Ben Carson refers to slaves as "immigrants"

[there4eyeM]

Yes, it is the dictionary definition of words.

Your citing of historical political strategies are arguments for the idea that black people are not people, does not change that.

And your point about native born slaves, is still not clear in the context of this thread.

SO, what if the slaves were denied their God Given Rights? What does that have to do with anything?

The 1790 Dictionary doesn't even contain the word "immigrant."

A Complete Dictionary of the English Language, Both with Regard to Sound and Meaning

Nonetheless, Q for you: Were these "immigrants" legal or illegal?

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.


I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Calling a slave a person doesn't make a slave an immigrant.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Yes, it is the dictionary definition of words.

Your citing of historical political strategies are arguments for the idea that black people are not people, does not change that.

And your point about native born slaves, is still not clear in the context of this thread.

SO, what if the slaves were denied their God Given Rights? What does that have to do with anything?

The 1790 Dictionary doesn't even contain the word "immigrant."

A Complete Dictionary of the English Language, Both with Regard to Sound and Meaning

Nonetheless, Q for you: Were these "immigrants" legal or illegal?

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.


I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Doesn't change the fact that from 1787 until 1864 slaves were only considered 3/5ths of a person, and therefore not full citizens.

 

[sealybobo]

You would think that the term "immigrant" would infer a person acting on their own, without coercion.

But no. Now that words really no longer mean anything, "immigrant" can be pretty much anything.

Holy crap, this just continues to get worse.
.

You are the one struggling with the real meaning of this word.



Definition of immigrant

1. : one that immigrates: such asa : a person who comes to a country to take up permanent residence

Ben Carson was NOT trying to downplay slavery.

His point, whatever it was, was something else, and that has been buried by manufactured outrage.

Let's overlook words like "fascist", "fascism", "democracy", etc., that so many twist tortuously. Let's just look at the above 'definition' of the word that has been put falsely forward for purposes of obfuscation. First, slaves were not 'persons' and had no standing in court; they were chattel. They did not 'come' to America, they were delivered against their will. And whatever will they had was certainly not to stay in a hostile foreign land. It is devoid of understanding and humanity to defend such a laughable proposition as calling them 'immigrants'.

And don't forget what Ben actually said:
'There were other immigrants who came in the bottom of slave ships, who worked even longer, even harder, for less'

So he's saying that there where white immigrants on the Amistad who also came to America at the same times slaves were shipped in. And he's saying some of those whites worked long and harder and for less than slaves. Forget the fact they were free Ben.

HUD spokesman Brian Sullivan attempted to clarify Carson's statement, saying, "Nobody here believes he was equating voluntary immigration with involuntary servitude."
Critics quickly decried his comment.
"Ben Carson is also the guy who once compared Obamacare to slavery," tweeted Keith Boykin, a CNN political contributor. "I'm starting to think he may not understand the word 'slavery.'"

Ben Carson appeared to liken slaves to immigrants who choose to come to the United States

No one is picking on Ben. It's hard being a black racist who hates blacks.

It is sad to see you playing dumb like this.

To me it is sad you are putting all your trust in Trump. I'm skeptical and so should everyone be.

But Ben being dumb isn't going to make me NOT vote for Trump in 2020. I want to see results. Sorry I'm not a cheerleader like you. I don't buy it. And just when I start to want to buy it Trump's an idiot.

You haven't done anything yet and you haven't won anyone over yet. We are all skeptically watching. Causiously pessimistic.

 

[Correll]

The 1790 Dictionary doesn't even contain the word "immigrant."

A Complete Dictionary of the English Language, Both with Regard to Sound and Meaning

Nonetheless, Q for you: Were these "immigrants" legal or illegal?

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.

I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Calling a slave a person doesn't make a slave an immigrant.

I am not "calling" slaves people. I am pointing out that slaves are people.

 

[Correll]

The 1790 Dictionary doesn't even contain the word "immigrant."

A Complete Dictionary of the English Language, Both with Regard to Sound and Meaning

Nonetheless, Q for you: Were these "immigrants" legal or illegal?

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.


I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Doesn't change the fact that from 1787 until 1864 slaves were only considered 3/5ths of a person, and therefore not full citizens.

The definition of an Immigrant says, PEOPLE, not CITIZENS.

Your "point" is completely irrelevant.

 

[ABikerSailor]

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.

I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Calling a slave a person doesn't make a slave an immigrant.

I am not "calling" slaves people. I am pointing out that slaves are people.

You're right, slaves are people, but under the way the first Congress looked at them, they only counted as 3/5ths of a person and weren't considered full citizens until after 1864.

 

[Correll]

You would think that the term "immigrant" would infer a person acting on their own, without coercion.

But no. Now that words really no longer mean anything, "immigrant" can be pretty much anything.

Holy crap, this just continues to get worse.
.

You are the one struggling with the real meaning of this word.



Definition of immigrant

1. : one that immigrates: such asa : a person who comes to a country to take up permanent residence

Ben Carson was NOT trying to downplay slavery.

His point, whatever it was, was something else, and that has been buried by manufactured outrage.

Let's overlook words like "fascist", "fascism", "democracy", etc., that so many twist tortuously. Let's just look at the above 'definition' of the word that has been put falsely forward for purposes of obfuscation. First, slaves were not 'persons' and had no standing in court; they were chattel. They did not 'come' to America, they were delivered against their will. And whatever will they had was certainly not to stay in a hostile foreign land. It is devoid of understanding and humanity to defend such a laughable proposition as calling them 'immigrants'.

And don't forget what Ben actually said:
'There were other immigrants who came in the bottom of slave ships, who worked even longer, even harder, for less'

So he's saying that there where white immigrants on the Amistad who also came to America at the same times slaves were shipped in. And he's saying some of those whites worked long and harder and for less than slaves. Forget the fact they were free Ben.

HUD spokesman Brian Sullivan attempted to clarify Carson's statement, saying, "Nobody here believes he was equating voluntary immigration with involuntary servitude."
Critics quickly decried his comment.
"Ben Carson is also the guy who once compared Obamacare to slavery," tweeted Keith Boykin, a CNN political contributor. "I'm starting to think he may not understand the word 'slavery.'"

Ben Carson appeared to liken slaves to immigrants who choose to come to the United States

No one is picking on Ben. It's hard being a black racist who hates blacks.

It is sad to see you playing dumb like this.

To me it is sad you are putting all your trust in Trump. I'm skeptical and so should everyone be.

But Ben being dumb isn't going to make me NOT vote for Trump in 2020. I want to see results. Sorry I'm not a cheerleader like you. I don't buy it. And just when I start to want to buy it Trump's an idiot.

You haven't done anything yet and you haven't won anyone over yet. We are all skeptically watching. Causiously pessimistic.

Ben Carson was not claiming that there were white immigrants traveling in the bottom of slave ships.

YOu are not skeptically watching when you play games like that.

You are dishonestly undermining.

 

[bodecea]

No. It's not. US Immigrants have rights. Slaves did not. They were imports, GOODS. Property. According to our Founders. Imma go with their definition. Theirs is the one that counts in that brief period the US imported a couple hundred thousand as goods, from 1801 to 1808.

"What point are you trying to make about the native born slaves?"

They accounted for 99%, as described earlier, and were not imported, nor, as you like to say immigrants.

Nor were they citizens.

Yes, it is the dictionary definition of words.

Your citing of historical political strategies are arguments for the idea that black people are not people, does not change that.

And your point about native born slaves, is still not clear in the context of this thread.

SO, what if the slaves were denied their God Given Rights? What does that have to do with anything?

The 1790 Dictionary doesn't even contain the word "immigrant."

A Complete Dictionary of the English Language, Both with Regard to Sound and Meaning

Nonetheless, Q for you: Were these "immigrants" legal or illegal?

I've never considered, cared or researched the varying legalities of the slave trade.

And it is all off topic anyways.

Ok....how is the slave trade "off topic" when it is at the core of Carson's remarks?

Nothing in the definition of the world Immigrant is effected by legality or illegality.


Thus it is NOT at the core of Carson's remarks.

Keep digging....it makes your blind spot all the more obvious.

 

[Correll]

off-topic.

Holy shit. YOU called them immigrants. You most certainly KNOW if you have two brain cells to rub together, the ones that were imported here, per our Constitution - were here legally.

So you don't know if they were legal or illegal immigrants.

??

Yeah, and per our Constitution, from 1787 until 1864, slaves were only 3/5ths of a person.

People are not a legal construct. People are real. Their reality exists regardless of what a political strategy says they are.

I can call my cat a dog. That does not make it so.

Calling a slave a person doesn't make a slave an immigrant.

I am not "calling" slaves people. I am pointing out that slaves are people.

You're right, slaves are people, but under the way the first Congress looked at them, they only counted as 3/5ths of a person and weren't considered full citizens until after 1864.

Which is irrelevant to the definition of Immigrant.

 

[ricechickie]

After the slaves were freed by the good will of white men, they were free to go back to Africa. Instead they chose to remain in America. Sounds like they liked being brought to America.

Yes, every slave who was brought here in the early 1700's chose to stay when freed in 1865.

The ones who were still alive, that is.

(See how stupid it sounds now?)

 

[bodecea]

It's rather awe-inspiring to see the lengths that the Trump puppets will go to excuse anything from this current so-called administration. How much longer before we actually see the so-called president shoot someone in broad daylight on 5th Ave. and the puppets go wild in their support?

 

[there4eyeM]

The reference in the 'definition' is to "persons", not "people". In any case, the definition is not of people and all situations. It does take for granted that by immigrant we are speaking of a person sufficiently at liberty to make decisions for him/her self and the means to travel. These do not apply, quite clearly and obviously, to a human who is held as a slave by other, demented humans.

 

[ricechickie]

Calling slaves "immigrants" is a euphemism. There's a difference between those who chose to come here and those who were kidnapped and brought here. A vast difference.

Yes there is, but the same vast difference is true of those who choose to come here illegally, yet there are some who insist they are immigrants...btw, who kidnapped them?

Not really. Legal or illegal, immigrants are those who move to a new country. While the word "immigrant" doesn't necessarily have being voluntary as part of the definition, the connotation is there. It's euphemistic. But in Carson's world, these "immigrants" weren't sold, they were "downsized."

 

[Correll]

It's rather awe-inspiring to see the lengths that the Trump puppets will go to excuse anything from this current so-called administration. How much longer before we actually see the so-called president shoot someone in broad daylight on 5th Ave. and the puppets go wild in their support?

YOu mean like the lefties spending nearly twenty pages arguing that slaves weren't people?

 

[Correll]

The reference in the 'definition' is to "persons", not "people". In any case, the definition is not of people and all situations. It does take for granted that by immigrant we are speaking of a person sufficiently at liberty to make decisions for him/her self and the means to travel. These do not apply, quite clearly and obviously, to a human who is held as a slave by other, demented humans.

1. Your pretense at not understanding the connection between the words, "persons" and "people" is dismissed as sophist nonsense.

2. Your pretense that you are unable to understand the concept of forced migrant is also dismissed.

 

[Ame®icano]

is ben carson really black? (i, like colbert, don't see race)

Samuel L. Jackson, NAACP Criticize Ben Carson for Deeming Slaves as "Immigrants"

Simple example how one word can drive lefties nutz to the core.

Technically, they were immigrants. Legal immigrants that became citizens.

By the way, how many of you heard the whole speech and the context of his remarks?

 

[Correll]

Calling slaves "immigrants" is a euphemism. There's a difference between those who chose to come here and those who were kidnapped and brought here. A vast difference.

Yes there is, but the same vast difference is true of those who choose to come here illegally, yet there are some who insist they are immigrants...btw, who kidnapped them?

Not really. Legal or illegal, immigrants are those who move to a new country. While the word "immigrant" doesn't necessarily have being voluntary as part of the definition, the connotation is there. It's euphemistic. But in Carson's world, these "immigrants" weren't sold, they were "downsized."

Despite your spin, you just agreed with Carson on the facts.

 

[ricechickie]

Not really. Legal or illegal, immigrants are those who move to a new country. While the word "immigrant" doesn't necessarily have being voluntary as part of the definition, the connotation is there. It's euphemistic. But in Carson's world, these "immigrants" weren't sold, they were "downsized."

Despite your spin, you just agreed with Carson on the facts.

Of course. But spin puts a new connotation on language.

For example, you're not dumb. Of course not. You are simply challenged when it comes to understanding concepts.

See what a nice euphemism does?

 

[Correll]

Not really. Legal or illegal, immigrants are those who move to a new country. While the word "immigrant" doesn't necessarily have being voluntary as part of the definition, the connotation is there. It's euphemistic. But in Carson's world, these "immigrants" weren't sold, they were "downsized."

Despite your spin, you just agreed with Carson on the facts.

Of course. But spin puts a new connotation on language.

For example, you're not dumb. Of course not. You are simply challenged when it comes to understanding concepts.

See what a nice euphemism does?

One of your fellow lefties said it very well.

Immigration is normally something a person does willingly.

BUt there are UNusual instances.

The Middle Passage was the largest of Forced Migrations.

 

[ricechickie]

Not really. Legal or illegal, immigrants are those who move to a new country. While the word "immigrant" doesn't necessarily have being voluntary as part of the definition, the connotation is there. It's euphemistic. But in Carson's world, these "immigrants" weren't sold, they were "downsized."

Despite your spin, you just agreed with Carson on the facts.

Of course. But spin puts a new connotation on language.

For example, you're not dumb. Of course not. You are simply challenged when it comes to understanding concepts.

See what a nice euphemism does?

One of your fellow lefties said it very well.

Immigration is normally something a person does willingly.

BUt there are UNusual instances.

The Middle Passage was the largest of Forced Migrations.

When there is a word that describes the situation more clearly, then that word should be used. Plain English has a word for forced immigration, or unwilling immigration, of those who are not considered citizens, but property - that word is slavery. Euphemisms are used to obfuscate meaning.