50 years later: has government dependency helped or hurt blacks?

[Oldstyle]

The point that I was making was a simple one...

If government dependency is increasing at a rapid rate over the past forty years and at the same time racism is decreasing at a rapid rate...then why would conditions for blacks in our inner cities be worsening instead of getting better? According to both Closed and Asclepias that shouldn't be happening...yet it is.

You said if. You are wrong in your assumptions, mixed up, and lost trying to explain why events over the last forty years can have an effect on the present but not the last 400 years.

So you're saying that I'm wrong, mixed up and lost when I say the government dependency has increased dramatically over the past 40 years? Or that I'm all of those things when I say that racism has dramatically lessened over the same 40 years? Really?

 

[Unkotare]

By clings you mean affected by it? Or are you of the same school of thought that says the past has nothing to do with the present?

YOU seem to be of the school of thought that the present has nothing to do with the present.

Now will you call me a liar for 3 pages to deflect from your inability to form a point?

If you lie (like someone we know) then I will surely point it out, don't worry.

 

[Oldstyle]

I have every right to demand permission for my race if you are asking me to represent their opinion. As a matter of fact I think of it as a responsibility.

Well as soon as someone DOES ask you to represent your race feel free to do so...until then please desist from naming yourself spokesman for black people everywhere!

Ive been asked several times.

Really? Please show what posts that took place in! I don't remember anyone demanding that you speak for blacks everywhere...I think you took it upon yourself to appoint a "spokesman" for your race.

 

[Unkotare]

While the rest of the world moves on, the black community steadfastly clings to the good old days of Jim Crow, the KKK, and the Civil Rights Movement.

By clings you mean affected by it? Or are you of the same school of thought that says the past has nothing to do with the present?

Reminds me of the Lion King. They better be glad a device was not invented that would allow me to reach through my computer and slap them in the back of their heads and say "It doesn't matter. It's in the past."

Wow. The 'tough guy' routine? You've been reduced to this level of clownish self-debasement? Truly, truly pathetic.

 

[Asclepias]

I'm still waiting for him to come back and dispute that government dependency is increasing dramatically while racism is waning. I don't think it's going to happen though...

According to your argument its impossible to increase it dramatically. If only the present counts then there are no habits created and the very definition of dependency doesn't exist.

Where was it that I argued that only the present counts?

Kindly explain how your theories hold water if government dependency has increased at a rapid rate over the past 40 years while racism has dramatically waned!

When you said government dependency was the reason for problems in the Black communities and that the notion that slavery and jim crow were not.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Back in the 50's and 60's, when there WAS institutional racism, blacks had a legitimate excuse for their community being in the toilet. Now, after 50 years of government handouts, affirmative action programs, welfare, food stamps, govt. grants, they're STILL in the toilet only now they have no one to blame except themselves. Acting as though the climate today is no different than it was 50 years ago, they can still make themselves believe that their failures are still somebody else's fault. It might make them feel better but it doesn't improve their lives (or society in general). And as long as politicians keep feeding this bullshit to them (for their vote), I see no end to this cycle of failure and dependency.

So are you still going with "only some of the past affects the future and others don't"? Since you didn't link to any information is that coming from the yourass.com or becauseisaidso.org?

I'm going with history. You have legislated equality and instead of taking advantage of the opportunity to build a productive future, blacks have taken advantage of the opportunity stay dependent on government assistance. Your idea of success is making Whitey pay for an injustice YOU never experienced yourself, and the stigma of being the least productive race in the world doesn't seem to bother you. You're out of excuses, and the only ones who don't realize that is the black community who keeps clinging to the "struggle" that ended 50 years ago.

Wait...ALL History or just the part you deem important?

I see now that I've stumped you you've turned to predicting what I believe. You COULD just ask but that would be to...fair and who needs fair when you can box your strawman. They don't hit back

The "struggle" is over? So (I'll ask again and again) So you're saying racism and discrimination no longer exist? Please just answer, I've seen enough of your Fred Astair impression

 

[Asclepias]

Well as soon as someone DOES ask you to represent your race feel free to do so...until then please desist from naming yourself spokesman for black people everywhere!

Ive been asked several times.

Really? Please show what posts that took place in! I don't remember anyone demanding that you speak for blacks everywhere...I think you took it upon yourself to appoint a "spokesman" for your race.

You go look for it after you stop trying to evade the question asked. How is the last 40 years relevant but not the last 400 years?

 

[Oldstyle]

According to your argument its impossible to increase it dramatically. If only the present counts then there are no habits created and the very definition of dependency doesn't exist.

Where was it that I argued that only the present counts?

Kindly explain how your theories hold water if government dependency has increased at a rapid rate over the past 40 years while racism has dramatically waned!

When you said government dependency was the reason for problems in the Black communities and that the notion that slavery and jim crow were not.

You didn't answer the question...

Do you admit that government dependency has increased dramatically over the past 40 years?

Do you also admit that racism has lessened dramatically over the past 40 years?

If both of those are indeed true...then why haven't the lives of inner city blacks improved dramatically over that time period?

 

[Asclepias]

You stop being an asshole first.

Nice playground response. "No, you first!"

I guess you calling me an asshole was adult behavior.

 

[Oldstyle]

Ive been asked several times.

Really? Please show what posts that took place in! I don't remember anyone demanding that you speak for blacks everywhere...I think you took it upon yourself to appoint a "spokesman" for your race.

You go look for it after you stop trying to evade the question asked. How is the last 40 years relevant but not the last 400 years?

Why would I go look for something that I just pointed out DOESN'T EXIST? Duh? Come on, Mensa Man...surely you can back up the contention you just made? Either that or admit that ONCE AGAIN you've been caught talking shit?

 

[Asclepias]

Where was it that I argued that only the present counts?

Kindly explain how your theories hold water if government dependency has increased at a rapid rate over the past 40 years while racism has dramatically waned!

When you said government dependency was the reason for problems in the Black communities and that the notion that slavery and jim crow were not.

You didn't answer the question...

Do you admit that government dependency has increased dramatically over the past 40 years?

Do you also admit that racism has lessened dramatically over the past 40 years?

If both of those are indeed true...then why haven't the lives of inner city blacks improved dramatically over that time period?

You quoted my answer. I'm still waiting for you to answer Closeds question.

 

[Oldstyle]

Now I've asked both of you a very simple question...and the sound of crickets in here is deafening. I answered your "tough" question in a matter of seconds...yet here we are waiting for you to respond to mine. That's telling...

 

[Asclepias]

Really? Please show what posts that took place in! I don't remember anyone demanding that you speak for blacks everywhere...I think you took it upon yourself to appoint a "spokesman" for your race.

You go look for it after you stop trying to evade the question asked. How is the last 40 years relevant but not the last 400 years?

Why would I go look for something that I just pointed out DOESN'T EXIST? Duh? Come on, Mensa Man...surely you can back up the contention you just made? Either that or admit that ONCE AGAIN you've been caught talking shit?

Because you want to see proof. i directed you to find it.

 

[Oldstyle]

When you said government dependency was the reason for problems in the Black communities and that the notion that slavery and jim crow were not.

You didn't answer the question...

Do you admit that government dependency has increased dramatically over the past 40 years?

Do you also admit that racism has lessened dramatically over the past 40 years?

If both of those are indeed true...then why haven't the lives of inner city blacks improved dramatically over that time period?

You quoted my answer. I'm still waiting for you to answer Closeds question.

Gee, you must have missed my post...should I cut and paste it for you?

 

[Asclepias]

Now I've asked both of you a very simple question...and the sound of crickets in here is deafening. I answered your "tough" question in a matter of seconds...yet here we are waiting for you to respond to mine. That's telling...

No you didnt answer the question. i'll state it again. How is the last 40 years relevant but not the last 400 years?

 

[squeeze berry]

No one can seem to answer this question or explain how the past govt dependency affects the present but the past racism doesn't.

Must be hard holding both opinions in that head without going cross eyed

Back in the 50's and 60's, when there WAS institutional racism, blacks had a legitimate excuse for their community being in the toilet. Now, after 50 years of government handouts, affirmative action programs, welfare, food stamps, govt. grants, they're STILL in the toilet only now they have no one to blame except themselves. Acting as though the climate today is no different than it was 50 years ago, they can still make themselves believe that their failures are still somebody else's fault. It might make them feel better but it doesn't improve their lives (or society in general). And as long as politicians keep feeding this bullshit to them (for their vote), I see no end to this cycle of failure and dependency.

So are you still going with "only some of the past affects the future and others don't"? Since you didn't link to any information is that coming from the yourass.com or becauseisaidso.org?

the past as in passing on low IQ.

You are an example

 

[Oldstyle]

To start with government dependency is on the rise while racism is waning. Even someone wearing the ideological blinders that you two wear should be cognizant of that fact. You don't want to admit that's the case however because to do so is to totally cuts your theory that this is a problem caused by "overt" racism, right off at the knees!

There it is, little buddy...glad to help

 

[squeeze berry]

Now I've asked both of you a very simple question...and the sound of crickets in here is deafening. I answered your "tough" question in a matter of seconds...yet here we are waiting for you to respond to mine. That's telling...

No you didnt answer the question. i'll state it again. How is the last 40 years relevant but not the last 400 years?

how old are you?

 

[Asclepias]

To start with government dependency is on the rise while racism is waning. Even someone wearing the ideological blinders that you two wear should be cognizant of that fact. You don't want to admit that's the case however because to do so is to totally cuts your theory that this is a problem caused by "overt" racism, right off at the knees!

There it is, little buddy...glad to help

In other words you're not going to answer the question because its causing a brain cramp? What does that answer have to do with the question asked? Anyone willing to take it on?

 

[Oldstyle]

The time period would seem to be self explanatory to a Mensa man like yourself but I'll flesh it out for you. Johnson's Great Society started about forty years ago and since then government dependency has increased dramatically and racism has decreased dramatically. The entire gist of this string is whether or not increased dependency has been a good thing for blacks. Following this so far?