50 years later: has government dependency helped or hurt blacks?

[Pheonixops]

So there's no problem in the black community because 75% are not on gov't assistance? Really?
The first step is admitting there is a problem.

The no problem with the MAJORITY of Black people, it a problem with a MINORITY of Black people, yet some people seem to be making it out to be a problem with "the Blacks".

THe minority of black people constitute a huge societal problem, accounting crime out of all proportion to their numbers. This "the majority is OK" business is sophistic nonsense. The black community has a huge problem. Period. The rate of unwed births is approaching 80%. That is more than a minority. The black community in toto suffers from demographic negatives not seen elsewhere in AMerican society. Even rural whites only come close.

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

 

[thanatos144]

The no problem with the MAJORITY of Black people, it a problem with a MINORITY of Black people, yet some people seem to be making it out to be a problem with "the Blacks".

THe minority of black people constitute a huge societal problem, accounting crime out of all proportion to their numbers. This "the majority is OK" business is sophistic nonsense. The black community has a huge problem. Period. The rate of unwed births is approaching 80%. That is more than a minority. The black community in toto suffers from demographic negatives not seen elsewhere in AMerican society. Even rural whites only come close.

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

This would be a very very insightful post if it wasn't for the fact welfare is and has destroyed the black family. the Great Society was just a way to reenslave the black population

 

[Tank]

Welfare didn't destroy black family's, blacks abusing welfare destroyed the black family

 

[thanatos144]

Welfare didn't destroy black family's, blacks abusing welfare destroyed the black family

Ignorance like yours doesn't help

 

[Tank]

Welfare didn't destroy black family's, blacks abusing welfare destroyed the black family

Ignorance like yours doesn't help

People gave blacks welfare trying to help them, but unfortunately the nature of blacks is to take advantage of situations like this.

 

[thanatos144]

Welfare didn't destroy black family's, blacks abusing welfare destroyed the black family

Ignorance like yours doesn't help

People gave blacks welfare trying to help them, but unfortunately the nature of blacks is to take advantage of situations like this.

Your an idiot

 

[Tank]

I just think blacks are responsible for their own actions

 

[Mac1958]

.

Many blacks have benefitted handsomely as a result of their efforts to keep blacks angry, isolated, dependent on others.

So I'd guess they're pretty happy.

.

 

[Flopper]

Finding the solution has to begin with the family, teaching young mothers parenting skills, building self-esteem in the kids, and providing kids from poor families the education they need to get the good jobs. Do this, I will fully support cutting back on government assistance because the need will disappear.

You say "family" but only mention "young mothers." That's part of the problem right there. "Self-esteem"?! Kids today hardly lack in self-esteem, in fact they suffer from a surfeit of it. What they need to learn is respect - for themselves, others, and society. Falling back on the facile refrain of "education" is nice and simple - too simple when we know that dumping more and more money into failing schools doesn't work. One of the most pernicious aspects of what democrat policies have done to the fabric of society over the past 60 years or so is that you can't 'fix it' by imposing some structure from above. The quality of a society lies in the character of its people, and that character has been (in some ways deliberately) undermined and enervated for decades. The good news is that Americans will gravitate toward independence, competition, and also a loyalty to community and country quite naturally if you let them. The bad news is that government is not inclined or currently designed to stay out of the way when it should.

Liberalism wants to believe that if you 'create' the perfect environment you will as a natural consequence create the perfect man. A nice idea (I suppose...) that has never worked and never will. Remove the finger of state from the process and man will naturally incline toward homeostasis according to his true nature. The nature of Americans is superior and will out if freed from the shackles of social engineering and well-intentioned meddling.

I have dealt with people that have been on government support for many years. These people don't gravitate toward independence, competition, and a loyalty to community. If you take away their ebt card, they will mooch off friends, and realities, beg, steal, or live on less. Take away child support and they will dump their kids on friends, relatives, or just on the streets. Many of these people are completely irresponsible. Most of them have menial temp and part time jobs. An employer would have to be nuts to hire these people in responsible jobs with decent pay. Most of them are emotional unstable, mentally ill, disabled, addicted to drugs or alcohol, functionally illiterate, or have long criminal records.

I mention self esteem because that's what's missing from so many young children from poverty stricken families. Don't confuse self esteem with false pride which is what many of these kids develop that go into gangs or become a problem at school.

 

[The Rabbi]

The no problem with the MAJORITY of Black people, it a problem with a MINORITY of Black people, yet some people seem to be making it out to be a problem with "the Blacks".

THe minority of black people constitute a huge societal problem, accounting crime out of all proportion to their numbers. This "the majority is OK" business is sophistic nonsense. The black community has a huge problem. Period. The rate of unwed births is approaching 80%. That is more than a minority. The black community in toto suffers from demographic negatives not seen elsewhere in AMerican society. Even rural whites only come close.

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

So your point is everything is A-OK? Are you insane? I wont even go through the statistics on black on black crime, out of wedlock births, children growing up in single parent families, high black unemployment, high black incarceration rates etc etc. It is well known and frankly depressing. Pretending that everything is peachy because some ill defined majority is fine is an act of cruelty.

 

[Unkotare]

I have dealt with people that have been on government support for many years. These people don't gravitate toward independence, competition, and a loyalty to community. If you take away their ebt card, they will mooch off friends, and realities, beg, steal, or live on less. Take away child support and they will dump their kids on friends, relatives, or just on the streets. Many of these people are completely irresponsible.

Because that is how they've been conditioned to be.

 

[Flopper]

I have dealt with people that have been on government support for many years. These people don't gravitate toward independence, competition, and a loyalty to community. If you take away their ebt card, they will mooch off friends, and realities, beg, steal, or live on less. Take away child support and they will dump their kids on friends, relatives, or just on the streets. Many of these people are completely irresponsible.

Because that is how they've been conditioned to be.

I suspect that since the time these people were children, they have been failures and regardless of what you do, they will continue to be. For these people, social welfare programs just keep them from being a bigger problem for society.

 

[Tank]

I have dealt with people that have been on government support for many years. These people don't gravitate toward independence, competition, and a loyalty to community. If you take away their ebt card, they will mooch off friends, and realities, beg, steal, or live on less. Take away child support and they will dump their kids on friends, relatives, or just on the streets. Many of these people are completely irresponsible.

Because that is how they've been conditioned to be.

That sucks when people are "conditioned" like that, to bad they don't have a choice in the matter.

 

[Pheonixops]

THe minority of black people constitute a huge societal problem, accounting crime out of all proportion to their numbers. This "the majority is OK" business is sophistic nonsense. The black community has a huge problem. Period. The rate of unwed births is approaching 80%. That is more than a minority. The black community in toto suffers from demographic negatives not seen elsewhere in AMerican society. Even rural whites only come close.

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

This would be a very very insightful post if it wasn't for the fact welfare is and has destroyed the black family. the Great Society was just a way to reenslave the black population

Thank you, but how did it destroy the "Black family"? The overwhelming MAJORITY of Black people that I am related to, am friends with,etc. are not on Welfare. For the most part their families are intact. Being "re-enslaved" would mean that "they" are owned against their will, I am interested in knowing what aspect of the Great Society that you think "re-enslaved" Black people. Did it "re-enslave" the White people who benefited from it?
Great Society - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Pheonixops]

THe minority of black people constitute a huge societal problem, accounting crime out of all proportion to their numbers. This "the majority is OK" business is sophistic nonsense. The black community has a huge problem. Period. The rate of unwed births is approaching 80%. That is more than a minority. The black community in toto suffers from demographic negatives not seen elsewhere in AMerican society. Even rural whites only come close.

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

So your point is everything is A-OK? Are you insane? I wont even go through the statistics on black on black crime, out of wedlock births, children growing up in single parent families, high black unemployment, high black incarceration rates etc etc. It is well known and frankly depressing. Pretending that everything is peachy because some ill defined majority is fine is an act of cruelty.

I don't think I ever said that "everything is A-OK", I was just stating the fact that the majority of Black people aren't in poverty, on government programs, in jail, or killing each other. Black on Black crime is 90% and White on White crime I think is at 84 or 95%, that a 5% point difference. Let's say that Black unemployment is at 30% (a high estimate for demonstration purposes), that still means that 70% are employed; that's over twice the amount of the inflated number I gave.
I'm not pretending that everything is peachy, I'm just trying to set the record straight.

 

[The Rabbi]

The fact is, that they still ARE a MINORITY of Black people. I thought that you conservatives state that "you don't see color and just individuals", yet you sure seem to be trying to define the MAJORITY by the MINORITY instead of just looking at INDIVIDUALS. The MAJORITY of Black people are employed and not in poverty, that's a fact. The amount of "out of wedlock" births is high, but that's their INDIVIDUAL choice. What percentage of those "out of wedlock" people are on government assistance, below the poverty line, and unemployed?

So your point is everything is A-OK? Are you insane? I wont even go through the statistics on black on black crime, out of wedlock births, children growing up in single parent families, high black unemployment, high black incarceration rates etc etc. It is well known and frankly depressing. Pretending that everything is peachy because some ill defined majority is fine is an act of cruelty.

I don't think I ever said that "everything is A-OK", I was just stating the fact that the majority of Black people aren't in poverty, on government programs, in jail, or killing each other. Black on Black crime is 90% and White on White crime I think is at 84 or 95%, that a 5% point difference. Let's say that Black unemployment is at 30% (a high estimate for demonstration purposes), that still means that 70% are employed; that's over twice the amount of the inflated number I gave.
I'm not pretending that everything is peachy, I'm just trying to set the record straight.

You're making inappropriate comparisons to minimize the situation. The situation is dire. Recognizing that is the first step to help. I dont care if every black person you know is a PhD driving a Lexus. That is irrelevant. The stats dont lie and they tell a grim story of failure.

 

[Flopper]

I have dealt with people that have been on government support for many years. These people don't gravitate toward independence, competition, and a loyalty to community. If you take away their ebt card, they will mooch off friends, and realities, beg, steal, or live on less. Take away child support and they will dump their kids on friends, relatives, or just on the streets. Many of these people are completely irresponsible.

Because that is how they've been conditioned to be.

That sucks when people are "conditioned" like that, to bad they don't have a choice in the matter.

That does suck, but that's life. The first 6 years of life are the most important. Personality is set by 6 or 7. By age 10 to 12, children have constructed an understanding of fairness and personal responsibility. The option for change and self improvement always exist but it will always be limited by the early childhood years.

 

[freedombecki]

Number and percentage of people receiving public assistance, by sex, race/ethnicity, and age group: Selected years, 1980 through 2009

2009: Americans on public assistance: 19,670,000

Percentages:

Percentage of Americans receiving public assistance in 2009: 6.5%

% White: 4.4%
% Black: 13.5%
Hispanic: 8.7%
Asian/Pacific Islanders: 5.9%
Native Americans/Eskimos: 16.1%

Males: 6.1%
Females: 6.8%

 

[Asclepias]

Number and percentage of people receiving public assistance, by sex, race/ethnicity, and age group: Selected years, 1980 through 2009

2009: Americans on public assistance: 19,670,000

Percentages:

Percentage of Americans receiving public assistance in 2009: 6.5%

% White: 4.4%
% Black: 13.5%
Hispanic: 8.7%
Asian/Pacific Islanders: 5.9%
Native Americans/Eskimos: 16.1%

Males: 6.1%
Females: 6.8%

Great stats but the reality is more whites will be effected if we do away with welfare bottom line. You can percent it to death but thats the reality. Whites seem to be fixated on Black issues they too are suffering but somehow Blacks are the problem? What is the problem with the whites on welfare? They have fewer obstacles in their way. what is their issue? Another thing I noticed about the stats is that the 2 groups in the US that were raped the worst have the highest welfare percentage. You still think racism has nothing to do with it?

 

[Tank]

Without white folks there would be no welfare to hand out