Boycott Staples

[Lonestar_logic]

so who owns it then?....

The USPS is created as a government agency under Title 39, Section 101.1 of the United States Code which states, in part:

(a) The United States Postal Service shall be operated as a basic and fundamental service provided to the people by the Government of the United States, authorized by the Constitution, created by Act of Congress, and supported by the people. The Postal Service shall have as its basic function the obligation to provide postal services to bind the Nation together through the personal, educational, literary, and business correspondence of the people. It shall provide prompt, reliable, and efficient services to patrons in all areas and shall render postal services to all communities. The costs of establishing and maintaining the Postal Service shall not be apportioned to impair the overall value of such service to the people.

No, the USPS is a Business!
the Postal Service takes on some several very non-governmental attributes via the powers granted to it under Title 39, Section 401, which include:
•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business. However, unlike other private businesses, the Postal Service is exempt from paying federal taxes. USPS can borrow money at discounted rates, and can condemn and acquire private property under governmental rights of eminent domain.

Under federal law, only the Postal Service can handle or charge postage for handling letters. Despite this virtual monopoly worth some $45 billion a year, the law merely requires the Postal Service to remain "revenue-neutral," neither making a profit or suffering a loss.

In simple terms, it's a branch of the federal government. It owns itself.

really?....but yet they cant make a move without some Committee or the Board of Governors and finally Congress giving this self owning business permission to do anything that they feel they should do....and it takes a while to get that permission....if Congress has the final word....how do you figure they own themselves?...

Sure they can. I just gave you a list of things they can do without congressional approval.

The USPS is an independent agency.

•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business.

 

[Harry Dresden]

The USPS is created as a government agency under Title 39, Section 101.1 of the United States Code which states, in part:

(a) The United States Postal Service shall be operated as a basic and fundamental service provided to the people by the Government of the United States, authorized by the Constitution, created by Act of Congress, and supported by the people. The Postal Service shall have as its basic function the obligation to provide postal services to bind the Nation together through the personal, educational, literary, and business correspondence of the people. It shall provide prompt, reliable, and efficient services to patrons in all areas and shall render postal services to all communities. The costs of establishing and maintaining the Postal Service shall not be apportioned to impair the overall value of such service to the people.

No, the USPS is a Business!
the Postal Service takes on some several very non-governmental attributes via the powers granted to it under Title 39, Section 401, which include:
•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business. However, unlike other private businesses, the Postal Service is exempt from paying federal taxes. USPS can borrow money at discounted rates, and can condemn and acquire private property under governmental rights of eminent domain.

Under federal law, only the Postal Service can handle or charge postage for handling letters. Despite this virtual monopoly worth some $45 billion a year, the law merely requires the Postal Service to remain "revenue-neutral," neither making a profit or suffering a loss.

In simple terms, it's a branch of the federal government. It owns itself.

really?....but yet they cant make a move without some Committee or the Board of Governors and finally Congress giving this self owning business permission to do anything that they feel they should do....and it takes a while to get that permission....if Congress has the final word....how do you figure they own themselves?...

Not to be a jerk, but what is it you're thinking they can't do without permission from Congress?

Didn't they just outsource work?

and they had to get permission from someone .....they just cant do it.....anything they do that is considered a major move has to be oked by some Congressional committee or the board of governors....

 

[Disir]

I have no idea what you want me to read in that 66 pages.

But, yes, the internet was part of it.

No. Here: http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/352857-boycott-staples-5.html#post9044098

they are the wrong people to be boycotting....

I don't agree. Further, I think a quick review of all of the corps that lobbied from 2005 and on is necessary and boycotting them.

 

[Harry Dresden]

No. https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/109/hr6407

yes it is....the Internet affected first class ....that bill did not....

The internet did not say fund 75 years in advance.

what?.....whatever that means.......but E-Mail has affected first class letters.....on line banking and things of that nature....

 

[bendog]

I thought this was an NBA/Sterling thread. )-:

 

[jc456]

this is the bullsh*t the Left tries to pass off as informed debate:


The FERS “Overpayment”

Two postal reform bills are pending in Congress. S. 1789 would transfer approximately $11.4 billion from the CSRDF to the USPS during fiscal year 2012 as a refund of “overpayments” that the USPS has made on its FERS funding obligations.[2] As reported by the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, H.R. 2309 also calls for a refund of FERS contributions. The USPS cites OPM figures to claim that it owes $75.9 billion for future FERS pension benefits, but has a balance in the trust fund of $87.3 billion.[3]

While this surplus appears to exist, it should be retained in the trust fund and used to offset future USPS funding requirements. This is how the private sector handles temporary surpluses in defined-benefit funding. The OPM estimates that the USPS will owe the CSRDF approximately $3 billion annually and given the USPS’s uncertain financial prospects, retaining the surplus would protect both its employees and the taxpayers. As long as the surplus remains, USPS would have lower expenses.

However, that surplus may not last. It is based on estimates of earned interest and the eventual cost of promised benefits. As private-sector employers that sponsor defined-benefit pensions for their employees have discovered, both estimates can be volatile, and today’s surplus can become tomorrow’s deficit very quickly.

The CSRDF is composed of special issue treasury bonds with maturities of up to 15 years, which pay the appropriate interest rate when they were issued. Currently, interest rates are near record lows and have been since the 2008 financial crisis. This is reflected by lower earnings than predicted. For instance, the CSRDF actuaries predicted interest earnings of 6.25 percent for the FERS fund in 2009, but the actual figure was 5.18 percent. For 2010, the prediction was 5.75 percent, but actual earnings were only 4.77 percent. The earnings for 2011 were also projected at 5.75 percent, but actual earnings are unlikely to be better. In short, the estimated USPS surplus is based on overly optimistic assumptions. When estimates are adjusted to show actual earnings, the expected surplus will likely shrink. Given this, refunding the entire surplus is extremely irresponsible.

The idea of pensions is old school, they cannot be maintained. 401ks are the tool to use for retirements. 4% match with the demand that the employee pay in 4%. If the employee does not pay in at that rate, they get zero. Guarantee pensions are obsolete, due to payouts to those retirees who never paid in.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

how many private businesses have to get permission from 3 or 4 committees a board of governors and congress before they can do something major?....

Define "something major".

Raising the price of a stamp by as little as 1 cent.

Under the law the post office can raise the price of a stamp without congressional approval as long as it's not more than the rate of inflation or 2.6 percent.

Under federal law, it can't raise prices more than the rate of inflation without approval from the commission.

Source

 

[Disir]

this is the bullsh*t the Left tries to pass off as informed debate:


The FERS “Overpayment”

Two postal reform bills are pending in Congress. S. 1789 would transfer approximately $11.4 billion from the CSRDF to the USPS during fiscal year 2012 as a refund of “overpayments” that the USPS has made on its FERS funding obligations.[2] As reported by the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, H.R. 2309 also calls for a refund of FERS contributions. The USPS cites OPM figures to claim that it owes $75.9 billion for future FERS pension benefits, but has a balance in the trust fund of $87.3 billion.[3]

While this surplus appears to exist, it should be retained in the trust fund and used to offset future USPS funding requirements. This is how the private sector handles temporary surpluses in defined-benefit funding. The OPM estimates that the USPS will owe the CSRDF approximately $3 billion annually and given the USPS’s uncertain financial prospects, retaining the surplus would protect both its employees and the taxpayers. As long as the surplus remains, USPS would have lower expenses.

However, that surplus may not last. It is based on estimates of earned interest and the eventual cost of promised benefits. As private-sector employers that sponsor defined-benefit pensions for their employees have discovered, both estimates can be volatile, and today’s surplus can become tomorrow’s deficit very quickly.

The CSRDF is composed of special issue treasury bonds with maturities of up to 15 years, which pay the appropriate interest rate when they were issued. Currently, interest rates are near record lows and have been since the 2008 financial crisis. This is reflected by lower earnings than predicted. For instance, the CSRDF actuaries predicted interest earnings of 6.25 percent for the FERS fund in 2009, but the actual figure was 5.18 percent. For 2010, the prediction was 5.75 percent, but actual earnings were only 4.77 percent. The earnings for 2011 were also projected at 5.75 percent, but actual earnings are unlikely to be better. In short, the estimated USPS surplus is based on overly optimistic assumptions. When estimates are adjusted to show actual earnings, the expected surplus will likely shrink. Given this, refunding the entire surplus is extremely irresponsible.

The idea of pensions is old school, they cannot be maintained. 401ks are the tool to use for retirements. 4% match with the demand that the employee pay in 4%. If the employee does not pay in at that rate, they get zero. Guarantee pensions are obsolete, due to payouts to those retirees who never paid in.

Ya, I mean the better for the fuckers to steal now, hey?

 

[Meister]

yes it is....the Internet affected first class ....that bill did not....

The internet did not say fund 75 years in advance.

what?.....whatever that means.......but E-Mail has affected first class letters.....on line banking and things of that nature....

Yep, Disir has taken revenue right out of the equation.

 

[jc456]

this is the bullsh*t the Left tries to pass off as informed debate:


The FERS “Overpayment”

Two postal reform bills are pending in Congress. S. 1789 would transfer approximately $11.4 billion from the CSRDF to the USPS during fiscal year 2012 as a refund of “overpayments” that the USPS has made on its FERS funding obligations.[2] As reported by the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, H.R. 2309 also calls for a refund of FERS contributions. The USPS cites OPM figures to claim that it owes $75.9 billion for future FERS pension benefits, but has a balance in the trust fund of $87.3 billion.[3]

While this surplus appears to exist, it should be retained in the trust fund and used to offset future USPS funding requirements. This is how the private sector handles temporary surpluses in defined-benefit funding. The OPM estimates that the USPS will owe the CSRDF approximately $3 billion annually and given the USPS’s uncertain financial prospects, retaining the surplus would protect both its employees and the taxpayers. As long as the surplus remains, USPS would have lower expenses.

However, that surplus may not last. It is based on estimates of earned interest and the eventual cost of promised benefits. As private-sector employers that sponsor defined-benefit pensions for their employees have discovered, both estimates can be volatile, and today’s surplus can become tomorrow’s deficit very quickly.

The CSRDF is composed of special issue treasury bonds with maturities of up to 15 years, which pay the appropriate interest rate when they were issued. Currently, interest rates are near record lows and have been since the 2008 financial crisis. This is reflected by lower earnings than predicted. For instance, the CSRDF actuaries predicted interest earnings of 6.25 percent for the FERS fund in 2009, but the actual figure was 5.18 percent. For 2010, the prediction was 5.75 percent, but actual earnings were only 4.77 percent. The earnings for 2011 were also projected at 5.75 percent, but actual earnings are unlikely to be better. In short, the estimated USPS surplus is based on overly optimistic assumptions. When estimates are adjusted to show actual earnings, the expected surplus will likely shrink. Given this, refunding the entire surplus is extremely irresponsible.

The idea of pensions is old school, they cannot be maintained. 401ks are the tool to use for retirements. 4% match with the demand that the employee pay in 4%. If the employee does not pay in at that rate, they get zero. Guarantee pensions are obsolete, due to payouts to those retirees who never paid in.

Ya, I mean the better for the fuckers to steal now, hey?

Hey!!

 

[Harry Dresden]

The USPS is created as a government agency under Title 39, Section 101.1 of the United States Code which states, in part:

(a) The United States Postal Service shall be operated as a basic and fundamental service provided to the people by the Government of the United States, authorized by the Constitution, created by Act of Congress, and supported by the people. The Postal Service shall have as its basic function the obligation to provide postal services to bind the Nation together through the personal, educational, literary, and business correspondence of the people. It shall provide prompt, reliable, and efficient services to patrons in all areas and shall render postal services to all communities. The costs of establishing and maintaining the Postal Service shall not be apportioned to impair the overall value of such service to the people.

No, the USPS is a Business!
the Postal Service takes on some several very non-governmental attributes via the powers granted to it under Title 39, Section 401, which include:
•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business. However, unlike other private businesses, the Postal Service is exempt from paying federal taxes. USPS can borrow money at discounted rates, and can condemn and acquire private property under governmental rights of eminent domain.

Under federal law, only the Postal Service can handle or charge postage for handling letters. Despite this virtual monopoly worth some $45 billion a year, the law merely requires the Postal Service to remain "revenue-neutral," neither making a profit or suffering a loss.

In simple terms, it's a branch of the federal government. It owns itself.

really?....but yet they cant make a move without some Committee or the Board of Governors and finally Congress giving this self owning business permission to do anything that they feel they should do....and it takes a while to get that permission....if Congress has the final word....how do you figure they own themselves?...

Sure they can. I just gave you a list of things they can do without congressional approval.

The USPS is an independent agency.

•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business.

everyone of those things would have to have a committee looking it over first....here is the latest "oversite committee"....

113th Congress Oversight Committee | Committee on Oversight & Government Reform

 

[Disir]

The internet did not say fund 75 years in advance.

what?.....whatever that means.......but E-Mail has affected first class letters.....on line banking and things of that nature....

Yep, Disir has taken revenue right out of the equation.

No. I didn't. It's just not the primary problem.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Define "something major".

Raising the price of a stamp by as little as 1 cent.

Under the law the post office can raise the price of a stamp without congressional approval as long as it's not more than the rate of inflation or 2.6 percent.

Under federal law, it can't raise prices more than the rate of inflation without approval from the commission.

Source

then why when they wanted to raise it 1 cent a year or so ago did the Postal Rate Committee and the board of Governors turn them down?...they said it wasnt warranted...

 

[Meister]

Define "something major".

Raising the price of a stamp by as little as 1 cent.

Under the law the post office can raise the price of a stamp without congressional approval as long as it's not more than the rate of inflation or 2.6 percent.

Under federal law, it can't raise prices more than the rate of inflation without approval from the commission.

Source

One would have to ask themselves if the commission is the same as congress.

The commission’s 2 to 1 approval of an emergency or “exigent” rise of 2 cents will give the Postal Service extra revenue for the first time since a 2006 law limited rate increases to the rate of inflation. Regulators approved an inflation-tied 1.7 percent hike in November that will raise stamp prices by a penny; the announcement Christmas Eve will result in an overall 6 percent jump in postal rates.
Postal Service gets approval for a temporary increase in stamp prices - The Washington Post

Here is some more info:

8. How are postage prices set?

Under the law, the Postal Service operates essentially two business lines, one for “market dominant” products and one for “competitive” products. Each line has its own regulations and pricing rules that are administered by the Commission.

Go to top

Market-Dominant Products
Market-dominant products comprise 99 percent of mail volume. Specifically, this includes First-Class Mail letters and sealed parcels; First-Class Mail cards; Periodicals; Standard Mail; Single-piece Parcel Post; Media Mail; Bound Printed Matter; Library Mail; Special Services; and Single-piece International Mail. The Postal Service dominates the market for these products because of its letter-mail monopoly and its position as the national mail service provider. Consequently, the law established an inflation- based price cap (Consumer Price Index for Urban consumers, CPI-U) on price increases for these product. For example, in 2008, the CPI-U cap was 2.9% and in 2009 it was 3.8%.


The Postal Service can change market-dominant prices following a 45-day public notice and review by the Commission. Under the Commission’s rules, the public is provided a 20-day comment period on the Postal Service’s proposal and the Commission will issue its decision within 14 days thereafter. Generally, public comments should address whether the Postal Service proposals meet the requirements of the law.


If the Commission finds that the Postal Service’s proposals do not meet the statutory requirements, the Postal Service must correct the deficiencies and resubmit the new prices. These prices, assuming they meet statutory requirements as determined by the Commission, cannot go into effect sooner than 45 days after they are submitted.


If the Commission finds that the Postal Service’s proposals do not meet the statutory requirements, the Postal Service must correct the deficiencies and resubmit the new prices. These prices, assuming they meet statutory requirements as determined by the Commission, cannot go into effect sooner than 45 days after they are submitted.


NOTE: In cases where the Postal Service implements prices that are lower than the price cap, the law provides that they may “bank” the difference and use it at a later date, subject to some limitations. Consequently, in a given year market dominant prices could be raised above the current cap up to the amount that had been previously banked. Also see ‘What is an Exigent Rate Case?” below.

Competitive Products
Competitive products include Priority Mail; Expedited Mail; Bulk Parcel Post and Bulk International Mail. The Postal Service is perceived to face competition for these products from private sector companies. Consequently, the Postal Service generally can price these products to the market as if they were a private sector company. However, competitive products are subject to a price floor to ensure against cross-subsidization by market-dominant products. Under rules established by the Commission, competitive product prices must cover all of the costs attributable to the product and additional cover 5.5 % of institutional costs (general overhead).

The Postal Service can raise Competitive prices no sooner than 30 days after it has presented its proposal to the Commission and provide public notice of its proposal. The Commission will complete its review within that time.
Postal Regulatory Commission: Information for Postal Consumers

 

[boilermaker55]

Overpay! Is that our response.
You have no feelings about CEO's being OVERPAID in their jobs. Or are they justified by which means.
Plus a large bonus and stock options!
Why do they not buy stocks like all the rest of the real stock holders?
Overpay!

the EXCUSE the idiotic Left is using is that they are required to "overpay" for their own employees retirement benefits.
what you wont here from the idiotic Left here pretending they are letting you in on a big secret is that the issue of whether they are "overpaying" is highly debateable

think OBAMA'S HOMESTATE OF ILLINOIS; and the $100 BILLION HOLE the state is in for underfunded pensions

 

[Meister]

what?.....whatever that means.......but E-Mail has affected first class letters.....on line banking and things of that nature....

Yep, Disir has taken revenue right out of the equation.

No. I didn't. It's just not the primary problem.

I have to laugh at you on this one, Dis.
YES, it was ONE of the primary problems, sorry to burst your bubble.
I lived through those years at the post office and heard the stand-ups regarding
loss of revenue because of the internet.

 

[Disir]

Yep, Disir has taken revenue right out of the equation.

No. I didn't. It's just not the primary problem.

I have to laugh at you on this one, Dis.
YES, it was ONE of the primary problems, sorry to burst your bubble.
I lived through those years at the post office and heard the stand-ups regarding
loss of revenue because of the internet.

No. The primary problem, since 2006, is that legislation. That legislation is the driving force behind privatization.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

really?....but yet they cant make a move without some Committee or the Board of Governors and finally Congress giving this self owning business permission to do anything that they feel they should do....and it takes a while to get that permission....if Congress has the final word....how do you figure they own themselves?...

Sure they can. I just gave you a list of things they can do without congressional approval.

The USPS is an independent agency.

•power to sue (and be sued) under its own name;
•power to adopt, amend and repeal its own regulations;
•power to "enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures";
•power to buy, sell and lease private property; and,
•power to build, operate, lease and maintain buildings and facilities.

All of which are typical functions and powers of a private business.

everyone of those things would have to have a committee looking it over first....here is the latest "oversite committee"....

113th Congress Oversight Committee | Committee on Oversight & Government Reform

Nope those things they can do without approval.

39 U.S. Code § 401 - General powers of the Postal Service

Subject to the provisions of section 404a, the Postal Service shall have the following general powers:

(1) to sue and be sued in its official name;

(2) to adopt, amend, and repeal such rules and regulations, not inconsistent with this title, as may be necessary in the execution of its functions under this title and such other functions as may be assigned to the Postal Service under any provisions of law outside of this title;

(3) to enter into and perform contracts, execute instruments, and determine the character of, and necessity for, its expenditures;

(4) to determine and keep its own system of accounts and the forms and contents of its contracts and other business documents, except as otherwise provided in this title;

(5) to acquire, in any lawful manner, such personal or real property, or any interest therein, as it deems necessary or convenient in the transaction of its business; to hold, maintain, sell, lease, or otherwise dispose of such property or any interest therein; and to provide services in connection therewith and charges therefor;

(6) to construct, operate, lease, and maintain buildings, facilities, equipment, and other improvements on any property owned or controlled by it, including, without limitation, any property or interest therein transferred to it under section 2002 of this title;

(7) to accept gifts or donations of services or property, real or personal, as it deems, necessary or convenient in the transaction of its business;

(8) to settle and compromise claims by or against it;

(9) to exercise, in the name of the United States, the right of eminent domain for the furtherance of its official purposes; and to have the priority of the United States with respect to the payment of debts out of bankrupt, insolvent, and decedents’ estates; and

(10) to have all other powers incidental, necessary, or appropriate to the carrying on of its functions or the exercise of its specific powers.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Yep, Disir has taken revenue right out of the equation.

No. I didn't. It's just not the primary problem.

I have to laugh at you on this one, Dis.
YES, it was ONE of the primary problems, sorry to burst your bubble.
I lived through those years at the post office and heard the stand-ups regarding
loss of revenue because of the internet.

yep....and the stand-ups about Automation coming....

 

[hortysir]

We are still paying for Vietnam...

US is still paying Civil War benefits- MSN Money

Oh and if Bush lied, so did these people.

snopes.com: Weapons of Mass Destruction Quotes

So if we're still paying for Vietnam then why did the Bush administration lie to start a war in the Middle East where the Mujaheddin were trained by the CIA in Viet Cong-style guerrilla warfare?

And Bush lied and tortured people. Read the declassified government documents.
https://www.google.com/search?q=gwu...la:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb
https://www.google.com/search?q=cur...la:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb
https://www.google.com/search?q=gwu...la:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb

Don't bother responding with any of that "well, the dimocraps lied, too." Just read everything in those links. Bush lied and tortured people.

yaaaawwwnnnn



First, let's take on your lie that "Bush's War" - you know? the one where more Americans have died in Afghanistan under Obama than under Bush? -WAS paid for....with continuing resolutions that both parties signed off on...even though democrats would try to hold those spending resolutions hostage in order to pass their own pet projects.

Now let's address your "Bush lied and tortured".
I don't care if you don't want to hear "dimocraps lied too". Because they did.
Remember Pelosi being briefed on, and giving the thumbs up to, Waterboarding?
Of course you do, but it would require honesty to admit it.


Now back to our regularly scheduled privatize the USPS thread.


To advocate for a bloated money-sucking government program and bemoan a more streamlined private company making a profit doing the same thing is lunacy at its finest.