All You Need to Know About Irrational "Self-Defense" Laws in Three Pictures

[AmyNation]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

 

[DiamondDave]

So now Stand Your Ground applies to your neighbors as well? Does it also apply to somebody living in a completely different neighborhood? If not, what is the difference? If so, when did we make vigilantism legal?

I catch a burglar or other criminal coming out of my neighbor's house and I will take their miserable life away from them as well if they come toward me (or anyone else) or try and run away.. and they will know that they can live if they lay down with their hands behind their heads and wait for law enforcement to come and start processing them into the system

If anyone would not do the same for their neighbors, I feel sorry for them.. and for their neighborhood

Does this condone going across town or our of town to somehow stop a felony that is in progress?? No.. but I did not think we had near-light-speed travel to make that possible

Would you be pointing your gun at them to make them comply with waiting for law enforcement? According to The Rabbi that would be brandishing.

Well.. except when showing, using, etc your firearm for a legal purpose such as self defense, the defense of your property, etc....

Because we all know that in libby land, it is only ok if you state the the criminal in front of your face that you will go back into your gun safe to get your limited use firearm and they they will obey and comply by staying there while they wait for you to get the weapon while keeping it secure and not pointing it at the perp

 

[DiamondDave]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

Stopping a criminal act is being a good neighbor.. and if they do not comply with getting into the submissive position, being restrained, and waiting for law enforcement.. and they try any aggressive move and try and flee the scene, additional force can be used... and if it means that they make an aggressive move that makes it necessary to use force that may be deadly, so be it

As stated.. I catch one and they comply with getting on their stomach with their hands behind their head.. they will have zero problems... well.. they may have some problems with law enforcement and the legal system, but that is a whole other can of worms

 

[The Rabbi]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

You thought wrong.

Technically was Joe Horn guilty? Yes. In the wider sense I have no problem with what he did. The miscreants were stealing stuff. He had had a number of thefts in the neighborhood. Eventually the thieves would be emboldened to commit a "hot robbery" with the owners home. The number of thefts fell as a result of that shooting. Scratch two worthless scumbag burglars. No, I dont have a problem with what he did.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

I was going to answer,but it looks like it's been pretty well handled already.
And I gotta say,I wouldnt want you as a neighbor if you're going to sit there and watch as my house is being robbed.
Most definitely a 'GEE THANKS' moment.

 

[Katzndogz]

What was different in the Joe Horn case was that the neighbor specifically asked Horn to watch his house. This took him out of the category of officious intermeddler and gave him the same rights as the neighbor would have had if he had been there.

 

[Harry Dresden]

So you don't believe in defending yourself? So if someone came up and punched you in the face...You'd call the police after they're done with you??? lol

so which one was actually defending THEMSELVES?.....see if you can figure it out....

 

[Harry Dresden]

SO three bad cases (and the third was not a bad case at all. She deserved jail time) mean we ought to repeal all self defense laws.
The crazy runs deep here.

she deserved jail time?.....what about the asshole coming at her?....

 

[Harry Dresden]

SO three bad cases (and the third was not a bad case at all. She deserved jail time) mean we ought to repeal all self defense laws.
The crazy runs deep here.

Wait a minute.

She 'deserved' jail time?

WTF.

Yeah. I dont have time to explain it to you. Get an adult to help.

you are one of the fucked up jurors....

 

[aaronleland]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

You thought wrong.

Technically was Joe Horn guilty? Yes. In the wider sense I have no problem with what he did. The miscreants were stealing stuff. He had had a number of thefts in the neighborhood. Eventually the thieves would be emboldened to commit a "hot robbery" with the owners home. The number of thefts fell as a result of that shooting. Scratch two worthless scumbag burglars. No, I dont have a problem with what he did.

You have been spouting technicalities throughout this topic in regards to self defense laws until it's a case that you agree with.

"Was Joe Horn technically guilty? Yes. Do I care? No"

 

[The Rabbi]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

You thought wrong.

Technically was Joe Horn guilty? Yes. In the wider sense I have no problem with what he did. The miscreants were stealing stuff. He had had a number of thefts in the neighborhood. Eventually the thieves would be emboldened to commit a "hot robbery" with the owners home. The number of thefts fell as a result of that shooting. Scratch two worthless scumbag burglars. No, I dont have a problem with what he did.

You have been spouting technicalities throughout this topic in regards to self defense laws until it's a case that you agree with.

"Was Joe Horn technically guilty? Yes. Do I care? No"

I realize the distinctions here are fine and therfore beyond your capability. But try to pay attention.

 

[The Rabbi]

SO three bad cases (and the third was not a bad case at all. She deserved jail time) mean we ought to repeal all self defense laws.
The crazy runs deep here.

she deserved jail time?.....what about the asshole coming at her?....

He probably deserved death. But "deserve" in that sense is irrelevant. She broke the law. She was found guilty and punished. Tough luck all around.

 

[aaronleland]

You thought wrong.

Technically was Joe Horn guilty? Yes. In the wider sense I have no problem with what he did. The miscreants were stealing stuff. He had had a number of thefts in the neighborhood. Eventually the thieves would be emboldened to commit a "hot robbery" with the owners home. The number of thefts fell as a result of that shooting. Scratch two worthless scumbag burglars. No, I dont have a problem with what he did.

You have been spouting technicalities throughout this topic in regards to self defense laws until it's a case that you agree with.

"Was Joe Horn technically guilty? Yes. Do I care? No"

I realize the distinctions here are fine and therfore beyond your capability. But try to pay attention.

Explain them. I'll wait...

Or are you going to use the "I don't have the time" excuse for the second time this morning, as you spend the rest of the day posting here?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Gun psychos run from this thread.

More like ignore it.
When you post something worthy of response, you'll get responses.

 

[OldUSAFSniper]

When I was a cop, one of my officers stopped a guy who had just smoked a bowl full of crack. He got out of the car, jumped on the officer and had just about wrestled the gun from the holster while he was screaming, "I'm going to kill you." As a sergeant, I run up and grab the guy and throw him backward. He hits his head on the pavement and cracks it open. We literally had to 'hog tie' him to keep him subdued to get him to the hospital where he took 3 stiches to close the wound. He blows a .21 blood alcohol level and his blood test showed not only crack but several other methamphetamines in his blood stream. Oh, by the way, he was on probation for breaking his girlfriends eye socket and one of her legs.

He pleads not guilty and goes to a jury trial. A little old lady on the jury was the only vote of NOT GUILTY because she said that the cops were mean and that if we had just 'asked' the guy to be nice he probably would have been. The ADA was beside himself. A retrial put the guy in prison for 10 years. He's doing life now because in prison he and another guy beat a third inmate to death.

Nothing a jury does surprises me. It should not surprise you. OJ, anyone?

Major fail... even for you.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Joe Horn, Huston Texas.

Murdered two men who were stealing from his neighbors house. Claimed the stand your ground defense and was never indicted .


The 1st time I heard the 911 tape, I was stunned.

TX law allows the use of deadly force in defense of property - yours, or, say, your neighbor's.
Texas Gun Laws - Use of Force and Deadly Force - Self Defense
Sec 9.41/9.42/9.43
Thus, he did not murder anyone.

 

[NLT]

All You Need to Know About Irrational "Self-Defense" Laws in Three Pictures

​

That's Ezekiel Gilbert. He was acquitted yesterday in the murder of Lenora Ivie Frago, who had taken $150 from Gilbert for sex and then refused to have sex with him or give him the money back. So he shot her, not wanting to kill her (and it did take her a few months to die). But because Texas allows people to use deadly force in order to retrieve stolen property (and because the sex did not occur, despite prostitution being illegal, the money was considered stolen), Gilbert, for lack of a better phrase, got off.

​

That's Ralph Wald. He was acquitted last week for the murder of Walter Conley. Conley had been in the middle of having sex with Wald's wife, so, like any reasonable person, Wald claimed that he assumed his wife was being raped and shot Conley dead. His defense was Florida's Stand Your Ground law, which allows anyone who believes that he or she is facing danger in his or her home to use deadly force. Wald said his wife was in danger, so he shot first and asked questions later. Oh, wait, actually he didn't do that last part. He told police he was glad the guy was dead.

​

That's Marissa Alexander. Last year, in Jacksonville, Florida, she was sentenced to 20 years in prison for firing a shot in the air to warn her husband, Rico Gray, to back off her. He had been arrested previously for domestic violence against her, beating her when she was pregnant, and on that day in 2010, he "approached her in a rage" when Alexander drove up to their house to get clothes. She was trying to move out and get away from Gray. Before she fired the shot, he had chased her through the house, broken down a door to get at her, and cornered her in the garage. The judge said she should have fled instead of firing twice into the air. At trial, her Stand Your Ground defense was rejected because the jury did not believe she faced imminent danger. She was convicted of aggravated assault and given the mandatory sentence. She is still in prison.

Look at the pictures. Here's your homework assignment. See if you can figure it out: What is different about Alexander?

Update: Several rude readers have pointed out that Alexander was not necessarily the innocent victim her defenders maker her out to be, as if that invalidates the point here. Nope, sorry. She's in jail for 20 years for firing a gun and harming no one. Wald and Gilbert are free after murdering people and using bad laws to shield them from punishment of any sort.






These laws should be repealed.

What about this guy? Got away with murder because of his skin color.

 

[Pogo]

Killing people for your neighbor is being a "good neighbor"?

And here I thought it was called vigilantism.

Stopping a criminal act is being a good neighbor.. and if they do not comply with getting into the submissive position, being restrained, and waiting for law enforcement.. and they try any aggressive move and try and flee the scene, additional force can be used... and if it means that they make an aggressive move that makes it necessary to use force that may be deadly, so be it

As stated.. I catch one and they comply with getting on their stomach with their hands behind their head.. they will have zero problems... well.. they may have some problems with law enforcement and the legal system, but that is a whole other can of worms

The post didn't say "stopping a criminal act" -- it said "shoot" him.
Nice try.

But just remember... we do NOT have a gun culture. Nosiree bob.

 

[aaronleland]

All You Need to Know About Irrational "Self-Defense" Laws in Three Pictures

​

That's Ezekiel Gilbert. He was acquitted yesterday in the murder of Lenora Ivie Frago, who had taken $150 from Gilbert for sex and then refused to have sex with him or give him the money back. So he shot her, not wanting to kill her (and it did take her a few months to die). But because Texas allows people to use deadly force in order to retrieve stolen property (and because the sex did not occur, despite prostitution being illegal, the money was considered stolen), Gilbert, for lack of a better phrase, got off.

​

That's Ralph Wald. He was acquitted last week for the murder of Walter Conley. Conley had been in the middle of having sex with Wald's wife, so, like any reasonable person, Wald claimed that he assumed his wife was being raped and shot Conley dead. His defense was Florida's Stand Your Ground law, which allows anyone who believes that he or she is facing danger in his or her home to use deadly force. Wald said his wife was in danger, so he shot first and asked questions later. Oh, wait, actually he didn't do that last part. He told police he was glad the guy was dead.

​

That's Marissa Alexander. Last year, in Jacksonville, Florida, she was sentenced to 20 years in prison for firing a shot in the air to warn her husband, Rico Gray, to back off her. He had been arrested previously for domestic violence against her, beating her when she was pregnant, and on that day in 2010, he "approached her in a rage" when Alexander drove up to their house to get clothes. She was trying to move out and get away from Gray. Before she fired the shot, he had chased her through the house, broken down a door to get at her, and cornered her in the garage. The judge said she should have fled instead of firing twice into the air. At trial, her Stand Your Ground defense was rejected because the jury did not believe she faced imminent danger. She was convicted of aggravated assault and given the mandatory sentence. She is still in prison.

Look at the pictures. Here's your homework assignment. See if you can figure it out: What is different about Alexander?

Update: Several rude readers have pointed out that Alexander was not necessarily the innocent victim her defenders maker her out to be, as if that invalidates the point here. Nope, sorry. She's in jail for 20 years for firing a gun and harming no one. Wald and Gilbert are free after murdering people and using bad laws to shield them from punishment of any sort.






These laws should be repealed.

What about this guy? Got away with murder because of his skin color.

He got away with murder because he was rich, famous, and could afford the best legal team money could buy.

 

[Synthaholic]

All You Need to Know About Irrational "Self-Defense" Laws in Three Pictures

​

That's Ezekiel Gilbert. He was acquitted yesterday in the murder of Lenora Ivie Frago, who had taken $150 from Gilbert for sex and then refused to have sex with him or give him the money back. So he shot her, not wanting to kill her (and it did take her a few months to die). But because Texas allows people to use deadly force in order to retrieve stolen property (and because the sex did not occur, despite prostitution being illegal, the money was considered stolen), Gilbert, for lack of a better phrase, got off.

He should have been in jail, did he get the OJ jury? I'm curious were there any women on his jury?( I ask because that's a standard liberal question)

​

That's Ralph Wald. He was acquitted last week for the murder of Walter Conley. Conley had been in the middle of having sex with Wald's wife, so, like any reasonable person, Wald claimed that he assumed his wife was being raped and shot Conley dead. His defense was Florida's Stand Your Ground law, which allows anyone who believes that he or she is facing danger in his or her home to use deadly force. Wald said his wife was in danger, so he shot first and asked questions later. Oh, wait, actually he didn't do that last part. He told police he was glad the guy was dead.

Uh what's wrong with you, dont mess with someone's wife, talk about stupid. I forgot to you marriage is just a benefits exchange!

​

That's Marissa Alexander. Last year, in Jacksonville, Florida, she was sentenced to 20 years in prison for firing a shot in the air to warn her husband, Rico Gray, to back off her. He had been arrested previously for domestic violence against her, beating her when she was pregnant, and on that day in 2010, he "approached her in a rage" when Alexander drove up to their house to get clothes. She was trying to move out and get away from Gray. Before she fired the shot, he had chased her through the house, broken down a door to get at her, and cornered her in the garage. The judge said she should have fled instead of firing twice into the air. At trial, her Stand Your Ground defense was rejected because the jury did not believe she faced imminent danger. She was convicted of aggravated assault and given the mandatory sentence. She is still in prison.

Look at the pictures. Here's your homework assignment. See if you can figure it out: What is different about Alexander?

Update: Several rude readers have pointed out that Alexander was not necessarily the innocent victim her defenders maker her out to be, as if that invalidates the point here. Nope, sorry. She's in jail for 20 years for firing a gun and harming no one. Wald and Gilbert are free after murdering people and using bad laws to shield them from punishment of any sort.






These laws should be repealed.

wow how suprising. So three "scientific picks", wow you really dont get much do you?
Uh so the woman shouldnt have had a gun? You think she should have been jailed for what she did? I dont, if that case is true. Other than trying to play the race card, I really dont see how this backs your story, case one is bad, but again it's an illicit underworld, it's best not to get involved. And hey how about we disarm everyone so criminal will stop committing crimes (yeah liberals really believe that!)

It shows deep flaws in the way that self-defense is defined.

It also doesn't pass the racial smell test. Is there anyone here who doesn't believe this woman was standing her ground in the face of a violent attacker who had a history of attacking her?