iraq, nor did we receive UNSC authorization. Therefore, the invasion was illegal.

Blair’s testimony directly contradicts the Democrats. Still, in the British manner, he continues to understate the case.

Blair is a convicted war criminal.

Intelligence compiled by American officials, as well as the testimony of known al Qaeda associates, confirms that al Qaeda established a significant presence in Iraq prior to March 2003. The evidence that al Qaeda was in Iraq before the war is simply overwhelming. And it helps to explain why the insurgency became so lethal.

Are you referring to DOCEX? That has been completely debunked and when it was made public, the government made the unusual disclaimer of saying "they take no responsibility as to it's authenticity."

Even though Blair says it “later emerged” that Zarqawi had set up shop in Iraq in 2002, this connection was actually a formal part of the American case for war. Secretary of State Colin Powell included a section on Zarqawi’s network in Iraq in his February 5, 2003, presentation before the United Nations.

There was never any evidence of a cooperative relationship between Hussein and al Qaeda. If you got some, let's see it!

Former CIA director George Tenet reveals in his own autobiography, At the Center of the Storm, some of the intelligence that backed up Powell’s presentation. More than one dozen other al Qaeda terrorists had joined Zarqawi in Baghdad. One of them was an Egyptian known as Abu Ayyub al Masri, who had served Osama bin Laden’s deputy, Ayman al Zawahiri, since the 1980s. After Zarqawi was killed in 2006, al Masri took his place as the leader of Al Qaeda in Iraq. Al Masri himself was killed earlier this year, and his widow confirmed that they had moved to central Baghdad in 2002.
Al Qaeda in Iraq | The Weekly Standard

That doesn't show a connection with the Hussein government. And besides, you can't invade a country, just because they harbor terrorists. We harbor Louis Posada. He's a terrorist. He put a bomb on a plane that killed 73 Cuban's. Should we be invaded by Cuba?

UN inspectors had left, there was confusion as to the reason but the was no confusion as to why there where let back in

Bush said they weren't in Iraq, while they were in Iraq! You, yourself, just confirmed this, with your preceding statement. Bush lied, people died!

Look Hans Blix made a speech on 1-27-2003 that was followed days later bt Colin Powell stating about the same except that Al Qaeda was there and setting there defenses up

Actually, it was March 27, but let's not split hairs.

However, Blix doesn't say what you claim he said. Actually, he indicated the opposite.

Transcript of Blix's U.N. presentation

As I noted on the 14th of February, intelligence authorities have claimed that weapons of mass destruction are moved around Iraq by trucks, in particular that there are mobile production units for biological weapons. The Iraqi side states that such activities do not exist.

Several inspections have taken place at declared and undeclared sites in relation to mobile production facilities. Food-testing mobile laboratories and mobile workshops have been seen as well as large containers with seed-processing equipment. No evidence of proscribed activities have so far been found.

So intelligence authorities say Iraq has mobile launchers for WMD's, Blix said no such launchers have been found. Moral of the story, don't take intelligence from coke-heads (Curveball).

Here's another debunked claim by Blix regarding intelligence authorities statements on Iraq using underground facilities.

There have been reports, denied from the Iraqi side, that proscribed activities are conducted underground. Iraq should provide information on any underground structure suitable for the production or storage of weapons of mass destruction.

During inspections of declared or undeclared facilities, inspection teams have examined building structures for any possible underground facilities. In addition, ground-penetrating radar equipment was used in several specific locations. No underground facilities for chemical or biological production or storage were found so far.

Once again, no evidence found. That's not a reason to go to war.

Blix made the case to go to war better than any-one
read the transcript for your self

Update 27 January 2003
www.un.org/Depts/unmovic/Bx27.htmTHE SECURITY COUNCIL, 27 JANUARY 2003: AN UPDATE ON INSPECTION. Executive Chairman of UNMOVIC, Dr. Hans Blix. The governing

Here's your link!




Page not found!

 

[JakeStarkey]

JRK disrespects our military every time he opens his mouth. I bet he has been permanently banned from our bases, ports, and fields.

 

[Billo_Really]

Sorry.
What broke the economy was an epidemic of mortgage fraud the FBI began warning about in 2004 with 80% of the crime originating with lenders. Wall Street did it, Stupid. You're a real credit to the conservative "trickle down" morality that kills other people's children for money and steals other peoples' houses for market share. Maybe you should get off your knees and stop worshiping rich parasites who don't exist without eternal war and endless debt?

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the derrivitive bubble got up to 181 times the collective GNP of all the nations in the world.

 

[starcraftzzz]

The tea tarty anti Americans do not deal in facts and have no conception of what their hate messaging does to innocent people. Over one and a half million innocent people were murdered by Bush st steal a "sea of oil."

Husein could have put bush in Gitmo for the rest of his treasonous life with the information he had on Bush selling him classified information on how to create biological weapons. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and many more PNAC writers deserve the death of a traitor and some day will get what they deserve. Bush and murder go together like peanut butter and jelly.

The brain dead GOP will support Bush until they die just because they have no agenda except hate and misery for their own people.

Bush= National Guard deserter

Bush= mass murder

Bush/Rove/Cheney= outing CIA agents

Bush= never voted into office, placed into office by daddies supreme court

Bush= failed drug test by National Guard

Bush= still supports his Nazi family ties to Hitler

Jack GWB never deserted anything
Never murdered any-one
He was voted into Office as legal as the day is long in 2000 and 2004
Drug test? Hitler

Those are not even items that I will comment on. Dude get real, get a life
What the hell all this other stuff is, is childish

Bush deserter afganastan and stopped looking for bin laden so like always you are a retard

 

[starcraftzzz]

Mac I do not talk to any-one who dis respects our military
I do not have anything else to say

Correction you have nothign intellgent to say

 

[Billo_Really]

]

What does any of that have to do with invading Kuwait?
Killing millions of Iraqis?
Ignoring the terms of surrender?

You liberals blow me away with this spin that has nothing to do with Al Qaeda being in Iraq in 2002
It has nothing to do with the UN accurately reporting 1-27-2003 that Saddam still had 6500 munitions with banned material in there war heads (we ended up finding over 500 of them after we invaded)

Saddam was more than evil
The region was becoming another hide out for Al Qaeda
No-one wanted violence. No-one profited from these events
It was as we say a necessary evil we had no choice in doing

If no one wanted violence, then why didn't we let UN inspectors "stay their coarse" and "finish their mission"?

And you're completely full of shit on what we found after we invaded. We found nothing! If we had found WMD's there, after everything that has been said on that subject, there would've been this headline on every newspaper in the world:

"WMD's
FOUND!"​

 

[Billo_Really]

JRK disrespects our military every time he opens his mouth. I bet he has been permanently banned from our bases, ports, and fields.

I wonder how he feels about IVAW or Veteran's for Peace, both of whom object to the Iraq war and both are former vets.

 

[JRK]

JRK disrespects our military every time he opens his mouth. I bet he has been permanently banned from our bases, ports, and fields.

I wonder how he feels about IVAW or Veteran's for Peace, both of whom object to the Iraq war and both are former vets.

Let me make this simple
you want to debate the war? Fine
you want to slander who I am?
That is not going to happen
People have a right to speak there opinions, this would be what those Vets went to war for

I find it amazing that the liberal uses these groups for there cause and ignore the millions who go on about there business and ask no-one for any funds

Objecting to the Iraq war is every-ones right

Slandering your fellow Americans name is not. This thread was started to tell the side of the story the press never told
At no time have I said anything bad about any-one who dis agrees with me
I just post factual information

Weapons were found
The UN stated the same things every-one else did
Saddam lied, he killed million (a fact you ignore when you speak of crimes)
Al Qaeda was n Iraq before 2003
The Info you used of the UN was after the 1-27-2003, when Hans Blix realized the truth was going to allow the 34 countries to remove Saddam

You want to debate the facts, you want to pretend that the 100s of thousands of young men ans women who volunteered to fight these wars do not exist will not change that fact

You ask me how I feel about a hand full of those vets wanting peace?
Why would I want anything else?

You might want to start with those who started this mess
Saddam Hussein
OBL

not the US
NO-ONE has been charged with any war crimes but Saddam and OBL
they both got justice

 

[JRK]

Update 27 January 2003
from the link
Even Iraq’s letter sent in response to our recent discussions in Baghdad to the President of the Security Council on 24 January does not lead us to the resolution of these issues.
The nerve agent VX is one of the most toxic ever developed.
Thus, there is a discrepancy of 6,500 bombs. The amount of chemical agent in these bombs would be in the order of about 1,000 tonnes
This was a relatively new bunker and therefore the rockets must have been moved there in the past few years, at a time when Iraq should not have had such munitions.
inspectors have found at another site a laboratory quantity of thiodiglycol, a mustard gas
precursor.
There are strong indications that Iraq produced more anthrax than it declared,
What is clear is that they were illegally brought into Iraq, that is, Iraq or some company in Iraq, circumvented the restrictions imposed by various resolutions.

 

[Too Tall]

Because, Too Tall, we should not have sold the precursors, much of what was done under Reagan's people,.

But, but, but Jake, you said Iraq was not on the list of nations that supported terrorists. Is there a double standard for the US as compared to all of our allies?

But, but, but, Too Tall, we think the we have a double standard, don't we?

Invading Iraq was the stupidest foreign policy this country has made since we tried to invade Canada in 1812, and they kicked our ass three times, and took an entire enemy captive.

My apologies, I had no idea that your adoration of Saddam Hussein and hatred of George Bush went to that extreme.

Iraq was in material breach of a cease fire from Gulf War I that was approved by the UN, the Congress and most of the countries in the region that formed a coalition under GHW Bush. He was given ample time to come clean. He didn't, end of cease fire and eventually, Saddam.

 

[Billo_Really]

Let me make this simple
you want to debate the war? Fine
you want to slander who I am?
That is not going to happen
People have a right to speak there opinions, this would be what those Vets went to war for.

I have not said anything about you personally, except for you being FOS, on claiming the finding of WMD's.

I find it amazing that the liberal uses these groups for there cause and ignore the millions who go on about there business and ask no-one for any funds.

I like to stay within the context of the discussion. I have no intention of discussing everything under the sun in one conversation.

Objecting to the Iraq war is every-ones right.

At least we agree on that.

Slandering your fellow Americans name is not. This thread was started to tell the side of the story the press never told
At no time have I said anything bad about any-one who dis agrees with me.

Which is appreciated, thank you for your diplomacy.

I just post factual information.

Of the information you posted, it did not prove your claim. There is still information you haven't posted, that I'm still waiting on.

Weapons were found
The UN stated the same things every-one else did.

This happens to be part of the information I'm still waiting for you to post.

Saddam lied, he killed million (a fact you ignore when you speak of crimes).

No one is saying Hussein wasn't a bad guy.

Al Qaeda was n Iraq before 2003.

Not as a guest of the government.

The Info you used of the UN was after the 1-27-2003, when Hans Blix realized the truth was going to allow the 34 countries to remove Saddam.

So Hans Blix statement in January was the truth and his statement in March was a lie? Why am I not surprized you'd say that?

You want to debate the facts, you want to pretend that the 100s of thousands of young men ans women who volunteered to fight these wars do not exist will not change that fact.

This is irrelevant. I've never said anything of the kind. But all the people I've met who were vets said the main reason for joining was the GI Bill. Not so they could go kill brown people with imunity.

You ask me how I feel about a hand full of those vets wanting peace?
Why would I want anything else?.

Because you argue the opposite. You go to war because you have to. Because you have no other choice. It is a last resort. We still had options in Iraq. We could of let the inspectors do their job and finish their mission. Again, there was no reason to rush into war that killed over a million Iraqi's and made over 4.5 million homeless.

You might want to start with those who started this mess
Saddam Hussein
OBL

not the US
NO-ONE has been charged with any war crimes but Saddam and OBL
they both got justice

WARNING: HERE COMES A PERSONAL ATTACK!

Your statement above, shows how irresponsible you are, by blaming others for your actions. WE decided to go to war. That was OUR decision. Don't blame anyone else but US!

 

[Too Tall]

NCLB has been a monstrostiy, and never should have been enacted: both parties at fault for that.

The Iraqi has been economically and philosophically a fiasco: illegal, unsustainable, and eventually a failure as Iran allies with Iraq. We had every choice, and we made the wrong one. Any conservative or Hard Right will agree with that.

George Bush is responsible for reaching across the aisle to Ted Kennedy and then signing into law the NCLB bill that Kennedy wrote and pushed through Congress.

Now ain't that a pisser!

 

[JRK]

But, but, but Jake, you said Iraq was not on the list of nations that supported terrorists. Is there a double standard for the US as compared to all of our allies?

But, but, but, Too Tall, we think the we have a double standard, don't we?

Invading Iraq was the stupidest foreign policy this country has made since we tried to invade Canada in 1812, and they kicked our ass three times, and took an entire enemy captive.

My apologies, I had no idea that your adoration of Saddam Hussein and hatred of George Bush went to that extreme.

Iraq was in material breach of a cease fire from Gulf War I that was approved by the UN, the Congress and most of the countries in the region that formed a coalition under GHW Bush. He was given ample time to come clean. He didn't, end of cease fire and eventually, Saddam.

In addition it was confirmed that Al Qaeda had began to man-up in 2002 as was presented to the UN By Colin Powell
Your spot on
There was no more to these events than Saddam had used his last ace. After 9-11 We made it clear

Claiming that GWB and T Blair along with the other 32 countries that assisted us in removing The terror groups in Iraq are criminals while ignoring those who killed, maimed, tortured, raped and brought terror to the middle east is a form of denial I cannot and refuse to try and understand

 

[Billo_Really]

Update 27 January 2003
from the link
Even Iraq’s letter sent in response to our recent discussions in Baghdad to the President of the Security Council on 24 January does not lead us to the resolution of these issues.
The nerve agent VX is one of the most toxic ever developed.
Thus, there is a discrepancy of 6,500 bombs. The amount of chemical agent in these bombs would be in the order of about 1,000 tonnes
This was a relatively new bunker and therefore the rockets must have been moved there in the past few years, at a time when Iraq should not have had such munitions.
inspectors have found at another site a laboratory quantity of thiodiglycol, a mustard gas
precursor.
There are strong indications that Iraq produced more anthrax than it declared,
What is clear is that they were illegally brought into Iraq, that is, Iraq or some company in Iraq, circumvented the restrictions imposed by various resolutions.

None of that constitutes WMD's and none of that indicates their mission was completed.


Here is the jist of Blix's statement to the UN...

From your link...
Iraq has on the whole cooperated rather well so far with UNMOVIC

 

[Mac1958]

Evidently some people are willing to defend paying $20 for a $4 gallon of milk.

They don't seem to comprehend the cost/benefit side of things. They ignore the costs. They don't WANT to know the costs.

If only my analogy were about milk, instead of American blood and lives and minds and families..

Mac I do not talk to any-one who dis respects our military
I do not have anything else to say

Take a good, close look, folks. JRK thinks I'm disrespecting our military. Every last damn one of my posts has been about the pain and horror and loss of our soldiers, their families and their children, something that JRK has chosen to ignore and avoid.

Ignore and avoid.

I can certainly understand why you have nothing else to say, JRK. You are absolutely delusional.

You may "love our military", JRK, but you clearly don't give A DAMN about the people in it.

.