Ask a Catholic

[Meriweather]

if married people choose not to have children, can they still be Catholics?

Absolutely.

 

[Meriweather]

Why is not allowing priests to marry the "ideal"?

Why do you believe it would be? Would you become a Catholic priest if you could be married?

 

[Blues Man]

if married people choose not to have children, can they still be Catholics?

Absolutely.

But that's unacceptable according to Catholics.

And why did you not answer the second question I asked?

 

[Blues Man]

Why is not allowing priests to marry the "ideal"?

Why do you believe it would be? Would you become a Catholic priest if you could be married?

I wouldn't become a priest in any religion.

It just seems silly that the Catholic chruch seems to want all its members to have children so much that it sais birth control is a sin and yet denies its own clergy the ability to marry and have children

 

[Meriweather]

But that's unacceptable according to Catholics.

No.

 

[Meriweather]

It just seems silly that the Catholic chruch seems to want all its members to have children so much that it sais birth control is a sin and yet denies its own clergy the ability to marry and have children

It is your claim that the Church seems "to want all its members to have children". The Church merely states that life is our greatest gift. Natural birth control is not a sin. Men who wish to marry do not become priests. No one is frog-marched into becoming a priest. It is both choice and calling.

Research shows about one of four men aged fifty and older have never married. The average age for men to marry is 29. Currently, they new high of unmarried men in the US population is 35%. Are you equally as eager for these men to marry? If not, why so eager to have priests marry?

 

[Blues Man]

It just seems silly that the Catholic chruch seems to want all its members to have children so much that it sais birth control is a sin and yet denies its own clergy the ability to marry and have children

It is your claim that the Church seems "to want all its members to have children". The Church merely states that life is our greatest gift. Natural birth control is not a sin. Men who wish to marry do not become priests. No one is frog-marched into becoming a priest. It is both choice and calling.

Research shows about one of four men aged fifty and older have never married. The average age for men to marry is 29. Currently, they new high of unmarried men in the US population is 35%. Are you equally as eager for these men to marry? If not, why so eager to have priests marry?

The only natural birth control is abstinence.

The Catholic church will annul a marriage if it it never consummated so it does seem that the Catholic church believe s that a married couple must have sex with no birth control in order for the marriage to be valid.

 

[Meriweather]

The Catholic church will annul a marriage if it it never consummated so it does seem that the Catholic church believe s that a married couple must have sex with no birth control in order for the marriage to be valid.

A marriage that is never consummated is grounds for one of the spouses to have the marriage annulled. An unconsummated marriage is not "automatically" annulled.

 

[Blues Man]

The Catholic church will annul a marriage if it it never consummated so it does seem that the Catholic church believe s that a married couple must have sex with no birth control in order for the marriage to be valid.

A marriage that is never consummated is grounds for one of the spouses to have the marriage annulled. An unconsummated marriage is not "automatically" annulled.

It wouldn't be annulled if the Catholic church thought abstinence was "natural" birth control.

And what about that what god has joined let no man separate bit that is part of the marriage ceremony ?

Why can a church council of men separate a married couple as if it never happened?

 

[rightwinger]

So, let’s take it to the next level for the Catholic Church and discuss sterilization

A couple is in their early 40s and have three children. They decide the husband should have a vasectomy because they have an “ideal” family

The Church calls them sinners

Correct. "Sin" is simply those who miss the ideal mark. Every person on God's green earth cannot hit all ideal marks. But keep in mind all those who thought that a certain number of children was their ideal...but then had another or even more. For one family I know, four was what they thought would be ideal, but then they tried eight. It convinced them that eight was their new ideal.

Maybe so...
But having eight children may not be ideal. It puts a strain on family resources and means the family will have to make do with less.

Talking about “ideal”
Some parents are NOT ideal. They have personal issues, maybe psychological issues. Maybe they don’t want children around.
Birth control or sterilization are ideal

 

[rightwinger]

Why is not allowing priests to marry the "ideal"?

Why do you believe it would be? Would you become a Catholic priest if you could be married?

I wouldn't become a priest in any religion.

It just seems silly that the Catholic chruch seems to want all its members to have children so much that it sais birth control is a sin and yet denies its own clergy the ability to marry and have children

The Catholic Church wants its Priests dedicated solely to the priesthood.

But what they miss out on is Priests who understand the challenges and issues of those couples they are counseling.

Priests are missing out on one of the most fulfilling benefits of humanity......a family
The Church says you can’t do both......every other religion shows you can.

Another thing that hurts the Catholic Church is the lack of legacy Priests. My father was a Priest, my grandfather was a priest. I grew up in that environment, I want to be a Priest

 

[Polishprince]

So, let’s take it to the next level for the Catholic Church and discuss sterilization

A couple is in their early 40s and have three children. They decide the husband should have a vasectomy because they have an “ideal” family

The Church calls them sinners

Correct. "Sin" is simply those who miss the ideal mark. Every person on God's green earth cannot hit all ideal marks. But keep in mind all those who thought that a certain number of children was their ideal...but then had another or even more. For one family I know, four was what they thought would be ideal, but then they tried eight. It convinced them that eight was their new ideal.

Maybe so...
But having eight children may not be ideal. It puts a strain on family resources and means the family will have to make do with less.

Talking about “ideal”
Some parents are NOT ideal. They have personal issues, maybe psychological issues. Maybe they don’t want children around.
Birth control or sterilization are ideal

Having a lot of children makes more sense for those who live in farming communities or families who are wards of the state dependent on welfare.

Children in farming families actually work and contribute to profitability.

Children born to Welfare Queens add to the welfare checks and EBT , and help mom buy gasoline for her Cadillac.

 

[Meriweather]

Maybe so...
But having eight children may not be ideal. It puts a strain on family resources and means the family will have to make do with less.

Talking about “ideal”
Some parents are NOT ideal. They have personal issues, maybe psychological issues. Maybe they don’t want children around.
Birth control or sterilization are ideal

It wouldn't be annulled if the Catholic church thought abstinence was "natural" birth control.

And what about that what god has joined let no man separate bit that is part of the marriage ceremony ?

Why can a church council of men separate a married couple as if it never happened?

You both present valid points on why some will not choose to have a Catholic marriage. Neither the Church nor I are disapproving of those who choose a different way of marriage. Climbing Mount Everest, running a marathon, or barbecuing the perfect steak are not for everyone. Most of us, most of the time, are willing to settle for a lot less. We are willing to settle for "Good enough." Even those who strive for perfection (be perfect as your heavenly father is perfect) fall short. In fact the rule of thumb is that we fall short at least seven times every day.

However, there are benefits for following the way Christ taught. Remember the rich young man who wanted to join the Apostles and follow more closely? He would have had to give up all he had that kept him tied to one location. He knew he couldn't do that. He had to settle for keeping the Commandments and loving his neighbors. He assessed what he could and could not do. And made his choice. I imagine he had a very good life and did many good things.

I feel the same about the two of you. The pinnacle of Everest may not be for you, but there are many other good things. The one thing we never heard the rich young man doing was criticizing the choices and sacrifices the Apostles made. We don't criticize those who make it to the top of Everest or complete the Boston Marathon. Nor do we tell these people to be content with climbing a small hill or running around the block. We should all cheer everyone on the paths which they choose and wish them well. (End of sermon. )

 

[Meriweather]

The Catholic Church wants its Priests dedicated solely to the priesthood.

But what they miss out on is Priests who understand the challenges and issues of those couples they are counseling.

Priests are missing out on one of the most fulfilling benefits of humanity......a family
The Church says you can’t do both......every other religion shows you can.

Another thing that hurts the Catholic Church is the lack of legacy Priests. My father was a Priest, my grandfather was a priest. I grew up in that environment, I want to be a Priest

Same question I asked Blues Man: If priests could marry would you be a Catholic priest?

 

[Meriweather]

Having a lot of children makes more sense for those who live in farming communities or families who are wards of the state dependent on welfare.

Children in farming families actually work and contribute to profitability.

Small populations set a greater priority and value on children as well. We are living in highly populated areas in a time where children are not seen as an investment but rather more like an expendable hobby if people have the time and inclination. (Not everyone, of course! It just comes with the highly populated territory.)

 

[Blues Man]

Maybe so...
But having eight children may not be ideal. It puts a strain on family resources and means the family will have to make do with less.

Talking about “ideal”
Some parents are NOT ideal. They have personal issues, maybe psychological issues. Maybe they don’t want children around.
Birth control or sterilization are ideal

It wouldn't be annulled if the Catholic church thought abstinence was "natural" birth control.

And what about that what god has joined let no man separate bit that is part of the marriage ceremony ?

Why can a church council of men separate a married couple as if it never happened?

You both present valid points on why some will not choose to have a Catholic marriage. Neither the Church nor I are disapproving of those who choose a different way of marriage. Climbing Mount Everest, running a marathon, or barbecuing the perfect steak are not for everyone. Most of us, most of the time, are willing to settle for a lot less. We are willing to settle for "Good enough." Even those who strive for perfection (be perfect as your heavenly father is perfect) fall short. In fact the rule of thumb is that we fall short at least seven times every day.

However, there are benefits for following the way Christ taught. Remember the rich young man who wanted to join the Apostles and follow more closely? He would have had to give up all he had that kept him tied to one location. He knew he couldn't do that. He had to settle for keeping the Commandments and loving his neighbors. He assessed what he could and could not do. And made his choice. I imagine he had a very good life and did many good things.

I feel the same about the two of you. The pinnacle of Everest may not be for you, but there are many other good things. The one thing we never heard the rich young man doing was criticizing the choices and sacrifices the Apostles made. We don't criticize those who make it to the top of Everest or complete the Boston Marathon. Nor do we tell these people to be content with climbing a small hill or running around the block. We should all cheer everyone on the paths which they choose and wish them well. (End of sermon. )

I didn't criticize I asked questions but in general religious institutions don't like when people ask questions

 

[rightwinger]

The Catholic Church wants its Priests dedicated solely to the priesthood.

But what they miss out on is Priests who understand the challenges and issues of those couples they are counseling.

Priests are missing out on one of the most fulfilling benefits of humanity......a family
The Church says you can’t do both......every other religion shows you can.

Another thing that hurts the Catholic Church is the lack of legacy Priests. My father was a Priest, my grandfather was a priest. I grew up in that environment, I want to be a Priest

Same question I asked Blues Man: If priests could marry would you be a Catholic priest?

I think the answer would be a definite YES
The Church is struggling to attract Priests. Celibacy rules are a big part of that. As is denying half the human population access to the priesthood.

 

[Polishprince]

The Catholic Church wants its Priests dedicated solely to the priesthood.

But what they miss out on is Priests who understand the challenges and issues of those couples they are counseling.

Priests are missing out on one of the most fulfilling benefits of humanity......a family
The Church says you can’t do both......every other religion shows you can.

Another thing that hurts the Catholic Church is the lack of legacy Priests. My father was a Priest, my grandfather was a priest. I grew up in that environment, I want to be a Priest

Same question I asked Blues Man: If priests could marry would you be a Catholic priest?

I think the answer would be a definite YES
The Church is struggling to attract Priests. Celibacy rules are a big part of that. As is denying half the human population access to the priesthood.

Disagree entirely here. The Catholic Church isn't struggling to attract priests, its struggling to attract the faithful.

The interest in the RCC has declined as the Pope and other high officials have adopted ultraliberalist views. There are plenty enough priests for the work that they have now.

When I was a kid, there were plenty of Catholic schools and churches which have since closed up.

 

[Meriweather]

I didn't criticize I asked questions but in general religious institutions don't like when people ask questions

Quite the contrary. Questions such as why do you do _____________________ the way you do, are always welcomed and encouraged. Should we favor major league baseball asking the national football league to make changes that would suit them. Why pass the football when pitching a round ball clearly works better? I am sure you see the difference.

Let's take on the issue of married priests from your standpoint with questions for you:

1. Priests move throughout the dioceses--even beyond, sometimes as much as every two to four years. How does this affect wives and children?
2. Who has the priority, the family or the parish?
3. Does the house belong to the parish or the family?
4. What problems have married Eastern Orthodox priests have had to overcome?
5. Should marriage be solely with a woman?
6. What about divorce? How is alimony and child support figured?
7. If marriage is approved, then why can't priests just live with someone without being married?
8. Why not just consensual, casual sex?
9. Why not call for a hooker?

In other words, where would you draw all the lines?

 

[Meriweather]

I think the answer would be a definite YES

Then I can imagine that you are already lending a helpful hand to the Catholic Church. How do you see yourself as being of greater help if you were a priest with a family?